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Issues with drivers and bus passes - Indigo701 - 06 Jan 2018
Hello Everyone,
I need some advice concerning GNE and my bus pass. I have Asperger Syndrome and hold a County Durham concession bus pass, my pass also allows for a companion to travel with me. However I have had issues with go north east bus drivers and my pass.
I am aware that my pass has to be checked on occasion to stop fraud, however certain for go north east drivers have started to target me and accuse me of stealing a pass, after printing a ticket for me these drivers have demanded to see my pass, with one driver following me to a seat and shouting at me in front of a crowded bus.
I’ve also been thrown off an X1 because the driver didn’t need believe that I was disabled and just yesterday my partner and I were going to Newcastle when the driver of the x21 demanded that I show my pass. Despite two other people, one being in a wheelchair and an elderly lady who the driver let on without hesitation, I lost my temper and walked off the bus.
I feel that I’m being signaled out for having autism, that because it can’t been seen means it’s not real.
I’ve written to the managing director about this, I have also had many heated correspondences with customer services, with the latest being that it’s for “revenue protection” and that the driver was in the right.
I’m now scared to use my pass, my social anxiety on buses has gotten so bad my partner doesn’t want to get buses with me for fear I’ll have a meltdowns
I just wondering if anyone else has had issues like this.
RE: Issues with drivers and bus passes - BusLoverMum - 06 Jan 2018
I can't say I've had any such problem with littlun, but his autism isn't that invisible. I suspect that bigun would be targeted more if we got around to applying for his pass, though. We've had enough problems with him being a tall 13 (now 14) year old, but not with gne drivers. He can't speak to people he's not really comfortable with at all, so would really struggle if he was challenged so aggressively.
RE: Issues with drivers and bus passes - Adrian - 06 Jan 2018
Sorry to hear of the bad experiences you've had whilst using your ENCTS pass.
I appreciate that drivers can ask to see passes, but it sounds most unusual for you to be challenged so often for it to become a problem? I've rarely witnessed any spot checks of ENCTS passes, and I'd class myself as a heavy bus user. Regardless, that is no excuse for rude, aggressive or confrontational behaviour from staff. That needs to be challenged by the company.
If you feel that it is becoming targeted, perhaps something is being displayed to the driver on their ticket machine, when your card is scanned? Is it perhaps worth speaking to Durham County Council about this?
RE: Issues with drivers and bus passes - Indigo701 - 06 Jan 2018
(06 Jan 2018, 4:09 pm)Adrian wrote Sorry to hear of the bad experiences you've had whilst using your ENCTS pass.
I appreciate that drivers can ask to see passes, but it sounds most unusual for you to be challenged so often for it to become a problem? I've rarely witnessed any spot checks of ENCTS passes, and I'd class myself as a heavy bus user. Regardless, that is no excuse for rude, aggressive or confrontational behaviour from staff. That needs to be challenged by the company.
If you feel that it is becoming targeted, perhaps something is being displayed to the driver on their ticket machine, when your card is scanned? Is it perhaps worth speaking to Durham County Council about this?
Hi Adrien,
From observation behind the cabin, on both ticketer and the Vixerg machines it’s a simple Yes/No question asking if I’m traveling on my own and I’ve honestly never seen anything other than the confirm screen.
After the x21 incident, my partner and I went into the Chester Customer Access Point and spoke to the staff, the best advice I got was to post on FB about it And make it public. Do you think it’s worth going to the ENCTS department about this?
Yet it’s only Chester depot where I have had issues, I’ve never had this from Deptford, riverside, Stanley’s or even Percy main. I don’t understand why?
Genuily thankful for both you and BLM’s response,
RE: Issues with drivers and bus passes - Andreos1 - 06 Jan 2018
If it is any consolation, changes are coming in to play and are to be enforced from next year.
https://www.theyworkforyou.com/pbc/2016-17/Bus_Services_Bill/03-0_2017-03-16a.97.3
“(1) All drivers of buses and staff at bus terminals must complete approved disability equality and awareness training (“approved training”) by 1 April 2019.
(2) This training must cover the needs of persons with mental or physical disabilities, including hidden disabilities.
(3) After 1 April 2019—
(a) all new bus drivers and terminal staff must complete approved training within one month of starting work; and
(b) bus drivers and terminal staff must undertake refresher training at least once every three years.
(4) Bus operating companies must consult passenger groups, disability stakeholder groups, trade unions and relevant authorities when developing their approved training for bus drivers and terminal staff.
(5) In this section “approved training” means a training course concerning the needs of persons with mental or physical disabilities, including hidden disabilities, who use or seek to use bus services, approved in a manner specified by regulations to be made by the Secretary of State.”. —
This new clause would require all drivers of buses and staff at bus terminals to complete approved disability equality and awareness training by 1 April 2019.
I am curious as to how the behaviour you have seen falls within any Act's and whether or not you are being discriminated against.
