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Go North East: Service Suggestions v2

Go North East: Service Suggestions v2

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omnicity4659

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5,589
22 Aug 2022, 5:59 am #2,481
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(17 Aug 2022, 5:37 am)Dan Is it fucked, or is it doing better financially now than before?


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Yeah, I prefer to drive all the way now as opposed to dump the car in Gateshead and get the X10. I'd consider something as fucked when I walk away as a regular customer.

Going to hourly is putting more money into the pockets of toll road operators TT2 and Autolink instead of GNE's.
omnicity4659
22 Aug 2022, 5:59 am #2,481

(17 Aug 2022, 5:37 am)Dan Is it fucked, or is it doing better financially now than before?


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Yeah, I prefer to drive all the way now as opposed to dump the car in Gateshead and get the X10. I'd consider something as fucked when I walk away as a regular customer.

Going to hourly is putting more money into the pockets of toll road operators TT2 and Autolink instead of GNE's.

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Dan

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18,116
22 Aug 2022, 6:59 am #2,482
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(22 Aug 2022, 5:59 am)omnicity4659 Yeah, I prefer to drive all the way now as opposed to dump the car in Gateshead and get the X10. I'd consider something as fucked when I walk away as a regular customer.

Going to hourly is putting more money into the pockets of toll road operators TT2 and Autolink instead of GNE's.


I wonder if you are one of many, or just a few? I suppose only Go North East will have access to that level of information.

If the latter, and the service is performing better now than before by consolidating the majority of seven buses worth of passengers into four, then I can’t see the service changing back any time soon.


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Dan
22 Aug 2022, 6:59 am #2,482

(22 Aug 2022, 5:59 am)omnicity4659 Yeah, I prefer to drive all the way now as opposed to dump the car in Gateshead and get the X10. I'd consider something as fucked when I walk away as a regular customer.

Going to hourly is putting more money into the pockets of toll road operators TT2 and Autolink instead of GNE's.


I wonder if you are one of many, or just a few? I suppose only Go North East will have access to that level of information.

If the latter, and the service is performing better now than before by consolidating the majority of seven buses worth of passengers into four, then I can’t see the service changing back any time soon.


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Unber43



3,552
22 Aug 2022, 7:07 am #2,483
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(22 Aug 2022, 6:59 am)Dan I wonder if you are one of many, or just a few? I suppose only Go North East will have access to that level of information.

If the latter, and the service is performing better now than before by consolidating the majority of seven buses worth of passengers into four, then I can’t see the service changing back any time soon.


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Surely losing a PVR of 3 shows GNE have/are losing passengers on that route
Unber43
22 Aug 2022, 7:07 am #2,483

(22 Aug 2022, 6:59 am)Dan I wonder if you are one of many, or just a few? I suppose only Go North East will have access to that level of information.

If the latter, and the service is performing better now than before by consolidating the majority of seven buses worth of passengers into four, then I can’t see the service changing back any time soon.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Surely losing a PVR of 3 shows GNE have/are losing passengers on that route

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omnicity4659

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5,589
22 Aug 2022, 7:42 am #2,484
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(22 Aug 2022, 6:59 am)Dan I wonder if you are one of many, or just a few? I suppose only Go North East will have access to that level of information.

If the latter, and the service is performing better now than before by consolidating the majority of seven buses worth of passengers into four, then I can’t see the service changing back any time soon.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Unfortunately, the majority of people who I know who lived on the X10 route now prefer to drive all the way or get lifts due to the frequency reduction. It may perform better in Go North East's eyes, but it doesn't in those of current and former customers.

The X9 and X10 were one of the few routes I'd happily use as a car driver based on the cost, comfort, frequency and direct nature of the route.

A short wait at Gateshead Interchange, often no more than 15-20 minutes, was ideal. Same at other points on the route. Planning to connect with twice hourly buses was easier than once hourly. Now, it's not worth the time sacrifice to save those extra pounds.
omnicity4659
22 Aug 2022, 7:42 am #2,484

(22 Aug 2022, 6:59 am)Dan I wonder if you are one of many, or just a few? I suppose only Go North East will have access to that level of information.

