(07 Jul 2019, 9:48 pm)Andreos1Congestion, and the management thereof is the problem in hand.
Customers ain't daft. Anyone drawn to the service, under the impression it is fast and express, will be left disappointed when they find out its not.
Even though the X1 operates as an express between the Galleries and Newcastle, it's often no quicker than a 4 and a metro.
Regardless of any measures to stop/not stop, it's the existing road infrastructure that is often the ultimate deciding factor.
Fancy livery and X prefix or not.
(07 Jul 2019, 9:48 pm)Andreos1Congestion, and the management thereof is the problem in hand.
Customers ain't daft. Anyone drawn to the service, under the impression it is fast and express, will be left disappointed when they find out its not.
Even though the X1 operates as an express between the Galleries and Newcastle, it's often no quicker than a 4 and a metro.
Regardless of any measures to stop/not stop, it's the existing road infrastructure that is often the ultimate deciding factor.
Fancy livery and X prefix or not.
(07 Jul 2019, 10:01 pm)peterIs there any clue yet as to what the new daytime interworking patterns of the X30/X31, X45/X46/X47 and X70/X71 will be??
This appeared a few pages back, and is the main reason for the Red Kite renumbering as far as I'm concerned:
X30 on its own
X31 interwork with X45/X46
X70/X71 interwork with X47
https://northeastbuses.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?tid=1832&pid=230968#pid230968
- for some reason link doesn't want to take you to the post I'm referring to, so I've attached a screenshot of it instead.
(07 Jul 2019, 10:01 pm)peterIs there any clue yet as to what the new daytime interworking patterns of the X30/X31, X45/X46/X47 and X70/X71 will be??
This appeared a few pages back, and is the main reason for the Red Kite renumbering as far as I'm concerned:
X30 on its own
X31 interwork with X45/X46
X70/X71 interwork with X47
https://northeastbuses.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?tid=1832&pid=230968#pid230968
- for some reason link doesn't want to take you to the post I'm referring to, so I've attached a screenshot of it instead.
(07 Jul 2019, 10:06 pm)Jamie M Congestion, and the management thereof is the problem in hand.
1) Our roads are poorly planned, especially bus lanes. The few we have, they either have bottleneck blind joining junctions (eg bottom of lobley hill), filled to the brim with cyclists so renders them useless (eg durham road-harlow green) or so short, pathetic and end up merging with cars every few meters (bensham bank).
2) It's a waste of everybody's money and time to develop these 'solutions', when they offer no benefit except to the white paint and signage budget.
3) Simply put, the only express service I can think of - that is a quicker version of a normal route is the X122, where there's minimal congestion along the route until you hit hexham.
4) If we weren't negotiating traffic lights with no priority and bus lanes that are redundant (...and more painful to use than the normal road), then this would create huge opportunities for the industry.
It's great we're having these new look buses, and I believe it vastly improves how buses can be seen, but it's not going to work any magic tricks until the infrastructure takes on funding and a competent planning team - but neither seems likely for now.
(07 Jul 2019, 10:06 pm)Jamie M Congestion, and the management thereof is the problem in hand.
1) Our roads are poorly planned, especially bus lanes. The few we have, they either have bottleneck blind joining junctions (eg bottom of lobley hill), filled to the brim with cyclists so renders them useless (eg durham road-harlow green) or so short, pathetic and end up merging with cars every few meters (bensham bank).
2) It's a waste of everybody's money and time to develop these 'solutions', when they offer no benefit except to the white paint and signage budget.
3) Simply put, the only express service I can think of - that is a quicker version of a normal route is the X122, where there's minimal congestion along the route until you hit hexham.
4) If we weren't negotiating traffic lights with no priority and bus lanes that are redundant (...and more painful to use than the normal road), then this would create huge opportunities for the industry.
It's great we're having these new look buses, and I believe it vastly improves how buses can be seen, but it's not going to work any magic tricks until the infrastructure takes on funding and a competent planning team - but neither seems likely for now.
(07 Jul 2019, 8:18 pm)ne14ne1
So what was their reason for dropping it? :-s
I would imagine as with any company a change of leadership at the top comes with a change of vision and difference of opinion regardless of whether people agree or disagree, quite clearly in 2006 when route branding was introduced a lot of services were merged together creating one core route opening up new quick links for passengers while other links were lost has had an impact on grown for the company over the last 13 years.
I'm sure you will heard of the saying "If something isn't broke don't fix it", well I would say in 2006 everything got ripped to shreds and a new era begun under whoever was the MD at the time and with the upcoming services the current MD I feel clearly shares a similar vision to those that come before him, a bit old school shall we say rolling the clock back almost 20 years and reusing an old business model with some tweaks and adaptations to make his own vision successful in the present day.
