Leamside Line
Leamside Line
(08 Mar 2024, 4:49 pm)Adrian Because even if you don't want to or won't use it, others will, and supposedly the numbers stack up for it.
Why should you have electricity and running water in your penthouse, when it doesn't benefit me that you do?
(08 Mar 2024, 6:04 pm)Andreos1 Because the train from the penthouse can take you to exotic Spoons far away. Not just Tursdale.
Meanwhile the residents in places like Fencehouses (we've not heard that mentioned for a while), can shove the pi$$ poor bus service that GNE and GCT offer, up their shareholders sphincter.
(08 Mar 2024, 4:49 pm)Adrian Because even if you don't want to or won't use it, others will, and supposedly the numbers stack up for it.
Why should you have electricity and running water in your penthouse, when it doesn't benefit me that you do?
(08 Mar 2024, 6:04 pm)Andreos1 Because the train from the penthouse can take you to exotic Spoons far away. Not just Tursdale.
Meanwhile the residents in places like Fencehouses (we've not heard that mentioned for a while), can shove the pi$$ poor bus service that GNE and GCT offer, up their shareholders sphincter.
(08 Mar 2024, 6:09 pm)Rob44 I think running water and electric are essental. Spending thousands/millions/billions and a train track/line that beaching would probably shut down as soon as it opened isn't???
(08 Mar 2024, 6:09 pm)Rob44 I think running water and electric are essental. Spending thousands/millions/billions and a train track/line that beaching would probably shut down as soon as it opened isn't???
(08 Mar 2024, 6:09 pm)Rob44 I think running water and electric are essental. Spending thousands/millions/billions and a train track/line that beaching would probably shut down as soon as it opened isn't???
which spoons?
Are we saying that this area has subsidised bus services? Is a railway from fencehouse going to make people jump from car to train/metro/tram/driverless bus? Doubt it.
(08 Mar 2024, 6:09 pm)Rob44 I think running water and electric are essental. Spending thousands/millions/billions and a train track/line that beaching would probably shut down as soon as it opened isn't???
which spoons?
Are we saying that this area has subsidised bus services? Is a railway from fencehouse going to make people jump from car to train/metro/tram/driverless bus? Doubt it.
(08 Mar 2024, 9:23 pm)Andreos1 York? Thirsk? Northallerton might have one now.
And yeah, Nexus (possibly DCC) fund the 71.
The increase in housing in the area vs the drop in bus services over the year (including direct buses to Newcastle) doesn't add up.
Either the bus services don't take people where they need to be or the people don't leave their houses.
If there was an alternative, it might be the case that people leave their houses.
(08 Mar 2024, 9:23 pm)Andreos1 York? Thirsk? Northallerton might have one now.
And yeah, Nexus (possibly DCC) fund the 71.
The increase in housing in the area vs the drop in bus services over the year (including direct buses to Newcastle) doesn't add up.
Either the bus services don't take people where they need to be or the people don't leave their houses.
If there was an alternative, it might be the case that people leave their houses.
(08 Mar 2024, 6:09 pm)Rob44 I think running water and electric are essental. Spending thousands/millions/billions and a train track/line that beaching would probably shut down as soon as it opened isn't???
which spoons?
Are we saying that this area has subsidised bus services? Is a railway from fencehouse going to make people jump from car to train/metro/tram/driverless bus? Doubt it.
(08 Mar 2024, 6:09 pm)Rob44 I think running water and electric are essental. Spending thousands/millions/billions and a train track/line that beaching would probably shut down as soon as it opened isn't???
which spoons?
Are we saying that this area has subsidised bus services? Is a railway from fencehouse going to make people jump from car to train/metro/tram/driverless bus? Doubt it.
(08 Mar 2024, 6:09 pm)Rob44 I think running water and electric are essental. Spending thousands/millions/billions and a train track/line that beaching would probably shut down as soon as it opened isn't???
which spoons?
Are we saying that this area has subsidised bus services? Is a railway from fencehouse going to make people jump from car to train/metro/tram/driverless bus? Doubt it.
(08 Mar 2024, 6:09 pm)Rob44 I think running water and electric are essental. Spending thousands/millions/billions and a train track/line that beaching would probably shut down as soon as it opened isn't???
which spoons?
Are we saying that this area has subsidised bus services? Is a railway from fencehouse going to make people jump from car to train/metro/tram/driverless bus? Doubt it.
(09 Mar 2024, 6:11 pm)Jimmi I can confirm that Northallerton now has a Spoons, The Buck Inn, can literally step off most bus services and you're inside.
