North East Buses

(21 Jan 2023, 9:58 am)RMF1254 wrote [ -> ]It’s £12 a year for T&W residents, I believe it’s more for Northumberland.

even better value

(21 Jan 2023, 9:58 am)RMF1254 wrote [ -> ]It’s £12 a year for T&W residents, I believe it’s more for Northumberland.

It's £24 for those outside of tyne and wear.
https://www.nexus.org.uk/metro-gold-card

(20 Jan 2023, 9:30 am)ne14ne1 wrote [ -> ]So which streets are the worst for pollution…

We know several Newcastle City Centre streets are along with Gosforth High Street, A1058 Coast Road, and Tyne Bridge/Central Motorway.
Anyone know which others are after that?

Hopefully if Nexus, Northumberland CC, GNE and Arriva all work together with a clean 5 minute service and joint ticketing, that should support a more 'local authority' bid rather than feeding the usual dog eat dog case. PVR would be 28x in total (306/308 = 14x & 309/310 = 14x).

(21 Jan 2023, 8:04 am)Rob44 wrote [ -> ]Can they not buy a gold card to give them free travel?

For £24 a year if you live outside Tyne & Wear? That could well be the impetus for people who might want to throw what cash they do have at city centre stores, a few times a year, to just not bother.

(22 Jan 2023, 4:58 pm)BusLoverMum wrote [ -> ]For £24 a year if you live outside Tyne & Wear? That could well be the impetus for people who might want to throw what cash they do have at city centre stores, a few times a year, to just not bother.

They could go and spend it at metrocentric, Durham, Sunderland Boro... alll have city centres.  How many people will having no buses in newcastle bring in extra? It was like a Utopia on new years day with no fumes from traffic at all.

(22 Jan 2023, 4:42 pm)L469 YVK wrote [ -> ]Hopefully if Nexus, Northumberland CC, GNE and Arriva all work together with a clean 5 minute service and joint ticketing, that should support a more 'local authority' bid rather than feeding the usual dog eat dog case. PVR would be 28x in total (306/308 = 14x & 309/310 = 14x).

If it's based purely on emissions then the 38 would be the better choice for the Coast Road and considering Stagecoach were the ones who commented on the funding coming it would suggest they've got something to do with it as I'm not sure why they'd be happy for their competitors getting funded buses.

My guess personally is something like this: Consett: X5/X15/16 (14), Riverside: 21 (16), Walkergate: 1/38 or 39/40 (22) with the 69 plates staying or displaced to the other two.

With a focus on both Durham and Newcastle; especially when Dickie Holden in Consett is fighting for his seat who has a minister role in transport right now.

(22 Jan 2023, 7:03 pm)Storx wrote [ -> ]If it's based purely on emissions then the 38 would be the better choice for the Coast Road and considering Stagecoach were the ones who commented on the funding coming it would suggest they've got something to do with it as I'm not sure why they'd be happy for their competitors getting funded buses.

My guess personally is something like this: Consett: X5/X15/16 (14), Riverside: 21 (16), Walkergate: 1/38 or 39/40 (22) with the 69 plates staying or displaced to the other two.

With a focus on both Durham and Newcastle; especially when Dickie Holden in Consett is fighting for his seat who has a minister role in transport right now.

It's worth pointing out that the failed Transport North East ZEBRA bid was for just under £19 million too, so I wouldn't expect to see the use of this fund far-deviate from an already written business case.

(22 Jan 2023, 5:50 pm)Rob44 wrote [ -> ]They could go and spend it at metrocentric, Durham, Sunderland Boro... alll have city centres.  How many people will having no buses in newcastle bring in extra? It was like a Utopia on new years day with no fumes from traffic at all.

Have you visited Durham and Sunderland City centres, lately? There ain't much there for shopping. Metrocentre isn't a city centre any more than Team Valley or the Arnison Centre are.

Even I have run out of reasons to venture into Durham city centre all that often and I live in walking distance.

