Bus Related Outings and Reviews
Bus Related Outings and Reviews
Today I put Tees Flex (AKA Ben’s Buses / Teesside Twirly Taxis) to the test, head-to-head over scheduled bus services along the same route – skip to the end to find out who won…
With service levels and capacity restrictions returned to near normal levels, I figured today I would make my first journeys on public transport since lockdown. There’s been much (valid) discussion of access to the QE from parts of Gateshead, with this in mind I wanted to address access to North Tees Hospital from Hartlepool. North Tees is the default hospital for many clinics since the downgrade of Hartlepool years ago, yet the public transport access has never been properly addressed.
Tees Flex was my weapon of choice for the outbound journey. The pick-up locations in Hartlepool are annoyingly restrictive as not to step on Stagecoach’s commercial toes, despite this not being seen as a concern in Arriva dominated East Cleveland. As below, choices are basically anywhere in the sparsely populated rural west, the Hospital, Queens Meadow or the Town Centre & Marina area. This at least provides a reasonably even spaced choice across the town. I chose to begin my journey from the Marina, partly reasoned as it’s the most central and mostly reasoned for the ample parking and proximity to a Costa Coffee.
(22 Jul 2020, 12:45 pm)James101 Today I put Tees Flex (AKA Ben’s Buses / Teesside Twirly Taxis) to the test, head-to-head over scheduled bus services along the same route – skip to the end to find out who won…
With service levels and capacity restrictions returned to near normal levels, I figured today I would make my first journeys on public transport since lockdown. There’s been much (valid) discussion of access to the QE from parts of Gateshead, with this in mind I wanted to address access to North Tees Hospital from Hartlepool. North Tees is the default hospital for many clinics since the downgrade of Hartlepool years ago, yet the public transport access has never been properly addressed.
Tees Flex was my weapon of choice for the outbound journey. The pick-up locations in Hartlepool are annoyingly restrictive as not to step on Stagecoach’s commercial toes, despite this not being seen as a concern in Arriva dominated East Cleveland. As below, choices are basically anywhere in the sparsely populated rural west, the Hospital, Queens Meadow or the Town Centre & Marina area. This at least provides a reasonably even spaced choice across the town. I chose to begin my journey from the Marina, partly reasoned as it’s the most central and mostly reasoned for the ample parking and proximity to a Costa Coffee.
I was also testing out a ‘hack’ for Tees Flex I had thought of – the 3 Tees Flex operating zones are designed to allows travel within zone but not between zones. Wynyard Village, however, is in both the Hartlepool and Stockton/Darlington zones – theoretically meaning I could make a journey from Hartlepool to Wynyard and then onto North Tees. For the purpose of this head-to-head I imagined I was making ‘on-demand’ journeys, though in reality Tees Flex allows users to pre-book journeys at specific times to reduce waiting. I requested a ride at 08:22 for pick-up ASAP. The app told me I should expect to wait 17 minutes and the fare would be £3, payable to the driver, which is a welcome difference from Arriva Click where payments are taken by the app.
Unsurprisingly, my ride was being dispatched from Ron Perry on the A19, which seems to be a popular hang out in down time. The live tracking map re-assured me I could pop-over to Costa and enjoy a take-away coffee before departure.
Out of interest I tapped in my intended journey into traveline to see how they suggested getting to North Tees, churning out a journey time of 1hr14min and an arrival time of 10:12. I reckoned if I had got my skates on and ran across town I could have got the previous departure on the 36, getting me to North Tees at 09:42. Target set. I returned to the shelter where the live travel info suggested taking a 23 which apparently randomly terminated at Seaham Grange (incorrect) or perhaps a jolly out to Newport on the 1, though it didn’t clarify whether it was the South Wales or Shropshire Newport so I gave it a miss.
44006 arrived bang on when expected and the driver requested payment and issued my ticket. For the purpose of this journey I was making single journeys, though Tees Flex offers return journeys at 50% of the single rate. I didn’t know how these returns would work, though I’m pleased to report it’s as simple as showing your outbound ticket to the driver who will then override the price for you to simply pay the ‘top-up’ fare – I don’t even need to commit to making the return journey when booking my outbound, I can simply make another scheduled or on-demand booking later.
I was wondering if I could book my second leg from Wynyard to North Tees during my first journey. Turns out this isn’t possible, during a journey the app is fixed as a live map with ETA. If there’s a next time I could pre-schedule my journey to be around the time I know the first leg will drop me off. I guess I could have called the booking line if I really wanted to narrow my connection – but I didn’t. I was the only passenger on the rapid 19 minutes journey and I was dropped off at Wynyard precinct (I bet you no-one that lives in Wynyard will call it a precinct) at the bus stop which declared ‘No Public Services’ – Doh! A poster letting people know Tees Flex exists wouldn’t go amiss.
I tapped in my next journey, wondering if the tech would allow 44006 to be released from the Hartlepool zone to make a Stockton zone journey considering it was the nearest available vehicle. It doesn’t. 44037 was duly dispatched from Stillington. I was told to expect a 18 minutes wait, not the end of the world considering Wynyard is a pleasant enough place to spend a short while. After 10 minutes, however, I had a push notification advising my Sprinter would be with me momentarily.
Not you mate, I want the next one…
44037 rolled up at 09:14 and I paid the £1.50 requested. It was only when I sat down I realised I had been issued a return. The driver must have assumed no-one would be making such a single journey and I wasn’t going to argue the 50p, especially as I was getting a private taxi for less than a standard bus single. Plus the newer Sprinters have all mod cons so I was able to reclaim the battery spend thus far on booking my rides via the USB chargers. The live map changed course from suggesting the back lanes to via the A19 not long after we set off, driver duly followed and dropped me at North Tees at exactly 09:30.
Next contender, scheduled buses. Popped straight on Traveline which churned out a suggested route of 37 to Norton, 36 to Hartlepool – exactly as expected. Next departure at 09:44, arriving 10:55, allowing for walking to stops. The Stagecoach app confirmed much the same, but has the useful feature of suggesting ticket types. I decided I didn’t require to final hop on the 7 at the flat £1.80 fare as I could probably walk quicker, meaning two singles at £5.30 just beat a dayrider plus at £5.70, though this of course would be valid for a return journey.
26285 provided traction on the 37 to Norton, where I was deposited at the Army centre. I crossed over to the Hartlepool bound side which is in a pretty sorry state, no timetable, broken live times info and social distancing guidance which as it turns out, I’ve been following for the best part of 30 years anyway.
26289 was about 8 minutes down when it got to Norton. This was my first ride on this batch on the 36, I was pleasantly surprised at their turn of speed down the A689, these seem to be worthy successors to the history of heavy-weight single decks on this route. Though I’m sure the odd E400s will be missed. It was 10:57 when I was finally deposited around the back of Middleton Grange, the closest the 36 will get you to the Marina these days. A brisk walk over the bridge had me back where I started by 11:08.
Side-by-side, head-to-head, for me one journey was quicker, cheaper, more comfortable and eminently more favourable, Tees Flex. I just wish the Hartlepool pick-ups were more flexible.
Some Facts:
Single:
Tees Flex: £4.50 (should have been £4) Bus: £5.30
Day Return:
Tees Flex: £6 Bus: £5.70
Travel Time – Including waiting for first journey:
Tees Flex: 1hr 7min. Bus: 1hr 27min.
Travel Time – From boarding first vehicle:
Tees Flex: 50min. Bus: 1hr 16min.
(22 Jul 2020, 12:45 pm)James101 Today I put Tees Flex (AKA Ben’s Buses / Teesside Twirly Taxis) to the test, head-to-head over scheduled bus services along the same route – skip to the end to find out who won…
With service levels and capacity restrictions returned to near normal levels, I figured today I would make my first journeys on public transport since lockdown. There’s been much (valid) discussion of access to the QE from parts of Gateshead, with this in mind I wanted to address access to North Tees Hospital from Hartlepool. North Tees is the default hospital for many clinics since the downgrade of Hartlepool years ago, yet the public transport access has never been properly addressed.
Tees Flex was my weapon of choice for the outbound journey. The pick-up locations in Hartlepool are annoyingly restrictive as not to step on Stagecoach’s commercial toes, despite this not being seen as a concern in Arriva dominated East Cleveland. As below, choices are basically anywhere in the sparsely populated rural west, the Hospital, Queens Meadow or the Town Centre & Marina area. This at least provides a reasonably even spaced choice across the town. I chose to begin my journey from the Marina, partly reasoned as it’s the most central and mostly reasoned for the ample parking and proximity to a Costa Coffee.
I was also testing out a ‘hack’ for Tees Flex I had thought of – the 3 Tees Flex operating zones are designed to allows travel within zone but not between zones. Wynyard Village, however, is in both the Hartlepool and Stockton/Darlington zones – theoretically meaning I could make a journey from Hartlepool to Wynyard and then onto North Tees. For the purpose of this head-to-head I imagined I was making ‘on-demand’ journeys, though in reality Tees Flex allows users to pre-book journeys at specific times to reduce waiting. I requested a ride at 08:22 for pick-up ASAP. The app told me I should expect to wait 17 minutes and the fare would be £3, payable to the driver, which is a welcome difference from Arriva Click where payments are taken by the app.
Unsurprisingly, my ride was being dispatched from Ron Perry on the A19, which seems to be a popular hang out in down time. The live tracking map re-assured me I could pop-over to Costa and enjoy a take-away coffee before departure.