(07 Jul 2019, 8:18 pm)ne14ne1
So what was their reason for dropping it? :-s
I would imagine as with any company a change of leadership at the top comes with a change of vision and difference of opinion regardless of whether people agree or disagree, quite clearly in 2006 when route branding was introduced a lot of services were merged together creating one core route opening up new quick links for passengers while other links were lost has had an impact on grown for the company over the last 13 years.
I'm sure you will heard of the saying "If something isn't broke don't fix it", well I would say in 2006 everything got ripped to shreds and a new era begun under whoever was the MD at the time and with the upcoming services the current MD I feel clearly shares a similar vision to those that come before him, a bit old school shall we say rolling the clock back almost 20 years and reusing an old business model with some tweaks and adaptations to make his own vision successful in the present day.
(07 Jul 2019, 10:06 pm)Jamie M Congestion, and the management thereof is the problem in hand.
1) Our roads are poorly planned, especially bus lanes. The few we have, they either have bottleneck blind joining junctions (eg bottom of lobley hill), filled to the brim with cyclists so renders them useless (eg durham road-harlow green) or so short, pathetic and end up merging with cars every few meters (bensham bank).
2) It's a waste of everybody's money and time to develop these 'solutions', when they offer no benefit except to the white paint and signage budget.
3) Simply put, the only express service I can think of - that is a quicker version of a normal route is the X122, where there's minimal congestion along the route until you hit hexham.
4) If we weren't negotiating traffic lights with no priority and bus lanes that are redundant (...and more painful to use than the normal road), then this would create huge opportunities for the industry.
It's great we're having these new look buses, and I believe it vastly improves how buses can be seen, but it's not going to work any magic tricks until the infrastructure takes on funding and a competent planning team - but neither seems likely for now.
Durham Road through Low Fell was designed in such a way, that from the mid 80's onwards, it was only going to suit pedestrians and local traffic.
The removal of footbridges and installation of traffic lights every few yards, was a determined way to discouraging traffic from the area.
The recent installation of speed humps, is just painful.
It does nothing to make me want to use the bus (express or not) and I can't be the only one.
In the past, you had longer distance services from say Co Durham, which operated on a limited stop basis once they got in to T&W.
Since then, it seems that a number of these routes have had an x pre-fix added and they now call anywhere any everywhere.
Going from Birtley to Newcastle back in the day, you had the limited stop services or the local services, that stopped everywhere.
The X1 (or X5 as it was known), was limited stop south of the Galleries too. It didn't offer the painful stop/start service around the coalfields, that it does now.
I do think there needs to be some balance, offering passengers an alternative, particularly when travelling a distance.
The X21 did offer some alternative over the 21, but seeing as it now serves Low Fell, the only major difference between the two, is Birtley.
(07 Jul 2019, 10:06 pm)Jamie M Congestion, and the management thereof is the problem in hand.
1) Our roads are poorly planned, especially bus lanes. The few we have, they either have bottleneck blind joining junctions (eg bottom of lobley hill), filled to the brim with cyclists so renders them useless (eg durham road-harlow green) or so short, pathetic and end up merging with cars every few meters (bensham bank).
2) It's a waste of everybody's money and time to develop these 'solutions', when they offer no benefit except to the white paint and signage budget.
3) Simply put, the only express service I can think of - that is a quicker version of a normal route is the X122, where there's minimal congestion along the route until you hit hexham.
4) If we weren't negotiating traffic lights with no priority and bus lanes that are redundant (...and more painful to use than the normal road), then this would create huge opportunities for the industry.
It's great we're having these new look buses, and I believe it vastly improves how buses can be seen, but it's not going to work any magic tricks until the infrastructure takes on funding and a competent planning team - but neither seems likely for now.
Durham Road through Low Fell was designed in such a way, that from the mid 80's onwards, it was only going to suit pedestrians and local traffic.
The removal of footbridges and installation of traffic lights every few yards, was a determined way to discouraging traffic from the area.
The recent installation of speed humps, is just painful.
It does nothing to make me want to use the bus (express or not) and I can't be the only one.
In the past, you had longer distance services from say Co Durham, which operated on a limited stop basis once they got in to T&W.
Since then, it seems that a number of these routes have had an x pre-fix added and they now call anywhere any everywhere.
Going from Birtley to Newcastle back in the day, you had the limited stop services or the local services, that stopped everywhere.
The X1 (or X5 as it was known), was limited stop south of the Galleries too. It didn't offer the painful stop/start service around the coalfields, that it does now.