(23 Jan 2023, 2:26 pm)BusLoverMum wrote [ -> ]Have you visited Durham and Sunderland City centres, lately? There ain't much there for shopping. Metrocentre isn't a city centre any more than Team Valley or the Arnison Centre are.

Even I have run out of reasons to venture into Durham city centre all that often and I live in walking distance.

If I want something that I can't (or don't want to) get online, I don't bother with anywhere but Newcastle for it nowadays. Durham and the Metrocentre have been on a downward spiral for years, largely due to unsustainable rents. Sunderland is dead and buried as far as retail goes.

Newcastle is also very easy and hassle free to travel to compared to the others.

(23 Jan 2023, 2:40 pm)Adrian wrote [ -> ]If I want something that I can't (or don't want to) get online, I don't bother with anywhere but Newcastle for it nowadays. Durham and the Metrocentre have been on a downward spiral for years, largely due to unsustainable rents. Sunderland is dead and buried as far as retail goes.

Newcastle is also very easy and hassle free to travel to compared to the others.

The closest to Durham I get for shopping is Arnison Centre or the retail parks near Tesco, the actual city is awful.

The only thing I would actually bother going there for was CEX or Poundland, but they're both at Arnison Centre now

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(23 Jan 2023, 9:14 am)Adrian wrote [ -> ]It's worth pointing out that the failed Transport North East ZEBRA bid was for just under £19 million too, so I wouldn't expect to see the use of this fund far-deviate from an already written business case.

Yeah had that mind when choosing Consett and 21 if I had to be honest. 

But it was mostly on where it could be done without spending an absolute fortune rebuilding depots as £30m let's say 50/50 won't get far with the charging equipment took off.

Blyth, Percy Main, Washington, Durham, Slatyford, South Shields and Wheatsheaf would be all expensive rebuilds or remodels. Which leaves Deptford (not sure if there's even space there), Ashington (which just seems the wrong depot), Consett, Riverside and Walkergate (where Arriva is currently). 

Not to mention the West End would be an ideal place for them and the 1 and 38 serve arguably the most important parts of the Coast Road anyway, with the Metro frequency increase and B&T Railway serving the more extreme areas.

(23 Jan 2023, 3:37 pm)streetdeckfan wrote [ -> ]The closest to Durham I get for shopping is Arnison Centre or the retail parks near Tesco, the actual city is awful.

The only thing I would actually bother going there for was CEX or Poundland, but they're both at Arnison Centre now

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For me, it's mostly the bank or post office as our local is now a boring traipse to the far end of Newton Hall. Even then I might save it for a trip to Newcastle and use the one in Smith's, there.

(23 Jan 2023, 2:26 pm)BusLoverMum wrote [ -> ]Have you visited Durham and Sunderland City centres, lately? There ain't much there for shopping. Metrocentre isn't a city centre any more than Team Valley or the Arnison Centre are.

Even I have run out of reasons to venture into Durham city centre all that often and I live in walking distance.

Can't remember the last time I went to the city centre, last time I went, it was a dump, not sure how a new train station or the VAUX development will attract people.. when the shops are all crap.

(23 Jan 2023, 4:06 pm)Michael wrote [ -> ]Can't remember the last time I went to the city centre, last time I went, it was a dump, not sure how a new train station or the VAUX development will attract people.. when the shops are all crap.

I need to visit to take a sewing machine in for a service, at some point but other than passing through, it no longer has anything to offer, since Debenhams went. I can see the markses there going the way of the Middlesbrough one - the building it's in is barely fit for purpose and the taps never work in the loos so goodness knows how they manage in the coffee shop.

I won't even joke about it being good if you fancy a Greggs, as I live pretty much opposite one!