Out of interest I tapped in my intended journey into traveline to see how they suggested getting to North Tees, churning out a journey time of 1hr14min and an arrival time of 10:12. I reckoned if I had got my skates on and ran across town I could have got the previous departure on the 36, getting me to North Tees at 09:42. Target set. I returned to the shelter where the live travel info suggested taking a 23 which apparently randomly terminated at Seaham Grange (incorrect) or perhaps a jolly out to Newport on the 1, though it didn’t clarify whether it was the South Wales or Shropshire Newport so I gave it a miss.
44006 arrived bang on when expected and the driver requested payment and issued my ticket. For the purpose of this journey I was making single journeys, though Tees Flex offers return journeys at 50% of the single rate. I didn’t know how these returns would work, though I’m pleased to report it’s as simple as showing your outbound ticket to the driver who will then override the price for you to simply pay the ‘top-up’ fare – I don’t even need to commit to making the return journey when booking my outbound, I can simply make another scheduled or on-demand booking later.
I was wondering if I could book my second leg from Wynyard to North Tees during my first journey. Turns out this isn’t possible, during a journey the app is fixed as a live map with ETA. If there’s a next time I could pre-schedule my journey to be around the time I know the first leg will drop me off. I guess I could have called the booking line if I really wanted to narrow my connection – but I didn’t. I was the only passenger on the rapid 19 minutes journey and I was dropped off at Wynyard precinct (I bet you no-one that lives in Wynyard will call it a precinct) at the bus stop which declared ‘No Public Services’ – Doh! A poster letting people know Tees Flex exists wouldn’t go amiss.
I tapped in my next journey, wondering if the tech would allow 44006 to be released from the Hartlepool zone to make a Stockton zone journey considering it was the nearest available vehicle. It doesn’t. 44037 was duly dispatched from Stillington. I was told to expect a 18 minutes wait, not the end of the world considering Wynyard is a pleasant enough place to spend a short while. After 10 minutes, however, I had a push notification advising my Sprinter would be with me momentarily.
Not you mate, I want the next one…
44037 rolled up at 09:14 and I paid the £1.50 requested. It was only when I sat down I realised I had been issued a return. The driver must have assumed no-one would be making such a single journey and I wasn’t going to argue the 50p, especially as I was getting a private taxi for less than a standard bus single. Plus the newer Sprinters have all mod cons so I was able to reclaim the battery spend thus far on booking my rides via the USB chargers. The live map changed course from suggesting the back lanes to via the A19 not long after we set off, driver duly followed and dropped me at North Tees at exactly 09:30.
Next contender, scheduled buses. Popped straight on Traveline which churned out a suggested route of 37 to Norton, 36 to Hartlepool – exactly as expected. Next departure at 09:44, arriving 10:55, allowing for walking to stops. The Stagecoach app confirmed much the same, but has the useful feature of suggesting ticket types. I decided I didn’t require to final hop on the 7 at the flat £1.80 fare as I could probably walk quicker, meaning two singles at £5.30 just beat a dayrider plus at £5.70, though this of course would be valid for a return journey.
26285 provided traction on the 37 to Norton, where I was deposited at the Army centre. I crossed over to the Hartlepool bound side which is in a pretty sorry state, no timetable, broken live times info and social distancing guidance which as it turns out, I’ve been following for the best part of 30 years anyway.
26289 was about 8 minutes down when it got to Norton. This was my first ride on this batch on the 36, I was pleasantly surprised at their turn of speed down the A689, these seem to be worthy successors to the history of heavy-weight single decks on this route. Though I’m sure the odd E400s will be missed. It was 10:57 when I was finally deposited around the back of Middleton Grange, the closest the 36 will get you to the Marina these days. A brisk walk over the bridge had me back where I started by 11:08.
Side-by-side, head-to-head, for me one journey was quicker, cheaper, more comfortable and eminently more favourable, Tees Flex. I just wish the Hartlepool pick-ups were more flexible.
Some Facts:
Single:
Tees Flex: £4.50 (should have been £4) Bus: £5.30
Day Return:
Tees Flex: £6 Bus: £5.70
Travel Time – Including waiting for first journey:
Tees Flex: 1hr 7min. Bus: 1hr 27min.
Travel Time – From boarding first vehicle:
Tees Flex: 50min. Bus: 1hr 16min.
(22 Jul 2020, 1:52 pm)Andreos1 An interesting read and one that really smacks home how difficult it can be to get to/from hospital using public transport.
I genuinely wonder if these difficulties enter the mindset of planners and commercial teams. Visiting friends/family or attending out patients via public transport shouldn't be a chore, shouldn't be difficult nor an expensive experience.
(22 Jul 2020, 1:52 pm)Andreos1 An interesting read and one that really smacks home how difficult it can be to get to/from hospital using public transport.
I genuinely wonder if these difficulties enter the mindset of planners and commercial teams. Visiting friends/family or attending out patients via public transport shouldn't be a chore, shouldn't be difficult nor an expensive experience.
(23 Jul 2020, 7:49 am)James101 It’s a real problem. Largely invisible as patients have no other choice but to make the arduous journey via Stockton or pay for taxis/lifts as it’s the only way to get treated. It’s even worse for parts of the Durham coast who fall under the North Tees trust.Fair to say it's one that's been on my radar for quite a while, the intersite shuttle bus was ran as a registered service years ago funded primarily by Hartlepool council. Compass Royston ran it with the B7RLE that later ended up being the Teesside Park bus for years. Once the council withdrew the funding the NHS trust has funded a minibus shuttle ever since, though it's been cut back more and more over the years and is now down to just one minibus, with 23Taxis running some extra journeys commercially, though prebookable only (and hence not registered). As far as I know priority is given to patients and staff are as good as banned from using it. Many staff were moved from Hartlepool to North Tees many years ago and have seen transport progressively withdrawn for them.
Rationalising clinics to one location in a NHS trust seems to be fairly common, but the transport provision to facilitate this seems to differ greatly. Up in Newcastle the link is provided by fully fledged stagecarriage services, integrated into the rest of the network, such as the 47. Down in Hartlepool it’s a inter-site transit minibus, must be pre booked and priority is given to staff and not for use by visitors. Some journeys are fee and others are chargeable but there’s not much reasoning to which are free and which aren’t. Only picks up-drops off at the hospital so is only truly of use for inter-site travel unless you live walking distance to the hospital in the first place.
I felt as if using Flex via Wynyard was cheating the system. Then I realised that’s bizarre - just give us a proper service and we would have to jump through hoops.
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Service Manager, Coatham Connect
(23 Jul 2020, 7:49 am)James101 It’s a real problem. Largely invisible as patients have no other choice but to make the arduous journey via Stockton or pay for taxis/lifts as it’s the only way to get treated. It’s even worse for parts of the Durham coast who fall under the North Tees trust.Fair to say it's one that's been on my radar for quite a while, the intersite shuttle bus was ran as a registered service years ago funded primarily by Hartlepool council. Compass Royston ran it with the B7RLE that later ended up being the Teesside Park bus for years. Once the council withdrew the funding the NHS trust has funded a minibus shuttle ever since, though it's been cut back more and more over the years and is now down to just one minibus, with 23Taxis running some extra journeys commercially, though prebookable only (and hence not registered). As far as I know priority is given to patients and staff are as good as banned from using it. Many staff were moved from Hartlepool to North Tees many years ago and have seen transport progressively withdrawn for them.
Rationalising clinics to one location in a NHS trust seems to be fairly common, but the transport provision to facilitate this seems to differ greatly. Up in Newcastle the link is provided by fully fledged stagecarriage services, integrated into the rest of the network, such as the 47. Down in Hartlepool it’s a inter-site transit minibus, must be pre booked and priority is given to staff and not for use by visitors. Some journeys are fee and others are chargeable but there’s not much reasoning to which are free and which aren’t. Only picks up-drops off at the hospital so is only truly of use for inter-site travel unless you live walking distance to the hospital in the first place.
I felt as if using Flex via Wynyard was cheating the system. Then I realised that’s bizarre - just give us a proper service and we would have to jump through hoops.
Forum Moderator | Let us know if you have any issues
Service Manager, Coatham Connect
(23 Jul 2020, 10:57 am)tyresmoke Fair to say it's one that's been on my radar for quite a while, the intersite shuttle bus was ran as a registered service years ago funded primarily by Hartlepool council. Compass Royston ran it with the B7RLE that later ended up being the Teesside Park bus for years. Once the council withdrew the funding the NHS trust has funded a minibus shuttle ever since, though it's been cut back more and more over the years and is now down to just one minibus, with 23Taxis running some extra journeys commercially, though prebookable only (and hence not registered). As far as I know priority is given to patients and staff are as good as banned from using it. Many staff were moved from Hartlepool to North Tees many years ago and have seen transport progressively withdrawn for them.
Personally I think there is potential for a commercial service there that would link the two hospital sites via Hartlepool centre and Billingham which doesn't have a direct Hospital bus. It would have to run early and late for both staff and afternoon/evening visiting times to be of much use though which is obviously a stumbling block. It would likely need the funding from the existing shuttles too which I can't imagine the NHS would be too keen at first. So it's a bit of a catch 22 in terms of running anything.
) and the 1, 6 & 7 on say, 15 minute frequencies. Put the 3 out of its misery. Make the rest of the town into a Tees Flex zone. Allow an interchange point into the Stockton zone. Could be done with maybe 10 Sprinters? Could provide an entire town with an on-demand transit system an all of the economic and social mobility benefits for about £1m per year?