71 is a Durham County Council contract.
(08 Mar 2024, 6:09 pm)Rob44 Are we saying that this area has subsidised bus services? Is a railway from fencehouse going to make people jump from car to train/metro/tram/driverless bus? Doubt it.
(09 Mar 2024, 6:11 pm)Jimmi I can confirm that Northallerton now has a Spoons, The Buck Inn, can literally step off most bus services and you're inside.
71 is a Durham County Council contract.
(08 Mar 2024, 6:09 pm)Rob44 Are we saying that this area has subsidised bus services? Is a railway from fencehouse going to make people jump from car to train/metro/tram/driverless bus? Doubt it.
(08 Mar 2024, 9:23 pm)Andreos1 York? Thirsk? Northallerton might have one now.
And yeah, Nexus (possibly DCC) fund the 71.
The increase in housing in the area vs the drop in bus services over the year (including direct buses to Newcastle) doesn't add up.
Either the bus services don't take people where they need to be or the people don't leave their houses.
If there was an alternative, it might be the case that people leave their houses.
(08 Mar 2024, 9:23 pm)Andreos1 York? Thirsk? Northallerton might have one now.
And yeah, Nexus (possibly DCC) fund the 71.
The increase in housing in the area vs the drop in bus services over the year (including direct buses to Newcastle) doesn't add up.
Either the bus services don't take people where they need to be or the people don't leave their houses.
If there was an alternative, it might be the case that people leave their houses.
(10 Mar 2024, 11:01 am)Rob44 So i would be able to get to the above places from pelaw? Cause its been mention on here that people don't like have to change bus/train/ferry to get to where they are going.... remember i got loads of abuse when i said all buses should terminate at gateshead metro rather than clog the tyne bridge up with 6 buses carrying a couple of doaen punter between them!
(10 Mar 2024, 11:01 am)Rob44 So i would be able to get to the above places from pelaw? Cause its been mention on here that people don't like have to change bus/train/ferry to get to where they are going.... remember i got loads of abuse when i said all buses should terminate at gateshead metro rather than clog the tyne bridge up with 6 buses carrying a couple of doaen punter between them!
(10 Mar 2024, 12:10 pm)Storx Not from Pelaw, but people are happy to change as long as the interchange is near their home. No-one wants to sit on a bus for 45 minutes, then get forced onto a train for last mile. The opposite is a completely different discussion though because of the time benefits.
Like if we're being ambitious and extending the Metro south of Washington rather than the frankly ridulous loop to Sunderland, you could make the case for a massive interchange at Shiney Row and a few minor ones and get people to Newcastle much easier. There's already tons of routes serving the place.
Just to give an idea above, with the blue zones being new housing developments which is an ideal area because of the good road links. Places like Doxford Park would now be a 5 minute or so bus ride and a direct train to Newcastle now, similar for places like Houghton rather than having to sit on a bus for ages stuck in traffic in Gateshead. Even places like East Durham would have better connections, changing at West Rainton off the 20.
Obviously some on this forum will argue that they'd rather sit on a bus for 2 weeks than change, but it doesn't really represent the real world. Add parking at some of these stations, you're on for a real winner imo.
(10 Mar 2024, 12:10 pm)Storx Not from Pelaw, but people are happy to change as long as the interchange is near their home. No-one wants to sit on a bus for 45 minutes, then get forced onto a train for last mile. The opposite is a completely different discussion though because of the time benefits.
Like if we're being ambitious and extending the Metro south of Washington rather than the frankly ridulous loop to Sunderland, you could make the case for a massive interchange at Shiney Row and a few minor ones and get people to Newcastle much easier. There's already tons of routes serving the place.
Just to give an idea above, with the blue zones being new housing developments which is an ideal area because of the good road links. Places like Doxford Park would now be a 5 minute or so bus ride and a direct train to Newcastle now, similar for places like Houghton rather than having to sit on a bus for ages stuck in traffic in Gateshead. Even places like East Durham would have better connections, changing at West Rainton off the 20.
Obviously some on this forum will argue that they'd rather sit on a bus for 2 weeks than change, but it doesn't really represent the real world. Add parking at some of these stations, you're on for a real winner imo.
(10 Mar 2024, 2:54 pm)Adrian It's this that is most likely to happen, if anything. But the ambition certainly seems to be a reopening in full.
(10 Mar 2024, 2:54 pm)Adrian It's this that is most likely to happen, if anything. But the ambition certainly seems to be a reopening in full.
