Pricing
Pricing
Completely forgot about this www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/local-news/lord-adonis-experiences-severe-delays-1351360
If the multi millionaire peer, thinks £1.90 is 'steep' for such a short fare, dread to think what his tweets would be for other routes
I think pricing within Tyne & Wear Is generally good. I think it is the rest of the region where it's lacking. I live in County Durham and the lack of any decent ticket where I live is a joke. I think either each local authority, T&W, C. Durham, Northumberland & Teeside all need there own transport card similar to the Nexus Pop/Network 1 system or more favourably a region wide card system, possibly with use on bus/metro/train. I think Zones are just one of them things really, no matter how hard you try there's always going to be a problem with a zone somewhere. I mean take the current borders of GNE's Buzzfare, South Hetton-Easington Lane, I don't know a specific fare but with one being a red zone and in Tyne & Wear and one being in turquoise zone and in County Durham, there's no DayTicket or anything suitable so going across to Sunderland from here is very costly, best option likely to be a two Zone Buzzfare at £6.10! But yet you can go to Middlesbrough for £4.65? It's a bit silly thinking about it like that.
Its when zones are set up with the sole intention of making money that frustrates me.
Key/popular routes with no competition often go through 3 zones end to end, whilst a similar duration/distance journey with competition will only have 1 or 2 zones.
Additional zones were added to the west of the region too.
The old system (which has been mentioned earlier) of Tyne & Wear, Co Durham etc was great for customers, easy to understand and was very affordable.
I have used a similar example previously on the old GNE facebook discussion page, but if I was to buy a red ticket - I could travel from Shiney Row to Woodstone Village to drop the kids at school, change buses and head to Houghton to pay some bills. From there, I can go to Hetton to go to the gym, change onto the bus to Seaham and eventually work my way up to South Shields to do some shopping and get some fish & chips - before making my way to see a mate in Hebburn. Heading home I have a range of options staying in the red zone.
I've travelled miles, used at least 7 buses just to get to Hebburn, but it is cheaper than getting a red/purple ticket from Shiney to Hebburn via Heworth or Gateshead and not being able to drop the kids off, pay the bills, do the shopping or have any fish & chips at the coast...
Aureloin also used the example previously about needing a 3zone ticket to travel between Washington, Chester and Shiney Row (we all know how far you can get on one of those tickets!).
From Bournmoor, it is cheaper to go to Sunderland on the bus, (even though it is further and in a different county) than it is to pop down the road to Chester le Street...
Bought a transfare for the first time in 10 years last night. £4.10 from Central Station to Washington - I kid you not. It's not right people are hit financially just because the metro doesn't cover most of Tyne and Wear. I think a 3 zone single is £3.20 which will get you from south hylton to the airport. 90p less than the said transfare.
(05 Jun 2013, 5:22 pm)aureolin Bought a transfare for the first time in 10 years last night. £4.10 from Central Station to Washington - I kid you not. It's not right people are hit financially just because the metro doesn't cover most of Tyne and Wear. I think a 3 zone single is £3.20 which will get you from south hylton to the airport. 90p less than the said transfare.
(05 Jun 2013, 5:22 pm)aureolin Bought a transfare for the first time in 10 years last night. £4.10 from Central Station to Washington - I kid you not. It's not right people are hit financially just because the metro doesn't cover most of Tyne and Wear. I think a 3 zone single is £3.20 which will get you from south hylton to the airport. 90p less than the said transfare.
(05 Jun 2013, 8:39 pm)Andreos1 How can that be justified a) with the price of the 3 zone single and b) compared to the price of a Day Rover?
I would love to see the breakdown/split and what proportion is "metro" fare and what proportion is "bus" fare.
(05 Jun 2013, 8:39 pm)Andreos1 How can that be justified a) with the price of the 3 zone single and b) compared to the price of a Day Rover?
I would love to see the breakdown/split and what proportion is "metro" fare and what proportion is "bus" fare.
I personally think that cross-operator tickets are needed. I mean some areas especially in County Durham go from being solely GNE to solely Arriva. I mean it's similar in Teeside which has a vast stagecoach presence down there, but that means little buses from other areas. I mean Some example High Pittington-Shotton Colliery, 10 minute car journey, but to get a bus you'll have to take GNE 260/259 to Durham then get Arriva 24/22 or get GNE 259 to Sheburn then the ANE 24. Which means 4 singles, I can only guess at prices but I'm assuming on the 24 it'll be about £2.90 single (£5.00 return?) then if Durham town & city fare zones apply in pittington it'll be £1.45 either way. Leading to a ten minute journeys costing give or take £7.90. Surely it's time County Durham got some sort of cross-operator tickets?
