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North East Buses Local Bus Scene Operations, Management & Infrastructure Customer Service thread

Customer Service thread

Customer Service thread

 
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S813 FVK



6,030
01 Aug 2014, 3:23 pm #82
(01 Aug 2014, 2:50 pm)Dan I was told, in the original e-mail from Customer Services, that my complaint was passed onto the depot. It was the depot who provided the Customer Services representative with the information that the bus operated on-time. I know fine well that this is not correct. If it was, I would have had my photo, and I wouldn't have lodged the complaint. I arrived at the stop 5 minutes before the bus was due, so it must have been at least 6 minutes early. That, in my eyes, is the lie. Why the depot would lie to this Customer Services representative, I do not know, but I am 100% certain that it did not operate on time.

It was 6+ minutes early at Monkwearmouth, so this would be replicated at the depot too - assuming the running times back to the depot are realistic (which I'm sure they would be). If the driver had his foot down all the way from East Boldon to Monkwearmouth, he could have perhaps managed to get back 2 minutes quicker than the scheduled timings - and he would have made this time up when passing the Greyhound Stadium at full speed, given that the driver certainly shouldn't be speeding through East Boldon. 6 minutes early is just a complete joke though, and he must have passed a timing point early to do that (despite what Customer Services has told me).

With regards to the whole running board/depot thing... My issue was that the Customer Services representative asked me if she could check any other times for me, and I did (when it actually arrived back in the depot versus the time scheduled to on the running board), and she chose not to answer - and instead suggested that she made a mistake and the bus actually left the East Boldon timing point 12 seconds early.

Did you remain at the stop for a few minutes after the bus was due or did you just walk off when it didnt come? There is also the possibility that it was severely delayed due to general reasons and not due to any traffic issues. It happens.
S813 FVK
01 Aug 2014, 3:23 pm #82

(01 Aug 2014, 2:50 pm)Dan I was told, in the original e-mail from Customer Services, that my complaint was passed onto the depot. It was the depot who provided the Customer Services representative with the information that the bus operated on-time. I know fine well that this is not correct. If it was, I would have had my photo, and I wouldn't have lodged the complaint. I arrived at the stop 5 minutes before the bus was due, so it must have been at least 6 minutes early. That, in my eyes, is the lie. Why the depot would lie to this Customer Services representative, I do not know, but I am 100% certain that it did not operate on time.

It was 6+ minutes early at Monkwearmouth, so this would be replicated at the depot too - assuming the running times back to the depot are realistic (which I'm sure they would be). If the driver had his foot down all the way from East Boldon to Monkwearmouth, he could have perhaps managed to get back 2 minutes quicker than the scheduled timings - and he would have made this time up when passing the Greyhound Stadium at full speed, given that the driver certainly shouldn't be speeding through East Boldon. 6 minutes early is just a complete joke though, and he must have passed a timing point early to do that (despite what Customer Services has told me).

With regards to the whole running board/depot thing... My issue was that the Customer Services representative asked me if she could check any other times for me, and I did (when it actually arrived back in the depot versus the time scheduled to on the running board), and she chose not to answer - and instead suggested that she made a mistake and the bus actually left the East Boldon timing point 12 seconds early.

Did you remain at the stop for a few minutes after the bus was due or did you just walk off when it didnt come? There is also the possibility that it was severely delayed due to general reasons and not due to any traffic issues. It happens.