If the latter, and the service is performing better now than before by consolidating the majority of seven buses worth of passengers into four, then I can’t see the service changing back any time soon.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Unfortunately, the majority of people who I know who lived on the X10 route now prefer to drive all the way or get lifts due to the frequency reduction. It may perform better in Go North East's eyes, but it doesn't in those of current and former customers.

The X9 and X10 were one of the few routes I'd happily use as a car driver based on the cost, comfort, frequency and direct nature of the route.

A short wait at Gateshead Interchange, often no more than 15-20 minutes, was ideal. Same at other points on the route. Planning to connect with twice hourly buses was easier than once hourly. Now, it's not worth the time sacrifice to save those extra pounds.

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streetdeckfan



4,703
22 Aug 2022, 7:42 am #2,485
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(22 Aug 2022, 7:07 am)Unber43 Surely losing a PVR of 3 shows GNE have/are losing passengers on that route

Was the X9/X10 ever packed though?
I don't recall ever using it in the past and it being full, whereas now it's pretty much always been standing only whenever I've used it.
That implies to me that numbers are pretty similar they're just carrying them on less buses
streetdeckfan
22 Aug 2022, 7:42 am #2,485

(22 Aug 2022, 7:07 am)Unber43 Surely losing a PVR of 3 shows GNE have/are losing passengers on that route

Was the X9/X10 ever packed though?
I don't recall ever using it in the past and it being full, whereas now it's pretty much always been standing only whenever I've used it.
That implies to me that numbers are pretty similar they're just carrying them on less buses

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omnicity4659

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5,589
22 Aug 2022, 7:45 am #2,486
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(22 Aug 2022, 7:42 am)streetdeckfan Was the X9/X10 ever packed though?
I don't recall ever using it in the past and it being full, whereas now it's pretty much always been standing only whenever I've used it.
That implies to me that numbers are pretty similar they're just carrying them on less buses

It fluctuated a lot, some journeys both pre- and post-Covid were packed on deckers and coaches, others were quiet.
omnicity4659
22 Aug 2022, 7:45 am #2,486

(22 Aug 2022, 7:42 am)streetdeckfan Was the X9/X10 ever packed though?
I don't recall ever using it in the past and it being full, whereas now it's pretty much always been standing only whenever I've used it.
That implies to me that numbers are pretty similar they're just carrying them on less buses

It fluctuated a lot, some journeys both pre- and post-Covid were packed on deckers and coaches, others were quiet.

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Unber43



3,552
22 Aug 2022, 8:16 am #2,487
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(22 Aug 2022, 7:42 am)streetdeckfan Was the X9/X10 ever packed though?
I don't recall ever using it in the past and it being full, whereas now it's pretty much always been standing only whenever I've used it.
That implies to me that numbers are pretty similar they're just carrying them on less buses
Whenever I used it from Middlesbrough / Newcastle there was atleast 30-40 people in a queue, then by the time it would leave most seats would be full. 

But that was around 1pm and later
Unber43
22 Aug 2022, 8:16 am #2,487

(22 Aug 2022, 7:42 am)streetdeckfan Was the X9/X10 ever packed though?
I don't recall ever using it in the past and it being full, whereas now it's pretty much always been standing only whenever I've used it.
That implies to me that numbers are pretty similar they're just carrying them on less buses
Whenever I used it from Middlesbrough / Newcastle there was atleast 30-40 people in a queue, then by the time it would leave most seats would be full. 

But that was around 1pm and later

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F114TML



905
22 Aug 2022, 2:59 pm #2,488
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(22 Aug 2022, 7:42 am)streetdeckfan Was the X9/X10 ever packed though?
I don't recall ever using it in the past and it being full, whereas now it's pretty much always been standing only whenever I've used it.
That implies to me that numbers are pretty similar they're just carrying them on less buses
Pre Covid, the peak time ones were very busy; I've definitely done a couple journeys on the X10 and stood the whole way. Still seems busy now at times but not seen one quite that rammed.
F114TML
22 Aug 2022, 2:59 pm #2,488

(22 Aug 2022, 7:42 am)streetdeckfan Was the X9/X10 ever packed though?
I don't recall ever using it in the past and it being full, whereas now it's pretty much always been standing only whenever I've used it.
That implies to me that numbers are pretty similar they're just carrying them on less buses
Pre Covid, the peak time ones were very busy; I've definitely done a couple journeys on the X10 and stood the whole way. Still seems busy now at times but not seen one quite that rammed.