It all comes down to what Lord Adonis and others have said about the NE.
We need to stop acting like a bunch of protective regionally xenophobic parochial idiots.
Newcastle needs to stop looking down at everyone else, Sunderland needs to get over Newcastle and we need that ethos brought into our public transport.
A city wide region from the Tees up to Berwick
(06 Jun 2013, 12:43 pm)CatsFast101 I personally think that cross-operator tickets are needed. I mean some areas especially in County Durham go from being solely GNE to solely Arriva. I mean it's similar in Teeside which has a vast stagecoach presence down there, but that means little buses from other areas. I mean Some example High Pittington-Shotton Colliery, 10 minute car journey, but to get a bus you'll have to take GNE 260/259 to Durham then get Arriva 24/22 or get GNE 259 to Sheburn then the ANE 24. Which means 4 singles, I can only guess at prices but I'm assuming on the 24 it'll be about £2.90 single (£5.00 return?) then if Durham town & city fare zones apply in pittington it'll be £1.45 either way. Leading to a ten minute journeys costing give or take £7.90. Surely it's time County Durham got some sort of cross-operator tickets?
(06 Jun 2013, 12:43 pm)CatsFast101 I personally think that cross-operator tickets are needed. I mean some areas especially in County Durham go from being solely GNE to solely Arriva. I mean it's similar in Teeside which has a vast stagecoach presence down there, but that means little buses from other areas. I mean Some example High Pittington-Shotton Colliery, 10 minute car journey, but to get a bus you'll have to take GNE 260/259 to Durham then get Arriva 24/22 or get GNE 259 to Sheburn then the ANE 24. Which means 4 singles, I can only guess at prices but I'm assuming on the 24 it'll be about £2.90 single (£5.00 return?) then if Durham town & city fare zones apply in pittington it'll be £1.45 either way. Leading to a ten minute journeys costing give or take £7.90. Surely it's time County Durham got some sort of cross-operator tickets?
(06 Jun 2013, 1:08 pm)Kuyoyo(06 Jun 2013, 12:43 pm)CatsFast101 I personally think that cross-operator tickets are needed. I mean some areas especially in County Durham go from being solely GNE to solely Arriva. I mean it's similar in Teeside which has a vast stagecoach presence down there, but that means little buses from other areas. I mean Some example High Pittington-Shotton Colliery, 10 minute car journey, but to get a bus you'll have to take GNE 260/259 to Durham then get Arriva 24/22 or get GNE 259 to Sheburn then the ANE 24. Which means 4 singles, I can only guess at prices but I'm assuming on the 24 it'll be about £2.90 single (£5.00 return?) then if Durham town & city fare zones apply in pittington it'll be £1.45 either way. Leading to a ten minute journeys costing give or take £7.90. Surely it's time County Durham got some sort of cross-operator tickets?
There is a cross operator ticket already - the Explorer North East. £9.30 valid on the big three, any County Durham and Nexus supported services as well as the Metro, the Ferry and Northern Rail between Newcastle and Sunderland. It's valid.
Also, your point regarding Teesside is invalid as we already have cross operator tickets. The Daytripper valid on Arriva and Stagecoach (but it's 5p cheaper on Arriva now than Stagecoach when it used to be the other way round, currently £4.35 on Stagecoach and £4.30 on Arriva). There's also the Easyrider which is available in two forms, the Teesside only zone and also one that covers Hartlepool and East Cleveland. The difference is the Easyrider is also valid on Compass Royston's commercial work (which only consists of their R66 to Teesside PRk and that is part-funded by the park's management) as well as all supported services operated by Leven Valley and Redcar & Cleveland Council.