(23 Jul 2020, 10:57 am)tyresmoke Fair to say it's one that's been on my radar for quite a while, the intersite shuttle bus was ran as a registered service years ago funded primarily by Hartlepool council. Compass Royston ran it with the B7RLE that later ended up being the Teesside Park bus for years. Once the council withdrew the funding the NHS trust has funded a minibus shuttle ever since, though it's been cut back more and more over the years and is now down to just one minibus, with 23Taxis running some extra journeys commercially, though prebookable only (and hence not registered). As far as I know priority is given to patients and staff are as good as banned from using it. Many staff were moved from Hartlepool to North Tees many years ago and have seen transport progressively withdrawn for them.
Personally I think there is potential for a commercial service there that would link the two hospital sites via Hartlepool centre and Billingham which doesn't have a direct Hospital bus. It would have to run early and late for both staff and afternoon/evening visiting times to be of much use though which is obviously a stumbling block. It would likely need the funding from the existing shuttles too which I can't imagine the NHS would be too keen at first. So it's a bit of a catch 22 in terms of running anything.
) and the 1, 6 & 7 on say, 15 minute frequencies. Put the 3 out of its misery. Make the rest of the town into a Tees Flex zone. Allow an interchange point into the Stockton zone. Could be done with maybe 10 Sprinters? Could provide an entire town with an on-demand transit system an all of the economic and social mobility benefits for about £1m per year?
![[Image: 1c9a9d9d86eb2f0c4aa840df5c8eccb2.jpg]](https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200723/1c9a9d9d86eb2f0c4aa840df5c8eccb2.jpg)
Quick write up from a trip I made last week
0910 Bishop Auckland (Northern 156479)
1004 X21 Chester-le-Street (GNE 6050)
1109 21 Birtley, Windsor Road (GNE 6316)
1149 X12 Eldon Square, Newcastle (ANE 7493)
1330(ish) 53 Newcastle (GNE 9070)
1453 X16 Morpeth Bus Station (ANE 1411)
1535ish X14 Haymarket, Newcastle (ANE 4653)
1630 X24 Fawcett Street, Sunderland (SNE 28012)
1756 61 Murton, Dalton Park Outlet (GNE 5485)
1852 X6 Peterlee Bus Station (GNE 5209)
1938 X21 Newton Aycliffe (ANE 5209)
Started the day with a quick bash to Bishop on the train as I had some photo targets there and the train is more than three times faster than the painful slog that is the 5A, this was my first rail journey since March although occasionally swung by the rail station for pics during lockdown (social distancing adhered to).
Took 6050 across to Chester which although more comfortable than the allocated StreetDecks IMO, the Red Arrows batch of B9s are showing their age a bit now, performance wise. I has a short bash to Birtley on 6316 to snap Cathedral Bus Solo SRs on service 23 before Belmont allocation roulette chucked up 7493 on the X12 to Newcastle which was not the finest example but much more fun than the modern kit around now.
Quick snapping session and my first trip to Five Guys since about Christmas I then sampled the MetroCity demonstrator, I always like checking out these alternative energy buses although this wasn't the greatest it has to be said, felt a bit down on power at times supposed something to do with issues with the batteries, think I preferred the Yutong although others weren't fond of it for some reason.
More pics and a quick trip across to Morpeth to see what Rural Link (PCL) had out which was an MPD and aimed VW Bluebird type thing, I've noticed on 1411 a few times it has a route map suggesting that the service runs via Stannington and other places it doesn't observe but also has a map without Stannington on as well, perhaps an idea that never came to fruition? Omnicity 4653 took be back to Newcastle which was making some unhealthy sounding noises.
Had a quick trip across to Sunderland on the X24 which was rather busy, the driver took the service towards Washington to reach the A19 presumably to dodge the works at Testos.
After some pics in Sunderland I started to slowly head home taking in Dalton Park on 5485 with a case of mix and match seating moquette. Resisted the temptation of Lowlander 7456 on the 23 to Sunderland to catch 5209 on the X6 to Peterlee which became my last ride on a Solar with GNE, this one felt a bit flat on the A19 but otherwise a nice ride. After a bit of a wait at Peterlee I boarded the deserted X21 home.
(23 Jul 2020, 11:45 am)James101 The shuttle bus is near to useless at the best of times, and actually useless during COVID restrictions. To demonstrate, as it only picks up at the Hospital, it is only of use to people who live within the shaded area in Hartlepool. I've used the government standard 'Creating Places' guidelines that passengers can be expected to walk up to 400m to access a bus service.I agree the shuttle bus is useless to most people and as I said it could be opened up to all travellers with a commercial service serving many more people but of course it would require funding to build it up I suspect, which is why it won't happen. In my eyes it would be better use of the funding available but that's my opinion as an operator. Clearly 23Taxis seem to think so too as they're making a decent amount on the journeys they operate.
Beyond this, people would have to change buses to access the shuttle, by which point they may as well go via Norton. That said, the Norton connection is only 'easy' if you live on the 36 route which is either town centre or within 400m of Oxford Rd/Catcote Road. I had suggested on this forum it would be useful to have the 36 extend up to Clavering in place of the 6 to improve connections but that was shot down in flames.
Connections sound reasonable on paper but of course you're not generally dealing with the most mobile people when it comes to Hospital access. My grandma lives in Seaton Carew and needs to access North Tees for cancer treatment. Her options are an almost 2 hour run via Middlesbrough Bus Station or changing twice - in Hartlepool and then out in all weathers in Norton, which due to the road layout, can be very confusing.
One thing to come out of COVID is that radical change to systems can actually be achieved quite quickly when we need to. Hartlepool's bus services are broken and I for one don't know the fix. As workplaces and public services are increasing decentralised and journey flows become more random this will only get worse. Hartlepool's geography lends itself well to a controlled trial of a new way of working. In the same vein as, say, Blackpool, the town is self contained - it's not a through route to any other place, you can only head to Hartlepool, not really through Hartlepool. It's why regional expresses to Newcastle can't really justify calling in.
With this in mind could Tees Flex be the way forward? Keep the 36 (even through to Clavering?
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Service Manager, Coatham Connect
(23 Jul 2020, 11:45 am)James101 The shuttle bus is near to useless at the best of times, and actually useless during COVID restrictions. To demonstrate, as it only picks up at the Hospital, it is only of use to people who live within the shaded area in Hartlepool. I've used the government standard 'Creating Places' guidelines that passengers can be expected to walk up to 400m to access a bus service.I agree the shuttle bus is useless to most people and as I said it could be opened up to all travellers with a commercial service serving many more people but of course it would require funding to build it up I suspect, which is why it won't happen. In my eyes it would be better use of the funding available but that's my opinion as an operator. Clearly 23Taxis seem to think so too as they're making a decent amount on the journeys they operate.
Beyond this, people would have to change buses to access the shuttle, by which point they may as well go via Norton. That said, the Norton connection is only 'easy' if you live on the 36 route which is either town centre or within 400m of Oxford Rd/Catcote Road. I had suggested on this forum it would be useful to have the 36 extend up to Clavering in place of the 6 to improve connections but that was shot down in flames.
Connections sound reasonable on paper but of course you're not generally dealing with the most mobile people when it comes to Hospital access. My grandma lives in Seaton Carew and needs to access North Tees for cancer treatment. Her options are an almost 2 hour run via Middlesbrough Bus Station or changing twice - in Hartlepool and then out in all weathers in Norton, which due to the road layout, can be very confusing.
One thing to come out of COVID is that radical change to systems can actually be achieved quite quickly when we need to. Hartlepool's bus services are broken and I for one don't know the fix. As workplaces and public services are increasing decentralised and journey flows become more random this will only get worse. Hartlepool's geography lends itself well to a controlled trial of a new way of working. In the same vein as, say, Blackpool, the town is self contained - it's not a through route to any other place, you can only head to Hartlepool, not really through Hartlepool. It's why regional expresses to Newcastle can't really justify calling in.
With this in mind could Tees Flex be the way forward? Keep the 36 (even through to Clavering?
Forum Moderator | Let us know if you have any issues
Service Manager, Coatham Connect
(23 Jul 2020, 3:11 pm)tyresmoke I agree the shuttle bus is useless to most people and as I said it could be opened up to all travellers with a commercial service serving many more people but of course it would require funding to build it up I suspect, which is why it won't happen. In my eyes it would be better use of the funding available but that's my opinion as an operator. Clearly 23Taxis seem to think so too as they're making a decent amount on the journeys they operate.
As for the rest of the issues with Hartlepool's network - I think Stagecoach are probably doing the best they can with what little resource they can justify but of course the councils around here are not bothered about filling gaps, other than Stockton's closed door 'services' and Redcar who run everything in house.
(23 Jul 2020, 3:11 pm)tyresmoke I agree the shuttle bus is useless to most people and as I said it could be opened up to all travellers with a commercial service serving many more people but of course it would require funding to build it up I suspect, which is why it won't happen. In my eyes it would be better use of the funding available but that's my opinion as an operator. Clearly 23Taxis seem to think so too as they're making a decent amount on the journeys they operate.
As for the rest of the issues with Hartlepool's network - I think Stagecoach are probably doing the best they can with what little resource they can justify but of course the councils around here are not bothered about filling gaps, other than Stockton's closed door 'services' and Redcar who run everything in house.