 
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Messages In This Thread
Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 16 Apr 2014, 8:15 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by tyresmoke - 16 Apr 2014, 8:39 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by R852 PRG - 18 Apr 2014, 8:47 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 18 Apr 2014, 9:06 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by R852 PRG - 18 Apr 2014, 9:10 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 18 Apr 2014, 9:14 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by R852 PRG - 18 Apr 2014, 9:15 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 18 Apr 2014, 9:22 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by R852 PRG - 18 Apr 2014, 9:27 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Roland Pratt - 19 Apr 2014, 1:49 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by R852 PRG - 19 Apr 2014, 5:29 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Davey Bowyer - 18 Apr 2014, 9:54 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 01 May 2014, 6:05 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 01 May 2014, 6:13 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 01 May 2014, 6:37 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 15 May 2014, 10:35 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 01 May 2014, 9:33 pm
Re: RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 15 May 2014, 2:38 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by robisdave15 - 15 May 2014, 6:13 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by R852 PRG - 15 May 2014, 6:15 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by R852 PRG - 15 May 2014, 6:32 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 15 May 2014, 7:17 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by R852 PRG - 23 May 2014, 10:51 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by northern156 - 10 Jun 2014, 11:01 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by RM2186 - 10 Jun 2014, 1:32 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by northern156 - 10 Jun 2014, 1:48 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by RM2186 - 11 Jun 2014, 1:59 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by northern156 - 10 Jun 2014, 2:05 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by R852 PRG - 10 Jun 2014, 3:05 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 10 Jun 2014, 3:24 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Jimmi - 10 Jun 2014, 4:31 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by BJ10VUS - 10 Jun 2014, 9:27 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by R852 PRG - 11 Jun 2014, 3:39 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 11 Jun 2014, 6:12 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by R852 PRG - 11 Jun 2014, 6:28 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by BJ10VUS - 25 Jul 2014, 6:30 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 13 Jul 2014, 9:13 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Michael - 13 Jul 2014, 9:19 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 13 Jul 2014, 9:24 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Tom - 13 Jul 2014, 9:27 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 13 Jul 2014, 9:29 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by mb134 - 13 Jul 2014, 9:20 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 13 Jul 2014, 9:22 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by idiot - 14 Jul 2014, 8:18 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by cbma06 - 14 Jul 2014, 9:01 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by MurdnunoC - 14 Jul 2014, 9:44 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 14 Jul 2014, 9:47 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by MurdnunoC - 14 Jul 2014, 9:57 am
Re: RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 14 Jul 2014, 10:08 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by tyresmoke - 14 Jul 2014, 10:25 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 14 Jul 2014, 10:57 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 25 Jul 2014, 2:23 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Roland Pratt - 25 Jul 2014, 2:37 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 25 Jul 2014, 3:02 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Tom - 25 Jul 2014, 3:02 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by R852 PRG - 25 Jul 2014, 3:19 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by VolvoMarkII - 25 Jul 2014, 5:26 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by R852 PRG - 25 Jul 2014, 6:45 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by mb134 - 25 Jul 2014, 8:14 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 25 Jul 2014, 9:49 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by mb134 - 25 Jul 2014, 9:56 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 25 Jul 2014, 9:48 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by R852 PRG - 25 Jul 2014, 11:21 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Tom - 26 Jul 2014, 7:23 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by mb134 - 26 Jul 2014, 7:44 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by tyresmoke - 26 Jul 2014, 7:53 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 26 Jul 2014, 8:02 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by L469 YVK - 01 Aug 2014, 4:33 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 01 Aug 2014, 4:40 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by palatine3833 - 26 Jul 2014, 8:35 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 26 Jul 2014, 8:39 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by palatine3833 - 26 Jul 2014, 8:33 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 26 Jul 2014, 9:13 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 01 Aug 2014, 11:33 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by MurdnunoC - 01 Aug 2014, 12:24 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 01 Aug 2014, 12:26 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by MurdnunoC - 01 Aug 2014, 2:39 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 01 Aug 2014, 2:50 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by S813 FVK - 01 Aug 2014, 3:23 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 01 Aug 2014, 4:44 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 01 Aug 2014, 4:52 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 02 Aug 2014, 9:14 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by Drifter60 - 01 Aug 2014, 2:08 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 01 Aug 2014, 1:42 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by R852 PRG - 01 Aug 2014, 2:05 pm
