North East Buses

So this may cause a bit of an agument but I'm saying my opinion 
I think the North Tyneside network needs looking at a bit. Mainly the routes and problems. I'm gonna say a few and people can agree or disagreement but here's mine

Number 1. The 1A 1B Coaster network needs looking at. Mainly some reason are is the Metrocenter part seems a bit pointless. It takes nearly 30 mins to get there from Gateshead. You have faster connections from Newcastle and Gateshead to get there. Especially the buses on market Street get to Gateshead the same way with the 1a and 1B. 

Number 2. The little coaster network. Ever since the changes back in March of 2021 they have fallen apartments major. The branding no longer makes sense anymore. Plus if you live along the 42/42A route after forest Hall (42) and Quorum Business Park (42A) to get to North Shields now you ether have to travel all the way to Wallsend to get a bus to North Shields or North Tyneside hospital or change to the Gateshead Central Taxis 335 at Four Lane Ends right till after Benton Asda or the metro from Four Lane ends. 

Number 3. The 42A route. This one may seem strange to some people. But if metro break down between Kingston Park and Airport. Only bus you have is the 42A with it being once an hour. (Postive as well on this one) the 42A between Four Lane Ends and Wallsend is amazing seeing many people use that. Once there wasn't a bus between Four Lane Ends and Wallsend so well done on that part. 

Number 4. Rebranded them. I think the little coaster should remain on some 11 as that makes sense. But for the rest I'm not sure. 

Number 5. The buses. I think the Solos should be taken of. Seeing Decker's on some of them or longer buses would be better as lately the solos have been breaking down quite a bit. 

Sorry for it being so long. But this is just my opinion on the North Tyneside network. I'm not saying Go North East are doing a bad job. But some things could be changed to make it between. I can understand if this is deleted but just my opinion. Would love to hear people response. I respect go North East and do not hate them at all. Just some the to be chance or sorted with the routes

The 1A/1B are not really designed for direct journeys to the Metrocentre and can't imagine many would be willing to do the full route... the reason for the route taken to the Metrocentre is the 1A/1B were basically combined into one (variation aside) through route from previous routes that ran to offer better connections from the Lobbley Hill area previously offered on the 96 > 11 and I think the 95 as well into Newcastle and the Metrocentre, doing this will have most likely reduce operational requirements and costs whilst also offering better connections for passengers.

The reason for the 'Little Coasters' branding is the services are seen as a sub network to compliment the main 'Coaster' service as the services meet and have connections avaliable with service 1A/1B in places along the route, the same is being done elsewhere within GNE like the Little Pinks somewhat being the Washington sub network linking in with the 'Connections 4' service which is now also pink.

I'm guessing the reason for Solos being allocated to these routes is that's what reflects the number of passengers using the service(s) so they're hardly gonna put deckers on just for the craic although the 19 has been increased to single deckers again although unsure if this is a permanent move or not? Although I do feel it was a bit of an injustice to take the Solo SRs that were originally acquired for these services off and allocate them elsewhere leaving these services with older and lower spec replacements although the X20 is losing it's Solo SRs so there's a chance they *may* end up back there (no clue what the plan for those are yet).

I can't add any further comments in regards to the routes as I don't know the services and the areas they operate in too well.

I think Dans touched on this a lot now, the demand just isn’t there in this area anymore. I’ve lived in north Tyneside all my 25 years on this planet, gone are the days of Percy Main being a hub of a million and one bus routes, they’ve condensed to try and make what they have profitable. Can you blame them?

I never see the 41 busy, I never really see any 42’s very busy and same goes for the 11. Unfortunately the competition have edged it in these areas.

I could understand you constantly saying it needs to change if there was footfall to back this up, but you have to accept from a none enthusiast point of view of the area. I do feel as though I grew up at a good time for this area, the excitement of never knowing what bus was going to show up on a 305 or even 340 used to be great, but that’s not how bus companies are ran anymore, it’s more uniformed, and on the whole as a customer perspective better.