(23 Jul 2020, 4:30 pm)James101 There must be a system in place for NHS trusts to subsidies commercial stagecarraige services as so many already do. Newcastle, Central Manchester, Nottingham, Derby at least all have this arrangement in some form.Oh yes there is and it needs a partnership to work but last time I suggested it to them I just got told to do one basically and they were only interested in taxi companies tendering for it.
I'll give Stagecoach credit for the £1.80 flat fare in Hartlepool as a positive move, ideal for a self contained network. The system should be simple to understand to be attractive. We can probably all agree services are never going to get any better under the current dysfunctional relationship between operator and authority.
It's also clear Hartlepool is never going to make any meaningful profit for Stagecoach. Despite this, if there was any ever radical new deal proposed by TVCA to take control of services or expand Tees Flex you can bet Stagecoach will fight tooth and nail against it to stop the concept being proven and rolled out elsewhere. Everybody loses, sad.
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(23 Jul 2020, 4:30 pm)James101 There must be a system in place for NHS trusts to subsidies commercial stagecarraige services as so many already do. Newcastle, Central Manchester, Nottingham, Derby at least all have this arrangement in some form.Oh yes there is and it needs a partnership to work but last time I suggested it to them I just got told to do one basically and they were only interested in taxi companies tendering for it.
I'll give Stagecoach credit for the £1.80 flat fare in Hartlepool as a positive move, ideal for a self contained network. The system should be simple to understand to be attractive. We can probably all agree services are never going to get any better under the current dysfunctional relationship between operator and authority.
It's also clear Hartlepool is never going to make any meaningful profit for Stagecoach. Despite this, if there was any ever radical new deal proposed by TVCA to take control of services or expand Tees Flex you can bet Stagecoach will fight tooth and nail against it to stop the concept being proven and rolled out elsewhere. Everybody loses, sad.
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(23 Jul 2020, 5:15 pm)tyresmoke Oh yes there is and it needs a partnership to work but last time I suggested it to them I just got told to do one basically and they were only interested in taxi companies tendering for it.
The only issue I've got with franchising is I don't trust the councils/MPs who would be in charge to run a growing network, I've seen too many times them fighting over buses not running to places that would never be commercially viable in a million years. The services Stockton Council run that are only open to residents are a good example of how they're only in it for themselves, they run the buses for free but only if you're a member of the transport scheme.
The potential franchising scheme in Manchester is hardly a glowing reference for councils taking over operation of a bus network either. Sadly it's going to take someone to take a punt on one to prove it doesn't work.
(23 Jul 2020, 5:15 pm)tyresmoke Oh yes there is and it needs a partnership to work but last time I suggested it to them I just got told to do one basically and they were only interested in taxi companies tendering for it.
The only issue I've got with franchising is I don't trust the councils/MPs who would be in charge to run a growing network, I've seen too many times them fighting over buses not running to places that would never be commercially viable in a million years. The services Stockton Council run that are only open to residents are a good example of how they're only in it for themselves, they run the buses for free but only if you're a member of the transport scheme.
The potential franchising scheme in Manchester is hardly a glowing reference for councils taking over operation of a bus network either. Sadly it's going to take someone to take a punt on one to prove it doesn't work.
Took my first trip out in the North East for well over a year today, have a number of things I'd like to tick off this summer so there might be a few more of these to come in the next few weeks:
#X21 - Bedlington Red Lion Front Street West to Gosforth Glamis Avenue (07:30 - 07:50) - Arriva North East 7527
One of the smaller things I'd wanted to get done this summer was to get one of the ageing B7 deckers on a dual carriageway hammering. I'd noted the first X16 frequently being allocated a B7, so after a quick check of bustimes at 6:45 todays planning began. My ride to Gosforth was a rather enjoyable 7527 - while not an MMC I do like these 14 plates, loads of top end pull and generally quite smooth. I believe this had replaced 7524 around Ashington, which then tracked again onto the board about an hour behind - of the Ashington 14 plates these are definitely the standouts, having had 7524 on an Alnwick express the other week it doesn't half shift.
#X16 - Gosforth Brunton Lane to Morpeth Castle Square (07:57 - 08:12) - Arriva North East 7413
Although this was something I wanted to do, it was more to see just how badly it struggled to get to 45mph more than anything else - so as I boarded and it easily kept up with the 3 year old 7548 I was reasonably surprised. Come the A1 we were quickly past the MMC, and a quick check of the GPS speedometer on my phone had us at a solid 60-62mph for the majority of the trip. For a 17-18 year old B7 both the pace and smoothness of the journey were most pleasant surprises, coupled with the refurbed interior made this trip very comfortable indeed. Still prefer the original 7413 mind...
#X18 - Morpeth Castle Square to Newcastle Barras Bridge (08:15 - 08:46) - Arriva North East 7532
For the next thing on the list I needed to head south and so, a couple of minutes after disembarking 7413, 7532 was my transport through to Newcastle. Though the interior is still fresh and welcoming, the puddle of water on the front seat was most unwelcome - hopefully it's rectified before the next rainy day. I'm unsure if it was because of the fairly slack timetable on these runs into Newcastle, particularly at the moment with no traffic, or if it was because it had no power - but 7532 was a far more leisurely experience along the A1. Topping out in the 50s, we still managed to make it to Barras Bridge well ahead of schedule which allowed me a more sedate walk to Eldon Square than originally envisaged.
#X10 - Newcastle Eldon Square to Stockton High Street (09:00 - 10:17) - Go North East 6311
A late addition to this summers to-do list was to get on some of the B5s on the TTX before their replacements arrive. I've had 6308, 6314 and 6334 over the past month when making a couple of small trips to visit friends etc, and coupled with 6311 they have changed my opinion of the batch somewhat. 6314 and 6334 in particular were standouts, easily handling the A19 and sitting at near enough 60 most of the way, while 6308 and 6311 were also more than adequate on the journeys I've had them on. When they're running well, the B5s can handle the A19 very well - however as has been shown over the past few years this is unfortunately not often enough. Unrelated to 6311, however on this journey it became evident how little regard some have for the current situation.
#X67 - Stockton High Street to Middlesbrough Bus Station (10:28 - 10:38) - Arriva North East 1459
As I had 55 minutes to kill until my X93, I decided to alight in Stockton and continue my journey to Middlesbrough with an X66/67. While hoping for an Omnicity, the appearance of 1459 for my X67 was most welcome. While the running gear is solid enough, and can be very enjoyable, my main attraction to Pulsars is the interior - whatever spec they are, Arriva's Pulsars are always pleasant places to be. In my mind they're one of the last single decks to feel like a proper single decker - full length and a decent amount of forward facing seating.
#X93 - Middlesbrough Bus Station to Whitby Bus Station (11:20 - 12:28) - Arriva North East 7404
Whilst not likely to go anywhere soon, I thought that I should get on an Arriva B9 this summer as I'd still not managed to get one in their 6 years in the region. Much like 7532, I'm not sure if the driver was fully going for it along the flats, as we only got up to around 50 but stayed on time the entire journey. The flats, however, weren't what I was interested in - I wanted to see how after 6 years it would cope with the hills. Virtually every hill it tackled, it tackled well and we got up with relatively little issue - even Birk Brow was climbed with relative ease, never dropping much below 30mph (though there were only about 15 on, so I do wonder how it would cope with a full load). The interior was reasonably tidy but, while I don't mind the seats, the legroom was a tad on the small side for my liking. Overall I think at 6 years old these B9s are still very capable, though I wonder what Arriva will replace them with when the time comes.
#X93 - Whitby Bus Station to Middlesbrough Bus Station (12:58 - 14:09) - Arriva North East 7610
While hoping for another B9, 7610 being my return was confirmed by bustimes before I even arrived in Whitby - I'm really undecided if allocations being this easy to see is something I enjoy or not, it does somewhat ruin any surprises, but at the same time is almightily useful for rare workings! Having only ever experienced these VDLs on Blyth expresses, I was intrigued as to how one would handle something far more demanding. While it was considerably weaker than 7404 on the hills, I must admit that it had a surprisingly good turn of speed along the flats and got up to 50 a tad quicker than 7404 managed. Again interior wise these remain nice and fresh - with far better legroom than the B9!
#X10 - Middlesbrough Bus Station to Newcastle Eldon Square (14:15 - 15:46) - Go North East 6311
Having enjoyed the trip down on 6311, I wasn't too bothered by this being my vehicle for the northbound trip as well. Again, for something that is often written off as not being able to handle the route, this spent an awful lot of time overtaking other traffic on the A19. For once I didn't mind how little light the Gemini 3 lets into the upper saloon, as it allowed for a small power nap.
#X16 - Newcastle Haymarket to Morpeth Damside (15:53 - 16:31) - Arriva North East 1411
A nice Pulsar bash along the A1 is also generally quite enjoyable, so I was happy as 6311 approached Newcastle and I decided upon getting 1411 on an X16 up to Morpeth. Despite two pensioners not understanding what 2 metres is in Haymarket, my mood was still upbeat when we pulled away - only for it to crash as soon as we got onto the A1. To describe the pace of this as glacial would be unfair on glaciers, I don't think we got above 45mph along the entire A1 stretch and even then it was very strained. I can't remember the last time I saw a bus lose time between Gosforth and Clifton, but this managed it, and we arrived in Morpeth about 7 minutes late.