I do think there needs to be some balance, offering passengers an alternative, particularly when travelling a distance.
The X21 did offer some alternative over the 21, but seeing as it now serves Low Fell, the only major difference between the two, is Birtley.
(08 Jul 2019, 10:30 am)Andreos1
Durham Road through Low Fell was designed in such a way, that from the mid 80's onwards, it was only going to suit pedestrians and local traffic.
The removal of footbridges and installation of traffic lights every few yards, was a determined way to discouraging traffic from the area.
The recent installation of speed humps, is just painful.
It does nothing to make me want to use the bus (express or not) and I can't be the only one.
In the past, you had longer distance services from say Co Durham, which operated on a limited stop basis once they got in to T&W.
Since then, it seems that a number of these routes have had an x pre-fix added and they now call anywhere any everywhere.
Going from Birtley to Newcastle back in the day, you had the limited stop services or the local services, that stopped everywhere.
The X1 (or X5 as it was known), was limited stop south of the Galleries too. It didn't offer the painful stop/start service around the coalfields, that it does now.
I do think there needs to be some balance, offering passengers an alternative, particularly when travelling a distance.
The X21 did offer some alternative over the 21, but seeing as it now serves Low Fell, the only major difference between the two, is Birtley.
The X5 wasn't as frequent, though, with the X1 appearing to be a merger of that and the 194(?) from Washington to Easington Lane.
(08 Jul 2019, 10:30 am)Andreos1
Durham Road through Low Fell was designed in such a way, that from the mid 80's onwards, it was only going to suit pedestrians and local traffic.
The removal of footbridges and installation of traffic lights every few yards, was a determined way to discouraging traffic from the area.
The recent installation of speed humps, is just painful.
It does nothing to make me want to use the bus (express or not) and I can't be the only one.
In the past, you had longer distance services from say Co Durham, which operated on a limited stop basis once they got in to T&W.
Since then, it seems that a number of these routes have had an x pre-fix added and they now call anywhere any everywhere.
Going from Birtley to Newcastle back in the day, you had the limited stop services or the local services, that stopped everywhere.
The X1 (or X5 as it was known), was limited stop south of the Galleries too. It didn't offer the painful stop/start service around the coalfields, that it does now.
I do think there needs to be some balance, offering passengers an alternative, particularly when travelling a distance.
The X21 did offer some alternative over the 21, but seeing as it now serves Low Fell, the only major difference between the two, is Birtley.
The X5 wasn't as frequent, though, with the X1 appearing to be a merger of that and the 194(?) from Washington to Easington Lane.
(08 Jul 2019, 10:34 am)BusLoverMum
The X5 wasn't as frequent, though, with the X1 appearing to be a merger of that and the 194(?) from Washington to Easington Lane.
Yeah, from Shiney to Easington Lane (via Herrington) , you had the hourly 164, the 3 times an hour 194 and the half hourly (limited stop) X5.
The X5 and X6 (that went along the A183 to Sunderland) provided fast links between Shiney and the Galleries.
Between the Galleries and Newcastle, you had (all half hourly) the X4 and X5.
You had others come and go, such as the X2, X15 and X94 - but those two combined to give a frequency not too different to now.
Add in the other services and the frequency was probably greater then, than now.
(08 Jul 2019, 10:34 am)BusLoverMum
The X5 wasn't as frequent, though, with the X1 appearing to be a merger of that and the 194(?) from Washington to Easington Lane.
Yeah, from Shiney to Easington Lane (via Herrington) , you had the hourly 164, the 3 times an hour 194 and the half hourly (limited stop) X5.
The X5 and X6 (that went along the A183 to Sunderland) provided fast links between Shiney and the Galleries.
Between the Galleries and Newcastle, you had (all half hourly) the X4 and X5.
You had others come and go, such as the X2, X15 and X94 - but those two combined to give a frequency not too different to now.
Add in the other services and the frequency was probably greater then, than now.
The X21 did offer some alternative over the 21, but seeing as it now serves Low Fell, the only major difference between the two, is Birtley.
[/quote
Even though it serves low fell it is only one stop. Still a lot quicker than the 21 which is stop/start every five seconds along Durham Road.
The X21 did offer some alternative over the 21, but seeing as it now serves Low Fell, the only major difference between the two, is Birtley.
[/quote
Even though it serves low fell it is only one stop. Still a lot quicker than the 21 which is stop/start every five seconds along Durham Road.
Has owt been mentioned anywhere about the westbound road closure at the A183/Bournmoor?
Saw a sign earlier, stating its going to be closed for 10 weeks. Obviously this will affect a few services and a few stops are going to be missed out.