Gone are the days of B10BLES flying round on the 17, or SPD’s cluttering up wallsend!


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(10 Mar 2021, 12:49 am)Jimmi wrote [ -> ]The 1A/1B are not really designed for direct journeys to the Metrocentre and can't imagine many would be willing to do the full route...

Yeah, no sane person would use the 1A along it's full route. 
Having said that, I have a couple times, and it's certainly a trek

(10 Mar 2021, 5:48 am)streetdeckfan wrote [ -> ]Yeah, no sane person would use the 1A along it's full route. 
Having said that, I have a couple times, and it's certainly a trek

We established a long time ago that you aren’t sane!


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(10 Mar 2021, 1:23 am)Wellsey18 wrote [ -> ]I think Dans touched on this a lot now, the demand just isn’t there in this area anymore. I’ve lived in north Tyneside all my 25 years on this planet, gone are the days of Percy Main being a hub of a million and one bus routes, they’ve condensed to try and make what they have profitable. Can you blame them?

I never see the 41 busy, I never really see any 42’s very busy and same goes for the 11. Unfortunately the competition have edged it in these areas.

I could understand you constantly saying it needs to change if there was footfall to back this up, but you have to accept from a none enthusiast point of view of the area. I do feel as though I grew up at a good time for this area, the excitement of never knowing what bus was going to show up on a 305 or even 340 used to be great, but that’s not how bus companies are ran anymore, it’s more uniformed, and on the whole as a customer perspective better.

Gone are the days of B10BLES flying round on the 17, or SPD’s cluttering up wallsend!


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I think you make some interesting points here. Whilst there's not many areas that have two bus operators competing on a corridor along with the metro, I do think there is demand. 
The number of people living and working in the area indicates to me that there is a lot of potential to grow the network, rather than reduce it.

Then you have all of the business parks opening and developing, the new houses being built alongside the A19 and the likes of the Silverlink.
Yet (and I feel like a broken record), we have a network which is basically as it was - all be it condensed and reduced.
Competition has seen investment in vehicles, but not the network. 

Then the SNE rock up, see that one of the many gaps in the market is open to exploit and expands the 22 from Wallsend.
Making a resource investment in the network, which could be paying off.
On the other hand, there's ANE and GNE reducing their resource investment in the network... 
Maybe, just maybe, we would see a different outcome if the opposite happened.

(10 Mar 2021, 8:48 am)Andreos1 wrote [ -> ]I think you make some interesting points here. Whilst there's not many areas that have two bus operators competing on a corridor along with the metro, I do think there is demand. 
The number of people living and working in the area indicates to me that there is a lot of potential to grow the network, rather than reduce it.

Then you have all of the business parks opening and developing, the new houses being built alongside the A19 and the likes of the Silverlink.
Yet (and I feel like a broken record), we have a network which is basically as it was - all be it condensed and reduced.
Competition has seen investment in vehicles, but not the network. 

Then the SNE rock up, see that one of the many gaps in the market is open to exploit and expands the 22 from Wallsend.
Making a resource investment in the network, which could be paying off.
On the other hand, there's ANE and GNE reducing their resource investment in the network... 
Maybe, just maybe, we would see a different outcome if the opposite happened.

Tbf to Arriva they haven't cut anything in North Tyneside either and have actually increased resources with the 51A and the 306 extension.

The best thing for North Tyneside (and some won't like this) would be for GNE to leave the area - I know it won't happen obv. but GNE have no purpose anymore. The 310 is duplicate of the 306 mostly, the 309 is a duplicate of the 308 mostly. The 311 is a waste of space. The 41/42/42A go through or connect with dominant Stagecoach (41) or Arriva and Stagecoach areas (42/42A). You've then got the 1 which goes through dominant Stagecoach areas (22, 40) or Arriva areas (306) plus the Metro shadowing it throughout. What's left the 11 and the 19 and the Ashington extension goes through Arriva areas. The competition brings nothing to benefit of passengers either bar the money spent from public taxes to subsidise 1/2 of it in the evening and Sundays.