#35 - Morpeth Dark Lane to Newbiggin St. Andrew's Church (16:35 - 17:11) - Arriva North East 7555
Seeing 7555 come around as my 35, particularly the after the journey I'd just had, resulted in a sigh - there's no way a good MAX E400 would be on the 35. However to my surprise it was in very good fettle, easily climbing Whorral Bank and flying along the Pegswood straight. I'm unsure if this may have been having reliability issues recently, as I noticed it on the 35 yesterday too - so it possibly is being kept local. It got me to Newbiggin in timely fashion, picking up quite a few passengers at various points too, ready for the last trip of the day.
#X21 - Newbiggin Front Street to Bedlington Red Lion Front Street West (17:15 - 17:57) - Arriva North East 7551
To round off the day, 7551 provided me with a very pleasant journey back to Bedlington to pick up the car. I know it's often discussed on this forum about attracting people to using the bus, and retaining their custom. Sitting on 7551 I'm unsure how any first time bus user could get off and not be pleased with their experience, everything felt modern, with comfortable seating, USBs, NSAs, WiFi and an airy atmosphere - I can't think of any other vehicle type that, even without the spec level, inherently feels this sophisticated.
It feels good to be back enjoying public transport again, I'm sure many on here will know what I mean when I say it helps to relax like very little else. It's equally good to be able to see so many drivers happy to see custom returning, every single one I had today echoed my thanks as I got off - something which generally doesn't happen. Wearing a mask really isn't a big price to pay to be able to enjoy days out again, and so I'm glad Boris is finally allowing them!
(23 Jul 2020, 6:01 pm)James101 Totally agree on the council front, asking Hartlepool Borough Council to look after your buses is like asking Bernard Mathews to look after your turkey. Like everything, some councils would be good at running buses, some terrible. What's needed is a independent bus body which sets out criteria like service per population density, distance to stops etc., which councils/PTEs/combined authorities would have to satisfy until it can be proven a service doesn't carry enough passengers to meet a nationally set threshold and can be applied to be withdrawn.
The GMCA bus franchising proposal has been widely lambasted and I think it's been harsh. Criticised for accepting bus ridership will still decline? Well of course, they're not magic. It's stemming decline with a view to increase patronage in the future, more than the private sector can hope to achieve. Criticised for costing £134 million over 5 years? Yup, Greater Manchester is a big ol' place and implementing a passenger-first bus network for less than £9 per resident per year doesn't actually sound too bad. What critics don't focus on is the reports findings that franchising adds a net benifit back to the local economy at a ratio of £3 for £1 invested. It comes back down to the argument that buses do not make money - they enable money to move around.
Takes a lot to admit they got it wrong when they broke up GM Buses into North & South and Manchester's buses haven't been right since. Operators throwing their toys out the pram and saying if we suffer you all suffer too isn't going to help anyone. If they're so damn confident franchising will fail then why don't they just let GMCA crack on with it and be there to pick up the pieces when it all breaks down? Unless of course franchising is only a success for the passenger and not the operator or its shareholders - disaster.
(23 Jul 2020, 6:01 pm)James101 Totally agree on the council front, asking Hartlepool Borough Council to look after your buses is like asking Bernard Mathews to look after your turkey. Like everything, some councils would be good at running buses, some terrible. What's needed is a independent bus body which sets out criteria like service per population density, distance to stops etc., which councils/PTEs/combined authorities would have to satisfy until it can be proven a service doesn't carry enough passengers to meet a nationally set threshold and can be applied to be withdrawn.
The GMCA bus franchising proposal has been widely lambasted and I think it's been harsh. Criticised for accepting bus ridership will still decline? Well of course, they're not magic. It's stemming decline with a view to increase patronage in the future, more than the private sector can hope to achieve. Criticised for costing £134 million over 5 years? Yup, Greater Manchester is a big ol' place and implementing a passenger-first bus network for less than £9 per resident per year doesn't actually sound too bad. What critics don't focus on is the reports findings that franchising adds a net benifit back to the local economy at a ratio of £3 for £1 invested. It comes back down to the argument that buses do not make money - they enable money to move around.
Takes a lot to admit they got it wrong when they broke up GM Buses into North & South and Manchester's buses haven't been right since. Operators throwing their toys out the pram and saying if we suffer you all suffer too isn't going to help anyone. If they're so damn confident franchising will fail then why don't they just let GMCA crack on with it and be there to pick up the pieces when it all breaks down? Unless of course franchising is only a success for the passenger and not the operator or its shareholders - disaster.
(24 Jul 2020, 1:21 pm)Andreos1 Conversely, a number of operators point towards partnership work.
If Sheffield is used as an example, then it's more than enough to point out that it wont work.
Apart from the network being as stable as a Reliant Robin in a force 9 gale, it just seems to be a list of never ending cuts and reductions - leaving passengers dissatisfied and without the links they've used for years.
The mayor launched a review last year (https://sheffieldcityregion.org.uk/bus-r...ouncement/) and in the link a quote from him states there has been a drop of almost 20%.
I wonder why?!
(24 Jul 2020, 1:21 pm)Andreos1 Conversely, a number of operators point towards partnership work.
If Sheffield is used as an example, then it's more than enough to point out that it wont work.
Apart from the network being as stable as a Reliant Robin in a force 9 gale, it just seems to be a list of never ending cuts and reductions - leaving passengers dissatisfied and without the links they've used for years.
The mayor launched a review last year (https://sheffieldcityregion.org.uk/bus-r...ouncement/) and in the link a quote from him states there has been a drop of almost 20%.
I wonder why?!
Today saw myself and Citaro5284 have a trip around the region. This is likely the last review I'll do for some time, especially in the North East, so hopefully anyone reading enjoys!
#X21 - Bedlington Red House Farm Meadowdale to Newcastle Barras Bridge (07:12 - 07:40) - Arriva North East 7543
Still half asleep, I boarded a pretty quiet 7543 to take me to the standard meeting place of Newcastle. I've never used this particular run before through to Newcastle, but as it gets in nicely before 08:00 I'd imagine it would generally carry far more than the 13 of us that were onboard this morning. I've said before that I believe E400 MMCs are pretty much the best deckers on the market currently and so, while uneventful, trips on these are always enjoyable and a nice way to start the day.
#X10 - Newcastle Eldon Square to Stockton High Street (07:55 - 09:12) - Go North East 6086
About 6 of us boarded at Eldon Square, again nowhere near as high as I imagine that number should be to make this journey sustainable. I do enjoy these B9s, and it's nice to be able to experience them on the X9/X10 again before the service are handed over to the B11RT/Elite interdeck coaches. I've had 6081 and 6084 over the past week and a bit as well, with 6084 definitely being the most lively of the three and 6081 decidedly being the most sluggish. 6086, sitting somewhere in the middle of the other two I've had, was smooth and coped well with the hills, but it was noticeably slower off the mark than 6084. Arriving into Stockton on time, we noted that for mid-morning on a Thursday the high street was dead - not a great omen for bus services and retail alike.
#X66 - Stockton High Street to Darlington Morrisons (09:17 - 09:42) - Arriva North East 1405
A correctly allocated Durham County bus just about ended Citaro5284, while it's performance along the A66 was impressive. Hard to believe that these Pulsars are now 11 years old and, while internally they don't have USB charging, they still generally feel nice and modern inside. We had decided en route to Darlington to attempt to catch the Northern Rail service down to Saltburn, in order to get a Temsa up to Middlesbrough - resulting in some rather rapid progress on foot which saw us arrive at the station just as the service was pulling in.
Darlington North Road to Saltburn (09:48 - 10:49) - Northern 156468
When the train was first suggested, I had forgotten about the refurbs that these sets have undergone. The seats were rather comfortable, and overall it was a pleasant place to be. By Middlesbrough the train was very cosy indeed, definitely a good sign for people returning to public transport, with the majority of the passengers getting off at Redcar. We arrived into a sunny Saltburn with around half an hour until our ride back to Middlesbrough.
#X3 - Saltburn Station to Middlesbrough Bus Station (11:18 - 12:18) - Arriva North East 4724
A first for both myself and Citaro5284, Temsa Avenue 4724 and it's rather aggressive cooling fans (reassuringly, given the thermal incidents involving Temsa's over the years) arrived into Saltburn. While the seats really aren't ideal, though I managed to get the one seat that seemed to have more than an inch of padding, the overall performance and ride quality of these was almost perfect. Little to no rattles, a very smooth gearbox and ample power - it's a shame that it's only the interior letting these down! While the bus was reasonably quiet between Saltburn and Redcar, we departed the driver changeover stop with a "full" bus and it remained fairly busy through to Middlesbrough. 4724 powered its way along into the bus station and made up a fair amount of time that had been lost in Redcar, getting us in nicely in time for our next trip.
#X12 - Middlesbrough Bus Station to Durham Bus Station (12:25 - 13:44) - Arriva North East 1476
To begin the journey back up north, we boarded Arriva's 1476 on the X12. Though not MAX spec, the interiors of these standard Pulsars remain reasonably smart and fresh - however at 9 years old the lack of WiFi and any other creature comforts made this feel older than the 11 year old 1405. Performance on this was also worse than on the older example, a number of times it kicked down too early then held the gear at high revs when more speed was required. It did, however, get us into Durham in enough time for a quick walk before our next trip.