Checked out the DCC website and it's on there too
http://www.durham.gov.uk/roadworks
(08 Jul 2019, 10:54 am)big mac
Even though it serves low fell it is only one stop. Still a lot quicker than the 21 which is stop/start every five seconds along Durham Road.
To be fair though, it's hardly free flowing along there, even if it's only stopping once.
Chances are, it gets stuck behind a stopping service or at one of the many red lights.
Has owt been mentioned anywhere about the westbound road closure at the A183/Bournmoor?
Saw a sign earlier, stating its going to be closed for 10 weeks. Obviously this will affect a few services and a few stops are going to be missed out.
Checked out the DCC website and it's on there too
http://www.durham.gov.uk/roadworks
(08 Jul 2019, 10:54 am)big mac
Even though it serves low fell it is only one stop. Still a lot quicker than the 21 which is stop/start every five seconds along Durham Road.
To be fair though, it's hardly free flowing along there, even if it's only stopping once.
Chances are, it gets stuck behind a stopping service or at one of the many red lights.
(08 Jul 2019, 6:57 pm)Andreos1
To be fair though, it's hardly free flowing along there, even if it's only stopping once.
Chances are, it gets stuck behind a stopping service or at one of the many red lights.
I live in Low Fell and since it started serving the Cannon it is very handy from a purely selfish point of view!
My general experience of it is that it has doesn't really have any adverse effect on the reliability of the service as most of the route between the Angel and Gateshead has bus lanes in both directions. It's only the short section in the centre of Low Fell where there isn't any.
(08 Jul 2019, 6:57 pm)Andreos1
To be fair though, it's hardly free flowing along there, even if it's only stopping once.
Chances are, it gets stuck behind a stopping service or at one of the many red lights.
I live in Low Fell and since it started serving the Cannon it is very handy from a purely selfish point of view!
My general experience of it is that it has doesn't really have any adverse effect on the reliability of the service as most of the route between the Angel and Gateshead has bus lanes in both directions. It's only the short section in the centre of Low Fell where there isn't any.
(08 Jul 2019, 7:35 pm)big mac
I live in Low Fell and since it started serving the Cannon it is very handy from a purely selfish point of view!
My general experience of it is that it has doesn't really have any adverse effect on the reliability of the service as most of the route between the Angel and Gateshead has bus lanes in both directions. It's only the short section in the centre of Low Fell where there isn't any.
I also live in Low Fell and I completely agree, the only issue for me is the amount of traffic lights through the central section of the fell and those speed humps they've put in along a few of the main junctions between there and Gateshead which do slow traffic down.
(08 Jul 2019, 7:35 pm)big mac
I live in Low Fell and since it started serving the Cannon it is very handy from a purely selfish point of view!
My general experience of it is that it has doesn't really have any adverse effect on the reliability of the service as most of the route between the Angel and Gateshead has bus lanes in both directions. It's only the short section in the centre of Low Fell where there isn't any.
I also live in Low Fell and I completely agree, the only issue for me is the amount of traffic lights through the central section of the fell and those speed humps they've put in along a few of the main junctions between there and Gateshead which do slow traffic down.
(08 Jul 2019, 9:16 pm)MalarkeyI'm surprised the buses have any suspension left with some of those bumps like. You literally have to brace for impact!
I also live in Low Fell and I completely agree, the only issue for me is the amount of traffic lights through the central section of the fell and those speed humps they've put in along a few of the main junctions between there and Gateshead which do slow traffic down.
(08 Jul 2019, 9:16 pm)MalarkeyI'm surprised the buses have any suspension left with some of those bumps like. You literally have to brace for impact!
I also live in Low Fell and I completely agree, the only issue for me is the amount of traffic lights through the central section of the fell and those speed humps they've put in along a few of the main junctions between there and Gateshead which do slow traffic down.
(08 Jul 2019, 7:35 pm)big mac
I live in Low Fell and since it started serving the Cannon it is very handy from a purely selfish point of view!
My general experience of it is that it has doesn't really have any adverse effect on the reliability of the service as most of the route between the Angel and Gateshead has bus lanes in both directions. It's only the short section in the centre of Low Fell where there isn't any.
(08 Jul 2019, 10:59 pm)streetdeckfan I'm surprised the buses have any suspension left with some of those bumps like. You literally have to brace for impact!
My elder ly dd didn't enjoy them. His spine is mine, 25 years on
(08 Jul 2019, 7:35 pm)big mac
I live in Low Fell and since it started serving the Cannon it is very handy from a purely selfish point of view!
My general experience of it is that it has doesn't really have any adverse effect on the reliability of the service as most of the route between the Angel and Gateshead has bus lanes in both directions. It's only the short section in the centre of Low Fell where there isn't any.
