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+--- Thread: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action (/showthread.php?tid=4392)
RE: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - Iamtheone8483748 - 06 Nov 2023
Go North East bosses dismayed as Unite ‘talks walkout’ creates misery for passengers
Today Mon 6th Nov 2023
Talks held today, brokered by the reconciliation service ACAS, aimed at resolving the Go North East driver pay dispute that has been ongoing for weeks ended in huge disappointment as Unite staged a walkout after four hours.
Unite demanded pay rises every six months in return for calling off their strike before refusing to continue talks. The stunt dashes hopes that unions were willing to reach a deal to end the strike and restore bus services.
Go North East sought a dialogue on proposals, but negotiations ended after four hours when Unite representatives walked out.
Go North East business director, Ben Maxfield said, “Today, Unite demanded six monthly pay increases: as well as rises backdated to July 2023, and another in July 2024, Unite are now insisting on an additional pay increase on 1 January 2024. All increases they say, must be higher than anything already on the table.
“Passengers are facing unacceptable levels of hardship. But instead of a constructive dialogue all we get from the local Unite representatives is a set of moving goal posts, escalating demands, and a succession of U-turns.”
Ben Maxfield added, “We persuaded ACAS to became involved in talks weeks ago and even they have struggled to keep Unite at the negotiating table. I think that says it all.
“This dispute, this strike, is entirely of Unite’s making. All we want is for the local union representatives to work constructively and collaboratively with us to secure a resolution.
“New demands for six-monthly pay rises will only add to mounting anger within the workforce, and from the public, over Unite’s handling of negotiations. It is impossible to negotiate with a union hell bent on disruption rather than dialogue.”
The company’s offer of a 10.3% pay increase would make the drivers the best-paid in the region. For drivers working a standard week annual pay would rise by almost £2,700 yearly, with an hourly rate of £14.15. Drivers who chose to work overtime stand to gain over £3,000 per year. Drivers who choose to work a 41-hour week will earn £30,000 per year.
Ben Maxfield said, “Coming on the back of the 10% increase our drivers received in July last year, our offer means they will have had a 20% pay rise in just over a year.
“Unite had been hanging their hat on references to North East drivers ‘earning less’ than their counterparts in Manchester. However, Manchester drivers work to far more flexible scheduling rules. Unite confirmed to us today that they would not want to swap their package of wages and conditions for that of Manchester or anywhere else. They want to keep their conditions as they are now.”
https://www.gonortheast.co.uk/go-north-east-bosses-dismayed-unite-talks-walkout-creates-misery-passengers
RE: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - Ambassador - 06 Nov 2023
The Unite response
https://www.unitetheunion.org/news-events/news/2023/november/go-north-east-talks-break-down-after-employer-refuses-to-improve-offer
Go North East talks break down after employer refuses to improve offer
Strike could be resolved for under £250,000 pounds but management refuse to move in negotiations
Bus strikes in the North East of England are set to continue after further talks with Go North East broke down this afternoon (Mon 6 Nov), Unite can reveal.
Unite officials suggested multiple ways of ending the strikes with a variety of financial packages for workers but each was met with refusal by Go North East management. Unite have calculated that the dispute could be resolved for approximately £238,000 - less than the pay for two Go North East directors, but the employer has refused to budge.
The difference between what the employer has previously offered and what Unite has asked for means that Go North East can end the strike with just 0.28 per cent of the annual profits of the Go Ahead bus group.
Unite general secretary Sharon Graham said: “Go North East could end this dispute with the stroke of a pen with the equivalent of money they’d find down the back of a sofa. The parent company is awash with cash and yet they won’t stump up the funds it would cost them to end this dispute right now.
“Go North East should be ashamed of its own stubbornness and how it is treating our members and the communities that built its transport empire.”
Unite regional officer Dave Telford added: “Our members’ resolve has not waivered, and we will not back down. Unite put various proposals on the table today for the employer to accept and every time Go North East just refused to budge.
“There is only one party currently wishing to negotiate and that’s Unite. I urge Go North East to put its hands in its pocket and come up with the money that it will cost them to end this dispute – pocket change for a company making £85million in profits.”
Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - TEN 6083 - 06 Nov 2023
Featham and Maxfield are a pair of [emoji1782]
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
RE: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - Aaron21 - 06 Nov 2023
There making Unite out to be worse. There throwing everything in now its not to wonder Unite talks keep falling. They simply do not give a s%%t. Its pathetic how bad Ben & Nigel are handling this. Nigel won't accept to make them like Manchester cause that means he would have to manged big companies which it seems he doesn't want to do
Nigel is sitting there stroking his own ego and thinking its Unite the problem not him. Same with Ben sitting there litral stroking his ego and pen using possible Chat GPT to come up with ways to describe Unite. Calling them unacceptable and saying its all there fault when they won't bring a deal to the table
If gne can afford repaints constantly and buying buses then they can afford to pay the driver. Will they of course not. I mean come on. Strikes on going and 6155 is now a GNW training advert bus. It's pathetic. This company is going to fail and then let's see them defend themselves.
Imagine Imagine the press release and statement if gne fell through and collapsed. Ben would use every swear word invented and become the new Donald trump by making new words to say how FLABBERGASTED he is that Unite didn't agree to him calling every name under the sun.
RE: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - Adrian - 06 Nov 2023
(06 Nov 2023, 7:11 pm)Iamtheone8483748 wrote Go North East bosses dismayed as Unite ‘talks walkout’ creates misery for passengers
Today Mon 6th Nov 2023
Talks held today, brokered by the reconciliation service ACAS, aimed at resolving the Go North East driver pay dispute that has been ongoing for weeks ended in huge disappointment as Unite staged a walkout after four hours.
Unite demanded pay rises every six months in return for calling off their strike before refusing to continue talks. The stunt dashes hopes that unions were willing to reach a deal to end the strike and restore bus services.
Go North East sought a dialogue on proposals, but negotiations ended after four hours when Unite representatives walked out.
Go North East business director, Ben Maxfield said, “Today, Unite demanded six monthly pay increases: as well as rises backdated to July 2023, and another in July 2024, Unite are now insisting on an additional pay increase on 1 January 2024. All increases they say, must be higher than anything already on the table.
“Passengers are facing unacceptable levels of hardship. But instead of a constructive dialogue all we get from the local Unite representatives is a set of moving goal posts, escalating demands, and a succession of U-turns.”
Ben Maxfield added, “We persuaded ACAS to became involved in talks weeks ago and even they have struggled to keep Unite at the negotiating table. I think that says it all.
“This dispute, this strike, is entirely of Unite’s making. All we want is for the local union representatives to work constructively and collaboratively with us to secure a resolution.
“New demands for six-monthly pay rises will only add to mounting anger within the workforce, and from the public, over Unite’s handling of negotiations. It is impossible to negotiate with a union hell bent on disruption rather than dialogue.”
The company’s offer of a 10.3% pay increase would make the drivers the best-paid in the region. For drivers working a standard week annual pay would rise by almost £2,700 yearly, with an hourly rate of £14.15. Drivers who chose to work overtime stand to gain over £3,000 per year. Drivers who choose to work a 41-hour week will earn £30,000 per year.
Ben Maxfield said, “Coming on the back of the 10% increase our drivers received in July last year, our offer means they will have had a 20% pay rise in just over a year.
“Unite had been hanging their hat on references to North East drivers ‘earning less’ than their counterparts in Manchester. However, Manchester drivers work to far more flexible scheduling rules. Unite confirmed to us today that they would not want to swap their package of wages and conditions for that of Manchester or anywhere else. They want to keep their conditions as they are now.”
https://www.gonortheast.co.uk/go-north-east-bosses-dismayed-unite-talks-walkout-creates-misery-passengers
I've just read this in parallel with the Unite statement.
What a stark contrast in language used alone. Go North East seem insistent on waging down this road of a culture war between them and the Union representing it's workers. Maxfield's language is inflammatory and down-right insulting. To suggest "This dispute, this strike, is entirely of Unite’s making." is an outrageous claim. You'd never have a dispute without a bad employer.
They're also hanging on to this productivity nonsense about Go North East versus Go North West. Why do these companies think that better pay can only be achieved, if you're willing to sell your soul to the company? I wonder what Christian gave up for his £8,333 a month relocation payment, before he gave his notice? My bet is nothing, as when it comes to cost-cutting, it's always the people at the bottom that seem to be the problem.
