North East Buses
Disruptions and driver shortages - Printable Version

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RE: Disruptions. - Malarkey - 17 Sep 2021

I finished work at 8pm and got my usual 309 into Newcastle without issue getting into Eldon Square at around 20:35 just missing the 21 departure around this time due to Percy Main's very slow drivers changes as always at New York the driver thereafter being in James May mode into town knowing he/she will leave town on the 310 on time, does not help those needing a connecting service.

As has been the case since Tuesday the 20:45 (21) was cancelled which would be the one i'd usually get home, I knew at this point the next one was 21:00 with a 28B at the same with both cancelled at this point the next bus was the X21 at 21:15 by which time I decided to get a Taxi as I did want to wait any longer as did a number other potential passengers, there was around 20 people waiting when I got into Eldon Square by the time I decided to leave there was 6 left waiting, one bloke was going to get a 21 to Chester-Le-Street and then from there the 8 to Stanley, I advised him to go up the top and wait for one of the expresses as would get home quicker.

I personally think it is quite shocking that whilst I understand there is so called "Driver Shortage" that it is unacceptable for the operator to allow so many services to be cancelled along one corridor in the late evening, more so when you 52,000 Mags watching Newcastle at home this evening against Leeds, how are they getting home this evening I wonder?

I think the independent operators were possible like we seen in Manchester during the Go North West strike need to be drafted in to keep services operating as these sort of cancellations simply cannot continue, more so when on a day by day basis it is different journey's that are being cancelled left, right and centre.


RE: Disruptions. - Adrian - 17 Sep 2021

(17 Sep 2021, 10:08 pm)Malarkey I finished work at 8pm and got my usual 309 into Newcastle without issue getting into Eldon Square at around 20:35 just missing the 21 departure around this time due to Percy Main's very slow drivers changes as always at New York the driver thereafter being in James May mode into town knowing he/she will leave town on the 310 on time, does not help those needing a connecting service.

As has been the case since Tuesday the 20:45 (21) was cancelled which would be the one i'd usually get home, I knew at this point the next one was 21:00 with a 28B at the same with both cancelled at this point the next bus was the X21 at 21:15 by which time I decided to get a Taxi as I did want to wait any longer as did a number other potential passengers, there was around 20 people waiting when I got into Eldon Square by the time I decided to leave there was 6 left waiting, one bloke was going to get a 21 to Chester-Le-Street and then from there the 8 to Stanley, I advised him to go up the top and wait for one of the expresses as would get home quicker.

I personally think it is quite shocking that whilst I understand there is so called "Driver Shortage" that it is unacceptable for the operator to allow so many services to be cancelled along one corridor in the late evening, more so when you 52,000 Mags watching Newcastle at home this evening against Leeds, how are they getting home this evening I wonder?

I think the independent operators were possible like we seen in Manchester during the Go North West strike need to be drafted in to keep services operating as these sort of cancellations simply cannot continue, more so when on a day by day basis it is different journey's that are being cancelled left, right and centre.

It's not a "so called driver shortage", there's a national shortage of labour. It's been experienced across multiple industries, especially those with lower pay and conditions, such as transport and hospitality. It's also been reported over the media for months now: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/cbi-staff-shortages-lorry-drivers-b1914605.html

I agree that its poor to have multiple services cancelled around the same time on one corridor, but given how tightly/'efficiently' operators seem to schedule (with duty boards are scheduled to the minute in terms of start times, finish times and legal breaks), I'd imagine it removes much flexibility in terms of asking Joe Bloggs to cover a 21 instead of a 34. With any leading drivers most likely already on the road.

As I understand CBBSG ended in August, I doubt trying to sub-contract commercial work out on a larger basis is affordable. Of course, that's on the assumption that independent operators aren't in the same boat... GCT seemed to hit this problem a few month ago.

I do however think there's been a lack of foresight here. As mentioned, national labour shortages have been in the media for months now, so I'd be really surprised if these so-called industry insiders weren't briefing operators even before then. I'm more surprised that we haven't seen the implementation of a reduced/emergency timetable by operators yet, reducing some of the high frequency services to allow some staff to be used as 'hot spares' to cover short-notice sickness etc. It would feel like a better solution than the current firefighting.


