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Bus Station Designs - Michael - 27 Jun 2013
It says on the title, design your own bus station for the NE and upload it.. sorry was bored haha
Please move if in wrong area of forum =)
Stands would be as of now:
|-Stand A - Metro Replacement
|-Stand B - 23/24
|-Stand C - 61/X7
|-Stand D - 60
|-Stand E - 38/38C/238/39 (Doxford Park)
|-Stand F - 42
|-Stand G - 700
|-Stand H - 39 (Pennywell)/73
|-Stand I- 2A,2C
|-Stand J - 8,78,78A
|-Stand K 35/35A/35B/35C - Silksworth / Newbottle / Houghton-le-Spring
|-Stand L - X35
|-Stand M - 20,20A,X20
|-Stand N- E1/E2/E6
|-Stand O - 35/35A/35B/35C- South Shields
|-Stand P - 9/X3
|-Stand Q - 56/N56
|-Stand R - 26/26A/36/36A/135/136
|-Stand S - X36/700
RE: Bus Station Designs - Malarkey - 27 Jun 2013
So as Newcastle City Centre is a bit of a mess regarding it Bus Ststions and Traffic in that particular area I have decided in my plan to close this area off to traffic except for usage of John Lewis Multi-Story Car Park, Buses/Taxis/Delivery Vechicles and Emergency Services.
As you can see by the plan Eldon Square remains in it's current form, whereas the Haymarket has had a bit of a revamp. The current Haymarket Bus Station would be knocked down with pavement where the bus stands are being pegged back closer to M&S, allowing for more room for the New Bus Station to be built and more area for road to be laid down also.
The New Bus Station would be positioned in the Centre of the current area with the current fencing being moved further over to make more room also, and in turn allowing only 2 Lanes instead of 4, one each way for Taxis/Delivery Vechicles and Emergency Services as Cars unless they are using the John Lewis Multi-Story Car Park will be unable to use this area and will have to use an alternative route around Newcastle City Centre.
Now most of the Bus Services would be moved over to the Haymarket serving the side of the road closest to the Pubs etc whereas the Current Services in Haymarket will use the side closest to M&S.
The closest to the Pubs will be used by GNE and Arriva X2 Services which head towards Gateshead, they'll come in via the Tyne Bridge and then up New Bridge Street and then Left at St.Mary's Place into Haymarket and then coming out of Newcastle via it's current route back to Gateshead.
Bus Services which serve the MetroCentre from Newcastle will remain in Eldon Square along with Stagecoachs Services which operate out of that area.
New Stand Allocations would be
Stand A/1 - 685/X87/X88 and other Stagecoach Services
Stand B/2 - Tynedale Links 74/684 + Munroes 131
Stand C/3 - Toonlink
Stand D/4 - Ten
Stand E/5 - Diamond/Red Kite
Stands F/6 to K/11 will be used by National Ezpress and Stagecoach MegaBus Services any other coach services, Making this area of Newcastle City Centre a Central Hub for Transport.
I think that pretty much covers it.
RE: Bus Station Designs - gtom - 28 Jun 2013
I'll have a think about this.
It's more likely (and the plan is) to build a bus station towards Pilgrim Street/Newbridge Street to keep Southbound (basically GNE) out of the City X=Centre and reduce congestion
Of course until Pilgrim Street is redeveloped (a long long long time away) nothing will happen as GNE aren't going to want passengers dumped in a dead part of the city as opposed to the horrifically designed Eldon Square
RE: Bus Station Designs - Malarkey - 28 Jun 2013
Pilgrim isn't bad idea if they were knock down those buildings where the old cinema was, not sure of the offices etc above and then slightly over into the middle of the road get used or not, But it were to be demolished i'd imagine it would be quite a big open area. Plus if there was room Stagecoach also use it aswell instead of The Green. Which is total nightmare getting buses through.
I do think my idea is a very good one, plus it would severly reduce traffic congestion aswell.
RE: Bus Station Designs - BJ10VUS - 29 Jun 2013
(28 Jun 2013, 4:31 pm)citaro5284 wrote(28 Jun 2013, 1:00 pm)gtomlinson wrote I'll have a think about this.
It's more likely (and the plan is) to build a bus station towards Pilgrim Street/Newbridge Street to keep Southbound (basically GNE) out of the City X=Centre and reduce congestion
Of course until Pilgrim Street is redeveloped (a long long long time away) nothing will happen as GNE aren't going to want passengers dumped in a dead part of the city as opposed to the horrifically designed Eldon Square
And of course there is the departure charges which Nexus currently charge every time a bus leaves a bus station - They need to be reasonable for a new station or bus companies will still operate around the City Centre.
Do they have departure charges for all bus stations, including smaller ones like Jarrow and Hetton-le-Hole?
