(26 Feb 2013, 6:37 pm)Adam Malarkey Yeah but you have the 21 every few minutes along low fell so therefore the 24 would be useless until it turns off half way along, plus after that it follows the 52 to Wrekenton.
Basically stop the 24 running and have the 52 run it's place, and the 52 would still operate it's normal service Orbit of Gateshead.
(26 Feb 2013, 6:37 pm)Adam Malarkey Yeah but you have the 21 every few minutes along low fell so therefore the 24 would be useless until it turns off half way along, plus after that it follows the 52 to Wrekenton.
Basically stop the 24 running and have the 52 run it's place, and the 52 would still operate it's normal service Orbit of Gateshead.
AFAIK, you can't change the Q1/Q2 unless Nexus approve since they pay for it.
Some of my (bad) ideas generally focused on the unreliability I find on services.
Re - 24.
I'd bring in the 24A as a weekday hourly service but from Kibblesworth use Smithy Lane straight to up to Wrekenton and continue as 24 from there maintaing links to Allerdene and if anyone wants a quicker Newcastle service, get off at Allerdene Bridge and switch to the 21 OR X2. Nexus service 29 retains links to the bottom of Allerdene and Team Valley Sainsburys.
As a result of the above change the 28A would no longer travel to Kibblesworth and revert to its old route hopefully increasing reliability (avoiding Coalhouse Roundabout!)
ALTERNATIVE
Service 28A runs direct from Ouston to Kibblesworth omitting Birtley. Birtley - Ouston Local service we'll call it the 30 (can't remember the number of what it used to be) using an MPD maintains link (similar to what 28B does now)
The walk in centre is no longer located at Bensham Hospital and links to Saltwell Road can be maintained through a change onto the 69 at Low Fell or a short walk through Saltwell Park to reach Saltwell Crem from the 21.
- - - - - - - -
X22, extend the service into Low Fell and then go non-stop from Low Fell Cannon (possibly down Belle Vue Bank then onto Team Valley to Metrocentre) as the loading is really weak at times.
ALTERNATIVE possibility.
X22 maintains current route but after Birtley serves Team Valley Retail Park to create echoes of part of the old 809 route.
---------------
Peak time short working 21 to Allerdene. The 21 is a nightmare at peak time and most users will notice bus empties heavily after leaving Low Fell Lyndhurst. So peak time evening journey runs to Allerdene School, under the bridge and back over to Newcastle. Possible Gateshead operation? Relieve pressure on Durham/Chester service
-- --- --- --- ---
A bus from Birtley to Washington that doesn't take forever. M(Collection) take about 25 minutes on average and NexusBus 23 takes equally long on its magical mystery tour.
M2/M3 run every 15 minutes from Birtley to Washington and it only takes 20 Minutes which isn't long tbh. I doubt GNE would introduce anything faster between the 2 areas.
As for the 24 thats not a bad idea, better than mine I think, I'd still reduce the frequency of the service though to every 20 minutes
(26 Feb 2013, 10:34 pm)Adam Malarkey M2/M3 run every 15 minutes from Birtley to Washington and it only takes 20 Minutes which isn't long tbh. I doubt GNE would introduce anything faster between the 2 areas.
As for the 24 thats not a bad idea, better than mine I think, I'd still reduce the frequency of the service though to every 20 minutes
(26 Feb 2013, 10:34 pm)Adam Malarkey M2/M3 run every 15 minutes from Birtley to Washington and it only takes 20 Minutes which isn't long tbh. I doubt GNE would introduce anything faster between the 2 areas.
As for the 24 thats not a bad idea, better than mine I think, I'd still reduce the frequency of the service though to every 20 minutes
Just racking my brains and trying to come up with services filling employment, education, medical and social needs that don't exist or need improving.
Dalton Park: For a major retail and employment provider, so close to the A19, it's amazing how poorly served it is or hard to get there from anywhere other than Peterlee, Sunderland or Seaham. I don't understand the insistence in running multiple services to Dalton Park, from the same places.
Doxford Park: When the fairly recent development of Rainton Bridge, Quroum business parks and also Team Valley can attract investment and partnership working with Arriva, Nexus and GNE, it baffles me as to why (apart from the odd exception) it is so difficult to get a direct route to the place from beyond Sunderland or Houghton.