RE: Disruptions. - stagecoachbusdepot - 17 Sep 2021

(17 Sep 2021, 10:08 pm)Malarkey I finished work at 8pm and got my usual 309 into Newcastle without issue getting into Eldon Square at around 20:35 just missing the 21 departure around this time due to Percy Main's very slow drivers changes as always at New York the driver thereafter being in James May mode into town knowing he/she will leave town on the 310 on time, does not help those needing a connecting service.

As has been the case since Tuesday the 20:45 (21) was cancelled which would be the one i'd usually get home, I knew at this point the next one was 21:00 with a 28B at the same with both cancelled at this point the next bus was the X21 at 21:15 by which time I decided to get a Taxi as I did want to wait any longer as did a number other potential passengers, there was around 20 people waiting when I got into Eldon Square by the time I decided to leave there was 6 left waiting, one bloke was going to get a 21 to Chester-Le-Street and then from there the 8 to Stanley, I advised him to go up the top and wait for one of the expresses as would get home quicker.

I personally think it is quite shocking that whilst I understand there is so called "Driver Shortage" that it is unacceptable for the operator to allow so many services to be cancelled along one corridor in the late evening, more so when you 52,000 Mags watching Newcastle at home this evening against Leeds, how are they getting home this evening I wonder?

Tbh, although several services were seemingly cancelled along a similar corridor, it was at worst a 40 minute wait...which while no doubt annoying after a day at work is not really that bad for the time of night (many services operating a 30 min or less evening frequency).  I suspect this may be why there is nothing stated as to when or if taxi fares would be refunded etc - clearly the absence of the last run of the day would be a clear cut case, but when it comes to delays the line of what's acceptable becomes very subjective.

(17 Sep 2021, 10:35 pm)Adrian I'm more surprised that we haven't seen the implementation of a reduced/emergency timetable by operators yet, reducing some of the high frequency services to allow some staff to be used as 'hot spares' to cover short-notice sickness etc. It would feel like a better solution than the current firefighting.

I guess the closest we have seen so far is Stagecoach in Newcastle with the reduced frequency on the 30/31/36 and temp cancellation of the 100.  Entirely subjective based on what I've noticed on bustimes (not detailed analysis!) it seems Stagecoach arent experiencing anything like the level of missing journeys - may just be that it's less visible/they may be lucky with staff absence & retention/the reduced timetables may be helping or more likely a combination of these factors.


RE: Disruptions. - idiot - 18 Sep 2021

I think it's been happening for a week or so now so GNE should have in place that all early morning and evening services run and the affected routes should be high frequency routes during the day.


RE: Disruptions. - RobinHood - 18 Sep 2021

(17 Sep 2021, 10:35 pm)Adrian It's not a "so called driver shortage", there's a national shortage of labour. It's been experienced across multiple industries, especially those with lower pay and conditions, such as transport and hospitality. It's also been reported over the media for months now: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/cbi-staff-shortages-lorry-drivers-b1914605.html

I agree that its poor to have multiple services cancelled around the same time on one corridor, but given how tightly/'efficiently' operators seem to schedule (with duty boards are scheduled to the minute in terms of start times, finish times and legal breaks), I'd imagine it removes much flexibility in terms of asking Joe Bloggs to cover a 21 instead of a 34. With any leading drivers most likely already on the road.

As I understand CBBSG ended in August, I doubt trying to sub-contract commercial work out on a larger basis is affordable. Of course, that's on the assumption that independent operators aren't in the same boat... GCT seemed to hit this problem a few month ago.

I do however think there's been a lack of foresight here. As mentioned, national labour shortages have been in the media for months now, so I'd be really surprised if these so-called industry insiders weren't briefing operators even before then. I'm more surprised that we haven't seen the implementation of a reduced/emergency timetable by operators yet, reducing some of the high frequency services to allow some staff to be used as 'hot spares' to cover short-notice sickness etc. It would feel like a better solution than the current firefighting.
The problem is, when CBSSG ended and the new BRG funding started, one of the hurdles is maintaining at least 90% of scheduled mileage (Vs before COVID).

This is why operators are reluctant to reduce mileage as they will get reduced funding if they do. Yes, reducing mileage will reduce costs somewhat, but certainly not im correlation.


