Enviro 400MMC's for the X10
Enviro 400MMC's for the X10
(20 Dec 2021, 3:26 pm)Dan The X85 is a commercial venture. The X84, and all other local bus services in Hexham, are secured by Northumberland County Council.
The X85 no longer runs to Newbrough because that section of the route was secured at the time, and Northumberland County Council wanted it to be a separate service.
(20 Dec 2021, 3:26 pm)Dan The X85 is a commercial venture. The X84, and all other local bus services in Hexham, are secured by Northumberland County Council.
The X85 no longer runs to Newbrough because that section of the route was secured at the time, and Northumberland County Council wanted it to be a separate service.
(20 Dec 2021, 5:05 pm)OrangeArrow49 Are the evening and Sunday trips on the X85 going to continue to run? With Versas allocated? Could we see Versas on the 74 soon? Perhaps the 74 and X85 could serve Central Station?really, they could keep the X85 and run it Via the Metrocentre, that would keep it profitable. But with the NCC musten be best pleased that the X84 is loosing such high spec vechiles
Would it be possible to extend the 42A to Kingston Park Tesco? Maybe run it along the M71 route to Westerhope? Nexus could secure the 42A from Dinnington to Westerhope via Kingston Park and Tesco Car Park and withdraw the M71? Hope to see the 42A stick around. Unfortunate the 42A can't be extended from Kingston Park into town, or maybe the M71 Kingston Park into town via Westerhope and West Denton Shops. 13 could alternatively run into town from West Denton Shops.
(20 Dec 2021, 5:05 pm)OrangeArrow49 Are the evening and Sunday trips on the X85 going to continue to run? With Versas allocated? Could we see Versas on the 74 soon? Perhaps the 74 and X85 could serve Central Station?really, they could keep the X85 and run it Via the Metrocentre, that would keep it profitable. But with the NCC musten be best pleased that the X84 is loosing such high spec vechiles
Would it be possible to extend the 42A to Kingston Park Tesco? Maybe run it along the M71 route to Westerhope? Nexus could secure the 42A from Dinnington to Westerhope via Kingston Park and Tesco Car Park and withdraw the M71? Hope to see the 42A stick around. Unfortunate the 42A can't be extended from Kingston Park into town, or maybe the M71 Kingston Park into town via Westerhope and West Denton Shops. 13 could alternatively run into town from West Denton Shops.
(20 Dec 2021, 5:11 pm)Keeiajs really, they could keep the X85 and run it Via the Metrocentre, that would keep it profitable. But with the NCC musten be best pleased that the X84 is loosing such high spec vechiles
(20 Dec 2021, 5:11 pm)Keeiajs really, they could keep the X85 and run it Via the Metrocentre, that would keep it profitable. But with the NCC musten be best pleased that the X84 is loosing such high spec vechiles
(20 Dec 2021, 5:58 pm)Kramer1 Surely the point of X85 is to provide an express service from Hexham and Corbridge to Newcastle, adding in the metrocentre would only detract from that and I doubt NCC are paying for such high spec vehicles in the first place. I think it comes down to capacity and accessibility, anything else is GNE trying to attract more passengers.But surely going Via Central Station & Metrocentre will attract more passengers. Or Maybe upto kingston park or NCL
(20 Dec 2021, 5:58 pm)Kramer1 Surely the point of X85 is to provide an express service from Hexham and Corbridge to Newcastle, adding in the metrocentre would only detract from that and I doubt NCC are paying for such high spec vehicles in the first place. I think it comes down to capacity and accessibility, anything else is GNE trying to attract more passengers.But surely going Via Central Station & Metrocentre will attract more passengers. Or Maybe upto kingston park or NCL
(20 Dec 2021, 6:09 pm)Keeiajs But surely going Via Central Station & Metrocentre will attract more passengers. Or Maybe upto kingston park or NCL
(20 Dec 2021, 6:09 pm)Keeiajs But surely going Via Central Station & Metrocentre will attract more passengers. Or Maybe upto kingston park or NCL
(20 Dec 2021, 5:05 pm)OrangeArrow49 Are the evening and Sunday trips on the X85 going to continue to run? With Versas allocated? Could we see Versas on the 74 soon? Perhaps the 74 and X85 could serve Central Station?