We'll never know but I wouldn't be surprised if Percy Main is leaking money like a sieve. As people say the Little Coaster buses are constantly dead and the Coast Road services aren't exactly much better yet car usage on the Coast is through the roof.

From what I recall in various reports North Tyneside (and parts of Sunderland) have the highest car ownership rates in the region so even if the network was there you have the issue of tempting folk out of their cars and off the Metro.

Go North East need to give percy main a massive overhaul. Yea the Cobalt and Coast buses were done but the fact is that the entire network and depot need new buses. It makes it feels like percy main gets sent buses half dead. I mean how long have the Coaster brand been about and its the one branding yet to have a 2021 look since the branding name hasn't changed since the branding was Bashe colour then it went to blue on the Scania and Has remained the same. Gne should when possible give the percy main Fleet/branding a look. Like when the solos went on the X20. Percy main got second hand ones. Way worse. They went from all of them having Next stop to now not having it

(10 Mar 2021, 8:48 am)Andreos1 wrote [ -> ]I think you make some interesting points here. Whilst there's not many areas that have two bus operators competing on a corridor along with the metro, I do think there is demand. 
The number of people living and working in the area indicates to me that there is a lot of potential to grow the network, rather than reduce it.

Then you have all of the business parks opening and developing, the new houses being built alongside the A19 and the likes of the Silverlink.
Yet (and I feel like a broken record), we have a network which is basically as it was - all be it condensed and reduced.
Competition has seen investment in vehicles, but not the network. 

Then the SNE rock up, see that one of the many gaps in the market is open to exploit and expands the 22 from Wallsend.
Making a resource investment in the network, which could be paying off.
On the other hand, there's ANE and GNE reducing their resource investment in the network... 
Maybe, just maybe, we would see a different outcome if the opposite happened.

Yeah I see your points, I definitely think Stagecoach went for a ‘he who dares’ approach, I know the 306/308 and 309/310 braise the outskirts of the silverlink but it’s been crying out for a bus to actually go into it! There was no reason why the 42 couldn’t have done that, at the end of the day it would only be omitting middle engine lane, where the 310 would serve the same purpose.

And let’s not forget that the Buses the 22 use aren’t actually too bad.

I like your idea of the linking up to new housing estates, but I’d be inclined to say that most the people in those areas are going to be resigned to using their car! But again it’s one of those until you try you don’t know?!

You never know the more we see an easing of lockdown (touch wood) it may help Go North East evaluate what they have a bit more and where they could expand.

You could argue GNE have done this to themselves at Percy Main, or you can go down the supply and demand route, either way I don’t think it’ll change soon.


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Go North East made the bad decision making the 42/42A cut from serving the Cobalt and Gateshead Central Taxis extended the 335 to North Shields. It makes no sense at all. Putting the 42/42A route to finsh at the Cobalt would be better but your then in competition with Stagecoach 22

Right where to start pick apart this.

The branding makes no sense.

Lets have a look at the branding - https://www.flickr.com/photos/gjm-photog...7922281112
Frequent Services in around North Tyneside - Makes sense, the Coaster Network covers about 75% of North Tyneside.
Early to Late 7 Days a week - True that GNE doesn't run the services on evening and Sundays as GCT were cheaper for the contracts, however I believe GNE tickets are still valid on the 11/41/42/42A services ran by GCT.

The Buses are old and secondhand
People seem to have forgotten Percy Main have had new buses or nearly new buses before. The NT network when previously known as Indigo recieved a batch of new Solos to replace the MPDs. Did passengers numbers improve, sadly they didn't. This lead to the Solos being new for the service heading off to pastures new whilst older Solos and Solo SRs were used for the rebranded Little Coaster network.