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Andreos1



14,218
22 Aug 2022, 7:15 pm #2,489
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(22 Aug 2022, 2:59 pm)F114TML Pre Covid, the peak time ones were very busy; I've definitely done a couple journeys on the X10 and stood the whole way. Still seems busy now at times but not seen one quite that rammed.

Think I reported standing on it earlier this year.
Would have been a Saturday and before they consolidated both routes in to one.
'Illegitimis non carborundum'
Andreos1
22 Aug 2022, 7:15 pm #2,489

(22 Aug 2022, 2:59 pm)F114TML Pre Covid, the peak time ones were very busy; I've definitely done a couple journeys on the X10 and stood the whole way. Still seems busy now at times but not seen one quite that rammed.

Think I reported standing on it earlier this year.
Would have been a Saturday and before they consolidated both routes in to one.

'Illegitimis non carborundum'

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L469 YVK



3,549
22 Aug 2022, 11:04 pm #2,490
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(22 Aug 2022, 7:15 pm)Andreos1 Think I reported standing on it earlier this year.
Would have been a Saturday and before they consolidated both routes in to one.
I thought GNE had the following policies pre-covid for standing?

- No standing allowed on X9/X10

- Any X21 journeys with standees non-stop via Birtley rather than A1M

Saying that......not much different to Arriva who allow standing on the X15/X18/X20 with fast sections of road.
L469 YVK
22 Aug 2022, 11:04 pm #2,490

(22 Aug 2022, 7:15 pm)Andreos1 Think I reported standing on it earlier this year.
Would have been a Saturday and before they consolidated both routes in to one.
I thought GNE had the following policies pre-covid for standing?

- No standing allowed on X9/X10

- Any X21 journeys with standees non-stop via Birtley rather than A1M

Saying that......not much different to Arriva who allow standing on the X15/X18/X20 with fast sections of road.

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Jimmi

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10,970
22 Aug 2022, 11:55 pm #2,491
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(22 Aug 2022, 11:04 pm)L469 YVK I thought GNE had the following policies pre-covid for standing?

- No standing allowed on X9/X10

- Any X21 journeys with standees non-stop via Birtley rather than A1M

Saying that......not much different to Arriva who allow standing on the X15/X18/X20 with fast sections of road.

Seemed to vary on driver as to if they actually enforced this or not.

The X9/X10 became difficult to enforce this on when Citaros were making semi-regular appearances and it became a case of let people stand or turn round and tell them they cannot get on and have to wait at least another half hour (or an hour).

I only encountered the issue with standees on the X21 once and the driver did make a fuss at making everyone sit down because of this apparent rule/guideline but there was still standees after Low Fell so it was all for nothing and he still ended up going down the A1(M) to CLS with standees on-board so the only achievement was me having a long wait in Durham as this delayed the X21 by 10-15 minutes resulting in a missed connection.
My YouTube https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC9HTKdt...fk4ab9rDjQ
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Jimmi
22 Aug 2022, 11:55 pm #2,491

(22 Aug 2022, 11:04 pm)L469 YVK I thought GNE had the following policies pre-covid for standing?

- No standing allowed on X9/X10

- Any X21 journeys with standees non-stop via Birtley rather than A1M

Saying that......not much different to Arriva who allow standing on the X15/X18/X20 with fast sections of road.

Seemed to vary on driver as to if they actually enforced this or not.

The X9/X10 became difficult to enforce this on when Citaros were making semi-regular appearances and it became a case of let people stand or turn round and tell them they cannot get on and have to wait at least another half hour (or an hour).

I only encountered the issue with standees on the X21 once and the driver did make a fuss at making everyone sit down because of this apparent rule/guideline but there was still standees after Low Fell so it was all for nothing and he still ended up going down the A1(M) to CLS with standees on-board so the only achievement was me having a long wait in Durham as this delayed the X21 by 10-15 minutes resulting in a missed connection.