As mentioned earlier, I believe the M1 and X1 should operate a circular route between Houghton and Shiney Row. X1 runs as is to Easington Lane from Newcastle and returns to Newcastle via the current M1 route to Shiney Row. The M1 would run on its old route from Houghton towards Shiney Row.
Some sort of spacing of services running between Chester and Washington. It is frustrating seeing a Lime 8 and Whey Aye 50 following each other in and out of the two town centres.
(01 Mar 2013, 4:57 pm)Rob Admittedly the 28/28A needs work. It doesn't operate as successfully as would be anticipated. The aim at the minute is very much to remove those vehicles from the fleet. I would anticipate changes to the service to follow in time.
(01 Mar 2013, 4:57 pm)Rob Admittedly the 28/28A needs work. It doesn't operate as successfully as would be anticipated. The aim at the minute is very much to remove those vehicles from the fleet. I would anticipate changes to the service to follow in time.
(01 Mar 2013, 7:34 pm)gtomlinson As a passenger, aside my suggestions above, I can see them scrapping the 28A and just doubling up on the 28. There is no need for the 28A whereas at least the 28 serves a supermarket at Wrekenton, the mini interchange at Wrekenton for onward travel to Sunderland and Washington (X1, 56 etc) and Gateshead (Orbit, 24) and importantly the QE Hospital.
(01 Mar 2013, 7:34 pm)gtomlinson As a passenger, aside my suggestions above, I can see them scrapping the 28A and just doubling up on the 28. There is no need for the 28A whereas at least the 28 serves a supermarket at Wrekenton, the mini interchange at Wrekenton for onward travel to Sunderland and Washington (X1, 56 etc) and Gateshead (Orbit, 24) and importantly the QE Hospital.
(01 Mar 2013, 8:11 pm)tom.robinson206 Team Valley Sainsbury's?
(01 Mar 2013, 8:11 pm)tom.robinson206 Team Valley Sainsbury's?
(01 Mar 2013, 8:28 pm)gtomlinson(01 Mar 2013, 8:11 pm)tom.robinson206 Team Valley Sainsbury's?
Served by the 93/94 from other areas and from Kibblesworth Nexus bus 29 (a GNE op so you can use Buzzfare etc on it)
28A only started serving Team Valley during the last change
Kibblesworth doesn't need a direct Newcastle bus. the 29 runs from 06.39 in the morning to 17.45 to Gateshead then the 24A kicks on in an evening.
(01 Mar 2013, 8:28 pm)gtomlinson(01 Mar 2013, 8:11 pm)tom.robinson206 Team Valley Sainsbury's?
Served by the 93/94 from other areas and from Kibblesworth Nexus bus 29 (a GNE op so you can use Buzzfare etc on it)
28A only started serving Team Valley during the last change
Kibblesworth doesn't need a direct Newcastle bus. the 29 runs from 06.39 in the morning to 17.45 to Gateshead then the 24A kicks on in an evening.
(01 Mar 2013, 8:34 pm)tom.robinson206 Yeah, suppose. I don't see the point in the 24A at all, it's usually a decker in the evenings, which is pointless. I don't see why they can't just run the 29 later and on a Sunday?
(01 Mar 2013, 8:34 pm)tom.robinson206 Yeah, suppose. I don't see the point in the 24A at all, it's usually a decker in the evenings, which is pointless. I don't see why they can't just run the 29 later and on a Sunday?
They should go back to the Coaster 1/2 serving Kibblesworth/Wreckenton as before. The 24 only running to Gateshead is daft when the 1 continues from Newcastle across the Tyne.
I've had an Idea regarding the M1/X1
Every 20 Minutes both Services go in the Direction of the current X1 into Houghton.And then Every 20 Minutes both services go in the direction of the current M1 service through Burnmoor into Houghton. Basically the they'd do a Loop in both directions. Obviously one direction would need renumbering so passengers don't get confused, so would have to M1A/X1A and then renumbered the current X1A that goes to Picktree the 1A/1X/X1B or something like that.