The Cobalt Clipper / Cobalt and Coast service has had vehicles brought new for it a few times, back when it was just the 309 it recieved new Omnicities, when the service introduced the 310, 5 new Citaros (https://www.flickr.com/photos/gjm-photogenic/5462996448) were added to the fleet along with 2 second hand examples.  Given the service was successful due to the increase of businesses at Cobalt, the service gained 15 Volvo B9TL - Wright Eclipse Gemini 2 for the 309/310. These vehicles have been refurbished 2 years ago, however since the pandemic has seen a lot of people who would normally work at Cobalt work from home, and the majority of those who are still working there are using cars. Maybe once things settle down numbers will increase, but we don't know, we cannot predict the future.

The 58 (Citylink) although a Gateshead (Sunderland Road / Riverside) service recieved Mercedes Benz Citaros when the route was rebranded and extended to Hadrian Park (https://www.flickr.com/photos/gjm-photogenic/5355291045). However demand for the route on the Gateshead side was so high it ended up recieving tired Bendy Buses (https://www.flickr.com/photos/gjm-photog...0837639863) from London and the service between Hadrian Pk and Newcastle was reduced to every 20 minutes. Not helped due to the prescense of Cobalt Clipper and Arriva services. However the bendys were uneconomical with high fuel costs and were replaced by new Optare Versas (https://www.flickr.com/photos/gjm-photog...9705078626). Again these new vehicles weren't bringing the passengers out of their cars. And the service was cut back and replaced by the 57 using Citaros that were ironically brought for the original 58 Citylink.

The Coaster route in parts is Pointless and too long
The 1A/1B is an interesting route to be honest, and it's as a result of streamlining a number of different routes into one service thus instead of several routes making little money each and using more resources, there is one route making money and using less resources. The service isn't really intended to be ridden end to end but does have a number of overlapping busy corridors. The service is effectively the old 300/301/315/316/325/326 (and their other respective route numbers) between Whitley Bay and North Shields with only the section along the coast between Cullercoats and Tynemouth Park (which wasn't that busy anyway) and a short section of the Broadway not being served anymore. From North Shields (well TBH Tynemouth Park) to Gateshead, it's effectively the old 301/302 route, one of Percy Main's foundation route corridors. Though in later years has seen increased competition from Stagecoach with the extension of the 22 to Cobalt over the Wallsend to Rosehill section of the route. Whilst the current route from Gateshead to the Metrocentre bus station is the old 95/96 service with the extension to ASDA replacing the S1. (Remember when that used 4 buses when it started). The route IMO has several busy corridors with people travelling between 2 areas the route services for example Howdon to Wallsend or North Shields as people head to them places for the shops. Especially if one town had shops that were unique to it or people preferred shopping in the Wallsend Co-Op compared to the one in North Shields or vice versa.

New Estates
New estates are popping up everywhere, and most of them are poorly served by buses, though also heavily catered towards car useage. One estate (Greenlee Drive behind the old Wills Factory) was built with the intention of buses serving it with laybys and a turning circle, but it never did get the bus service it was designed for. Of the new estates recently built, the one at Backworth (Backworth Park I think) has had a bus service (59/359) routed through it. Whilst the one at Holystone has had a small extension added to it by the 51A. Whilst a section of Great Park has the Q3 and another part has the 46, though a lot of estates being built now have loop roads which could be easily served by buses. Another new estate (although in the Gateshead area) thats lacking buses is the one build on the site of Stella south power station. Bus companies are frightened to try services to new estates, here's an idea, start off small, use vehicles like the Sprinter City 45s, if the service is popular, upgrade to a bigger bus. Or go for Electric Minibuses like the Mellor Orion E and advertise as an EcoLink to services on the main road with through fares.

I could see Stagecoach trying competition for the 40/41/42/42A. If they felt like extending an existing service that terminates at wallsend to Hadrian Park. Or even running a new service to provide extra buses between east and west.

(10 Mar 2021, 1:16 pm)ASX_Terranova wrote [ -> ]I could see Stagecoach trying competition for the 40/41/42/42A. If they felt like extending an existing service that terminates at wallsend to Hadrian Park. Or even running a new service to provide extra buses between east and west.

