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East Coast Main Line

 
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12 Sep 2021, 7:28 am #81
(12 Sep 2021, 7:25 am)IRHardy It seems as though the implementation of the new timetable has been delayed by a year or more due to the outcry at the proposals which are mainly just to allow LNER to get to Edinburgh 15 minutes faster than they do now.
That's due to no upgrade of OLE north of Newcastle. Still... There ain't enough juice..
54APhotography
12 Sep 2021, 7:28 am #81

(12 Sep 2021, 7:25 am)IRHardy It seems as though the implementation of the new timetable has been delayed by a year or more due to the outcry at the proposals which are mainly just to allow LNER to get to Edinburgh 15 minutes faster than they do now.
That's due to no upgrade of OLE north of Newcastle. Still... There ain't enough juice..

Andreos1



14,155
17 Dec 2021, 12:27 pm #82
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-tyne-59696134

Push to re-open Consett rail link and connect with ECML.

'Illegitimis non carborundum'
Andreos1
17 Dec 2021, 12:27 pm #82

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-tyne-59696134

Push to re-open Consett rail link and connect with ECML.


'Illegitimis non carborundum'

Adrian



9,566
17 Dec 2021, 1:22 pm #83
(17 Dec 2021, 12:27 pm)Andreos1 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-tyne-59696134

Push to re-open Consett rail link and connect with ECML.

Sounds like the congestion-busting buses of North West Durham aren't doing it for Dicky.

In seriousness, and whilst I can't see either happening, the Annfield Plain/Stanley route is probably the better option, but you then hit the hurdle of how many paths they're likely to be given on the ECML, where it would join around Birtley. It's already over-congested with no light at the end of the tunnel, thanks to the Tories already kicking the much more widely-supported Leamside reopening into the long grass. That of course impacts the likely frequency along the line.

The frequency can of course reduce any benefits gained from journey time, but I'd be interested in what they'd anticipate as a journey time between Consett and Newcastle. Whilst the X70/X71 aren't exactly the quickest routes, I think we'd see them become a lot quicker faced with competition from a train.

I just can't see the business case stacking up here, and I think its nothing more than a token gesture from the politicians.

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Adrian
17 Dec 2021, 1:22 pm #83

(17 Dec 2021, 12:27 pm)Andreos1 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-tyne-59696134

Push to re-open Consett rail link and connect with ECML.

Sounds like the congestion-busting buses of North West Durham aren't doing it for Dicky.

In seriousness, and whilst I can't see either happening, the Annfield Plain/Stanley route is probably the better option, but you then hit the hurdle of how many paths they're likely to be given on the ECML, where it would join around Birtley. It's already over-congested with no light at the end of the tunnel, thanks to the Tories already kicking the much more widely-supported Leamside reopening into the long grass. That of course impacts the likely frequency along the line.

The frequency can of course reduce any benefits gained from journey time, but I'd be interested in what they'd anticipate as a journey time between Consett and Newcastle. Whilst the X70/X71 aren't exactly the quickest routes, I think we'd see them become a lot quicker faced with competition from a train.

I just can't see the business case stacking up here, and I think its nothing more than a token gesture from the politicians.


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Andreos1



14,155
17 Dec 2021, 1:44 pm #84
(17 Dec 2021, 1:22 pm)Adrian Sounds like the congestion-busting buses of North West Durham aren't doing it for Dicky.

In seriousness, and whilst I can't see either happening, the Annfield Plain/Stanley route is probably the better option, but you then hit the hurdle of how many paths they're likely to be given on the ECML, where it would join around Birtley. It's already over-congested with no light at the end of the tunnel, thanks to the Tories already kicking the much more widely-supported Leamside reopening into the long grass. That of course impacts the likely frequency along the line.

The frequency can of course reduce any benefits gained from journey time, but I'd be interested in what they'd anticipate as a journey time between Consett and Newcastle. Whilst the X70/X71 aren't exactly the quickest routes, I think we'd see them become a lot quicker faced with competition from a train.

I just can't see the business case stacking up here, and I think its nothing more than a token gesture from the politicians.

My own thoughts were immediately focused on reinstating the slow lines between Pelaw Grange and Team Valley. That would help massively in this scenario. 
If I remember right, they were pulled up around 88/89 when electrification happened. 

Like you say, I can't see the business case stacking up. Which is unfortunate.

'Illegitimis non carborundum'
Andreos1
17 Dec 2021, 1:44 pm #84

(17 Dec 2021, 1:22 pm)Adrian Sounds like the congestion-busting buses of North West Durham aren't doing it for Dicky.

In seriousness, and whilst I can't see either happening, the Annfield Plain/Stanley route is probably the better option, but you then hit the hurdle of how many paths they're likely to be given on the ECML, where it would join around Birtley. It's already over-congested with no light at the end of the tunnel, thanks to the Tories already kicking the much more widely-supported Leamside reopening into the long grass. That of course impacts the likely frequency along the line.