Unite's statement on the other hand is straight to the point and publicly suggests a way out, which I'd say is contrary to GNE have put out. They claim that "We persuaded ACAS to became involved in talks weeks ago and even they have struggled to keep Unite at the negotiating table. I think that says it all.". IMO that's a bit misleading and it's really not how ACAS conciliation services work. See here: https://www.acas.org.uk/collective-conciliation
From my own experiences of having been through this process (on a TU side), both the employer and TU negotiating teams will be held in separate meeting rooms. There'll also be a third, which is used and chaired by the conciliator (from ACAS). The TU side will normally put on the table what they think it'd take to resolve the dispute. The employer side will make a counter proposal, and it'll go back and forth for a bit until there's something close. During this time, you'll keep meeting in the joint room and going back to your own room to discuss as a negotiating team. So whilst you can 'walk out' of the process, in practice, it'd only happen at the point which the other side are either not being serious or they're point blank refusing to even come close the the settlement point.
Maybe Nigel and Ben's tactics are to try and turn the public on their own employees. If they're not going to have enough bad blood in the depot with strike breakers, maybe they think the next best thing is to create the maximum amount of hostility all-round? Way to go, when you're already in an industry with rock-bottom morale and one you already struggle to get people to work for you...
RE: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - xpm - 06 Nov 2023
If I was still a driver there I’d be waiting for my back pay whenever it came handing in my 1 week notice and going to another operator. Lots of other unreported incidents on the picket lines which show how much disdain and childish pettiness, management are willing to stoop too, and other more serious disproportionate reactions which I hope the individuals affected follow up and progress to the relevant authorities to the full extent.
RE: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - Storx - 06 Nov 2023
Now I might be naive but am I the only one reading this as.
Lower deal now backdated to July, end the strikes immediately and everyone starts driving again.
New additional Jan' 24 wage increase only (not every 6 months) to sort out the differences, instead of the strike action. No doubt Arriva Northumbria will be done by this to add fuel on the fire.
July '24 back to normal.
Both articles, are suggesting this, bar one has twisted it to the extreme and the other has put it under a number of packages.
RE: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - DeltaMan - 06 Nov 2023
Both sides are as bad as each other. They will ultimately get what they deserve. Nothing!
RE: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - mb134 - 06 Nov 2023
(06 Nov 2023, 7:11 pm)Iamtheone8483748 wrote Ben Maxfield added, “We persuaded ACAS to became involved in talks weeks ago and even they have struggled to keep Unite at the negotiating table. I think that says it all.
“This dispute, this strike, is entirely of Unite’s making. All we want is for the local union representatives to work constructively and collaboratively with us to secure a resolution.
Focusing on these two bits:
- Isn't part of the function of ACAS to help mediate strike talks, I hardly think they would have had to be "persuaded" them to become involve?
- It, by the nature of strike action, is not entirely of Unite's making. The GNE staff voted for this overwhelmingly (twice!), and regardless of the feasibility of the conditions offered GNE *could* end this at any time by giving them what is asked for.
The statements strike me as wanting to gaslight the public and paint GNE as some angelic company. Obviously the truth is somewhere in the middle, but the communications on all of this have been unlike anything I've seen from any company that respects itself, their employees, and their customers.
RE: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - Unber43 - 06 Nov 2023
GNW had to wait 85 days, also a pay deal every 6 months is a bit far considering this would be the 1st one ever..
GNE are going to lose more than £238K through this. People have made other ways/lifts theyll just stick to them all the contracts...digging a hole
RE: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - Adrian - 06 Nov 2023
(06 Nov 2023, 9:51 pm)Unber43 wrote GNW had to wait 85 days, also a pay deal every 6 months is a bit far considering this would be the 1st one ever..
GNE are going to lose more than £238K through this. People have made other ways/lifts theyll just stick to them all the contracts...digging a hole
Yes, our local community group seems to have sorted quite a number of car share arrangements out now. A friend of mine is making use of one and finding it to be a lot less stressful than their usual bus commute.
I have also heard of two employers that have reintroduced a full work from home option for workers. There'll no doubt be others that have made similar moves, protecting their own business, regardless of GNE choosing to destroy theirs.
RE: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - Ambassador - 06 Nov 2023
(06 Nov 2023, 10:02 pm)Adrian wrote I have also heard of two employers that have reintroduced a full work from home option for workers. There'll no doubt be others that have made similar moves, protecting their own business, regardless of GNE choosing to destroy theirs.