Following comment by Adrian to take this thread back to topic, Transport North East did publicise back in December that a bit was being submitted, though it doesn't include any particular detail. It followed comment passed by TNE when the ZEBRA bid was unsuccessful that alternative funding streams would be sought.

https://www.transportnortheast.gov.uk/ca...nding-bid/

North East MPs and transport leaders are backing a new £19.5m bid to decarbonise transport in the North East through the delivery of new electric buses and Electric Vehicle (EV) charging facilities for local people.

The bid, developed in partnership by Transport North East on behalf of the North East Joint Transport Committee, Arriva North East, Go North East, Stagecoach and the seven local authorities, was submitted to Government as part of the Levelling Up Fund (Round 2). The submission was endorsed by Liz Twist, MP for Blaydon. 

If successful, the funding will boost the zero carbon transport options available for people in the North East – both by investing in additional electric buses which will operate across the region and new EV chargers which will encourage more people to consider switching to a zero-emission vehicle.

The bid would fund 52 new high-quality zero emission buses which would join the public transport network alongside supporting infrastructure. Buses would operate on eight of the highest frequency bus routes across the North East. These routes experience some of the highest levels of air pollution, with this investment part of the strategy for a zero-emission transport system.

The funding would also provide 92 new EV chargers across 36 regional sites. These would include Park & Ride locations and other key destinations to encourage multi-modal journeys which use public transport for at least part of the journey.

Cllr Martin Gannon, Chair, North East Joint Transport Committee, said: “If we are successful in securing this £19.5m investment, we will greatly improve the availability of zero carbon transport options for local people – allowing greener journeys to work, school and leisure opportunities.

“The project would improve our air quality while reducing congestion on our roads and noise pollution which is great news all round. High-tech electric buses offer a modern, comfortable journey for passengers and, for those who do need to drive, an enhanced network of EV chargers at Park and Ride sites we hope will encourage more people to use public transport for part of their journeys.

“I hope the Government sees the strength of the North East Levelling Up Fund bid and the support it has – we are determined to secure funding needed to drive forward ambitious local projects which greatly improve our transport network.”

Following submission, the Government is now appraising the schemes submitted across the UK with a decision expected late 2022.

So according to this article, the buses from the leveling up fund will be.

Stagecoach: 20 single decks for E1, E2 and E6

Arriva: 13 double and 1 single deck for 43, 44, 45 and 47

Go Ahead: 14 double decks for 21

https://www.route-one.net/news/52-more-b...t-england/

(31 Jan 2023, 10:08 am)Shrek wrote [ -> ]So according to this article, the buses from the leveling up fund will be.

Stagecoach: 20 single decks for E1, E2 and E6

Arriva: 13 double and 1 single deck for 43, 44, 45 and 47

Go Ahead: 14 double decks for 21

https://www.route-one.net/news/52-more-b...t-england/

Assuming this confirms that the 43/44/45 and 47 are going to Ashington long term now as there's no space for electric charging at Blyth, unless there's plans to move depot completely.

Also good to see the 'levelling up' fund is going to level up all the poverty in Gosforth especially when the Q3 already runs along there.

(31 Jan 2023, 10:52 am)Storx wrote [ -> ]Assuming this confirms that the 43/44/45 and 47 are going to Ashington long term now as there's no space for electric charging at Blyth, unless there's plans to move depot completely.

Also good to see the 'levelling up' fund is going to level up all the poverty in Gosforth especially when the Q3 already runs along there. 

Never mind that, what about the 21?
How much money has that had over the years? 
For such a profitable route, you would assume they could use that to buy some of their own vehicles...

(31 Jan 2023, 11:30 am)Andreos1 wrote [ -> ]Never mind that, what about the 21?
How much money has that had over the years? 
For such a profitable route, you would assume they could use that to buy some of their own vehicles...

Couldn't agree more!!!

Surely if GNE had " unprofitable" routes they could stick these electric buses on there and maybe they would become profitable ?>

(31 Jan 2023, 12:02 pm)Rob44 wrote [ -> ]Couldn't agree more!!!