Obviously there has been a number of high profile cases between people in wheelchairs and bus operators.
I don't see how/why those with hidden or less obvious disabilities and being made to feel uncomfortable is any different.
Hope you get sorted and travel becomes easier.
RE: Issues with drivers and bus passes - Adrian - 06 Jan 2018
(06 Jan 2018, 4:47 pm)Indigo701 wrote Hi Adrien,
From observation behind the cabin, on both ticketer and the Vixerg machines it’s a simple Yes/No question asking if I’m traveling on my own and I’ve honestly never seen anything other than the confirm screen.
After the x21 incident, my partner and I went into the Chester Customer Access Point and spoke to the staff, the best advice I got was to post on FB about it And make it public. Do you think it’s worth going to the ENCTS department about this?
Yet it’s only Chester depot where I have had issues, I’ve never had this from Deptford, riverside, Stanley’s or even Percy main. I don’t understand why?
Genuily thankful for both you and BLM’s response,
That seems like a strange suggestion from the customer access point staff. I'd certainly recommend going direct to the department that manage the ENCTS scheme at Durham, as you will probably get a more sensible answer.
The other alternative would be to contact your ward councillor. They can escalate things within Durham County Council for you, which you may find useful? A list can be found here https://democracy.durham.gov.uk/mgMemberIndex.aspx?FN=WARD&VW=LIST&PIC=0
RE: Issues with drivers and bus passes - LVK 404L - 06 Jan 2018
(06 Jan 2018, 4:47 pm)Indigo701 wrote Hi Adrien,
From observation behind the cabin, on both ticketer and the Vixerg machines it’s a simple Yes/No question asking if I’m traveling on my own and I’ve honestly never seen anything other than the confirm screen.
After the x21 incident, my partner and I went into the Chester Customer Access Point and spoke to the staff, the best advice I got was to post on FB about it And make it public. Do you think it’s worth going to the ENCTS department about this?
Yet it’s only Chester depot where I have had issues, I’ve never had this from Deptford, riverside, Stanley’s or even Percy main. I don’t understand why?
Genuily thankful for both you and BLM’s response,
Do you travel on your own?
RE: Issues with drivers and bus passes - Indigo701 - 07 Jan 2018
(06 Jan 2018, 10:10 pm)ifm001 wrote Do you travel on your own?
I used to travel a lot on my own, but since the incident where I had a horrible driver follow me to my seat and shout and scream at me because he didn't believe that I was disabled, I've opted to walk or even not go out at all by myself.
RE: Issues with drivers and bus passes - LVK 404L - 07 Jan 2018
(07 Jan 2018, 8:10 am)Indigo701 wrote I used to travel a lot on my own, but since the incident where I had a horrible driver follow me to my seat and shout and scream at me because he didn't believe that I was disabled, I've opted to walk or even not go out at all by myself.
is that not the reason why possibly. With the concessions pass if you have the free companion added onto it, you are not permitted to travel alone, you must always have a companion with you.
RE: Issues with drivers and bus passes - Adrian - 07 Jan 2018
(07 Jan 2018, 11:23 am)ifm001 wrote is that not the reason why possibly. With the concessions pass if you have the free companion added onto it, you are not permitted to travel alone, you must always have a companion with you.
Where has that information come from? The companion element of the ENCTS scheme was always a discretionary add-on to the national scheme, and varies from local authority to local authority. It doesn't add additional caveats to the use of a disabled persons ENCTS pass.
RE: Issues with drivers and bus passes - LVK 404L - 07 Jan 2018
(07 Jan 2018, 1:03 pm)Adrian wrote Where has that information come from? The companion element of the ENCTS scheme was always a discretionary add-on to the national scheme, and varies from local authority to local authority. It doesn't add additional caveats to the use of a disabled persons ENCTS pass.
unless it depends on the class of disability element. My father in law and the disabled persons that were in my care were all not allowed travel on their own with the ENCTS pass once they had C+ added to it. I was under the impression it was across the board though.
also states on the Nexus website that you must have the companion travelling with you in order to use the card.(not really worth being called Companion Card otherwise is it)
RE: Issues with drivers and bus passes - BusLoverMum - 07 Jan 2018
(07 Jan 2018, 11:23 am)ifm001 wrote is that not the reason why possibly. With the concessions pass if you have the free companion added onto it, you are not permitted to travel alone, you must always have a companion with you.
No, you don't have to have a companion. The forms you fill in if you're not automatically entitled die to being in receipt of higher rate mobility acknowledge that passengers with disabilities might need help on some journeys but not others.
RE: Issues with drivers and bus passes - LVK 404L - 07 Jan 2018
(07 Jan 2018, 7:58 pm)BusLoverMum wrote No, you don't have to have a companion. The forms you fill in if you're not automatically entitled die to being in receipt of higher rate mobility acknowledge that passengers with disabilities might need help on some journeys but not others.
that's not what it says on the website though, and they tell you also at Nexus House on application.