(06 Jun 2013, 1:08 pm)Kuyoyo(06 Jun 2013, 12:43 pm)CatsFast101 I personally think that cross-operator tickets are needed. I mean some areas especially in County Durham go from being solely GNE to solely Arriva. I mean it's similar in Teeside which has a vast stagecoach presence down there, but that means little buses from other areas. I mean Some example High Pittington-Shotton Colliery, 10 minute car journey, but to get a bus you'll have to take GNE 260/259 to Durham then get Arriva 24/22 or get GNE 259 to Sheburn then the ANE 24. Which means 4 singles, I can only guess at prices but I'm assuming on the 24 it'll be about £2.90 single (£5.00 return?) then if Durham town & city fare zones apply in pittington it'll be £1.45 either way. Leading to a ten minute journeys costing give or take £7.90. Surely it's time County Durham got some sort of cross-operator tickets?
There is a cross operator ticket already - the Explorer North East. £9.30 valid on the big three, any County Durham and Nexus supported services as well as the Metro, the Ferry and Northern Rail between Newcastle and Sunderland. It's valid.
Also, your point regarding Teesside is invalid as we already have cross operator tickets. The Daytripper valid on Arriva and Stagecoach (but it's 5p cheaper on Arriva now than Stagecoach when it used to be the other way round, currently £4.35 on Stagecoach and £4.30 on Arriva). There's also the Easyrider which is available in two forms, the Teesside only zone and also one that covers Hartlepool and East Cleveland. The difference is the Easyrider is also valid on Compass Royston's commercial work (which only consists of their R66 to Teesside PRk and that is part-funded by the park's management) as well as all supported services operated by Leven Valley and Redcar & Cleveland Council.
Sorry for the double post, but something came to me last night and thought it worth sticking on here.
GNE (and other bus companies too) need to make a certain amount of money per mile from their passengers. That probably explains why it costs more on the X1 from Wrekenton to Gateshead/Newcastle than it does on say the 56 or 58 - the X1 can't generate additional revenue from passengers between the points, other than the QE with it being limited stop.
The point I'm making is that on certain routes at certain times of the day, more profit will be generated than others, creating a surplus, which will cover costs when it is quiet.
However, due to the cuts they have made on certain services by axing, reducing or stopping it running in the evening or Sunday, the amount of money they generate will possibly be diminished.
Without having all of their figures to analyse, it becomes difficult - but say I buy a 2 zone ticket at £6.10. The initial bus I get on records that ticket and that service has generated £6.10 towards its income.
If I head to the Metrocentre, changing at the Galleries and Gateshead, immediately, the price GNE are making per mile is diminshed. Because of the cuts made to the daytime services, when I head home, I need to use four buses - opposed to the outgoing journey of 3. Meaning that the revenue generated by my initial £6.10 purchase is minimal. Using a conservative estimate of a 35mile round trip (it is probably nearer 40 miles due to the additional bus on my way home), the pence per mile generated by GNE from my journey is 18p.
That journey isn't beyond normal and is one myself and others make on a regular basis.
The price per mile would actually be more expensive had they not cut/reduced services to save money/generate more day ticket sales.
A few weeks back, I had a red and purple ticket - travelled from home to the Galleries to sort some bills out, back home for a bit, I headed out to Newcastle, popped to Birtley to see family and then had to get a bus to the Galleries so I could get a connecting bus home. The pence per mile generated on that ticket would be minimal.
I know this has been touched on in the past, but compare that to me going on a short journey of 3 miles and being charged £1.45 for a single and the price per mile from that fare is 48p.
Or a 15 mile journey costing £3.15 and the price per mile of 21p.
(13 Jun 2013, 7:38 pm)citaro5284(13 Jun 2013, 6:56 pm)aureolin They narrow the data for the target down far too much. Having a target across a depot or even a brand would provide a far better service than having it per run. It wouldn't please the shareholders though!
The target is based on route
(13 Jun 2013, 7:38 pm)citaro5284(13 Jun 2013, 6:56 pm)aureolin They narrow the data for the target down far too much. Having a target across a depot or even a brand would provide a far better service than having it per run. It wouldn't please the shareholders though!
The target is based on route
The late X1s probably wont be feasible if a typical passenger is using something like an oap pass for a short run from Newbottle club back home to Houghton or a passenger using a heavily diluted day ticket like I have done in the past.
A bus running at that time of night, is very rarely going to pick up cash passengers. It will be people heading home on day/week/28day tickets or for local journeys an oap pass.
Edit: I was reading this earlier. Good job GNE or other local companies don't operate in Brazil! www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-latin-america-22899748
