Politics (and other political stuff)

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Although I appreciate that some on here may not be able to vote, but for those who do have the vote, did you exercise your to right in the European and Local elections yesterday?

I voted Green in the European elections and, rather begrudgingly, voted Labour in the local council elections.
(23 May 2014, 2:37 pm)AdamY Wrote: Although I appreciate that some on here may not be able to vote, but for those who do have the vote, did you exercise your to right in the European and Local elections yesterday?

I voted Green in the European elections and, rather begrudgingly, voted Labour in the local council elections.

I have a mate who has a VERY strong political view (last week he went around Newcastle handing out leaflets supporting the conservatives Dodgy). I honestly can't be bothered with politics, just as long as I get a job when I'm older! Smile
(23 May 2014, 2:40 pm)Marcus Wrote: I have a mate who has a VERY strong political view (last week he went around Newcastle handing out leaflets supporting the conservatives Dodgy). I honestly can't be bothered with politics, just as long as I get a job when I'm older! Smile

Nice to see that your mate is getting some sort of political education. You learn a lot by knocking on doors and handing out leaflets.
Didn't vote yesterday - not through apathy, but because there wasn't an organisation which stood out, either locally or in Europe.

My political opinions have probably swayed my opinions on QCS and other issues (Royal Mail) and are probably easy to identify, but there wasn't a party who have similar ideas or beliefs throughout.

Yes, Ukip want to be out of Europe (so do I), but I don't agree with their other policies.

I wouldn't vote Tory or BNP - which left Liberal Democrats, Green and Labour, which like Ukip have one or two similar thoughts to mine, but nowt else.

My local councillor has been of use recently - so would have attracted a vote because of that.
However, she didn't stand this year.

I had my forms, sifted through the literature which was posted, did research and in the end - didn't put my tick in the box.

Lots of right leaning parties are coming to the fore, is it time for a well oiled left leaning party to step up and fill some gaps?
'Illegitimis non carborundum'
(23 May 2014, 2:42 pm)AdamY Wrote: Nice to see that your mate is getting some sort of political education. You learn a lot by knocking on doors and handing out leaflets.

Your telling me! He mentioned specifically how hard it is handing out leaflets supporting the Conservative party when your living in a region that's been practically defined as the capital of the Labour Party.
With me being 18 now, I voted for the first time yesterday. Made is feel quite important haha
(23 May 2014, 4:07 pm)Andreos Constantopolous Wrote: I had my forms, sifted through the literature which was posted, did research and in the end - didn't put my tick in the box.

On the contrary, I don't recall receiving any literature whatsoever. I can only assume that my vote (or the votes of my neighbours presuming I wasn't singled out) didn't mean anything!

Quote:Lots of right leaning parties are coming to the fore, is it time for a well oiled left leaning party to step up and fill some gaps?

The left are their own worst enemy in my opinion. From what I've personally witnessed there is too much emphasis on arbitrary doctrinal nonsense, most of which goes way over the head of your typical voter, creating unnecessary divisions between parties which all have similar goals. I've also seen left-wing parties trying to poach members from other left-wing parties, usually through belittling each others views - it's rather tragic and depressing. Nobody needs to use a 'divide and conquer' tactic on the left any-more; they do exceptionally well themselves.
I voted Labour, but that's simply because I've been a member for 12 years. I honestly think they've lost their way too much though. The run up to their local elections up in Sunderland was pitiful. They never actually made any pledges in their campaign material, and I know the Labour councillors that knocked on my mothers door were only interested in talking about UKIP.

I wish they'd go back to their roots and start organising on the ground. Put up a proper fight. As it stands, we're looking at another 5 years of Tories when it comes to a general election. Sad

Not sure if I've posted before, but try this - http://uk.isidewith.com/political-quiz
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(23 May 2014, 5:11 pm)AdamY Wrote: On the contrary, I don't recall receiving any literature whatsoever. I can only assume that my vote (or the votes of my neighbours presuming I wasn't singled out) didn't mean anything!


The left are their own worst enemy in my opinion. From what I've personally witnessed there is too much emphasis on arbitrary doctrinal nonsense, most of which goes way over the head of your typical voter, creating unnecessary divisions between parties which all have similar goals. I've also seen left-wing parties trying to poach members from other left-wing parties, usually through belittling each others views - it's rather tragic and depressing. Nobody needs to use a 'divide and conquer' tactic on the left any-more; they do exceptionally well themselves.

At 7.45 yesterday morning someone from Labour was putting stuff through the door.
Just seen a photo from yesterday morning and it appears the local MP was out with a councillor or two and a few others too.

I don't think the problems you mentioned are unique to the left.
It is quite often the case that the right leaning parties have similar issues.

In fact, whenever you have a group of people meeting as part of some sort of collective - whether it be sport, social, business or whatever else, you will see similar things.
Not that I agree with it, far from it - but I am guessing it must be human nature.