Yes that’s becoming pretty much policy in most places. Most hybrid models are switching to fully remote vs 1/2 days in and I know a few major employers in my group contacts have switched fully remote back on (after withdrawing it)
Even a few of the Christmas fairs in offices and business parks are going hybrid with online discount codes etc.
It’s a real testament to people management…Ben might wish to visit
RE: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - Unber43 - 06 Nov 2023
i cannot wait for Arriva Northumrbia getting their paydeal, any updates on that?
RE: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - Shrek - 06 Nov 2023
(06 Nov 2023, 10:38 pm)Ambassador wrote Yes that’s becoming pretty much policy in most places. Most hybrid models are switching to fully remote vs 1/2 days in and I know a few major employers in my group contacts have switched fully remote back on (after withdrawing it)
Even a few of the Christmas fairs in offices and business parks are going hybrid with online discount codes etc.
It’s a real testament to people management…Ben might wish to visit
I've found it going the other way myself. I'm finding more and more people I know are having to go back to the office on a slightly more frequent basis. Most seem to be getting flexibility around the strikes though.
RE: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - Ambassador - 06 Nov 2023
(06 Nov 2023, 10:54 pm)Shrek wrote I've found it going the other way myself. I'm finding more and more people I know are having to go back to the office on a slightly more frequent basis. Most seem to be getting flexibility around the strikes though.
That was the direction of travel for some employers who sort of messed up the initial hybrid piece by letting people do what they want (Sage and Greggs are two major employers I know of ) but there’s nothing like a crisis to focus minds.
Then again, bus users are in a minority, hence the total lack of political resolve to do anything about this
RE: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - Unber43 - 06 Nov 2023
Personally I would quite like a hybrid work week, with 2/3 days in the office (depending on whether its a 4-5 day week) and two at home at the least, but the ability to chose would be beneficial depending on peoples needs. Obvs if you have to be in the office, for launches, big meetings etc
RE: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - Bazza - 07 Nov 2023
(06 Nov 2023, 10:48 pm)Unber43 wrote i cannot wait for Arriva Northumrbia getting their paydeal, any updates on that?
What a strange thing to say!
RE: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - Unber43 - 07 Nov 2023
(07 Nov 2023, 9:33 am)Bazza wrote What a strange thing to say!It will just add more pressure to GNE
RE: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - Bazza - 07 Nov 2023
(07 Nov 2023, 9:42 am)Unber43 wrote It will just add more pressure to GNE
It took around 4-5 months this year for the Arriva pay rise to be settled. I dont think either side in the GNE dispute will be that worried yet by it
RE: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - V514DFT - 07 Nov 2023
Yeah Arriva, the same Arriva that scrapped most of the network in North Tyneside?, if they're not that bothered about the customers, then i dont see them being that bothered about the drivers, only one i have faith in now (barely) is Stagecoach, btw GNE,9 quid it just cost me in Taxis, adding that to the 16 it cost the other week, thats 25 now
RE: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - Ambassador - 07 Nov 2023
(07 Nov 2023, 11:02 am)V514DFT wrote Yeah Arriva, the same Arriva that scrapped most of the network in North Tyneside?, if they're not that bothered about the customers, then i dont see them being that bothered about the drivers, only one i have faith in now (barely) is Stagecoach, btw GNE,9 quid it just cost me in Taxis, adding that to the 16 it cost the other week, thats 25 now
Think we need to give the new owners an opportunity before we cast them into the abyss.
Hopefully they'll make a few better local decisions than GNE's new owners have so far
RE: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - Storx - 07 Nov 2023
(07 Nov 2023, 11:02 am)V514DFT wrote Yeah Arriva, the same Arriva that scrapped most of the network in North Tyneside?, if they're not that bothered about the customers, then i dont see them being that bothered about the drivers, only one i have faith in now (barely) is Stagecoach, btw GNE,9 quid it just cost me in Taxis, adding that to the 16 it cost the other week, thats 25 now
In fairness, Blyth and Ashington have a very generous package already. I can't see them actually wanting that much as they're already well above the North East average. I'll highly doubt Arriva will go for a below inflation wage increase.
Stagecoach will be the one hitting problems as Sunderland has already been on strike over wages and I can imagine it all starting again if GoNorthEast get anything like suggested by Unite. It doesn't help that all the Stagecoach depots have different wages either.