Would it be possible to extend the 42A to Kingston Park Tesco? Maybe run it along the M71 route to Westerhope? Nexus could secure the 42A from Dinnington to Westerhope via Kingston Park and Tesco Car Park and withdraw the M71? Hope to see the 42A stick around. Unfortunate the 42A can't be extended from Kingston Park into town, or maybe the M71 Kingston Park into town via Westerhope and West Denton Shops. 13 could alternatively run into town from West Denton Shops.
(20 Dec 2021, 5:05 pm)OrangeArrow49 Are the evening and Sunday trips on the X85 going to continue to run? With Versas allocated? Could we see Versas on the 74 soon? Perhaps the 74 and X85 could serve Central Station?
Would it be possible to extend the 42A to Kingston Park Tesco? Maybe run it along the M71 route to Westerhope? Nexus could secure the 42A from Dinnington to Westerhope via Kingston Park and Tesco Car Park and withdraw the M71? Hope to see the 42A stick around. Unfortunate the 42A can't be extended from Kingston Park into town, or maybe the M71 Kingston Park into town via Westerhope and West Denton Shops. 13 could alternatively run into town from West Denton Shops.
(20 Dec 2021, 6:59 pm)Keeiajs Aldepends which way it goes, whether it joins the A1, then upto the A69, or whether it continues upto Prudhoe and Blaydon
(20 Dec 2021, 6:59 pm)Keeiajs Aldepends which way it goes, whether it joins the A1, then upto the A69, or whether it continues upto Prudhoe and Blaydon
(20 Dec 2021, 7:04 pm)streetdeckfan Both journeys take roughly the same amount of time (in the car at least), so they might as well just run it through Blaydon and Prudhoe to pick up some extra passengersI think going Via A69 would be quicker, possibly under 1 hour.
It seems 'Commuter Express' runs are on their way out at least under current circumstances and its not just here, Green Line routes are being withdrawn and King's Ferry are also scrapping their commuter express runs after service on Friday due to reduced demand since COVID hit.
COVID seems to have been one of the biggest killers for the X9/X10 as it has been for the last several years due to less people travelling because of restrictions and feeling uneasy about travelling or going out in general.
I think other factors have also led to its downfall over the years such as reliability such as breakdowns, late running, works at Testos, I wouldn't be surprised if some changes that went with the introduction of coaches being introduced also were a factor for its demise such as being less accessible for those with mobility issues (Arriva got loads of complaints when they made their X66 between Darlington & Middlesbrough coach operated in the past) and also pulling the service out of Eldon Square, have encountered passengers asking in Eldon Square for a bus to Middlesbrough with some even opting for the X12 due to them being unaware of the X9/X10 being moved out and just assume its been withdrawn. The train has also been a challenge to compete with, although it hasn't gone near to Peterlee for years, the opening of Horden Station in the last year may have impacted the numbers with some who may have travelled into Peterlee previously instead travelling to Horden Station and getting the train in and let's face it, where would rather wait, a well lit train station or a little grotty shelter on the slip-road to the A19?
Similar issues have fallen on the X85 except with that one they've tried to go against the train by making it faster and running it into the evening but at the expense of omitting Heddon & Horsley which resulted into the passengers being left with the longer journey on the X84 into Hexham or the 685 and whilst there may be three buses an hour between Hexham and Newcastle (excluding 10 & 74) they leave Hexham Bus Station within the space of 6 minutes during off peak hours (X85: 39 mins past, 685: 44 mins past, X84: 45 mins past) what use is that?! It's actually the thing that's stopped me going to Hexham as there's times I've thought about doing some of the other runs around Hexham but put off when I find I have something like 40 minutes to wait for a bus because all three leave at virtually the same time.
