Yesterday I had a bit of a interesting idea, To build bus stops in the grounds of both Northbound & Southbound Washington Services called the Washington MotoHub. It could be used as a sort bus parkway for washington or an interchange to other areas.
I would like peoples opinions on few questions:
Which routes or operators would serve this?
Would any new passenger flows appear as a result of the proposal?
Could any other service stations in the North East be transformed in a similar manner.
(24 Jul 2021, 6:55 pm)ASX_Terranova wrote [ -> ]Yesterday I had a bit of a interesting idea, To build bus stops in the grounds of both Northbound & Southbound Washington Services called the Washington MotoHub. It could be used as a sort bus parkway for washington or an interchange to other areas.
Washington Services has only one service going anywhere near it (25, Portobello) and the only access to the services area is through a hole in the fence on the Birtley side. Can't remember how accessible it is from the Washington side however no buses currently serve the road leading up to Crowther Industrial Estate (one works service might, but I'd have to check).
Those limitations aside, Washington Sevices is quite difficult for a bus to serve; has limited facilities; and would only interchangeable with one mode of transport (the bus). Why anyone would want to change from a bus to another bus on a petrol station forecourt with extortionate prices for both petrol and groceries is beyond me.
(24 Jul 2021, 7:18 pm)MurdnunoC wrote [ -> ]Washington Services has only one service going anywhere near it (25, Portobello) and the only access to the services area is through a hole in the fence on the Birtley side. Can't remember how accessible it is from the Washington side however no buses currently serve the road leading up to Ceowther Industrial Estate (one works service might, but I'd have to check).
Those limitations aside, Washington Sevices is quite difficult for a bus to serve; has limited facilities; and would only interchangeable with one mode of transport (the bus). Why anyone would want to change from a bus to another bus on a petrol station forecourt with extortionate prices for both petrol and groceries is beyond me.
I was thinking more services that use the A1(M) i.e. GNE X21. You could create a network of services that would connect here quite easily. You could build paths from the shelters to the roads you mentioned. Correct me if i'm wrong but don't some coaches already do this.
(24 Jul 2021, 7:29 pm)ASX_Terranova wrote [ -> ]I was thinking more services that use the A1(M) i.e. GNE X21. You could create a network of services that would connect here quite easily. You could build paths from the shelters to the roads you mentioned. Correct me if i'm wrong but don't some coaches already do this.
They used to, but stopped doing so because it is easier just to pop to the Galleries - where it is more central to Washington and where there are more transport options available.
It wouldn't be easy for buses to serve Washington Services unless you're going to undertake significant road infrastructure realignment including, possibly, a bus bridge across the A1M - in order to minimise slow moving traffic (buses) impeding faster moving vehicles.
It's a thumbs down from me.
(24 Jul 2021, 7:18 pm)MurdnunoC wrote [ -> ]Washington Services has only one service going anywhere near it (25, Portobello) and the only access to the services area is through a hole in the fence on the Birtley side. Can't remember how accessible it is from the Washington side however no buses currently serve the road leading up to Crowther Industrial Estate (one works service might, but I'd have to check).
Those limitations aside, Washington Sevices is quite difficult for a bus to serve; has limited facilities; and would only interchangeable with one mode of transport (the bus). Why anyone would want to change from a bus to another bus on a petrol station forecourt with extortionate prices for both petrol and groceries is beyond me.
5-10 mins walk to the South Bound services from the bus link next to what was Chevvies, but you have to cut through the trees to get into the services bit. The actual footpath takes you to a footbridge (but not the enclosed services one) over to Portobello.
The real limitation is that nobody really wants to go to Washington services unless they have to. I don't think there's anything there other than an overpriced Burger King and a Travelodge either side. I don't see why there'd need to be a bus parkway into Washington either. In the grand scheme of things, its a town with a couple of retail parks (heavily designed for car users), a shopping centre that is a dump and not much else.
The only times I've ever been into Washington Services is on Christmas Day when we usually pop into Costa for a coffee since it's one of the only places open
Personally don't see the point in this. If you wanted something like this you'd be better building a fit for purpose site near Eighton Lodge / The Angel with a large P&R site. It'd be as cheap as retrofitting lifts in a pretty grim bridge which is an issue in itself. You'd also have the bonus of 21, 23, 28, X12, X21 and X22 already passing it.