RE: Disruptions. - mb134 - 18 Sep 2021

(17 Sep 2021, 10:35 pm)Adrian I do however think there's been a lack of foresight here. As mentioned, national labour shortages have been in the media for months now, so I'd be really surprised if these so-called industry insiders weren't briefing operators even before then. I'm more surprised that we haven't seen the implementation of a reduced/emergency timetable by operators yet, reducing some of the high frequency services to allow some staff to be used as 'hot spares' to cover short-notice sickness etc. It would feel like a better solution than the current firefighting.

I wonder, in GNEs case, if it would have been a better idea to postpone some of the service extensions at the start of September. Things like the X1 extensions to Peterlee and Dalton Park, and the 21 extension to Brandon will no doubt increase driver requirements for those depots - and the 21 in particular seems to be getting cancelled with some frequency. In other words, look after the network they have and try to expand when they have sufficient resources to do so.


Disruptions. - Dan - 18 Sep 2021

(18 Sep 2021, 9:56 am)mb134 I wonder, in GNEs case, if it would have been a better idea to postpone some of the service extensions at the start of September. Things like the X1 extensions to Peterlee and Dalton Park, and the 21 extension to Brandon will no doubt increase driver requirements for those depots - and the 21 in particular seems to be getting cancelled with some frequency. In other words, look after the network they have and try to expand when they have sufficient resources to do so.


The people of Brandon seem to be pretty happy that the 21 is running - as the 49 rarely turns up, by all accounts!


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RE: Disruptions. - Rob44 - 18 Sep 2021

I was at the match last night and against my better judgement decided to use the bus.

Went out for the 28a to town at 530. App said running on time until I git to stop and it suddenly became 15 minutes late. It also said on the app the bus was "quiet". When me and Mrs got on no a double seat available and by Saltwell road people were standing. Thankfully on the way back all was good. $1 to Gateshead on 27 which also was almost fill at 1020 several quick pints in the Britex blokes bar the an onetime 28b home. So thanks for getting home gne in these testing times


RE: Disruptions. - mb134 - 18 Sep 2021

(18 Sep 2021, 10:09 am)Dan The people of Brandon seem to be pretty happy that the 21 is running - as the 49 rarely turns up, by all accounts!


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Granted Bustimes can be inaccurate, but looking over the past few days there appears to be only a handful of 49 journeys missing. Not exactly "rarely" turning up! I also note today that GNE have posted that multiple Brandon journeys are starting at CLS - those in glass houses...

That said, I don't see how that helps the passengers on the rest of the 21 route, or other services that CLS are dropping such as the 28.


RE: Disruptions. - Keeiajs - 18 Sep 2021

265/65 seems to be getting a lot of breakdowns since the new streetlites came


Disruptions. - Dan - 18 Sep 2021

(18 Sep 2021, 10:31 am)mb134 Granted Bustimes can be inaccurate, but looking over the past few days there appears to be only a handful of 49 journeys missing. Not exactly "rarely" turning up! I also note today that GNE have posted that multiple Brandon journeys are starting at CLS - those in glass houses...

That said, I don't see how that helps the passengers on the rest of the 21 route, or other services that CLS are dropping such as the 28.


Always so serious!


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RE: Disruptions. - BusLoverMum - 18 Sep 2021

Arriva have already reduced some county Durham services. The 64 is down to 4 buses an hour from 6 and even they're not all turning up. It's put me off buying a return ticket on it.


RE: Disruptions. - MurdnunoC - 18 Sep 2021

Rumour has it GNE were meant to turn up at some food festival today but didn't...

It appears disruptions are even affecting PR opportunities now!


RE: Disruptions. - L469 YVK - 18 Sep 2021

(17 Sep 2021, 10:08 pm)Malarkey I finished work at 8pm and got my usual 309 into Newcastle without issue getting into Eldon Square at around 20:35 just missing the 21 departure around this time due to Percy Main's very slow drivers changes as always at New York the driver thereafter being in James May mode into town knowing he/she will leave town on the 310 on time, does not help those needing a connecting service.
"Toading" was one of my pet hates when I had to use the bus for work although I still do use buses casually.