RE: Issues with drivers and bus passes - BusLoverMum - 07 Jan 2018
(07 Jan 2018, 10:08 pm)ifm001 wrote that's not what it says on the website though, and they tell you also at Nexus House on application.
I applied through DCC's disability registration forms. It stated that a companion can travel through the agreement area but that it may be used without, too. I've always been asked in county Durham whether I want one or two tickets and, when I was taking him to school with it, then I just flashed my weekly ticket that I needed to travel without him, before 9:30am, rather than paying my own 50p and never got questioned once.
It stands to reason that someone even with a severe neurological disability may be fine travelling alone for 2 miles on a single bus to aunty Freda's house but couldn't unfamiliar or more complicated journeys alone, or that someone with a physical disability can travel to work alone but need a companion when shopping or visiting somewhere that they're not sure about the accessibility of.
And of course, if I were to take littlun on the bus in, say, East Yorkshire, or even Boro, iirc, his pass wouldn't entitle him to a free companion, anyhow.
RE: Issues with drivers and bus passes - RobinHood - 16 Jan 2018
In most cases, the C+ entitlement only applies when travelling within the area of the local authority who issued the pass.
If you head into Teesside for example, you can get a companion ticket on the journey there (as you board in County Durham) but the driver won't be able to issue one in Middlesbrough to come back, so Companion would need to pay to return.
Pass holder is always free, anywhere in England after 0930.
Issues with drivers and bus passes - Mark51953 - 16 Jan 2018
We have it around York all the time people trying to use passes plus c but most drivers are unaware of the terms and conditions until a inspector gets on Metro use to issue drivers hand books but have now stopped and drivers are unaware
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Issues with drivers and bus passes - TEN 6083 - 18 Jan 2018
Never had any problems using my ENCTS pass, only once a driver wanted to have a look which was on a Connections 4 a couple of years ago
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RE: Issues with drivers and bus passes - Multi21 - 21 Jan 2018
Speaking from the flip side of this.
Personally if someone gets on with a pass I watch the ticket machine for obvious discrepancies ie A 20odd year old with a Pension Pass because the ticket machine tell us the difference. Anyone and I mean anyone Age, Race or Otherwise gets on with a disabled pass I don't even bat an eyelid. As people have already pointed out not all disabilities are visible and some people don't like talking about them.
As for C+ Cards. When outside Teesside and North Yorkshire when a C+ Pass is placed on a reader it comes up on the screen
Concession Only
Concession + Companion
If the driver is being a grump the most he has to say to you is "is it just you travelling" so he can issue the correct ticket.
Honestly it boils my blood when people make trouble for themselves because they are bored. Next time you get chew from a driver make sure you keep your ticket and stick your boot in!
RE: Issues with drivers and bus passes - Indigo701 - 14 Feb 2018
(21 Jan 2018, 1:57 am)Multi21 wrote Speaking from the flip side of this.
Personally if someone gets on with a pass I watch the ticket machine for obvious discrepancies ie A 20odd year old with a Pension Pass because the ticket machine tell us the difference. Anyone and I mean anyone Age, Race or Otherwise gets on with a disabled pass I don't even bat an eyelid. As people have already pointed out not all disabilities are visible and some people don't like talking about them.
As for C+ Cards. When outside Teesside and North Yorkshire when a C+ Pass is placed on a reader it comes up on the screen
Concession Only
Concession + Companion
If the driver is being a grump the most he has to say to you is "is it just you travelling" so he can issue the correct ticket.
Honestly it boils my blood when people make trouble for themselves because they are bored. Next time you get chew from a driver make sure you keep your ticket and stick your boot in!
It happened again this morning, getting the 34 to Chester from Pelton, driver checked my pass ( I handled that alright) and then processed to interrogate me about my autism and why I was traveling. I didn't answer her at all and got my ticket and sat down. Once I was off I full on laced into customer service about it.
I just don't understand why I am always picked on, if this happens again should I write to the MD about this? It wouldn't be the first time I've done this?
RE: Issues with drivers and bus passes - Multi21 - 16 Feb 2018
(14 Feb 2018, 10:33 am)Indigo701 wrote It happened again this morning, getting the 34 to Chester from Pelton, driver checked my pass ( I handled that alright) and then processed to interrogate me about my autism and why I was traveling. I didn't answer her at all and got my ticket and sat down. Once I was off I full on laced into customer service about it.
I just don't understand why I am always picked on, if this happens again should I write to the MD about this? It wouldn't be the first time I've done this?
It's pointless getting the MD involved to be completely honest with you. Hes only gonna pass it down the line.
My advice put a compaint on Facebook with the driver number off the ticket. Let them deal with it. If they dont drop passenger focus a line. If you want any info drop me a PM