My YouTube https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC9HTKdt...fk4ab9rDjQ
My Flickr https://www.flickr.com/photos/127079988@N02/

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L469 YVK



3,549
23 Aug 2022, 8:10 am #2,492
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(22 Aug 2022, 11:55 pm)Jimmi I only encountered the issue with standees on the X21 once and the driver did make a fuss at making everyone sit down because of this apparent rule/guideline but there was still standees after Low Fell so it was all for nothing and he still ended up going down the A1(M) to CLS with standees on-board so the only achievement was me having a long wait in Durham as this delayed the X21 by 10-15 minutes resulting in a missed connection.
See, the X21 probably spends about the same time if not less than Arriva's X14/X15/X18/X20 on 50+ MPH dual carriageways / motorways.

I'd imagine especially on match days Arriva carry standing loads between Clifton and Gosforth Park on the A1, sometimes up to 62MPH. I don't think any Arriva drivers would divert via Stannington, Plessey Checks, Snowy Owl and Wideopen unless it was a bit gusty.
L469 YVK
23 Aug 2022, 8:10 am #2,492

(22 Aug 2022, 11:55 pm)Jimmi I only encountered the issue with standees on the X21 once and the driver did make a fuss at making everyone sit down because of this apparent rule/guideline but there was still standees after Low Fell so it was all for nothing and he still ended up going down the A1(M) to CLS with standees on-board so the only achievement was me having a long wait in Durham as this delayed the X21 by 10-15 minutes resulting in a missed connection.
See, the X21 probably spends about the same time if not less than Arriva's X14/X15/X18/X20 on 50+ MPH dual carriageways / motorways.

I'd imagine especially on match days Arriva carry standing loads between Clifton and Gosforth Park on the A1, sometimes up to 62MPH. I don't think any Arriva drivers would divert via Stannington, Plessey Checks, Snowy Owl and Wideopen unless it was a bit gusty.

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streetdeckfan



4,703
23 Aug 2022, 8:23 am #2,493
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(23 Aug 2022, 8:10 am)L469 YVK See, the X21 probably spends about the same time if not less than Arriva's X14/X15/X18/X20 on 50+ MPH dual carriageways / motorways.

I'd imagine especially on match days Arriva carry standing loads between Clifton and Gosforth Park on the A1, sometimes up to 62MPH. I don't think any Arriva drivers would divert via Stannington, Plessey Checks, Snowy Owl and Wideopen unless it was a bit gusty.

Maybe it's just me, but I'd be far more wary of standing on a bus on a bumpy and twisty A/B road than I would be standing on a dual carriageway or motorway as they're a constant speed
streetdeckfan
23 Aug 2022, 8:23 am #2,493

(23 Aug 2022, 8:10 am)L469 YVK See, the X21 probably spends about the same time if not less than Arriva's X14/X15/X18/X20 on 50+ MPH dual carriageways / motorways.

I'd imagine especially on match days Arriva carry standing loads between Clifton and Gosforth Park on the A1, sometimes up to 62MPH. I don't think any Arriva drivers would divert via Stannington, Plessey Checks, Snowy Owl and Wideopen unless it was a bit gusty.

Maybe it's just me, but I'd be far more wary of standing on a bus on a bumpy and twisty A/B road than I would be standing on a dual carriageway or motorway as they're a constant speed

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BusLoverMum



5,282
23 Aug 2022, 10:01 pm #2,494
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(23 Aug 2022, 8:23 am)streetdeckfan Maybe it's just me, but I'd be far more wary of standing on a bus on a bumpy and twisty A/B road than I would be standing on a dual carriageway or motorway as they're a constant speed
Do that at 50.mph on the A19 in winter when a sudden hail storm hits and someone joining at one of the  many dangerous junctions that the A19 has loses control in front of you (this has happened to us in our car)  and you're through the front windscreen.
BusLoverMum
23 Aug 2022, 10:01 pm #2,494

(23 Aug 2022, 8:23 am)streetdeckfan Maybe it's just me, but I'd be far more wary of standing on a bus on a bumpy and twisty A/B road than I would be standing on a dual carriageway or motorway as they're a constant speed
Do that at 50.mph on the A19 in winter when a sudden hail storm hits and someone joining at one of the  many dangerous junctions that the A19 has loses control in front of you (this has happened to us in our car)  and you're through the front windscreen.