#X15 - Durham Bus Station to Consett Bus Station (14:00 - 14:40) - Go North East 6919
Heading back to Newcastle via Consett, our first vehicle was the dual door, ex-London, B7TL 6919. The interior on these is significantly more dated than that on the native GNE examples or ANEs ex-London batch - with the seats really not helping matters. Performance was solid enough, but hills were a killer and at times it felt like it would be quicker to walk up them. A timely arrival into a sunny Consett gave us a bit of time outside before the X70 to Newcastle pulled onto the stand.
#X70 - Consett Bus Station to Newcastle St Mary's Place (14:52 - 16:01) - Go North East 6119
Our final GNE bus for the day was Red Kite B9 6119 - and what a pleasant experience it was. Plenty of power, smooth gear changes and a smart, pleasant interior. I've had a few B9s on the Consett expresses over the past month and a bit and, while all were impressive, this and 6154 were by far the standouts. The journey passed without anything else of real note, and we were dropped at St Mary's Place just over 8 hours after leaving Newcastle.
#X18 - Newcastle Haymarket to Morpeth (16:12 - 16:47) - Arriva North East 7531
With a fair bit of time before either of wanted to be home, we decided upon a trip up to Morpeth to finish off the day. 7531 on it's branded route of the X18 was our transportation for the blast up the A1 and, while E400s are often blasted by enthusiasts, this sat at 55-60mph without any fuss. Reasonably surprisingly it was also virtually rattle free which, along with the smart interior, resulted in a very pleasant trip into Northumberland. Despite arriving into Morpeth early, we weren't quite able to make the connection onto the X14 back to Newcastle - instead opting to wait for 4664 on the X15.
#X15 - Morpeth Bus Station to Newcastle Barras Bridge (17:09 - 17:47) - Arriva North East 4664
Around 15 of us left Morpeth on a smart 4664, definitely one of the more surprising loadings of the day. While the overall build quality of the frames of these Scanias has never been fantastic, otherwise the interior of 4664 was pleasant and virtually without any rattles! The performance along the A1 was quite admirable, again coping with holding 55-60mph without any huge amount of fuss. Due to traffic in both Morpeth and on the A1 from Seaton Burn, we arrived into Newcastle late, though the journey had been an enjoyable end to the day.
#X21 - Newcastle Haymarket to Bedlington Red House Farm Meadowdale (18:05 - 18:36) - Arriva North East 7541
Myself and Citaro5284 parted ways, and I boarded 7541 back towards home. A reasonable load, but still nowhere near the levels of passengers that you'd usually find on the 18:05 X21 from town. Having been up since 4am, I fell asleep before we'd got to Gosforth so I don't really have much to say about this trip, just that it was evidently quite smooth and we arrived back into Bedlington on time, so happy days.
Overall, then, a most enjoyable day with some excellent journeys and vehicles. The North East is, on a sunny day especially, a stunning place to travel around and relax just looking at the scenery - something sorely missed when living in a city. Thanks again for reading!
(06 Aug 2020, 8:43 pm)mb134 #X18 - Newcastle Haymarket to Morpeth (16:12 - 16:47) - Arriva North East 7531They do exactly what they say on the tin. I slated them years back but 7529-33 have really stood their test on the X18. I hope GNE move the 6 cylinder StreetDeck to Hexham temporarily (in the winter months when fewer cyclists) and allocate an E400MMC as spare on the X9/X10. They've only briefly trialled an E400MMC twice (1x Voith version [with City bodywork] and 1x ZF version [pink 9077]).
With a fair bit of time before either of wanted to be home, we decided upon a trip up to Morpeth to finish off the day. 7531 on it's branded route of the X18 was our transportation for the blast up the A1 and, while E400s are often blasted by enthusiasts, this sat at 55-60mph without any fuss. Reasonably surprisingly it was also virtually rattle free which, along with the smart interior, resulted in a very pleasant trip into Northumberland. Despite arriving into Morpeth early, we weren't quite able to make the connection onto the X14 back to Newcastle - instead opting to wait for 4664 on the X15.
(06 Aug 2020, 8:43 pm)mb134 #X18 - Newcastle Haymarket to Morpeth (16:12 - 16:47) - Arriva North East 7531They do exactly what they say on the tin. I slated them years back but 7529-33 have really stood their test on the X18. I hope GNE move the 6 cylinder StreetDeck to Hexham temporarily (in the winter months when fewer cyclists) and allocate an E400MMC as spare on the X9/X10. They've only briefly trialled an E400MMC twice (1x Voith version [with City bodywork] and 1x ZF version [pink 9077]).
With a fair bit of time before either of wanted to be home, we decided upon a trip up to Morpeth to finish off the day. 7531 on it's branded route of the X18 was our transportation for the blast up the A1 and, while E400s are often blasted by enthusiasts, this sat at 55-60mph without any fuss. Reasonably surprisingly it was also virtually rattle free which, along with the smart interior, resulted in a very pleasant trip into Northumberland. Despite arriving into Morpeth early, we weren't quite able to make the connection onto the X14 back to Newcastle - instead opting to wait for 4664 on the X15.
Unfortunately for us, we managed to sit across from a rowdy group of adults and behind someone playing the radio for some reason! We missed our connection to Consett so we bailed out at Gateshead to take a Voltra around Saltwell Park.
It was a very short ride, but it was okay!
So after 30,000 miles of uninterrupted car driving (well, apart from the few company-issued trains here and there) over the past year and a half, I thought I'd go and try out the "better than ever" service from Go North East yesterday. A summary of the pros and cons are listed at the end.
For context, the car I drive is a German SUV with stuff such as USB charging, leather/fabric seating, reclining seats, cupholders, phone storage etc. So this is the standard to beat for me...
I'm awful at writing individual reviews for each journey, so apologies about how short they are!
Unfortunately for us, we managed to sit across from a rowdy group of adults and behind someone playing the radio for some reason! We missed our connection to Consett so we bailed out at Gateshead to take a Voltra around Saltwell Park. It was a very short ride, but it was okay!
(20 Dec 2020, 12:54 pm)omnicity4659 X9 10:32 Newcastle Eldon Square to Middlesbrough Bus Station | Go North East 6044 (NK12 GCU) Volvo B9TL/Wright Gemini 2
Was disappointed when this turned up. Not the best journey in the world, some issues are listed below (not going to say which ones for obvious reasons). It struggled up hills and slip roads on the A19, but we eventually got to Middlesbrough, where we went off for burgers at McDonald's.
(20 Dec 2020, 12:54 pm)omnicity4659 X9 10:32 Newcastle Eldon Square to Middlesbrough Bus Station | Go North East 6044 (NK12 GCU) Volvo B9TL/Wright Gemini 2
Was disappointed when this turned up. Not the best journey in the world, some issues are listed below (not going to say which ones for obvious reasons). It struggled up hills and slip roads on the A19, but we eventually got to Middlesbrough, where we went off for burgers at McDonald's.
(20 Dec 2020, 11:36 pm)Rapidsnap By chance were you sitting upstairs at the front on the nearside?
I photoed said journey whilst stood at the Bigg Market in Toon on Saturday. Was annoyed myself that it was a decker instead of a coach. But on the plus side I managed to get photos of the AG and Charterplan coaches which I needed better photos of than what I already had, plus I got 2 of the coaches with the X-Lines branding, which is better than nothing.
(20 Dec 2020, 11:36 pm)Rapidsnap By chance were you sitting upstairs at the front on the nearside?
I photoed said journey whilst stood at the Bigg Market in Toon on Saturday. Was annoyed myself that it was a decker instead of a coach. But on the plus side I managed to get photos of the AG and Charterplan coaches which I needed better photos of than what I already had, plus I got 2 of the coaches with the X-Lines branding, which is better than nothing.
(20 Dec 2020, 12:54 pm)omnicity4659 So after 30,000 miles of uninterrupted car driving (well, apart from the few company-issued trains here and there) over the past year and a half, I thought I'd go and try out the "better than ever" service from Go North East yesterday. A summary of the pros and cons are listed at the end.
For context, the car I drive is a German SUV with stuff such as USB charging, leather/fabric seating, reclining seats, cupholders, phone storage etc. So this is the standard to beat for me...
I'm awful at writing individual reviews for each journey, so apologies about how short they are!
I started my day by heading over to the bus stop joined by my friend, it looked like that Newcastle city council were doing a spot of maintenance to it, so I couldn't take cover from the elements.
X84 to Newcastle Eldon Square | Go North East 6355 (YX70 OKP) X-lines X84/X85 Enviro400MMC
My first GNE bus since May last year! It still had the new bus smell, too. I asked the driver for the under 25 day ticket, and the driver was friendly and politely explained the need for ID. Information regarding the route and COVID-19 was plentiful onboard, whilst the bus itself was clean and tidy.
X9 10:32 Newcastle Eldon Square to Middlesbrough Bus Station | Go North East 6044 (NK12 GCU) Volvo B9TL/Wright Gemini 2
Was disappointed when this turned up. Not the best journey in the world, some issues are listed below (not going to say which ones for obvious reasons). It struggled up hills and slip roads on the A19, but we eventually got to Middlesbrough, where we went off for burgers at McDonald's.
X9 12:45 Middlesbrough Bus Station to Peterlee Thorpe Road Roundabout | Go North East 7110 (FCU 190) "Armstrong Galley" Caetano Levante
It had an abundance of power and handled everything well. The seats were comfortable, but we couldn't charge our phones as it only had 3-pins. As we sat in Peterlee for a while, it was clear that something wasn't right. My mechanically clued-up friend translated what the driver was saying on the phone as brake issues...oh dear! We left Peterlee bus station eventually, but the driver understandably threw in the towel at the Thorpe Road roundabout. Was very pleased to watch the X10 turning right into Peterlee on Bus Times' map...thought we were going to be stuck for an hour!