Re: RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 01 Aug 2014, 2:09 pm
Re: RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 01 Aug 2014, 3:26 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by S813 FVK - 01 Aug 2014, 3:32 pm
Re: RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 01 Aug 2014, 3:47 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 01 Aug 2014, 4:29 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by citaro5284 - 01 Aug 2014, 5:41 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Tom - 02 Aug 2014, 5:21 pm
Customer Service thread - by R852 PRG - 02 Aug 2014, 6:03 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Tom - 02 Aug 2014, 6:05 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by BJ10VUS - 02 Aug 2014, 8:03 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 02 Aug 2014, 8:05 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Jimmi - 02 Aug 2014, 8:10 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by tyresmoke - 02 Aug 2014, 8:14 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Roland Pratt - 03 Aug 2014, 8:36 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by Tom - 07 Sep 2014, 8:15 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by L469 YVK - 07 Sep 2014, 9:11 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 07 Sep 2014, 9:18 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by S813 FVK - 07 Sep 2014, 9:22 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 09 Sep 2014, 10:26 am
Re: RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 09 Sep 2014, 10:39 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by gtom - 09 Sep 2014, 7:54 pm
Re: RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 09 Sep 2014, 8:08 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by gtom - 09 Sep 2014, 10:40 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 23 Sep 2014, 5:21 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 07 Oct 2014, 4:08 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Michael - 07 Oct 2014, 6:27 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 07 Oct 2014, 7:22 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 07 Oct 2014, 7:25 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 07 Oct 2014, 7:30 pm
Customer Service thread - by R852 PRG - 07 Oct 2014, 6:13 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 07 Oct 2014, 6:22 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 13 Oct 2014, 5:16 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 07 Nov 2014, 10:34 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 09 Nov 2014, 6:00 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 09 Nov 2014, 7:47 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 12 Nov 2014, 6:45 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 12 Nov 2014, 8:17 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 12 Nov 2014, 8:47 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 12 Nov 2014, 8:59 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 12 Nov 2014, 9:13 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by mb134 - 12 Nov 2014, 9:28 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 12 Nov 2014, 9:38 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by mb134 - 12 Nov 2014, 9:50 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 17 Nov 2014, 2:42 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 12 Nov 2014, 10:17 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by mb134 - 12 Nov 2014, 10:29 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 12 Nov 2014, 10:41 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 13 Nov 2014, 5:50 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 13 Nov 2014, 6:09 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 13 Nov 2014, 6:14 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by citaro5284 - 15 Nov 2014, 8:41 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by eezypeazy - 15 Nov 2014, 9:24 am
Re: RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 15 Nov 2014, 9:29 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 29 Nov 2014, 5:32 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 01 Dec 2014, 5:35 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 08 Dec 2014, 8:48 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 08 Dec 2014, 8:51 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by mb134 - 08 Dec 2014, 9:15 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by cbma06 - 12 Dec 2014, 6:59 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by cbma06 - 12 Dec 2014, 7:08 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Jimmi - 12 Dec 2014, 8:50 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Tom - 12 Dec 2014, 8:51 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 12 Dec 2014, 11:10 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Jimmi - 12 Dec 2014, 9:09 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 13 Dec 2014, 9:15 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by mb134 - 30 Dec 2014, 3:51 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 30 Dec 2014, 3:57 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by mb134 - 30 Dec 2014, 4:05 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 30 Dec 2014, 4:28 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by mb134 - 30 Dec 2014, 4:39 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by tyresmoke - 30 Dec 2014, 9:56 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by mb134 - 30 Dec 2014, 10:07 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by tyresmoke - 31 Dec 2014, 7:35 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by mb134 - 31 Dec 2014, 9:39 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 30 Dec 2014, 4:31 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 30 Dec 2014, 9:19 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by mb134 - 30 Dec 2014, 9:24 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 30 Dec 2014, 10:02 pm
Customer Service thread - by R852 PRG - 22 Feb 2015, 3:33 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 22 Feb 2015, 3:35 pm