According to job applications, might be out of date they're currently:
South Shields: £13.01
Stockton: £13.49
Sunderland: £13.57
Newcastle: £13.69
Arriva Northumbria: £14.15, will go up soon.
GoNorthEast: At least, £14.15
Quite a sizeable difference there and if the terms are the same, not sure on that, then South Shields should really be asking wtf is going on.
RE: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - MurdnunoC - 07 Nov 2023
(07 Nov 2023, 9:42 am)Unber43 wrote It will just add more pressure to GNE
I'd say it was the other way around.
Both Arriva and Stagecoach will have to better GNE's pay offer in order to recruit or retain staff. So it's in the interests of both companies that any increase to GNE's pay offer is as little as possible to maximise profit margins in that area.
RE: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - logidoodah - 08 Nov 2023
What has any of this got to do with GNE Strikes and pay talks?
RE: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - Adrian - 08 Nov 2023
(08 Nov 2023, 1:28 am)logidoodah wrote What has any of this got to do with GNE Strikes and pay talks?
Very little, but I've split that discussion off into a new Arriva Northumbria - North Tyneside/South East Northumberland Network thread.
If you use the report button next time, we'll see it sooner.
RE: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - Ambassador - 08 Nov 2023
Martin Gannon speaks....and he's not held back
https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/north-east-news/go-north-east-bus-strike-28066843
Coun Gannon called the current strike the low point of a “rotten” and “completely broken” system of deregulated bus services run by private companies, and told Go North East bosses to “stop putting out aggressive communications and instead roll up its sleeves, today – right now, and work constructively with its employees and their trade union to get the buses running again tomorrow”.
“Although we have no active role in this dispute, we do have an obligation to our residents to make sure that Go North East’s behaviour does not go unpunished. As local authorities we pay the company many millions each year for carrying concessionary passes and to shore up unprofitable routes. I will be making sure that every possible financial penalty is applied for non-delivery.
“We recently secured £163.5m of national funding to improve local bus services through partnership. As far as I'm concerned, Go North East is currently in breach of its responsibilities as a partner - we can’t improve services that aren’t being operated, and the company’s actions are damaging the bus network and the lives of its customers. Go North East should not be receiving a penny of this improvement funding until they are providing a bus service worthy of the name.”
RE: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - Adrian - 08 Nov 2023
(08 Nov 2023, 12:24 pm)Ambassador wrote Martin Gannon speaks....and he's not held back
https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/north-east-news/go-north-east-bus-strike-28066843
Not often I find myself in almost complete agreement with him, but I think he's right to look at what financial penalties can be imposed. If they're not running services, they shouldn't receive a penny of public money; nor should they be considered for any additional work.
GNE have committed to delivering several contracts issued by Nexus. They may be covering these one/two a day misc. works contracts and scholars (when they figure out when half term isn't), but there's still several instances of secured services not being ran. In the latest version of the Nexus contract that I've seen, they have the ability to terminate the contract if the strike lasts longer than a month. Given they've only managed to operate two weeks out of the last six, I'd say it's time for Nexus to start giving notice.
RE: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - Andreos1 - 08 Nov 2023
(08 Nov 2023, 12:44 pm)Adrian wrote Not often I find myself in almost complete agreement with him, but I think he's right to look at what financial penalties can be imposed. If they're not running services, they shouldn't receive a penny of public money; nor should they be considered for any additional work.
GNE have committed to delivering several contracts issued by Nexus. They may be covering these one/two a day misc. works contracts and scholars (when they figure out when half term isn't), but there's still several instances of secured services not being ran. In the latest version of the Nexus contract that I've seen, they have the ability to terminate the contract if the strike lasts longer than a month. Given they've only managed to operate two weeks out of the last six, I'd say it's time for Nexus to start giving notice.
Not just that claw back, I imagine BSOG and any other handouts theyre in reciept of will also be at risk based on the lack of mileage.
RE: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - BusLoverMum - 08 Nov 2023
Whoa. He's not mincing his words there and it very much needed to be said.
RE: Go North East - 2023 Pay Deal and Industrial Action - 54APhotography - 08 Nov 2023
(08 Nov 2023, 12:24 pm)Ambassador wrote Martin Gannon speaks....and he's not held back
https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/north-east-news/go-north-east-bus-strike-28066843
Had to be said. Perhaps this may bear influence on Nexus/Durham County to act and terminate all supported routes pending emergency tender process