Not that I'd expect anyone to use it's more for the P&R element more than anything.
(24 Jul 2021, 7:56 pm)Storx wrote [ -> ]Personally don't see the point in this. If you wanted something like this you'd be better building a fit for purpose site near Eighton Lodge / The Angel with a large P&R site. It'd be as cheap as retrofitting lifts in a pretty grim bridge which is an issue in itself. You'd also have the bonus of 21, 23, 28, X12, X21 and X22 already passing it.
Not that I'd expect anyone to use it's more for the P&R element more than anything.
once the Highways agency move in and out after the Birtley to Team Valley works are complete in 4 years time the long awaited Angel P&R at EightonLodge will open.
It’ll be the field to the left of the current slip road onto the A1 southbound, fully funded by Gateshead Council
Don't mention those bloody works!?
(24 Jul 2021, 7:29 pm)ASX_Terranova wrote [ -> ]I was thinking more services that use the A1(M) i.e. GNE X21. You could create a network of services that would connect here quite easily. You could build paths from the shelters to the roads you mentioned. Correct me if i'm wrong but don't some coaches already do this.
I'm led to believe that this isn't permitted at English motorway services for safety reasons.
(24 Jul 2021, 10:05 pm)Ambassador wrote [ -> ]once the Highways agency move in and out after the Birtley to Team Valley works are complete in 4 years time the long awaited Angel P&R at EightonLodge will open.
It’ll be the field to the left of the current slip road onto the A1 southbound, fully funded by Gateshead Council
Didn't realise they finally had plans to do knew it's been in the pipeline for years with a site at Follingsby aswell but haven't heard anything for awhile.
(25 Jul 2021, 9:51 am)Storx wrote [ -> ]Didn't realise they finally had plans to do knew it's been in the pipeline for years with a site at Follingsby aswell but haven't heard anything for awhile.
If it was up to me, I would have went with Follingsby over Eighton Lodge.
The A194(M) gives direct access to the A1 from the South (albeit not from the North unless coming off at the A1231 or going around Washington on the A195); it is accessible from the A19 and potentially has a rail or Metro link if the Leamside Line ever comes back into use. It is also close enough to be used as a Park and Ride for special occasions like the Sunderland Air Show; concerts at the Stadium of Light or The Sage; or sporting events at Gateshead International Stadium, to give just a few examples.
(25 Jul 2021, 4:55 pm)MurdnunoC wrote [ -> ]If it was up to me, I would have went with Follingsby over Eighton Lodge.
The A194(M) gives direct access to the A1 from the South (albeit not from the North unless coming off at the A1231 or going around Washington on the A195); it is accessible from the A19 and potentially has a rail or Metro link if the Leamside Line ever comes back into use. It is also close enough to be used as a Park and Ride for special occasions like the Sunderland Air Show; concerts at the Stadium of Light or The Sage; or sporting events at Gateshead International Stadium, to give just a few examples.
See honestly I thought Follingsby is a bit of weird one as there's no bus service near there to Newcastle so your going to have buses pretty much running parallel to the Metro and it's more buses going into Newcastle etc which if it becomes unpopular is counter productive.
Personally I think they'd be better off just building a decent multi storey at Heworth and utilising the Metro from there which is every 6 minutes (off peak), every 3 mins (peak). Then if they built the Gateshead Quays train station which is rumoured they could have a shuttle train from Newcastle to Heworth and use that multistorey for events etc and could easily use it for the GNR (Metro to South Shields / Newcastle) and the Airshow aswell (Metro to Seaburn).
Least at Eighton Lodge you already have the 21 running through which if needed could easily be made more frequent with some buses terminating at the P&R, maybe more X21 buses either.
(25 Jul 2021, 6:33 pm)Storx wrote [ -> ]See honestly I thought Follingsby is a bit of weird one as there's no bus service near there to Newcastle so your going to have buses pretty much running parallel to the Metro and it's more buses going into Newcastle etc which if it becomes unpopular is counter productive.