X10 14:03 Peterlee Thorpe Road Roundabout to Gateshead Interchange | Go North East 7124 (BD65 JDZ) unbranded National Express Caetano Levante
Rescued at last!
53 14:45 Gateshead Interchange to Newcastle Market Street | Go North East 8804 (ND70 AEV) Voltra Yutong E10
Didn't need to run for this as the Mobitec displays informed us we had three minutes! Loved how quiet and fast these Yutongs are. Stop bell and announcements were good, as well as the screens when they weren't frozen. I used the phone holders and USB chargers which worked fine too.
X45 15:35 Newcastle Eldon Square to Metrocentre Interchange | Go North East 6332 (NK67 GOA) X-lines X45/X46/X47 Wright StreetDeck
Hopped onboard this StreetDeck over to the Metrocentre, glad to see a more prominent (generic isn't the right word...) brand for major connections like this, instead of being purely branded for the Red Kite. Bus was clean, and we had a table to ourselves where we played GNE's version of Where's Wally...
49A 16:07 Metrocentre Interchange to Winlaton Bus Station | Go North East 5457 (NK66 EWF) Wright StreetLite
After redeeming my Costa coffee club points, we hopped on my friend's first ever StreetLite... his good reviews were quickly taken back when we headed up the Shibdon Bank.
12 16:40 Winlaton Bus Station to Newcastle Newgate Street | Go North East 5282 (NK07 KPT) Mercedes Citaro
After a cold and somewhat unpleasant wait in Winlaton, 5282 rocked up to take us into the toon. I've missed going on these purely for how fast they are! It was a short but sweet journey through Blaydon and along the Scotswood Road into Newcastle.
X84 17:50 from Newcastle Eldon Square | Go North East 6355 (YX70 OKP) X-lines X84/X85 Enviro400MMC
And the first bus of the day was also our last! Loved the red lighting around the tables. We were the only passengers on-board for our whole journey.
Pros
Cons
- Seats were comfortable and supported both bums and backs well. (X-lines X84/X85 and Caetano Levantes)
Probably the best seats I've ever sat on whilst travelling on buses. The cushioning and fabrics were just right.
- Printed bus information is of high quality and is informative, where available.
Only gripes I have is referencing to X84/X85 as "X84/85". Also, the X84/X85 leaflet refers to a bike bus guarantee and tells me to go online to find out more...where?!
- USB charging worked on all buses we went on.
Including Voltra buses, where we both utilised the phone holder which worked very well.
- Communication between drivers and control was good.
I saw drivers reporting issues to control twice via both mobile and radio, resulting in vehicle changeovers or diversions to rescue stranded passengers.
- Cleanliness on most buses was good.
I found the majority of buses to have high levels of hygiene and didn't visibly seem dirty.
- Buses were mostly within 5 minutes of schedule.
- Pricing of fares for under 25s is excellent, especially with the addition of routes X9 and X10.
- Online information was informative, however, a more obvious link to timetables needs to be visible on the website especially when rushing to find out times.
I also experienced issues with downloading timetables, with only being able to download one PDF in a given time onto my phone. Perhaps have PDFs accessible to view directly through the website?
- Driving standards were generally good.
On the majority of journeys, no illegal, dangerous or uncomfortable manoeuvres were made.
- Lighting really made the journey comfortable. (X-lines X84/X85)
At night, having only one side illuminated with the white lights above was amazing. Just having the red table lights is a good touch. I couldn't imagine that colours such as green or orange would have been as good though.
Overall, the experience is a lot better than what it was when I last used GNE's buses properly, and certainly a lot better than other operators. They've come a long way but there's still a long way to go until they could attract car drivers like me to use them for more than just leisure every blue moon. Unless it was for a longer journey on a comfortable reliable coach or X-lines X84/X85 E400MMC, I'd just stick to driving to be honest.
- Being asked for ID when boarding every other bus does get irritating, especially when in some cases the driver just accepts me pulling out my driving licence without looking at it.
Perhaps asking for ID at the point of sale only would be easier for both customers and drivers? Maybe work with Ticketer to implement a first-time ID check for those using mobile tickets?
- Cupholders were too shallow, the tables were too flimsy and USB ports are difficult to access when tables are extended. (X-lines X84/X85)
My table took a good bit of power to pull out, whilst my friend's table was twisting. I'm not too sure as to why shallow cupholders and flush wireless charging pads are fitted to a moving vehicle? I also found that the gap at the back of the extending table is wide enough to let my phone slip through.
- Announcements about COVID-19 cleaning measures and the app were very irritating, especially when it impaired my ability to have a conversation.
I found that these announcements always played on the approach to stops too and missed out the vital "this is XXX" announcement, completely obliterating the point of having announcements fitted. Keep these messages to posters and online in the future. Everyone can see the bus is clean.
- Driving standards were very poor at times.
I spotted alarming rates of tailgating vehicles in front (even at speed), misuse of the horn, as well as driving on or over the rumble strips on dual carriageways, as well as crossing lane, slip road and layby markings (at times almost hitting the kerb - if I was following behind I'd be submitting dashcam footage to both GNE and the police!). Harsh braking for no reason, clipping kerbs and speeding was also experienced on other buses.
- Communication between driver/company and passengers was poor.
The driver only told the front passengers about what was happening and what was being done about it. No reassurance or news was provided to the rest of the bus, simply just having to rely on hearing their conversation.
- Cleanliness was an issue. (Caetano Levantes)
There was a lot of sticky substances and dirt residue which had clearly been there a long time. Both toilets were locked, despite it being mentioned that these were in use?
- Hand sanitisers installed facing into the aisle causes issues. (Voltra Yutongs)
An elderly man accidentally knocked the device off causing a spillage.
- Limited or too much of a view from certain windows. (Voltra Yutongs)
A pair of nearside seats have a very obscured view whilst the rearmost seats are placed above the window line causing privacy issues.
- Merger of buggy and wheelchair bays. (Voltra Yutongs)
Another niggle of mine is when this happens... much better when they're separated. Also, two standard size buggies didn't fit comfortably into the space so this kind of misses the point of having a long bay.
- Door and next stop announcement faults. (Voltra Yutongs)
The driver had to regularly get out and open the doors manually, whilst there were gaps in the next stop announcements.
- Lack of physical bus information, by both Nexus and operators.
Nexus had hijacked all matrix screens with information about face coverings, whilst there wasn't a single printed timetable in sight other than on-board buses. Could GNE work with Nexus to install their own timetable rack at bus stations? Also, Nexus should keep matrix screens for bus departures only!
- Legacy features such as 3-pin charging still in place.
A passenger sat opposite us on 6044 tried using their socket but it didn't work.
- Information regarding exemptions from face coverings is very poor.
A common issue when communicating this... On-board signs only mentioned young children and those with respiratory disabilities as being exempt. This is incorrect, please just stick to the "unless exempt" wording instead of trying to poorly list exempt conditions. The government has made guidance clear about this, stating that people are exempt if they cannot physically/mentally wear a mask because of a condition, not if they have a condition. Also, an issue I spotted a while ago on Twitter was GNE encouraging customers to carry an exemption card if they were exempt. This is also wrong as shown in the last section of this page on GOV.UK. The signs are still better than what I spotted at Metrocentre though, where those who didn't have a face covering were threatened with being denied entry or being asked to leave.
(20 Dec 2020, 12:54 pm)omnicity4659 So after 30,000 miles of uninterrupted car driving (well, apart from the few company-issued trains here and there) over the past year and a half, I thought I'd go and try out the "better than ever" service from Go North East yesterday. A summary of the pros and cons are listed at the end.
For context, the car I drive is a German SUV with stuff such as USB charging, leather/fabric seating, reclining seats, cupholders, phone storage etc. So this is the standard to beat for me...
I'm awful at writing individual reviews for each journey, so apologies about how short they are!
I started my day by heading over to the bus stop joined by my friend, it looked like that Newcastle city council were doing a spot of maintenance to it, so I couldn't take cover from the elements.
X84 to Newcastle Eldon Square | Go North East 6355 (YX70 OKP) X-lines X84/X85 Enviro400MMC
My first GNE bus since May last year! It still had the new bus smell, too. I asked the driver for the under 25 day ticket, and the driver was friendly and politely explained the need for ID. Information regarding the route and COVID-19 was plentiful onboard, whilst the bus itself was clean and tidy.
X9 10:32 Newcastle Eldon Square to Middlesbrough Bus Station | Go North East 6044 (NK12 GCU) Volvo B9TL/Wright Gemini 2
Was disappointed when this turned up. Not the best journey in the world, some issues are listed below (not going to say which ones for obvious reasons). It struggled up hills and slip roads on the A19, but we eventually got to Middlesbrough, where we went off for burgers at McDonald's.
X9 12:45 Middlesbrough Bus Station to Peterlee Thorpe Road Roundabout | Go North East 7110 (FCU 190) "Armstrong Galley" Caetano Levante
It had an abundance of power and handled everything well. The seats were comfortable, but we couldn't charge our phones as it only had 3-pins. As we sat in Peterlee for a while, it was clear that something wasn't right. My mechanically clued-up friend translated what the driver was saying on the phone as brake issues...oh dear! We left Peterlee bus station eventually, but the driver understandably threw in the towel at the Thorpe Road roundabout. Was very pleased to watch the X10 turning right into Peterlee on Bus Times' map...thought we were going to be stuck for an hour!