The Stagecoach 12 springs to mind

I think a big factor is going to be the return to office for most of cobalt, that coupled with the fact that sage is (eventually) opening a huge site there could really help swing an advantage for either of the companies, however I’d have thought GNE would have a good relationship with sage already!


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(10 Mar 2021, 12:02 pm)Wellsey18 wrote [ -> ]Yeah I see your points, I definitely think Stagecoach went for a ‘he who dares’ approach, I know the 306/308 and 309/310 braise the outskirts of the silverlink but it’s been crying out for a bus to actually go into it! There was no reason why the 42 couldn’t have done that, at the end of the day it would only be omitting middle engine lane, where the 310 would serve the same purpose.

And let’s not forget that the Buses the 22 use aren’t actually too bad.

I like your idea of the linking up to new housing estates, but I’d be inclined to say that most the people in those areas are going to be resigned to using their car! But again it’s one of those until you try you don’t know?!

You never know the more we see an easing of lockdown (touch wood) it may help Go North East evaluate what they have a bit more and where they could expand.

You could argue GNE have done this to themselves at Percy Main, or you can go down the supply and demand route, either way I don’t think it’ll change soon.


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I don't think it's necessariky about linking up housing estates to housing estates. More about seeing where the flows are and doing something about it. 
I only see operators moaning about flows causing delays. Not doing anything about taking advantage of those flows and operating services in those areas. 
There are people living in North Tyneside who work on North Tyneside, but there's absolutely no straightforward way they can make that journey. 
Living in Forest Hall, but working at Cobalt. It's going to be car all day long.
Ditto for those living in Marden but working at Quorum. 
It's OK for those living in Tynemouth or Whitley Bay and working in the town though. As long as they can get beyond the pinch points and queues caused by people who are going to Quorum or Cobalt. 

It's the same with Team Valley. Major centre of employment, but an absolute pain to get to using public transport from anywhere other than the likes of Bensham, Heworth or Felling.
Then operators push for bus lanes and priorities through Birtley. The irony of operators being stuck in traffic, complaining about the traffic, yet not giving the people in the cars a viable alternative, mustnt have hit home in ANE or GNE towers yet.

It's bonkers.

(10 Mar 2021, 3:56 pm)Andreos1 wrote [ -> ]I don't think it's necessariky about linking up housing estates to housing estates. More about seeing where the flows are and doing something about it. 
I only see operators moaning about flows causing delays. Not doing anything about taking advantage of those flows and operating services in those areas. 
There are people living in North Tyneside who work on North Tyneside, but there's absolutely no straightforward way they can make that journey. 
Living in Forest Hall, but working at Cobalt. It's going to be car all day long.
Ditto for those living in Marden but working at Quorum. 
It's OK for those living in Tynemouth or Whitley Bay and working in the town though. As long as they can get beyond the pinch points and queues caused by people who are going to Quorum or Cobalt. 

It's the same with Team Valley. Major centre of employment, but an absolute pain to get to using public transport from anywhere other than the likes of Bensham, Heworth or Felling.
Then operators push for bus lanes and priorities through Birtley. The irony of operators being stuck in traffic, complaining about the traffic, yet not giving the people in the cars a viable alternative, mustnt have hit home in ANE or GNE towers yet.

It's bonkers.

I've just picked up this ([attachment=9713]) from the Quorum site. 

What is interesting is where the buses originate from and terminate. 
52 buses an hour and they're all from and to pretty much the same place. There's nothing there (without at least one change - probably involving another bus operator or the metro) from some of the more densely populated areas of North Tyneside.

Ditto Cobalt ([attachment=9714]). It looks impressive on the fancy spider map, but the majority of the services shadow each other or involve some sort of change between mode and operator. 

I used to witter on about Dalton Park and it being brilliant for public transport if you lived in Seaham...
Thankfully it is a little bit more accessible these days. 