The driver shortages and articles being published stating such is off putting to passenger and not exactly going to attract many if you know this, even less so when the shortages actually fall on you, I hate a bus being cancelled on the Sapphire 7 with a 20 minute frequency, what must people think on a less frequent route like the above? Doesn't even need to actually happen, just the thought that it *could* happen is off putting for many, myself included.
(20 Dec 2021, 7:21 pm)Jimmi Similar issues have fallen on the X85 except with that one they've tried to go against the train by making it faster and running it into the evening but at the expense of omitting Heddon & Horsley which resulted into the passengers being left with the longer journey on the X84 into Hexham or the 685 and whilst there may be three buses an hour between Hexham and Newcastle (excluding 10 & 74) they leave Hexham Bus Station within the space of 6 minutes during off peak hours (X85: 39 mins past, 685: 44 mins past, X84: 45 mins past) what use is that?! It's actually the thing that's stopped me going to Hexham as there's times I've thought about doing some of the other runs around Hexham but put off when I find I have something like 40 minutes to wait for a bus because all three leave at virtually the same time.This is the same for me, even if I could quickly get off the X84, and jump onto the X85 I would miss the X85, and I would have to wait a hour and it was just a pain. Its not like there is a McDonalds or KFC near by. And for your comment about eldon square I have heard people ask what buses to go to Middlesborough the nexus person says X12.
(20 Dec 2021, 7:21 pm)Jimmi Similar issues have fallen on the X85 except with that one they've tried to go against the train by making it faster and running it into the evening but at the expense of omitting Heddon & Horsley which resulted into the passengers being left with the longer journey on the X84 into Hexham or the 685 and whilst there may be three buses an hour between Hexham and Newcastle (excluding 10 & 74) they leave Hexham Bus Station within the space of 6 minutes during off peak hours (X85: 39 mins past, 685: 44 mins past, X84: 45 mins past) what use is that?! It's actually the thing that's stopped me going to Hexham as there's times I've thought about doing some of the other runs around Hexham but put off when I find I have something like 40 minutes to wait for a bus because all three leave at virtually the same time.This is the same for me, even if I could quickly get off the X84, and jump onto the X85 I would miss the X85, and I would have to wait a hour and it was just a pain. Its not like there is a McDonalds or KFC near by. And for your comment about eldon square I have heard people ask what buses to go to Middlesborough the nexus person says X12.
Can't see the X85 doing Blaydon and Metrocentre because the 10 already does, but it would allow direct travel from Denton Burn/Fenham to Blaydon/Metrocentre without going into town, as well as being a quick, direct route to Hexham. I hope the X84 survives for Heddon & Throckley and wherever else. Serving Central Station could be useful.
Would it be possible to run the X85 through Ponteland and Kingston Park into town instead of Denton Burn/Fenham/Benwell or would that add too much time on? 74A used to do Ponteland & Kingston Park between Hexham and Newcastle.
To be honest, going back to deckers for the X10 (X9) maybe a good move, since they are quicker at unloading and loading passengers, and more likely the pensioners may return to using the service since they don't have an awkward staircase to climb to access a dark dingy seating area. Plus the deckers will be more brighter and airy inside.
(20 Dec 2021, 8:47 pm)Rapidsnap To be honest, going back to deckers for the X10 (X9) maybe a good move, since they are quicker at unloading and loading passengers, and more likely the pensioners may return to using the service since they don't have an awkward staircase to climb to access a dark dingy seating area. Plus the deckers will be more brighter and airy inside.And the awkward senario when you don't think anyone is at the front, so you walk to the front and there is someone there...