(10 Mar 2024, 3:08 pm)Storx Cannot see it happening personally, don't know why but I have a feeling they'll get to Washington then for [insert reason] they can't do the rest of it.
The reasons being the A19 issue, the viaduct is too broken, cost too much etc. Not that it would be the end of the world, rather see the money spent elsewhere personally - the Washington to Pelaw bit should definitely be done though.
(10 Mar 2024, 3:08 pm)Storx Cannot see it happening personally, don't know why but I have a feeling they'll get to Washington then for [insert reason] they can't do the rest of it.
The reasons being the A19 issue, the viaduct is too broken, cost too much etc. Not that it would be the end of the world, rather see the money spent elsewhere personally - the Washington to Pelaw bit should definitely be done though.
(10 Mar 2024, 5:21 pm)Adrian The business case wouldn't work with a Washington terminus. It'll be all or none, as far as the Wearside loop goes.
There'll be structural assessments done right across the route, long before the first shovel goes into the ground. It's not just the Viaduct, there's sections of elevated embankment and other structures. The A19 isn't that much of an issue, other than it'd need the current underpass replacing with something wider, and they can always go down slightly if they need more clearance.
The biggest challenge is likely to be the crossing on Hylton Bank to connect to the existing South Hylton terminus. There's absolutely no way you can avoid having anything but a level crossing there, as there's no other way in or out.
(10 Mar 2024, 5:21 pm)Adrian The business case wouldn't work with a Washington terminus. It'll be all or none, as far as the Wearside loop goes.
There'll be structural assessments done right across the route, long before the first shovel goes into the ground. It's not just the Viaduct, there's sections of elevated embankment and other structures. The A19 isn't that much of an issue, other than it'd need the current underpass replacing with something wider, and they can always go down slightly if they need more clearance.
The biggest challenge is likely to be the crossing on Hylton Bank to connect to the existing South Hylton terminus. There's absolutely no way you can avoid having anything but a level crossing there, as there's no other way in or out.
(10 Mar 2024, 6:21 pm)Storx I just can't see where the people are coming from between Washington <> Sunderland, especially considering this isn't going to be a 10p job to do. There's literally absolutely no reason why anyone from Sunderland would want to head along there as it serves nothing pretty much and going the other way is questionable aswell.
(10 Mar 2024, 6:21 pm)Storx I just can't see where the people are coming from between Washington <> Sunderland, especially considering this isn't going to be a 10p job to do. There's literally absolutely no reason why anyone from Sunderland would want to head along there as it serves nothing pretty much and going the other way is questionable aswell.
(10 Mar 2024, 7:40 pm)Adrian They don't need to come from anywhere. It's only a 2.5 mile stretch between the south end of the Viaduct to South Hylton. Probably the same distance as East Boldon to Seaburn.
Although there was historically a station at Cox Green, there's just nothing there to serve, and I imagine any proposals for development would be fiercely resisted.
Washington is a growing town of 67k, and even at that, one of the proposed stations is being built with a new development in mind; Washington Meadows. The plans I saw last May included a P&R, Station, housing, bus loop, and new primary school.
Sent from my SM-S916B using Tapatalk
(10 Mar 2024, 7:40 pm)Adrian They don't need to come from anywhere. It's only a 2.5 mile stretch between the south end of the Viaduct to South Hylton. Probably the same distance as East Boldon to Seaburn.
Although there was historically a station at Cox Green, there's just nothing there to serve, and I imagine any proposals for development would be fiercely resisted.
Washington is a growing town of 67k, and even at that, one of the proposed stations is being built with a new development in mind; Washington Meadows. The plans I saw last May included a P&R, Station, housing, bus loop, and new primary school.
Sent from my SM-S916B using Tapatalk
(10 Mar 2024, 8:13 pm)Storx See, any plans with housing I could imagine being completely toxic considering all the fields near the railway line are green belt which never goes well.
Even known it's only 2.5 mile, if that's going to a take a large chunk of the budget for no benefits it won't be going anywhere. £700m is a lot of money being spent for 2 stations at East Washington, as it's completely useless for the Galleries or anywhere west of the A182.
If I'm right, the feasibility study hasn't been done yet and it'll be interesting to see the results as I have a feeling it won't be too positive.
If we're really being ambitious, I'd rather see the line extended down to Rainton/Hetton with a new town built between Fenceshouses, the Raintons and Hetton. It's not exactly the most difficult, with proper planning - which won't happen as it's England.
(10 Mar 2024, 8:13 pm)Storx See, any plans with housing I could imagine being completely toxic considering all the fields near the railway line are green belt which never goes well.