The frequency can of course reduce any benefits gained from journey time, but I'd be interested in what they'd anticipate as a journey time between Consett and Newcastle. Whilst the X70/X71 aren't exactly the quickest routes, I think we'd see them become a lot quicker faced with competition from a train.

I just can't see the business case stacking up here, and I think its nothing more than a token gesture from the politicians.

My own thoughts were immediately focused on reinstating the slow lines between Pelaw Grange and Team Valley. That would help massively in this scenario. 
If I remember right, they were pulled up around 88/89 when electrification happened. 

Like you say, I can't see the business case stacking up. Which is unfortunate.


'Illegitimis non carborundum'

17 Dec 2021, 2:29 pm #85
They can push as much as they like, it won't happen, like the far greater need of the Leamside. This regime has shown itself to be nothing but a deceitful, false promise and sound byte responsive vessel. Consett via South Pelaw is ridiculous, a monumental civil engineering prospect. Only via Lintz is feasible until you hit Swalwell.. Then what..
54APhotography
17 Dec 2021, 2:29 pm #85

They can push as much as they like, it won't happen, like the far greater need of the Leamside. This regime has shown itself to be nothing but a deceitful, false promise and sound byte responsive vessel. Consett via South Pelaw is ridiculous, a monumental civil engineering prospect. Only via Lintz is feasible until you hit Swalwell.. Then what..

Storx



4,481
17 Dec 2021, 6:49 pm #86
Pie in the sky idea and there's no economic reason to build it either. There's other towns in the North East which are much higher priority Washington for example or the West End of Newcastle or South side of Sunderland both which would offer a much better return for not much difference in costs since it's just building a new line. Other than Stanley, there's nothing between Consett and Newcastle.

I live near the B&T line and the only reason that works is because the line already exists so it's easier and much much cheaper to do.
Storx
17 Dec 2021, 6:49 pm #86

Pie in the sky idea and there's no economic reason to build it either. There's other towns in the North East which are much higher priority Washington for example or the West End of Newcastle or South side of Sunderland both which would offer a much better return for not much difference in costs since it's just building a new line. Other than Stanley, there's nothing between Consett and Newcastle.

I live near the B&T line and the only reason that works is because the line already exists so it's easier and much much cheaper to do.

17 Dec 2021, 6:54 pm #87
(17 Dec 2021, 6:49 pm)Storx Pie in the sky idea and there's no economic reason to build it either. There's other towns in the North East which are much higher priority Washington for example or the West End of Newcastle or South side of Sunderland both which would offer a much better return for not much difference in costs since it's just building a new line. Other than Stanley, there's nothing between Consett and Newcastle.

I live near the B&T line and the only reason that works is because the line already exists so it's easier and much much cheaper to do.
Absolutely, and the B&T project has been watered down already, no relaying and bed work, so speeds are going to be slower than claimed as well.

We won't get the rail network we need, just as much as we won't get a bus network that works..
54APhotography
17 Dec 2021, 6:54 pm #87

(17 Dec 2021, 6:49 pm)Storx Pie in the sky idea and there's no economic reason to build it either. There's other towns in the North East which are much higher priority Washington for example or the West End of Newcastle or South side of Sunderland both which would offer a much better return for not much difference in costs since it's just building a new line. Other than Stanley, there's nothing between Consett and Newcastle.

I live near the B&T line and the only reason that works is because the line already exists so it's easier and much much cheaper to do.
Absolutely, and the B&T project has been watered down already, no relaying and bed work, so speeds are going to be slower than claimed as well.

We won't get the rail network we need, just as much as we won't get a bus network that works..

Andreos1



14,155
19 Jun 2022, 9:30 am #88
https://www.itv.com/news/tyne-tees/2022-...nt-support

New station for Ferryhill?

'Illegitimis non carborundum'
Andreos1
19 Jun 2022, 9:30 am #88

https://www.itv.com/news/tyne-tees/2022-...nt-support

New station for Ferryhill?


'Illegitimis non carborundum'

Adrian



9,566
19 Jun 2022, 11:37 am #89
(19 Jun 2022, 9:30 am)Andreos1 https://www.itv.com/news/tyne-tees/2022-...nt-support

New station for Ferryhill?

I'm not convinced how successful it'll be, without it being part of a reopened Leamside line. Other than maybe diverting the existing two morning Northern services that already run the ECML, they're very unlikely to get a regular service pattern heading North.

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Adrian
19 Jun 2022, 11:37 am #89

(19 Jun 2022, 9:30 am)Andreos1 https://www.itv.com/news/tyne-tees/2022-...nt-support

New station for Ferryhill?

I'm not convinced how successful it'll be, without it being part of a reopened Leamside line. Other than maybe diverting the existing two morning Northern services that already run the ECML, they're very unlikely to get a regular service pattern heading North.