Personally I think they'd be better off just building a decent multi storey at Heworth and utilising the Metro from there which is every 6 minutes (off peak), every 3 mins (peak). Then if they built the Gateshead Quays train station which is rumoured they could have a shuttle train from Newcastle to Heworth and use that multistorey for events etc and could easily use it for the GNR (Metro to South Shields / Newcastle) and the Airshow aswell (Metro to Seaburn).
Least at Eighton Lodge you already have the 21 running through which if needed could easily be made more frequent with some buses terminating at the P&R, maybe more X21 buses either.
But why consider buses as the only feasible option for a Park and Ride anyway? Rail and Metro, reliability permitting, offer a faster route into Newcastle and don't suffer from delays brought about by traffic (cars won't just disappear). I mean, I take your point about buses potentially running parallel but it doesn't have to be that way with an holistic planning approach to public transport. Heworth, in my opinion, gets a bit too congested as it is more urban than Follingsby. However, a multi-storey car park could be a step in the right direction if the space is there to construct it.
(25 Jul 2021, 7:04 pm)MurdnunoC wrote [ -> ]But why consider buses as the only feasible option for a Park and Ride anyway? Rail and Metro, reliability permitting, offer a faster route into Newcastle and don't suffer from delays brought about by traffic (cars won't just disappear). I mean, I take your point about buses potentially running parallel but it doesn't have to be that way with an holistic planning approach to public transport. Heworth, in my opinion, gets a bit too congested as it is more urban than Follingsby. However, a multi-storey car park could be a step in the right direction if the space is there to construct it.
Follingsby would be a very good park and ride for the metro, as would a justifiable terminus for Durham being the A690 park and ride.
Nexus need to talk to GBR now, and specify multi voltage for their new trains, or any ideas of congestion busting will be pie in the sky.
(25 Jul 2021, 7:04 pm)MurdnunoC wrote [ -> ]But why consider buses as the only feasible option for a Park and Ride anyway? Rail and Metro, reliability permitting, offer a faster route into Newcastle and don't suffer from delays brought about by traffic (cars won't just disappear). I mean, I take your point about buses potentially running parallel but it doesn't have to be that way with an holistic planning approach to public transport. Heworth, in my opinion, gets a bit too congested as it is more urban than Follingsby. However, a multi-storey car park could be a step in the right direction if the space is there to construct it.
Oh I don't I'm more for the rail park and rides, they'd be more popular imo as the journey time is much quicker and reliable. It's a shame we can't get the Leamside reopened to be honest though it'd be ideal for a Park and Rail site at Follingsby to be honest. Agreed about the congestion problems at Heworth though.
That said though and bringing it back to the thread if there was going to be a Hub anywhere it definitely should be Heworth imo, the place is really underutilised right now and to be honest is a bit of a dump. They should be imo looking at ways to integrate parking, buses, coaches and rail together as one place and make it an actual attractive place to interchange, not a few bus shelters outside a 80's rundown station which you can't access the rail station at all without going outside and down some grim stairs. It literally has everything there but it's just not utilised at all, Four Lane Ends which got redone in the 00's is a much nicer interchange (but in the wrong place).
The coach station in Newcastle is in a pretty unattractive place and Heworth is argubly easier to get to for most of Tyneside. I know they mostly stop at Meadowhall down in Sheffield so don't see why they couldn't do the same at Heworth tbh and it's served from pretty much everywhere South / South East of Newcastle including parts of Sunderland and also all the way down to Middlesbrough.
(25 Jul 2021, 7:18 pm)54APhotography wrote [ -> ]Follingsby would be a very good park and ride for the metro, as would a justifiable terminus for Durham being the A690 park and ride.
Nexus need to talk to GBR now, and specify multi voltage for their new trains, or any ideas of congestion busting will be pie in the sky.
Not sure what the point in that would be, people driving in cars won't want an option to park to use another public transport, that's just a bit of a farce especially when you could just park at one of the Metro stations 5 minutes away. The Stadler trains have a battery pack on though which can travel enough distance to be able to run to Follingsby though think they could get as far as Washington on them as a future proofing for the Leamside Line and I believe potential extensions South of Sunderland.