RE: Bus Station Designs - Michael - 29 Jun 2013
(29 Jun 2013, 12:38 pm)BJ10VUS wrote(28 Jun 2013, 4:31 pm)citaro5284 wrote(28 Jun 2013, 1:00 pm)gtomlinson wrote I'll have a think about this.
It's more likely (and the plan is) to build a bus station towards Pilgrim Street/Newbridge Street to keep Southbound (basically GNE) out of the City X=Centre and reduce congestion
Of course until Pilgrim Street is redeveloped (a long long long time away) nothing will happen as GNE aren't going to want passengers dumped in a dead part of the city as opposed to the horrifically designed Eldon Square
And of course there is the departure charges which Nexus currently charge every time a bus leaves a bus station - They need to be reasonable for a new station or bus companies will still operate around the City Centre.
Do they have departure charges for all bus stations, including smaller ones like Jarrow and Hetton-le-Hole?
Wait, NEXUS charge the bus companies to use the bus station?, The North East has some of the worst designed bus stations going...
Park Lane, Eldon Square, Haymarket is the worst.
RE: Bus Station Designs - BJ10VUS - 29 Jun 2013
I've actually done some Google searching and managed to find the following. Not how up-to-date the information is, but this is the charge per bus departure.
Eldon Square - 62.7p
Haymarket - 55p
Gateshead - 47p
Park Lane Interchange - 47p
Four Lane Ends - 26p
That's pretty expensive, to be honest. Consider a bus service like the X66 - there's probably about 700 departures per week? This is just guess work...
700 x 47p - £329
£329 x 52 = £17108 per year
RE: Bus Station Designs - Andreos1 - 29 Jun 2013
Now it makes sense bus companies owning their own stations in the past or driving "around" town.
In Sunderland, I wonder how much difference those charges make in relation to the profitability of a Stagecoach service being stable and consistent over a GNE service, which is subject to changes on what seems like an all too regular basis.
RE: Bus Station Designs - BJ10VUS - 29 Jun 2013
(29 Jun 2013, 1:13 pm)Andreos1 wrote Now it makes sense bus companies owning their own stations in the past or driving "around" town.
In Sunderland, I wonder how much difference those charges make in relation to the profitability of a Stagecoach service being stable and consistent over a GNE service, which is subject to changes on what seems like an all too regular basis.
I think it's ridiculous that bus companies are charged to use a bus station. Thinking Go North East and the amount of services that operate through Gateshead Interchange and Park Lane - that must amount to hundreds of thousands of pounds a year. I see why Stagecoach's X34 only serves Gateshead Interchange in one direction!
RE: Bus Station Designs - Andreos1 - 29 Jun 2013
Those charges will be for things like maintenance costs and to pay the leaseholder rent too.
Even if Nexus manage a station, they don't necessarily own it - so any money they do take, will be poured back into the landowners/leaseholders pockets.
I'd imagine the likes of Four Lane Ends and Heworth are owned by Nexus, judging by the infrastructure and facilities - compared to Gateshead or Park Lane, which are possibly just managed by them.
Obviously this doesn't help us passengers, who are likely to feel the burden of these costs in our fares.
RE: Bus Station Designs - Dan - 29 Jun 2013
(29 Jun 2013, 1:03 pm)BJ10VUS wrote I've actually done some Google searching and managed to find the following. Not how up-to-date the information is, but this is the charge per bus departure.
Eldon Square - 62.7p
Haymarket - 55p
Gateshead - 47p
Park Lane Interchange - 47p
Four Lane Ends - 26p
That's pretty expensive, to be honest. Consider a bus service like the X66 - there's probably about 700 departures per week? This is just guess work...
700 x 47p - £329
£329 x 52 = £17108 per year
Crikey, I didn't think that the costs would be so high just for one service!
Here's a question for you all... If a service is secured by Nexus and is operated by say, Go North East... Do Go North East pay for it, or does the tender?
RE: Bus Station Designs - Andreos1 - 29 Jun 2013
I imagine (but maybe wrong) that things such as wages, fuel, bus station fees are all included within the bid as 'operating costs' - with a bit extra added to the bid, counting as profit.
Or
The bid is 'discounted', to take into account the bus station fees. So wages, fuel and profit are calculated, with the bus station fees then deducted.
Unless anyone can come up with the official answer or an alternative.
Edit: Possibly looking like one of these simple forumlae C + F + P = Bid or C + P - F = Bid
* C = Operating costs
* F = Bus station fees
* P = Profit
Some of the bigger operators may take a loss on the fees, depending on the service and discount them from the bid.
RE: Bus Station Designs - Adrian - 29 Jun 2013
(29 Jun 2013, 3:53 pm)Daniel wrote(29 Jun 2013, 1:03 pm)BJ10VUS wrote I've actually done some Google searching and managed to find the following. Not how up-to-date the information is, but this is the charge per bus departure.