Fair enough if:
- Road & traffic conditions are unfavourable
- Prevent early running for stops en-route but not the terminus
- Bus has driveable defect

Other than that, it's extremely annoying when passengers could've avoidably not been delayed. Thankfully, I haven't experienced it too many times with GNE and most drivers do try to keep to time within permitted safety & running boundaries.


RE: Disruptions. - GNE6312 - 18 Sep 2021

(18 Sep 2021, 7:06 pm)MurdnunoC Rumour has it GNE were meant to turn up at some food festival today but didn't...

It appears disruptions are even affecting PR opportunities now!
This was also obvious with the absence of the them on the ECML rail replacement instead the Northern journeys were operated by Garnett's, LNERs were various independent operators and XCs were whitestar travel.


Disruptions. - Adrian - 10 Dec 2021

Starting to think I'm really unlucky, but almost every time I go for this X1 extension to Dalton Park, its cancelled or doesn't run!

Another customer has just been asking about it at Newbottle, saying it was also the case earlier in the week for her.

Oh well. Only an hour until the next one might turn up.

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Disruptions. - cbma06 - 10 Dec 2021

(10 Dec 2021, 9:45 am)Adrian Starting to think I'm really unlucky, but almost every time I go for this X1 extension to Dalton Park, its cancelled or doesn't run!

Another customer has just been asking about it at Newbottle, saying it was also the case earlier in the week for her.

Oh well. Only an hour until the next one might turn up.

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You could get any x1 to Hetton then get the half hourly service 65 from Hetton to Dalton park


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RE: Disruptions. - Andreos1 - 10 Dec 2021

(10 Dec 2021, 9:45 am)Adrian Starting to think I'm really unlucky, but almost every time I go for this X1 extension to Dalton Park, its cancelled or doesn't run!

Another customer has just been asking about it at Newbottle, saying it was also the case earlier in the week for her.

Oh well. Only an hour until the next one might turn up.

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Owt on social media about it not running?

(10 Dec 2021, 10:27 am)cbma06 You could get any x1 to Hetton then get the half hourly service 65 from Hetton to Dalton park


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It's an option I suppose, but could end up leaving customers out of pocket due to not being able to buy a single/return and depending on connection times, more than inconvenienced or delayed too.


RE: Disruptions. - Rob44 - 10 Dec 2021

(10 Dec 2021, 11:13 am)Andreos1 Owt on social media about it not running?


It's an option I suppose, but could end up leaving customers out of pocket due to not being able to buy a single/return and depending on connection times, more than inconvenienced or delayed too.

This is what gets me too. A number of people on here are quick to say "you could jump on the bus to gateshead" when they are turning buses there for late running leaving Newcastle stranded... but if your just buying a single its 1.80 ( i think) then the same price from gateshead to you destination as it would have been from Newcastle. Now wouldn't it be a good idea to get buses going to town to pick up those waiting and get them to gateshead to catch the bus from there for free?  Just a thought


Disruptions. - cbma06 - 10 Dec 2021

(10 Dec 2021, 11:13 am)Andreos1 Owt on social media about it not running?


It's an option I suppose, but could end up leaving customers out of pocket due to not being able to buy a single/return and depending on connection times, more than inconvenienced or delayed too.


Day tickets might be better , depends on the length of journey though, I’m sure GNE would prefer to sell there day tickets etc…

The extensions of x1 to Dalton park and Peterlee might look good through passengers eyes but since there are other services duplicating those extension sections by the same bus company and since the 65 have been turned into a bigger bus and frequency been doubled , GNE could advertise the 65 to Dalton Park connection on there X1 timetables and on the bus to promote the connection, same as the X1 to Easington lane and onward connection with service 55 and 62 to Peterlee, probably more towards service 55 as it’s a bigger bus than the 62, I’m surprised GNE are duplicating there routes since there’s a pandemic on and it’s been said that there still making a loss or the money from the government will shortly be going and there have to start making cut backs?.

The X1 extension that GNE should of looked into was extending some journeys from Easington Lane towards Haswell/Shotton/Wheatley Hill/side of Thornley and Ludworth back up the side of Haswell to Easington Lane, which would of been links between the villages and lost connection to Hetton/Houghton and towards Washington to Newcastle which were lost decades ago.


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