However, to add to what I was saying earlier, I do feel there is a gap in the political market, for a well oiled left leaning party.
If anyone said the same about the right several years ago, people wouldn't have agreed, as the Tories were there, the BNP/EDL too and there were elements of Labour and Lib Dem policies which looked to that side of the fence (New Labour, Blair etc).

Look what Ukip have done under Farage? They have found a gap and using the personality of Farage and voter discontent - have done fairly well.

If a charismatic left leaning leaning leader was to grab the bull by the horns, milk some media attention and find a topic which causes consternation amongst the voting population - then they can do just as Ukip have done over the last 24hrs.
'Illegitimis non carborundum'
(23 May 2014, 5:47 pm)Andreos Constantopolous Wrote: However, to add to what I was saying earlier, I do feel there is a gap in the political market, for a well oiled left leaning party

Or a proper Labour party! Not this mob that advocate Tory job cuts in the public sector, and agree with austerity.
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(23 May 2014, 6:35 pm)aureolin Wrote: Or a proper Labour party! Not this mob that advocate Tory job cuts in the public sector, and agree with austerity.

When living in Durham 10/11 years ago, I was doorstepped through the car window after pulling in from work.
The labour representative was canny enough and asked how I was going to vote - I explained I hadn't decided.
He then asked what my thoughts were regarding the labour party. I wasn't nasty, wasn't vindictive and simply replied 'the labour party isn't the labour party anymore'. The bloke seemed to shrink inside, thanked me and slinked off.

Although labour may have retained their votes in the northern heartlands, I feel many may be of the same opinion as yourself.
In my opinion, they only attract votes through tradition and lack of an alternative.

In the immediate future, I don't think there will be a switch back to the left - too much time is spent trying to win support and curry favour from those with more conservative tendencies.

http://www.conservativehome.com/platform...think.html

Some thoughts from Lord Ashcroft on European elections.
'Illegitimis non carborundum'
(24 May 2014, 9:21 am)Andreos Constantopolous Wrote: When living in Durham 10/11 years ago, I was doorstepped through the car window after pulling in from work.
The labour representative was canny enough and asked how I was going to vote - I explained I hadn't decided.
He then asked what my thoughts were regarding the labour party. I wasn't nasty, wasn't vindictive and simply replied 'the labour party isn't the labour party anymore'. The bloke seemed to shrink inside, thanked me and slinked off.

A similar thing happened to me during the run-up to the 2010 General Election. Dave Anderson, accompanied by a bunch of Labour councillors, knocked on my door asking how I was going to vote. At the time, I replied Liberal Democrats. They asked why and I explained that I agreed with a lot of their policies. They tried to persuade me that I would be wasting vote by voting LibDem. I conceded this point before arguing any vote made under FPTP is essentially wasted unless you vote for the party that wins and, in my opinion, Labour wouldn't win, so my vote would be wasted regardless. They went away that.

Of course, voting LibDem was a big mistake in retrospect. But hindsight is a wonderful thing...

Quote:http://www.conservativehome.com/platform...think.html

Some thoughts from Lord Ashcroft on European elections.

One thing that hit me after reading that article.

Quote:But at the next election, their votes are up for grabs – especially for the Tories. Two thirds of Thursday’s UKIP voters think David Cameron is the best available Prime Minister, compared to a quarter for Ed Miliband. And nearly seven in ten trust Cameron and Osborne more than Miliband and Balls when it comes to running the economy. (Indeed, one in ten Labour voters trust the Tory duo more than their own two Eds).

I probably agree with the bit in bold. As a potential Labour voter, I just don't trust Ed Balls to oversee the economy and, furthermore, although I don't mind Ed Miliband, I can't envisage him as Prime Minister.

They both lack the charisma and confidence needed to run the country.
(24 May 2014, 10:02 am)AdamY Wrote: A similar thing happened to me during the run-up to the 2010 General Election. Dave Anderson, accompanied by a bunch of Labour councillors, knocked on my door asking how I was going to vote. At the time, I replied Liberal Democrats. They asked why and I explained that I agreed with a lot of their policies. They tried to persuade me that I would be wasting vote by voting LibDem. I conceded this point before arguing any vote made under FPTP is essentially wasted unless you vote for the party that wins and, in my opinion, Labour wouldn't win, so my vote would be wasted regardless. They went away that.

Of course, voting LibDem was a big mistake in retrospect. But hindsight is a wonderful thing...


One thing that hit me after reading that article.


I probably agree with the bit in bold. As a potential Labour voter, I just don't trust Ed Balls to oversee the economy and, furthermore, although I don't mind Ed Miliband, I can't envisage him as Prime Minister.

They both lack the charisma and confidence needed to run the country.