Another Idea is regarding the Laser 35/35A/35B/35C
35 South Shields - Sunderland - Every 20 Minutes
35A - Sunderland - Royal Hospital - Silksworth - Doxford Park - Houghton-le-Spring - Hetton le Hole - Easington Lane - Every 20 Minutes
35B Sunderland - Silksworth - East Herrington - Herrington Burn - Newbottle - Houghton-le-Spring - Hetton le Hole - Low Moorsley - South Hetton - Every 30 Minutes
20A Sunderland - Doxford Park - Houghton - Rainton Bridge - Durham - Every 20 Minutes
35C gets withdrawn
And that change regarding Stagecoach 8/20 I'd do that but have the service operate using some Enviro 400's because the 20 is always packed going to/from Town to my Grandparents house. and perhaps decrease the frequency as you also have the 10 every 15 Minutes. along that way also.
Just reading complaints about the 21 on the Quality Contracts page and I've left this comment on it, so I'm post it on here to.
The problem with the 21 is A.) The 7/8 Minutes Frequency and B.) The 21 which terminates at Chester le Street if that is running late then obviously there is going to be 2/3 coming together and also the swap over can cause even more lateness would also lead to 2/3 buses coming together.
So here is my suggestion.
21 Durham - Chester le Street - Gateshead - Newcastle - Every 10 Minutes
Then Re-Route the one as far Chester le Street and Re-Number it 21A, The route would then be.
21A Chester le Street - Birtley - Eighton Banks - Wrekenton - QE Hospital - Gateshead - Newcastle Pilgrim Street - Every 15 Minutes
Perhaps a possible extension to Langley Park would then displace the X25 also the 28 between Chester le Street and Newcastle. Which then lead to the 28 following the 28A route and also increasing the frequency to every 15 minutes along the current 28A route.
This would also free up some buses on the PVR for the X25
(02 Mar 2013, 11:49 pm)Adam Malarkey Just reading complaints about the 21 on the Quality Contracts page and I've left this comment on it, so I'm post it on here to.
The problem with the 21 is A.) The 7/8 Minutes Frequency and B.) The 21 which terminates at Chester le Street if that is running late then obviously there is going to be 2/3 coming together and also the swap over can cause even more lateness would also lead to 2/3 buses coming together.
So here is my suggestion.
21 Durham - Chester le Street - Gateshead - Newcastle - Every 10 Minutes
Then Re-Route the one as far Chester le Street and Re-Number it 21A, The route would then be.
21A Chester le Street - Birtley - Eighton Banks - Wrekenton - QE Hospital - Gateshead - Newcastle Pilgrim Street - Every 15 Minutes
Perhaps a possible extension to Langley Park would then displace the X25 also the 28 between Chester le Street and Newcastle. Which then lead to the 28 following the 28A route and also increasing the frequency to every 15 minutes along the current 28A route.
This would also free up some buses on the PVR for the X25
(02 Mar 2013, 11:49 pm)Adam Malarkey Just reading complaints about the 21 on the Quality Contracts page and I've left this comment on it, so I'm post it on here to.
The problem with the 21 is A.) The 7/8 Minutes Frequency and B.) The 21 which terminates at Chester le Street if that is running late then obviously there is going to be 2/3 coming together and also the swap over can cause even more lateness would also lead to 2/3 buses coming together.
So here is my suggestion.
21 Durham - Chester le Street - Gateshead - Newcastle - Every 10 Minutes
Then Re-Route the one as far Chester le Street and Re-Number it 21A, The route would then be.
21A Chester le Street - Birtley - Eighton Banks - Wrekenton - QE Hospital - Gateshead - Newcastle Pilgrim Street - Every 15 Minutes
Perhaps a possible extension to Langley Park would then displace the X25 also the 28 between Chester le Street and Newcastle. Which then lead to the 28 following the 28A route and also increasing the frequency to every 15 minutes along the current 28A route.
This would also free up some buses on the PVR for the X25
well keep the 21 on it's current frequency to Durham to Newcastle.
But I'd still re-route the 21 that goes Chester le Street - Newcastle but have go along the X25 route between Chester and Gateshead.