Even known it's only 2.5 mile, if that's going to a take a large chunk of the budget for no benefits it won't be going anywhere. £700m is a lot of money being spent for 2 stations at East Washington, as it's completely useless for the Galleries or anywhere west of the A182.
If I'm right, the feasibility study hasn't been done yet and it'll be interesting to see the results as I have a feeling it won't be too positive.
If we're really being ambitious, I'd rather see the line extended down to Rainton/Hetton with a new town built between Fenceshouses, the Raintons and Hetton. It's not exactly the most difficult, with proper planning - which won't happen as it's England.
(10 Mar 2024, 8:54 pm)Andreos1 Can't see owt being built on Rainton Meadows. Particularly with it being a site of SSI.
(10 Mar 2024, 8:54 pm)Andreos1 Can't see owt being built on Rainton Meadows. Particularly with it being a site of SSI.
(10 Mar 2024, 8:13 pm)Storx See, any plans with housing I could imagine being completely toxic considering all the fields near the railway line are green belt which never goes well.
Even known it's only 2.5 mile, if that's going to a take a large chunk of the budget for no benefits it won't be going anywhere. £700m is a lot of money being spent for 2 stations at East Washington, as it's completely useless for the Galleries or anywhere west of the A182.
If I'm right, the feasibility study hasn't been done yet and it'll be interesting to see the results as I have a feeling it won't be too positive.
If we're really being ambitious, I'd rather see the line extended down to Rainton/Hetton with a new town built between Fenceshouses, the Raintons and Hetton. It's not exactly the most difficult, with proper planning - which won't happen as it's England.
(10 Mar 2024, 8:13 pm)Storx See, any plans with housing I could imagine being completely toxic considering all the fields near the railway line are green belt which never goes well.
Even known it's only 2.5 mile, if that's going to a take a large chunk of the budget for no benefits it won't be going anywhere. £700m is a lot of money being spent for 2 stations at East Washington, as it's completely useless for the Galleries or anywhere west of the A182.
If I'm right, the feasibility study hasn't been done yet and it'll be interesting to see the results as I have a feeling it won't be too positive.
If we're really being ambitious, I'd rather see the line extended down to Rainton/Hetton with a new town built between Fenceshouses, the Raintons and Hetton. It's not exactly the most difficult, with proper planning - which won't happen as it's England.
(10 Mar 2024, 10:16 pm)Adrian They're not, though.
In the case of Washington Meadows specifically, this was removed from the green belt and added to the list of safeguarded land under Sunderland's Core Strategy and Development Plan 2015-2033. See here. Policy SS3 covers safeguarded land, pg38-42 specifically the area I'm writing about. You can also see a report on the land: see here.
There's a further PDF that I've seen (which I can't find in the public domain, so won't share), and that lists a more formal plan for the site. I'll try and get an update on it, but the consultation was only last year and no planning application has been submitted yet.
It's also worth pointing out that since closure, there's been housing built right along the line. (Most of) Sulgrave, Barmston, Teal Farm and (most of) Fatfield, didn't exist.
"Even known it's only 2.5 mile, if that's going to a take a large chunk of the budget for no benefits it won't be going anywhere." - I'm not sure that I understand this point? It's a railway, not a bus. It doesn't have to stop every 500 yards.
I'm not suggesting this will go ahead by the way, I just know there's been a lot of people who have spent a lot of time on the project, so to even get the Govt to put money into this study is a big step forward.
(10 Mar 2024, 10:16 pm)Adrian They're not, though.
In the case of Washington Meadows specifically, this was removed from the green belt and added to the list of safeguarded land under Sunderland's Core Strategy and Development Plan 2015-2033. See here. Policy SS3 covers safeguarded land, pg38-42 specifically the area I'm writing about. You can also see a report on the land: see here.
There's a further PDF that I've seen (which I can't find in the public domain, so won't share), and that lists a more formal plan for the site. I'll try and get an update on it, but the consultation was only last year and no planning application has been submitted yet.
It's also worth pointing out that since closure, there's been housing built right along the line. (Most of) Sulgrave, Barmston, Teal Farm and (most of) Fatfield, didn't exist.
"Even known it's only 2.5 mile, if that's going to a take a large chunk of the budget for no benefits it won't be going anywhere." - I'm not sure that I understand this point? It's a railway, not a bus. It doesn't have to stop every 500 yards.
I'm not suggesting this will go ahead by the way, I just know there's been a lot of people who have spent a lot of time on the project, so to even get the Govt to put money into this study is a big step forward.