Surely if GNE had " unprofitable" routes they could stick these electric buses on there and maybe they would become profitable ?>

If it's the same terms as the previous funding for EVs (I haven't looked into it), then doesn't it only cover the additional cost for it being an EV over the equivalent Diesel vehicle?

So would the route not have to be profitable enough to support a brand new bus regardless of the funding?

(31 Jan 2023, 12:17 pm)streetdeckfan wrote [ -> ]If it's the same terms as the previous funding for EVs (I haven't looked into it), then doesn't it only cover the additional cost for it being an EV over the equivalent Diesel vehicle?

So would the route not have to be profitable enough to support a brand new bus regardless of the funding?

It doesn't even cover that. The costings were around £379,801 per single deck bus and around £435,685 for a decker, in the ZEBRA bid last year, and the expectation was that the operators would have to more than match the Government funding.

(31 Jan 2023, 12:17 pm)streetdeckfan wrote [ -> ]If it's the same terms as the previous funding for EVs (I haven't looked into it), then doesn't it only cover the additional cost for it being an EV over the equivalent Diesel vehicle?

So would the route not have to be profitable enough to support a brand new bus regardless of the funding?

Ah right. that's fare enough then, although when they go onto the 21 they are just going to make a already profitable route more profitable for  no extra outlay?  Although electric might be as expensive as diesel by the time they arrive

(31 Jan 2023, 10:08 am)Shrek wrote [ -> ]So according to this article, the buses from the leveling up fund will be.

Stagecoach: 20 single decks for E1, E2 and E6

Arriva: 13 double and 1 single deck for 43, 44, 45 and 47

Go Ahead: 14 double decks for 21

https://www.route-one.net/news/52-more-b...t-england/

I wonder if that confirms the E services will go back to every 20 mins (7 mins combined)

Edit:

Current E routes PVR is 9
Back to pre-covid will be 13

7 spare


Wonder if the spares, would go on the X24

I'm surprised the 21 isn't getting more than 14 for spare/s as isn't the 21's PVR 14? Not sure if the other routes are getting spares, not familiar on those routes.

(31 Jan 2023, 5:21 pm)Jack Gill wrote [ -> ]I'm surprised the 21 isn't getting more than 14 for spare/s as isn't the 21's PVR 14? Not sure if the other routes are getting spares, not familiar on those routes.

It’s 18 buses. A mistake in the article.


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(31 Jan 2023, 5:27 pm)Dan wrote [ -> ]It’s 18 buses. A mistake in the article.


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Thanks Dan. I was wondering where the other 4 buses would go

(31 Jan 2023, 5:27 pm)Dan wrote [ -> ]It’s 18 buses. A mistake in the article.


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Ah, thanks.

(31 Jan 2023, 4:45 pm)Michael wrote [ -> ]I wonder if that confirms the E services will go back to every 20 mins (7 mins combined)

Edit:

Current E routes PVR is 9
Back to pre-covid will be 13

7 spare


Wonder if the spares, would go on the X24

Can't see them going on the X24, it's the total wrong type of bus route and very likely couldn't do a days work. More than likely go onto something like the 20 instead (PVR 5) which is Sunderland's most frequent bus route I believe.

(31 Jan 2023, 6:28 pm)Storx wrote [ -> ]Can't see them going on the X24, it's the total wrong type of bus route and very likely couldn't do a days work. More than likely go onto something like the 20 instead (PVR 5) which is Sunderland's most frequent bus route I believe.

The fact they've done a new network map though - https://tiscon-maps-stagecoachbus.s3.ama...023JAN.pdf. Probably suggests they're not going back up though.

That's true, I forgot about the 20 tbh

(31 Jan 2023, 6:44 pm)Michael wrote [ -> ]That's true, I forgot about the 20 tbh

https://bustimes.org/vehicles/scne-28031...2023-01-30 - Just quickly worked it out believe it's about 15 mile end to end and that board there does 16 runs which is roughly 240 mile. Believe their range is 200 mile or so, so couldn't do it unless there's form of charging on route.