Plus if you look at it X25/M2 run every 30 mins along the top end of Birtley where Kingsleys are based, with a 2 minute gap in the timetable. So then by re-routing the 21 that starts at chester le street would then bring a better service to that area operating every 15 instead 30 minutes, and would also reduce the time of waiting for the next bus. and you have to admit the X25 is an awful service.
I think scrapping the X25 and replacing it with the re-routed 21 is a good idea and it would provide a much better link between Chester le Street and the QE plus it could also replace the 28 aswell, so there is two services covered by the re-routing. also have the new 21A stop on Pilgrim Street to ease congestion in Eldon Square and also save 2/3 buses coming along through Birtley at the same time.
I rememeber back in 2007 I think it was when one of the 21's run through Birtley/Low Fell and other ran through Wrekenton and the QE. Plus the fact it would free up more buses and it wouldnt change the PVR on the 21 either.
There is always going to be problems when you have 'one' service along a particular route or corridoor - however, when the 21 ran alongside the 21a and 21b and had the likes of a 724 and the Arriva X1 and 723 to back it up, how often did you hear of complaints along the Durham Road corridoor? The frequency between Chester and Newcastle was more or less the same as now, but you were sure a bus would turn up, because the routes all deviated at some point South of Chester.
It was the same in the 80's and 90's with the 231, 722, 723, 724, 735 and X1. Granted traffic congestion may not have been as bad in some places, but the route wasnt percieved as one bus, going the same way.
On top of that, there was the 721 which operated Chester to Newcastle via Barley Mow and Wrekenton, the hourly 725 and 726 along Portobello Road and Wrekenton and the 26 between Barley Mow and Newcastle (or the OK 727 which ran via Wrekenton). You also had the 183 between Barley Mow and Low Fell
Each route had its own identity and you could get 'a' bus, regardless of another breaking down or getting stuck in traffic.
Good points Andreos.
There was also the 809 and 733 that ran and the 777 with Birtley Local 23.
Do you remember the Classic/GNE 'corridor war' with the 21/221?
Adam, the X25 is pretty much down in the dumps because it doesn't make any money. Pretty sad state of affairs but sadly true.
The 'top end' of Birtley 'Northside' doesn't need any more buses that it has. The new housing is high end with car ownership pretty much 2 per house
Chester Le Street doesn't really need a link to the QE as people from Chester generally wouldn't be referred up to the QE but to Durham Hospital. The terminus on Pilgrim Street wasn't popular with passengers.
I think it's a problem that can't be solved unless GNE focus on actual timetables and service over wi-fi and social networking
I can remember those routes, but tended to remember the 777 as a Chester - Sunderland route, rather than going to Newcastle as it did towards the end. I think they re-routed it when the 26 was axed.
The 733 was a funny service. Did it go via Ouston, except on a Sunday when it went via Barley Mow?
There was even a short lived GNE route from Newcastle to somewhere like Spennymoor or Ferryhill along Durham Road in the mid-90's, that had a Gateshead two digit route number. I can't remember too much about that one though.
After I posted that last message, I counted up and reckon there were more buses per hour 15-20+ years ago along Durham Road than there are now... As well as the 26, Gateshead also operated the twice hourly 24, 25, 27 and 28 as far as Low Fell/Harlow Green. Chester tended to operate the hourly routes beyond there - all before Bus Lanes and priority lights were flavour of the month in Gateshead Civic Centre.
If I remember rightly, as well as the cross-Gateshead routes from West to East Gateshead, you had local services around some of the estates in Whickham, Blaydon, Beacon Lough etc running from Gateshead and the MetroCentre.
I'm going to take Low Fell as example here for services that operate that way.
21 - Every 7/8 Minutes
24 - Every 20 Minutes
93/93 Every 15 Minutes
69 - Every hour
X21 - Every 30 Minutes - But doesn't stop
Arriva X2 - Every 30 Minutes
That's basically a bus every 1/2 Minutes. I honestly think if GNE do what i've said it would be a better more reliable service, and obviously there would still a frequent every 1/2 minutes service.
Plus it would also result in a much needed upgrade for the X25/ Re-Numbering. Going to put this Idea and others toward GNE at somepoint.