(08 Jul 2019, 10:59 pm)streetdeckfan I'm surprised the buses have any suspension left with some of those bumps like. You literally have to brace for impact!
My elder ly dd didn't enjoy them. His spine is mine, 25 years on
PB0003954/1107 Registered (Short notice)
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Herrington Country Park to Bungalow Cafe
Service number: PR3 ()
Service type: Limited Stop
Effective date: 27 Jul 2019
PB0003954/1106 Registered (Short notice)
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Fulwell Quarry to Seaburn, Recreation Park
Service number: PR2 ()
Service type: Limited Stop
Effective date: 27 Jul 2019
PB0003954/1105 Registered (Short notice)
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Deptford Terrace to Seaburn, Recreation Park
Service number: PR1 ()
Service type: Limited Stop
Effective date: 27 Jul 2019
(07 Jul 2019, 10:07 pm)S813 FVKThis appeared a few pages back, and is the main reason for the Red Kite renumbering as far as I'm concerned:
X30 on its own
X31 interwork with X45/X46
X70/X71 interwork with X47
https://northeastbuses.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?tid=1832&pid=230968#pid230968
- for some reason link doesn't want to take you to the post I'm referring to, so I've attached a screenshot of it instead.
Ah cheers! Seems to make sense looking at the timings!!
(07 Jul 2019, 10:07 pm)S813 FVKThis appeared a few pages back, and is the main reason for the Red Kite renumbering as far as I'm concerned:
X30 on its own
X31 interwork with X45/X46
X70/X71 interwork with X47
https://northeastbuses.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?tid=1832&pid=230968#pid230968
- for some reason link doesn't want to take you to the post I'm referring to, so I've attached a screenshot of it instead.
Ah cheers! Seems to make sense looking at the timings!!
(08 Jul 2019, 10:54 am)big macI often meet the same 21 that leaves eldon square at the same time as me at chester.
The X21 did offer some alternative over the 21, but seeing as it now serves Low Fell, the only major difference between the two, is Birtley.
[/quote
Even though it serves low fell it is only one stop. Still a lot quicker than the 21 which is stop/start every five seconds along Durham Road.
(08 Jul 2019, 10:54 am)big macI often meet the same 21 that leaves eldon square at the same time as me at chester.
The X21 did offer some alternative over the 21, but seeing as it now serves Low Fell, the only major difference between the two, is Birtley.
[/quote
Even though it serves low fell it is only one stop. Still a lot quicker than the 21 which is stop/start every five seconds along Durham Road.
(09 Jul 2019, 10:46 am)Jamie M I often meet the same 21 that leaves eldon square at the same time as me at chester.
Would be better having a couple more dupe 21s at peak. than saving no time whatsoever going along the A1M. A bit of a white elephant!
(09 Jul 2019, 10:46 am)Jamie M I often meet the same 21 that leaves eldon square at the same time as me at chester.
Would be better having a couple more dupe 21s at peak. than saving no time whatsoever going along the A1M. A bit of a white elephant!
(09 Jul 2019, 10:46 am)Jamie M .
Would be better having a couple more dupe 21s at peak. than saving no time whatsoever going along the A1M. A bit of a white elephant!
Duplicate 21s aren't a bad idea at all. I'd suggest run peak 21s to Chester instead of the extra peak x21s.
(08 Jul 2019, 10:59 pm)streetdeckfan I'm surprised the buses have any suspension left with some of those bumps like. You literally have to brace for impact!
Surprised I haven't broke my back yet the way some of the drivers go over them, I don't think they realise how highly raised they are.
(09 Jul 2019, 10:46 am)Jamie M I often meet the same 21 that leaves eldon square at the same time as me at chester.
Would be better having a couple more dupe 21s at peak. than saving no time whatsoever going along the A1M. A bit of a white elephant!
Obviously not thrashing that B7 engine enough, would've thought a woman was driving this evening, just kidding your a #cannygnedriver
(08 Jul 2019, 10:59 pm)streetdeckfan I'm surprised the buses have any suspension left with some of those bumps like. You literally have to brace for impact!
Surprised I haven't broke my back yet the way some of the drivers go over them, I don't think they realise how highly raised they are.
(09 Jul 2019, 10:46 am)Jamie M I often meet the same 21 that leaves eldon square at the same time as me at chester.
Would be better having a couple more dupe 21s at peak. than saving no time whatsoever going along the A1M. A bit of a white elephant!
Obviously not thrashing that B7 engine enough, would've thought a woman was driving this evening, just kidding your a #cannygnedriver