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OrangeArrow49



1,359
23 Aug 2022, 10:27 pm #2,495
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QuayCity Q3 - Hazlerigg - Fawdon - Great Park - Gosforth - Jesmond - Newcastle - Quayside - Byker - Walker - Wallsend - Hadrian Park - Cobalt - North Shields every 30 minutes. Cobalt & Coast 310 curtailed at Wallsend Town Centre.
OrangeArrow49
23 Aug 2022, 10:27 pm #2,495

QuayCity Q3 - Hazlerigg - Fawdon - Great Park - Gosforth - Jesmond - Newcastle - Quayside - Byker - Walker - Wallsend - Hadrian Park - Cobalt - North Shields every 30 minutes. Cobalt & Coast 310 curtailed at Wallsend Town Centre.

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Unber43



3,552
23 Aug 2022, 10:49 pm #2,496
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(23 Aug 2022, 10:27 pm)OrangeArrow49 QuayCity Q3 - Hazlerigg - Fawdon - Great Park - Gosforth - Jesmond - Newcastle - Quayside - Byker - Walker - Wallsend - Hadrian Park - Cobalt - North Shields every 30 minutes. Cobalt & Coast 310 curtailed at Wallsend Town Centre.
Why half the frequency between Great Park & St Peters.
Unber43
23 Aug 2022, 10:49 pm #2,496

(23 Aug 2022, 10:27 pm)OrangeArrow49 QuayCity Q3 - Hazlerigg - Fawdon - Great Park - Gosforth - Jesmond - Newcastle - Quayside - Byker - Walker - Wallsend - Hadrian Park - Cobalt - North Shields every 30 minutes. Cobalt & Coast 310 curtailed at Wallsend Town Centre.
Why half the frequency between Great Park & St Peters.

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Rob44



1,500
24 Aug 2022, 5:46 pm #2,497
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(23 Aug 2022, 10:27 pm)OrangeArrow49 QuayCity Q3 - Hazlerigg - Fawdon - Great Park - Gosforth - Jesmond - Newcastle - Quayside - Byker - Walker - Wallsend - Hadrian Park - Cobalt - North Shields every 30 minutes. Cobalt & Coast 310 curtailed at Wallsend Town Centre.

Think I'll stick to the 44 although I hear jesmond is nice on a friday night around 8 and Fawdons  a party place after dark!
Rob44
24 Aug 2022, 5:46 pm #2,497

(23 Aug 2022, 10:27 pm)OrangeArrow49 QuayCity Q3 - Hazlerigg - Fawdon - Great Park - Gosforth - Jesmond - Newcastle - Quayside - Byker - Walker - Wallsend - Hadrian Park - Cobalt - North Shields every 30 minutes. Cobalt & Coast 310 curtailed at Wallsend Town Centre.

Think I'll stick to the 44 although I hear jesmond is nice on a friday night around 8 and Fawdons  a party place after dark!

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col87



506
24 Aug 2022, 7:34 pm #2,498
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To Answer the question the X9/10 was always busy whenever i used it. Even a few weeks ago when I got on at Peterlee they was hardly any seats left and that was at about 12ish. I can see them needing to do something soon.
col87
24 Aug 2022, 7:34 pm #2,498

To Answer the question the X9/10 was always busy whenever i used it. Even a few weeks ago when I got on at Peterlee they was hardly any seats left and that was at about 12ish. I can see them needing to do something soon.

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L469 YVK



3,549
26 Aug 2022, 2:57 pm #2,499
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Following up from my rant about the 309/310/311 a few weeks back, here is my suggestion timetable for the evening journeys.