There's so much more operators can do to make travel more attractive, than sticking in a table, a couple of plugs and some WiFi.
Improving the network and having buses go where people need them to go (particularly during peaks) will reduce the numbers of cars on the roads. 
It's not rocket science.

(10 Mar 2021, 5:57 pm)Andreos1 wrote [ -> ]I've just picked up this () from the Quorum site. 

What is interesting is where the buses originate from and terminate. 
52 buses an hour and they're all from and to pretty much the same place. There's nothing there (without at least one change - probably involving another bus operator or the metro) from some of the more densely populated areas of North Tyneside.

Ditto Cobalt (). It looks impressive on the fancy spider map, but the majority of the services shadow each other or involve some sort of change between mode and operator. 

I used to witter on about Dalton Park and it being brilliant for public transport if you lived in Seaham...
Thankfully it is a little bit more accessible these days. 

There's so much more operators can do to make travel more attractive, than sticking in a table, a couple of plugs and some WiFi.
Improving the network and having buses go where people need them to go (particularly during peaks) will reduce the numbers of cars on the roads. 
It's not rocket science.

That’s the sum total of it in my opinion, every main working hun outside the city centre needs connections. I drive to Gosforth every day for work, would I rather drive and be there in 10 minutes, or would I rather get two separate buses?

As a North Tyneside resident, connections - with some thought put into them - are key for me. I don't claim to be a bus enthusiast so won't say which vehicles should be used, but I do take a strong interest in transport networks.

A single into town on the Coast Road bus is currently £2 on Arriva, £2.30 on Go North East. I can get day saver tickets for £3.90 or £4 respectively, if I think my return evening journey will coincide with the correct operator.

Now, I quite often need to travel by train from the Central Station - but not every day. Currently (and admittedly as a result of Covid), parking all day after 09:30 at the Central Station only costs £5. It's a no brainer for me to pay the extra £1 / £1.10 to drive into Newcastle. As well as the convenience about not having to wait for buses, it also saves me the walk from St. Mary's Place to the Central Station and back.

If there was a direct service along the Coast Road, but one which continued to the Central Station / MetroCentre / beyond, that may tip the balance and get me out of the car. To take it to the next level, if one of the South / West axis X-Lines (Hexham / Consett) could be extended along the Coast Road into North Tyneside - perhaps first stop Station Road to keep the express factor, then all the better! Where would it go beyond there? Who knows - Redesdale Park / Cobalt / Hadrian Park / semi-express to the Coast - I'd suggest prudent not to over-target areas already served by the Metro.

I would probably withdraw one or two Cobalt and Coast an hour from the west end of the Coast Road (at the cost of missing intermediate stops in the Newcastle borough), with the X-Lines operating in lieu. Surely the Coast Road itself is an asset which the X-Lines brand should exploit? I've read previously, although the GNE website does not explicitly say, that the raison d'etre of X-Lines is to provide inter-urban services and arguably North Tyneside is suburban. So what? If I lived at the Coast would I want to sit on a stopping service for best part of an hour, where it can be driven direct in less than half that? Of course not. Would I sit on a bus that got me into town slighty slower the car, but faster than the stopping services, most probably!

Another example, I had regular cause to use the Shields Ferry on a Friday evening. 22:15 ferry from South Shields, and hope it arrived on time in North Shields at 22:22. Then a brisk walk, breath-taking (not breathtaking!), walk up the hill for the 22:30 310 from the top of Borough Bank. The route 19 bus would have missed the 310. Said 310 no longer operates, but for the sake of a minute or two to divert to (terminate at) the ferry landing would have helped massively.

I appreciate I'm only one person and wouldn't want the network to revolve around me, but these are just a couple of examples where some changes could get me on the bus more often.

If any GNE planners are reading this, I'd be happy to further my two-penneth in any consultation.

I agree totally. I'm very surprised that North Tyneside hasn't received an X Lines yet. Like u said the Coast Road would be perfect. Say Ashington to Newcastle Via Blyth and the Coast. Number it X2 say for example. Would be nice. There's a few things that would make the North Tyneside network a bit better