Eldon Square - 62.7p
Haymarket - 55p
Gateshead - 47p
Park Lane Interchange - 47p
Four Lane Ends - 26p
That's pretty expensive, to be honest. Consider a bus service like the X66 - there's probably about 700 departures per week? This is just guess work...
700 x 47p - £329
£329 x 52 = £17108 per year
Crikey, I didn't think that the costs would be so high just for one service!
Here's a question for you all... If a service is secured by Nexus and is operated by say, Go North East... Do Go North East pay for it, or does the tender?
Had a search through that Nexus tender contract I uploaded a while ago, and I can't see no reference of it in there. If there's no term in the contract, I'd personally assume that 'business as usual' applies - i.e. the operator pays.
RE: Bus Station Designs - Andreos1 - 29 Jun 2013
It seems there are different methods, depending on location in the country.
Page 5 of this document gives a few different examples of how it would work.
Edit: its not letting me attach the pdf from my phone. If you google 'bus station costs working paper' - you should be able to find the document by the Competition Commission
This is it: http://www.competition-commission.org.uk/
assets/competitioncommission/docs/pdf/inquiry/
ref2010/localbus/pdf/
bus_station_costs_working_paper.pdf
RE: Bus Station Designs - BJ10VUS - 29 Jun 2013
(29 Jun 2013, 3:53 pm)Daniel wrote Crikey, I didn't think that the costs would be so high just for one service!
I know. I dread to think how much it costs for the 'Angel' 21 - using both Gateshead and Eldon Square - not even going in to whether Durham also charges? I'm guessing there's probably about 600 depatures in each direction per week?
62.7p x 600 x 52 = £16952
47p x 600 x 52 = £12788
That makes a total of £29740
then multiplying by 2 for the opposite direction makes a total of £59480! That's like a year's wages for three drivers, or a reasonably new second-hand bus!
RE: Bus Station Designs - cbma06 - 29 Jun 2013
This is why Stagecoach pulled there services out of Park Lane Interchange which the Stagecoach 10/11 to Pennywell got withdrawn first then the rest followed on, its only the Ecomonic buses that are left there.
When Park Lane Interchange first opened, GNE got a good deal as there had there shuttle bus paid for a year and also discounts for each bus that entered into the Interchange as a pay back for moving down to Deptford.
And the reason why Park Lane is a cold and windy place than the warmth of Eldon Square Bus Station is that Sunderland Interchange didn't have any fianicial backing as what Eldon Square has.
The new Sunderland bus station was only built at Park Lane because of the proposed metro station (also because of the fat cats at Civic Centre) otherwise the new bus station was going to be built on Green Terrace through to Crowtree Road at least then it would of been built properly combined in with the Bridges and more centred in the Town Centre.
Wouldnt be long until owners of Bus stations will be installing toll booths for passengers entering and exiting bus stations if there find a way to make more money.
RE: Bus Station Designs - Sland2000 - 01 Jul 2013
(29 Jun 2013, 1:22 pm)BJ10VUS wrote(29 Jun 2013, 1:13 pm)Andreos1 wrote Now it makes sense bus companies owning their own stations in the past or driving "around" town.
In Sunderland, I wonder how much difference those charges make in relation to the profitability of a Stagecoach service being stable and consistent over a GNE service, which is subject to changes on what seems like an all too regular basis.
I think it's ridiculous that bus companies are charged to use a bus station. Thinking Go North East and the amount of services that operate through Gateshead Interchange and Park Lane - that must amount to hundreds of thousands of pounds a year. I see why Stagecoach's X34 only serves Gateshead Interchange in one direction!
Unsure why it is ridiculous. Bus companies are private companies so they can't have it all ways. They should pay for the upkeep of these bus stations. It's a shame Stagecoach pulled out of using the bus station. The council/nexus provide new facilities which stagecoach chose to pull out of saving themselves money. It is supposed to be an interchange and coming off the metro to a stagecoach bus means an inconvenient walk. So much for thinking about the customer!
RE: Bus Station Designs - CatsFast101 - 01 Jul 2013
Will all interchanges charge for departures? So like Hetton or Seaham? Peterlee Bus Station or Hartlepool Interchange? Or is it just large bus station? I mean things like Peterlee will probably still need a bit maintenance especially Peterlee with there auto senor doors.
Re: RE: Bus Station Designs - MrFozz - 13 Aug 2013
(01 Jul 2013, 10:24 am)CatsFast101 wrote Will all interchanges charge for departures? So like Hetton or Seaham? Peterlee Bus Station or Hartlepool Interchange? Or is it just large bus station? I mean things like Peterlee will probably still need a bit maintenance especially Peterlee with there auto senor doors.