But David 'hug a hoodie' Cameron and Gideon 'coke, hookers and BDSM' Osbourne do? Wink
'Illegitimis non carborundum'
(24 May 2014, 10:25 am)Andreos Constantopolous Wrote: But David 'hug a hoodie' Cameron and Gideon 'coke, hookers and BDSM' Osbourne do? Wink

While I'm certainly not a fan of Gid and Dave and would like to see the Conservatives voted out at the next election, I am not convinced by what Balls and Miliband have to offer and believe that nothing will change if they get into government.

I suppose 'coke, hookers and BDSM' at least makes Gideon slightly more interesting than his peers.
(24 May 2014, 10:47 am)AdamY Wrote: While I'm certainly not a fan of Gid and Dave and would like to see the Conservatives voted out at the next election, I am not convinced by what Balls and Miliband have to offer and believe that nothing will change if they get into government.

I suppose 'coke, hookers and BDSM' at least makes Gideon slightly more interesting than his peers.

More interesting than his peers? Certainly not his tory colleagues. They have all been at it for years man!
It wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if it was revealed in the next batch of papers released under the 30yr rule; that Thatcher had a secret den, dressed up in leather and treat the tory boys to a kinky flogging at the end of a hard day!

Going back to your first point - that is why I didn't vote on Thursday and possibly why Ukip did so well.
There is nothing to separate the parties or make one stand out above the others.
'Illegitimis non carborundum'
(24 May 2014, 11:03 am)Andreos Constantopolous Wrote: It wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if it was revealed in the next batch of papers released under the 30yr rule; that Thatcher had a secret den, dressed up in leather and treat the tory boys to a kinky flogging at the end of a hard day!

When Thatcher used to label Michael Hesletine as being 'wet' - most assumed that it was because he had some social conscience in the hard-nosed era of Thatcherism.

I now wonder whether there was another, more kinkier reason, why Hesletine (and other such tories) were referred to as 'wet'.

On the subject of UKIP. This rather amusing flow-chart has been doing the rounds recently.

[Image: original.jpg]
Got too admit I made a mistake voting last Thursday, I voted UKIP on one single policy(immigration) without thinking about other policies of theres, I have voted Labour since 2001/02 and last week was the first time I drifted away from Labour...

When it comes to politics, I have always identified myself as a Labour Voter, my folks before me are staunch labour, my grandparents were Labour and if they could see me voting anyone but, they would come back and haunt me if they could Wink

As for next year, I need to have a good look at the manifestos when the parties announce before I decide who gets my vote in the General Election
(27 May 2014, 9:37 am)marxistafozzski Wrote: Got too admit I made a mistake voting last Thursday, I voted UKIP on one single policy(immigration) without thinking about other policies of theres, I have voted Labour since 2001/02 and last week was the first time I drifted away from Labour...

When it comes to politics, I have always identified myself as a Labour Voter, my folks before me are staunch labour, my grandparents were Labour and if they could see me voting anyone but, they would come back and haunt me if they could Wink

As for next year, I need to have a good look at the manifestos when the parties announce before I decide who gets my vote in the General Election

If you've voted Labour for that long, have you never thought about getting involved in the party as a member? I've been a member for years now, and try and have my say wherever possible. I'd love to get myself elected to their NEC one day, but can't see me having the time in the near future. Being part of a non-affiliated union tends not to help either. Smile
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(27 May 2014, 7:01 pm)aureolin Wrote: If you've voted Labour for that long, have you never thought about getting involved in the party as a member? I've been a member for years now, and try and have my say wherever possible. I'd love to get myself elected to their NEC one day, but can't see me having the time in the near future. Being part of a non-affiliated union tends not to help either. Smile

Becoming a member of the Labour Party is always something I have intended to do, purely on a local level...Last time I seriously thought about was about 10 years ago, but the BNP were trying to sign me up...Nick Griffin would have loved me if his activists were to be believed, one mistake I was pleased not to make.

I honestly don't know if I would fit in in the Labour Party, I have my own opinions on different policies and not sure if they are compatible with Party...Guess I just have to have a good look through the Manifesto for the next General Election

I do come from a very Labour background, my nan was a parish councillor and my great granny was dedicated to Labour, she absolutely adored Arthur Scargill, bad mouth Scargill in her presence and you would know about it.
(27 May 2014, 7:14 pm)marxistafozzski Wrote: Becoming a member of the Labour Party is always something I have intended to do, purely on a local level...Last time I seriously thought about was about 10 years ago, but the BNP were trying to sign me up...Nick Griffin would have loved me if his activists were to be believed, one mistake I was pleased not to make.

I honestly don't know if I would fit in in the Labour Party, I have my own opinions on different policies and not sure if they are compatible with Party...Guess I just have to have a good look through the Manifesto for the next General Election

I do come from a very Labour background, my nan was a parish councillor and my great granny was dedicated to Labour, she absolutely adored Arthur Scargill, bad mouth Scargill in her presence and you would know about it.

As long as you agree with the main principals of the party, you'll be fine. I used to attend the local CLP meetings when I had loads of free time, and also contributed quite a bit towards Bridget Phillipson's big bus campaign.
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