(20 Dec 2021, 8:47 pm)Rapidsnap To be honest, going back to deckers for the X10 (X9) maybe a good move, since they are quicker at unloading and loading passengers, and more likely the pensioners may return to using the service since they don't have an awkward staircase to climb to access a dark dingy seating area. Plus the deckers will be more brighter and airy inside.And the awkward senario when you don't think anyone is at the front, so you walk to the front and there is someone there...
(20 Dec 2021, 12:12 pm)Storx Train: 1 hour 20 minsThe route the trains take between Heworth/Pelaw - Sunderland etc... is already at max capacity due to the line being used for frieght, metro, Northern, LNER, Grand Central trains. The only way to be able to do this 30 min freq would be revamp the Leamside Line as Frieght would be diverted down there and metro is eager to expand (preCOVID) once the current 'Metro Flow' project is completed by end of next year. In time for new trains. Which will allow 10 min freq of both yellow and green lines, 5 min comb.
Bus: 1 hour 45 mins
There's quite a big difference between Middlesbrough and Newcastle and a train will very likely take 1 hour 20 mins, a bus on the otherhand is linked to other traffic so could take much much longer and on such a long route it's not rare.
Neither have connections either. There's nothing at all in Middlesbrough and there's very little North of Newcastle either. Durham / Sunderland passengers won't be travelling via the X10 and would use the X12 or train instead. Passengers in Peterlee are more likely to have Arriva day tickets aswell since they offer more services and could use the X22 especially if they live on the route, the time it takes to change will knock off the 20 minutes in time difference.
I don't care what anyone says on here the worst train (excluding buses on rails) is better than the best conventional bus. There's more space, there's toilets, there's tables, the ride is better generally, they rarely break down, there's rarely traffic issues.
I'd take a Class 156 or Class 158 anyday over any Alexander Dennis or Wright bus with as many fancy mod cons they can attempt to squeeze on even if it cost 40% more and most of the GP will agree. As soon as the Newcastle to Middlesbrough eventually go every 30 minutes, then it's incomparable.
It's not a co-incidence the two routes competing against trains are struggling.
(20 Dec 2021, 12:12 pm)Storx Train: 1 hour 20 minsThe route the trains take between Heworth/Pelaw - Sunderland etc... is already at max capacity due to the line being used for frieght, metro, Northern, LNER, Grand Central trains. The only way to be able to do this 30 min freq would be revamp the Leamside Line as Frieght would be diverted down there and metro is eager to expand (preCOVID) once the current 'Metro Flow' project is completed by end of next year. In time for new trains. Which will allow 10 min freq of both yellow and green lines, 5 min comb.
Bus: 1 hour 45 mins
There's quite a big difference between Middlesbrough and Newcastle and a train will very likely take 1 hour 20 mins, a bus on the otherhand is linked to other traffic so could take much much longer and on such a long route it's not rare.
Neither have connections either. There's nothing at all in Middlesbrough and there's very little North of Newcastle either. Durham / Sunderland passengers won't be travelling via the X10 and would use the X12 or train instead. Passengers in Peterlee are more likely to have Arriva day tickets aswell since they offer more services and could use the X22 especially if they live on the route, the time it takes to change will knock off the 20 minutes in time difference.
I don't care what anyone says on here the worst train (excluding buses on rails) is better than the best conventional bus. There's more space, there's toilets, there's tables, the ride is better generally, they rarely break down, there's rarely traffic issues.
I'd take a Class 156 or Class 158 anyday over any Alexander Dennis or Wright bus with as many fancy mod cons they can attempt to squeeze on even if it cost 40% more and most of the GP will agree. As soon as the Newcastle to Middlesbrough eventually go every 30 minutes, then it's incomparable.
It's not a co-incidence the two routes competing against trains are struggling.
It's a shame to see the X9 X10 not recovering. Can remember when the B5s were on, quite a few times taking one of the last couple of seats on the peak afternoons back to Middlesbrough. Im not a fan of coaches so maybe a bit biased but parking up round the corner like many have said just doesn't make sense. Enviros would be good and maybe should've been considered first time round. Would be a shame to lose the half hourly frequency as so much work was done on marketing it (and it worked). It seems to just be forgotten about the last 18 months or so.