Customer Service thread - by R852 PRG - 22 Feb 2015, 3:37 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 22 Feb 2015, 3:39 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by R852 PRG - 20 Mar 2015, 6:09 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Michael - 31 Mar 2015, 8:41 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 26 May 2015, 12:38 pm
Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 28 May 2015, 9:48 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Malarkey - 28 May 2015, 9:54 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by S813 FVK - 28 May 2015, 10:15 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Davie - 28 May 2015, 10:30 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Jimmi - 02 Jun 2015, 8:34 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 02 Jun 2015, 8:37 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 03 Jun 2015, 9:25 am
Customer Service thread - by Jimmi - 16 Jun 2015, 11:08 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 19 Jun 2015, 6:24 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Jimmi - 19 Jun 2015, 6:43 pm
Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 31 Jul 2015, 4:41 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by S813 FVK - 11 Aug 2015, 6:51 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by citaro5284 - 11 Aug 2015, 6:53 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by S813 FVK - 11 Aug 2015, 6:54 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by BusLoverMum - 11 Aug 2015, 6:59 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by BusLoverMum - 11 Aug 2015, 6:57 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 11 Aug 2015, 7:00 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by BusLoverMum - 11 Aug 2015, 7:14 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 11 Aug 2015, 7:17 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by omnicity4659 - 13 Aug 2015, 1:09 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 07 Sep 2015, 6:10 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 07 Sep 2015, 7:55 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by R852 PRG - 07 Sep 2015, 8:01 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by northern156 - 07 Sep 2015, 9:04 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by citaro5284 - 08 Sep 2015, 4:06 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by omnicity4659 - 26 Nov 2015, 3:32 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by BusLoverMum - 26 Nov 2015, 3:56 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by omnicity4659 - 26 Nov 2015, 4:01 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by BusLoverMum - 26 Nov 2015, 4:09 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by omnicity4659 - 26 Nov 2015, 4:30 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Tom - 23 Dec 2016, 5:49 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 23 Dec 2016, 7:27 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Tom - 23 Dec 2016, 8:34 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 23 Dec 2016, 11:16 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Ambassador - 23 Dec 2016, 10:23 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 24 Dec 2016, 11:23 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by Michael - 23 Dec 2016, 10:27 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Dan - 09 Apr 2017, 7:09 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 09 Apr 2017, 8:15 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by markydh - 09 Apr 2017, 12:19 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 09 Apr 2017, 12:25 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by James101 - 09 Apr 2017, 6:14 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 09 Apr 2017, 7:52 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by James101 - 09 Apr 2017, 7:56 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 09 Apr 2017, 7:58 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Ambassador - 09 Apr 2017, 11:17 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by LeeCalder - 10 Apr 2017, 6:19 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 10 Apr 2017, 8:55 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 10 Apr 2017, 9:32 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 10 Apr 2017, 9:40 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by markydh - 10 Apr 2017, 10:42 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 07 Dec 2017, 6:50 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 28 Mar 2018, 5:45 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Chris 1 - 29 Mar 2018, 11:16 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 30 Mar 2018, 9:32 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by James101 - 30 Mar 2018, 9:39 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 31 Mar 2018, 1:17 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Chris 1 - 04 Apr 2018, 12:16 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 04 Apr 2018, 12:54 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 12 Jul 2019, 5:36 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by James101 - 24 Jul 2019, 9:30 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by deanmachine - 24 Jul 2019, 10:41 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by James101 - 24 Jul 2019, 11:02 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 25 Jul 2019, 8:00 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 16 Aug 2019, 6:46 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 16 Aug 2019, 9:16 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 24 Aug 2019, 8:59 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Tyne_Traveller - 25 Aug 2019, 8:38 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 25 Aug 2019, 3:26 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by tyresmoke - 26 Aug 2019, 11:04 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 26 Aug 2019, 3:03 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 23 Jun 2020, 8:05 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by deanmachine - 30 Jul 2020, 7:05 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Andreos1 - 30 Jul 2020, 8:22 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by tyresmoke - 30 Jul 2020, 7:38 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by deanmachine - 30 Jul 2020, 8:17 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Rob44 - 31 Jul 2020, 10:40 am
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 14 Aug 2021, 1:22 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by Adrian - 30 Mar 2022, 12:16 pm
RE: Customer Service thread - by streetdeckfan - 30 Mar 2022, 4:39 pm
RE: Complaint Stories - by Adrian - 18 Apr 2014, 8:23 pm