.pdf
309_310_311 evening suggestion times Sep 2022.pdf
Size 442.96 KB / Downloads 8


Other than a bit of 'tidying up' and re-timing the later 309 journeys to better serve Cobalt Park and create some form of even headway with Arriva's 308 ex Newcastle, the only major change is Sunday evenings after 20:00 which to be honest, would be a sensible set of cuts (although no cuts are exactly good). 

Although some rota changes would be required, run-in times (give or take) shouldn't be too different.

Current last run-in times (from terminus)
Mon-Sun - Norham Road / Verne Road - 00:04
Mon-Sun - Norham Road North - 23:59
Mon-Sun - Whitley Bay Cemetery - 23:13
Mon-Sat - Blyth - 21:23
Sun - Blyth - 19:23

New last run-in times (from terminus)
Mon-Sat - Norham Road / Verne Road - 00:04
Sun - Norham Road / Verne Road - 23:39
Mon-Sat - Whitley Bay Cemetery - 23:38
Mon-Sat - Norham Road North - 23:23
Sun - Norham Road North - 23:03
Mon-Sat - Blyth 21:47
Sun - Blyth - 20:43
Sun - Blyth - 19:43
L469 YVK
26 Aug 2022, 2:57 pm #2,499

Following up from my rant about the 309/310/311 a few weeks back, here is my suggestion timetable for the evening journeys.

.pdf
309_310_311 evening suggestion times Sep 2022.pdf
Size 442.96 KB / Downloads 8


Other than a bit of 'tidying up' and re-timing the later 309 journeys to better serve Cobalt Park and create some form of even headway with Arriva's 308 ex Newcastle, the only major change is Sunday evenings after 20:00 which to be honest, would be a sensible set of cuts (although no cuts are exactly good). 

Although some rota changes would be required, run-in times (give or take) shouldn't be too different.

Current last run-in times (from terminus)
Mon-Sun - Norham Road / Verne Road - 00:04
Mon-Sun - Norham Road North - 23:59
Mon-Sun - Whitley Bay Cemetery - 23:13
Mon-Sat - Blyth - 21:23
Sun - Blyth - 19:23

New last run-in times (from terminus)
Mon-Sat - Norham Road / Verne Road - 00:04
Sun - Norham Road / Verne Road - 23:39
Mon-Sat - Whitley Bay Cemetery - 23:38
Mon-Sat - Norham Road North - 23:23
Sun - Norham Road North - 23:03
Mon-Sat - Blyth 21:47
Sun - Blyth - 20:43
Sun - Blyth - 19:43

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L469 YVK



3,549
27 Aug 2022, 3:43 pm #2,500
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(24 Aug 2022, 7:34 pm)col87 To Answer the question the X9/10 was always busy whenever i used it. Even a few weeks ago when I got on at Peterlee they was hardly any seats left and that was at about 12ish.  I can see them needing to do something soon.
Maybe numbers didn't recover back in January.

Big issue now if numbers re-grow and even if driver retention is sorted, would be what vehicles to allocate if X9 brought back?

Not enough 'new' spare E400MMC at Consett with 13 out of 14 - 69, 20, 70 plates being used on X30's/X45/X70's

However, would the 6 moving to Consett not justify re-opening the bait room at Stanley? X30/X31 going standalone would reduce the 'low height' requirement at Consett overnight and that would at least free three up if needed. I'm not going to bother working a full allocation out but that would be a starting point.
L469 YVK
27 Aug 2022, 3:43 pm #2,500

(24 Aug 2022, 7:34 pm)col87 To Answer the question the X9/10 was always busy whenever i used it. Even a few weeks ago when I got on at Peterlee they was hardly any seats left and that was at about 12ish.  I can see them needing to do something soon.
Maybe numbers didn't recover back in January.

Big issue now if numbers re-grow and even if driver retention is sorted, would be what vehicles to allocate if X9 brought back?

Not enough 'new' spare E400MMC at Consett with 13 out of 14 - 69, 20, 70 plates being used on X30's/X45/X70's

However, would the 6 moving to Consett not justify re-opening the bait room at Stanley? X30/X31 going standalone would reduce the 'low height' requirement at Consett overnight and that would at least free three up if needed. I'm not going to bother working a full allocation out but that would be a starting point.

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