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Andreos1



14,155
19 Jun 2022, 11:42 am #90
(19 Jun 2022, 11:37 am)Adrian I'm not convinced how successful it'll be, without it being part of a reopened Leamside line. Other than maybe diverting the existing two morning Northern services that already run the ECML, they're very unlikely to get a regular service pattern heading North.
I think there's mention of it working in sync with the Stillington Line. Maybe Northern Connect (if/when that ever appears) and TPX would be the main players. 
I agree about the Leamside Line, but having ECML calling patterns would only be a good thing.

It would be interesting to see how it fits in and around existing infrastructure.
Maybe similar to the set up at Dunbar.

'Illegitimis non carborundum'
Andreos1
19 Jun 2022, 11:42 am #90

(19 Jun 2022, 11:37 am)Adrian I'm not convinced how successful it'll be, without it being part of a reopened Leamside line. Other than maybe diverting the existing two morning Northern services that already run the ECML, they're very unlikely to get a regular service pattern heading North.
I think there's mention of it working in sync with the Stillington Line. Maybe Northern Connect (if/when that ever appears) and TPX would be the main players. 
I agree about the Leamside Line, but having ECML calling patterns would only be a good thing.

It would be interesting to see how it fits in and around existing infrastructure.
Maybe similar to the set up at Dunbar.


'Illegitimis non carborundum'

19 Jun 2022, 11:43 am #91
I'd assume that TPE would stop there as they seem to be picking up what is left behind by LNER, XC and Northern.

(19 Jun 2022, 11:42 am)Andreos1 I think there's mention of it working in sync with the Stillington Line. Maybe Northern Connect (if/when that ever appears) and TPX would be the main players. 

It would be interesting to see how it fits in and around existing infrastructure.

The Northern Connect scheme has been abandoned.
Edited 19 Jun 2022, 11:44 am by omnicity4659.
omnicity4659
19 Jun 2022, 11:43 am #91

I'd assume that TPE would stop there as they seem to be picking up what is left behind by LNER, XC and Northern.


(19 Jun 2022, 11:42 am)Andreos1 I think there's mention of it working in sync with the Stillington Line. Maybe Northern Connect (if/when that ever appears) and TPX would be the main players. 

It would be interesting to see how it fits in and around existing infrastructure.

The Northern Connect scheme has been abandoned.

Andreos1



14,155
19 Jun 2022, 11:47 am #92
(19 Jun 2022, 11:43 am)omnicity4659 I'd assume that TPE would stop there as they seem to be picking up what is left behind by LNER, XC and Northern.


The Northern Connect scheme has been abandoned. 
Was this ever confirmed officially?

'Illegitimis non carborundum'
Andreos1
19 Jun 2022, 11:47 am #92

(19 Jun 2022, 11:43 am)omnicity4659 I'd assume that TPE would stop there as they seem to be picking up what is left behind by LNER, XC and Northern.


The Northern Connect scheme has been abandoned. 
Was this ever confirmed officially?


'Illegitimis non carborundum'

19 Jun 2022, 11:51 am #93
(19 Jun 2022, 11:47 am)Andreos1 Was this ever confirmed officially?

OLR removed any reference of it from the Northern website either last year or in 2020. I'd imagine that the only way of getting official confirmation would be through FoI.
omnicity4659
19 Jun 2022, 11:51 am #93

(19 Jun 2022, 11:47 am)Andreos1 Was this ever confirmed officially?

OLR removed any reference of it from the Northern website either last year or in 2020. I'd imagine that the only way of getting official confirmation would be through FoI.

busmanT



921
20 Jun 2022, 11:23 pm #94
(19 Jun 2022, 11:51 am)omnicity4659 OLR removed any reference of it from the Northern website either last year or in 2020. I'd imagine that the only way of getting official confirmation would be through FoI.
My understanding is that “Northern Connect” was part of the Arriva franchise bid, and as a name disappeared when the TOC was taken over by the OLR.
With TPE and XC both only running 1 tph north of York there are probably paths for a Middlesbrough-Stillington - Ferryhill- Durham - Newcastle service
busmanT
20 Jun 2022, 11:23 pm #94

(19 Jun 2022, 11:51 am)omnicity4659 OLR removed any reference of it from the Northern website either last year or in 2020. I'd imagine that the only way of getting official confirmation would be through FoI.
My understanding is that “Northern Connect” was part of the Arriva franchise bid, and as a name disappeared when the TOC was taken over by the OLR.
With TPE and XC both only running 1 tph north of York there are probably paths for a Middlesbrough-Stillington - Ferryhill- Durham - Newcastle service

21 Jun 2022, 8:18 am #95
Could they not run a loop, Middlesbrough-stillington-ferryhill-durham-newcastle-heworth-sunderland-durham coast line-middlesbrough. 1/2 trains an hour in each direction.
User2613
21 Jun 2022, 8:18 am #95

Could they not run a loop, Middlesbrough-stillington-ferryhill-durham-newcastle-heworth-sunderland-durham coast line-middlesbrough. 1/2 trains an hour in each direction.

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