X10 14:03 Peterlee Thorpe Road Roundabout to Gateshead Interchange | Go North East 7124 (BD65 JDZ) unbranded National Express Caetano Levante
Rescued at last!
53 14:45 Gateshead Interchange to Newcastle Market Street | Go North East 8804 (ND70 AEV) Voltra Yutong E10
Didn't need to run for this as the Mobitec displays informed us we had three minutes! Loved how quiet and fast these Yutongs are. Stop bell and announcements were good, as well as the screens when they weren't frozen. I used the phone holders and USB chargers which worked fine too.
X45 15:35 Newcastle Eldon Square to Metrocentre Interchange | Go North East 6332 (NK67 GOA) X-lines X45/X46/X47 Wright StreetDeck
Hopped onboard this StreetDeck over to the Metrocentre, glad to see a more prominent (generic isn't the right word...) brand for major connections like this, instead of being purely branded for the Red Kite. Bus was clean, and we had a table to ourselves where we played GNE's version of Where's Wally...
49A 16:07 Metrocentre Interchange to Winlaton Bus Station | Go North East 5457 (NK66 EWF) Wright StreetLite
After redeeming my Costa coffee club points, we hopped on my friend's first ever StreetLite... his good reviews were quickly taken back when we headed up the Shibdon Bank.
12 16:40 Winlaton Bus Station to Newcastle Newgate Street | Go North East 5282 (NK07 KPT) Mercedes Citaro
After a cold and somewhat unpleasant wait in Winlaton, 5282 rocked up to take us into the toon. I've missed going on these purely for how fast they are! It was a short but sweet journey through Blaydon and along the Scotswood Road into Newcastle.
X84 17:50 from Newcastle Eldon Square | Go North East 6355 (YX70 OKP) X-lines X84/X85 Enviro400MMC
And the first bus of the day was also our last! Loved the red lighting around the tables. We were the only passengers on-board for our whole journey.
Pros
Cons
- Seats were comfortable and supported both bums and backs well. (X-lines X84/X85 and Caetano Levantes)
Probably the best seats I've ever sat on whilst travelling on buses. The cushioning and fabrics were just right.
- Printed bus information is of high quality and is informative, where available.
Only gripes I have is referencing to X84/X85 as "X84/85". Also, the X84/X85 leaflet refers to a bike bus guarantee and tells me to go online to find out more...where?!
- USB charging worked on all buses we went on.
Including Voltra buses, where we both utilised the phone holder which worked very well.
- Communication between drivers and control was good.
I saw drivers reporting issues to control twice via both mobile and radio, resulting in vehicle changeovers or diversions to rescue stranded passengers.
- Cleanliness on most buses was good.
I found the majority of buses to have high levels of hygiene and didn't visibly seem dirty.
- Buses were mostly within 5 minutes of schedule.
- Pricing of fares for under 25s is excellent, especially with the addition of routes X9 and X10.
- Online information was informative, however, a more obvious link to timetables needs to be visible on the website especially when rushing to find out times.
I also experienced issues with downloading timetables, with only being able to download one PDF in a given time onto my phone. Perhaps have PDFs accessible to view directly through the website?
- Driving standards were generally good.
On the majority of journeys, no illegal, dangerous or uncomfortable manoeuvres were made.
- Lighting really made the journey comfortable. (X-lines X84/X85)
At night, having only one side illuminated with the white lights above was amazing. Just having the red table lights is a good touch. I couldn't imagine that colours such as green or orange would have been as good though.
Overall, the experience is a lot better than what it was when I last used GNE's buses properly, and certainly a lot better than other operators. They've come a long way but there's still a long way to go until they could attract car drivers like me to use them for more than just leisure every blue moon. Unless it was for a longer journey on a comfortable reliable coach or X-lines X84/X85 E400MMC, I'd just stick to driving to be honest.
- Being asked for ID when boarding every other bus does get irritating, especially when in some cases the driver just accepts me pulling out my driving licence without looking at it.
Perhaps asking for ID at the point of sale only would be easier for both customers and drivers? Maybe work with Ticketer to implement a first-time ID check for those using mobile tickets?
- Cupholders were too shallow, the tables were too flimsy and USB ports are difficult to access when tables are extended. (X-lines X84/X85)
My table took a good bit of power to pull out, whilst my friend's table was twisting. I'm not too sure as to why shallow cupholders and flush wireless charging pads are fitted to a moving vehicle? I also found that the gap at the back of the extending table is wide enough to let my phone slip through.
- Announcements about COVID-19 cleaning measures and the app were very irritating, especially when it impaired my ability to have a conversation.
I found that these announcements always played on the approach to stops too and missed out the vital "this is XXX" announcement, completely obliterating the point of having announcements fitted. Keep these messages to posters and online in the future. Everyone can see the bus is clean.
- Driving standards were very poor at times.
I spotted alarming rates of tailgating vehicles in front (even at speed), misuse of the horn, as well as driving on or over the rumble strips on dual carriageways, as well as crossing lane, slip road and layby markings (at times almost hitting the kerb - if I was following behind I'd be submitting dashcam footage to both GNE and the police!). Harsh braking for no reason, clipping kerbs and speeding was also experienced on other buses.
- Communication between driver/company and passengers was poor.
The driver only told the front passengers about what was happening and what was being done about it. No reassurance or news was provided to the rest of the bus, simply just having to rely on hearing their conversation.
- Cleanliness was an issue. (Caetano Levantes)
There was a lot of sticky substances and dirt residue which had clearly been there a long time. Both toilets were locked, despite it being mentioned that these were in use?
- Hand sanitisers installed facing into the aisle causes issues. (Voltra Yutongs)
An elderly man accidentally knocked the device off causing a spillage.
- Limited or too much of a view from certain windows. (Voltra Yutongs)
A pair of nearside seats have a very obscured view whilst the rearmost seats are placed above the window line causing privacy issues.
- Merger of buggy and wheelchair bays. (Voltra Yutongs)
Another niggle of mine is when this happens... much better when they're separated. Also, two standard size buggies didn't fit comfortably into the space so this kind of misses the point of having a long bay.
- Door and next stop announcement faults. (Voltra Yutongs)
The driver had to regularly get out and open the doors manually, whilst there were gaps in the next stop announcements.
- Lack of physical bus information, by both Nexus and operators.
Nexus had hijacked all matrix screens with information about face coverings, whilst there wasn't a single printed timetable in sight other than on-board buses. Could GNE work with Nexus to install their own timetable rack at bus stations? Also, Nexus should keep matrix screens for bus departures only!
- Legacy features such as 3-pin charging still in place.
A passenger sat opposite us on 6044 tried using their socket but it didn't work.
- Information regarding exemptions from face coverings is very poor.
A common issue when communicating this... On-board signs only mentioned young children and those with respiratory disabilities as being exempt. This is incorrect, please just stick to the "unless exempt" wording instead of trying to poorly list exempt conditions. The government has made guidance clear about this, stating that people are exempt if they cannot physically/mentally wear a mask because of a condition, not if they have a condition. Also, an issue I spotted a while ago on Twitter was GNE encouraging customers to carry an exemption card if they were exempt. This is also wrong as shown in the last section of this page on GOV.UK. The signs are still better than what I spotted at Metrocentre though, where those who didn't have a face covering were threatened with being denied entry or being asked to leave.
(21 Dec 2020, 3:13 am)streetdeckfan I've yet to go on a new StreetDeck which has the sockets/USB ports working, and the wireless chargers on the E400s seem to be temperamental at best.
I'd personally pick a 3 pin over a USB port because I'd like my phone to be charged at a reasonable rate, it's just a shame they don't use a more powerful inverter, because from what I've... heard... they aren't powerful enough for a gaming laptop, and plugging one in will cause the sockets to cut off.
I personally haven't been asked for ID since the start of the pandemic, even when I've bought the ticket from the driver. It's not much of an issue for me because I keep my ID in my bus pass holder (which hasn't held my Key Card for a while since GNE seem to be killing it).
It's not just Nexus that have taken over the matrix displays, it's the same all over Durham. I don't understand why they think that telling people to follow social distancing guidelines is more important than giving people the bus times. All it does is cause people to crowd around the timetables at the stand so they can see when their bus is!
(21 Dec 2020, 3:13 am)streetdeckfan I've yet to go on a new StreetDeck which has the sockets/USB ports working, and the wireless chargers on the E400s seem to be temperamental at best.
I'd personally pick a 3 pin over a USB port because I'd like my phone to be charged at a reasonable rate, it's just a shame they don't use a more powerful inverter, because from what I've... heard... they aren't powerful enough for a gaming laptop, and plugging one in will cause the sockets to cut off.
I personally haven't been asked for ID since the start of the pandemic, even when I've bought the ticket from the driver. It's not much of an issue for me because I keep my ID in my bus pass holder (which hasn't held my Key Card for a while since GNE seem to be killing it).
It's not just Nexus that have taken over the matrix displays, it's the same all over Durham. I don't understand why they think that telling people to follow social distancing guidelines is more important than giving people the bus times. All it does is cause people to crowd around the timetables at the stand so they can see when their bus is!