On a side note, will X21 ever go back to every 15 mins? I guess the PVR is gone for that too.
Before anyone says, I completely understand the financial side, but can't understanding not giving chance to a once highly profitable route when Covid is still very much in the present.
Why not bring back a service between Middlesbrough & Sunderland via Peterlee, and make it the X8 or something.
(21 Dec 2021, 1:14 am)Keeiajs Really you could send the X9 via DurhamWhy? You've got the X21 and 21 running down there which are frequent. X21 is pretty much the quickest you're going to get so if you ran the X9 the same way you're just increasing the frequency with no guarantees of enough passengers to make both services cost effective. Then to run the X9 onto Peterlee, you'd probably have to send it along the A181 to Wingate and then back up the A19 to Peterlee to head back down to Boro. The alternative is sending it along B roads through villages already served by either Arriva (who probably won't take the competition too kindly) or GNE.
(21 Dec 2021, 1:14 am)Keeiajs Really you could send the X9 via DurhamWhy? You've got the X21 and 21 running down there which are frequent. X21 is pretty much the quickest you're going to get so if you ran the X9 the same way you're just increasing the frequency with no guarantees of enough passengers to make both services cost effective. Then to run the X9 onto Peterlee, you'd probably have to send it along the A181 to Wingate and then back up the A19 to Peterlee to head back down to Boro. The alternative is sending it along B roads through villages already served by either Arriva (who probably won't take the competition too kindly) or GNE.
(21 Dec 2021, 2:30 am)6049 Why? You've got the X21 and 21 running down there which are frequent. X21 is pretty much the quickest you're going to get so if you ran the X9 the same way you're just increasing the frequency with no guarantees of enough passengers to make both services cost effective. Then to run the X9 onto Peterlee, you'd probably have to send it along the A181 to Wingate and then back up the A19 to Peterlee to head back down to Boro. The alternative is sending it along B roads through villages already served by either Arriva (who probably won't take the competition too kindly) or GNE.Realistically for the Durham route you could send it to leave Durham straight down the A1 till just past Team Valley, the A184 then to Gateshead Straight into Newcastle.
I like the idea of sending the X9 via Sunderland down to Boro, but again, the demand has never really seemed to be there. Anyone going from Sunderland to Newcastle (centre to centre) will almost always choose the Metro. You'd probably pick up a few in the Boldons, but the 9 serves the same route towards Sunderland and the X34 is never more than a 5/10m walk away to get to Newcastle. The demand may be better from Sunderland down, but I never noticed the Sunderland to Peterlee express loads so wouldn't like to comment.
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(21 Dec 2021, 2:30 am)6049 Why? You've got the X21 and 21 running down there which are frequent. X21 is pretty much the quickest you're going to get so if you ran the X9 the same way you're just increasing the frequency with no guarantees of enough passengers to make both services cost effective. Then to run the X9 onto Peterlee, you'd probably have to send it along the A181 to Wingate and then back up the A19 to Peterlee to head back down to Boro. The alternative is sending it along B roads through villages already served by either Arriva (who probably won't take the competition too kindly) or GNE.Realistically for the Durham route you could send it to leave Durham straight down the A1 till just past Team Valley, the A184 then to Gateshead Straight into Newcastle.
I like the idea of sending the X9 via Sunderland down to Boro, but again, the demand has never really seemed to be there. Anyone going from Sunderland to Newcastle (centre to centre) will almost always choose the Metro. You'd probably pick up a few in the Boldons, but the 9 serves the same route towards Sunderland and the X34 is never more than a 5/10m walk away to get to Newcastle. The demand may be better from Sunderland down, but I never noticed the Sunderland to Peterlee express loads so wouldn't like to comment.
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