Is Seaham really an Interchange, it is 3/4 bus stops on a Street with another 10 yards away over the road, I would always have defined the word Interchange as a place to Interchange between other forms of transport i.e. Gateshead or Park Lane.
RE: Bus Station Designs - Malarkey - 08 Dec 2013
Whilst I was in Newcastle on Friday Morning, I decided to sit down on one of the Benches on the Green next to the Eldon Square before going into one of the offices on the Green for an Interview. And thought to myself about having a New Bus Station to Replace the Dreadfully Designed Current Eldon Square Bus Station.
So here is my Idea
[attachment=5059]
Basically what happen is Office Block which is Joint Greggs and the Newsagents on the Green would be Demolished, Then the bit across the road for the Green where Poundland is situated would also be Demolished upto where Walkway for Sports Direct is, to make the Area Bigger.
As a Result the Entrance just Inside Eldon Square for Monument Metro would be sealed off, Meaning Metro Passenger would have to use the Entrances Next to Fenicks and Waterstones opposite the Monument, These Entrances are Marked in Blue on the Map.
Also the Following Businesses from I can remember off top of my head would have to Relocate, The Current Eldon Square Bus Station could be a Possibillity for an Area for those Shops to move to which include:
Pizza Hut Express
American Candy Shop
New Look
Vision Express
Poundland
Gadget Store
Greggs
Newsagents
Shake a Holic
As for the Office Block situated on the Green I thought they could be situated on top of the Shops if they were to move into the Current Bus Station, Much like the Student Accomodation Flats, which are Built on top of the new Tesco in Gateshead.
The New Bus Station would Accommodate the Services which already Serve Eldon Square and Stagecoach Services which Serve The Green along with Megabus Services if there is Room.
RE: Bus Station Designs - Malarkey - 24 Oct 2014
Does anyone think there should be Modifications made to Sunderland Park Lane Interchange, if so what would like to see done?
Here is a few I have thought of.
- Pedestrianize the Current Stockton Road/Mary Street Entrance/Exit to Park Lane and have the Entrance/Exit on the Main Stretch of Stockton Road alongside the Current Entrance to where the 42 and 60 etc Stop, This would therefore result in Traffic Lights having to be re-positioned, it would also prevent Serious Accidents such as Pedestrians been knocked over by a Bus, This Afternoon alone I witnessed 3 close shaves in the space of 20 Minutes.
- Modifications to both sets of Layovers and Stands as Buses seem to have Difficulty getting past if there Buses on Both the Layover and the Stands at the same time, *Cough* Particularly on the Centre Piece where the 56/X36/29 and 700 all Stop.
- Widening of the Road next to where the 2A/2C/8/39/73 and 78 Stop, Often gets congested due the poor Alignment of Vehicles on those Stands, Particulary the 39/SA Stand.
- Male/Female and Disabled Toilets Refurbished so that are more Public Friendly and are Properly Maintained as they are Rank, surprised no one has been Raped or something in there with those horrid Blue Lights.
RE: Bus Station Designs - Tom - 24 Oct 2014
(24 Oct 2014, 3:32 pm)NEBCD Malarkey wrote Does anyone think there should be Modifications made to Sunderland Park Lane Interchange, if so what would like to see done?
Here is a few I have thought of.
- Pedestrianize the Current Stockton Road/Mary Street Entrance/Exit to Park Lane and have the Entrance/Exit on the Main Stretch of Stockton Road alongside the Current Entrance to where the 42 and 60 etc Stop, This would therefore result in Traffic Lights having to be re-positioned, it would also prevent Serious Accidents such as Pedestrians been knocked over by a Bus, This Afternoon alone I witnessed 3 close shaves in the space of 20 Minutes.
- Modifications to both sets of Layovers and Stands as Buses seem to have Difficulty getting past if there Buses on Both the Layover and the Stands at the same time, *Cough* Particularly on the Centre Piece where the 56/X36/29 and 700 all Stop.
- Widening of the Road next to where the 2A/2C/8/39/73 and 78 Stop, Often gets congested due the poor Alignment of Vehicles on those Stands, Particulary the 39/SA Stand.
- Male/Female and Disabled Toilets Refurbished so that are more Public Friendly and are Properly Maintained as they are Rank, surprised no one has been Raped or something in there with those horrid Blue Lights.
Completely agree, those toilets are vile. I don't use them and generally go to Debenhams or somewhere if I need to use the toilet.
RE: Bus Station Designs - Malarkey - 24 Oct 2014
(24 Oct 2014, 3:34 pm)Tom wrote Completely agree, those toilets are vile. I don't use them and generally go to Debenhams or somewhere if I need to use the toilet.
I would rather Risk Shitting Myself whilst walking to Debenhams or The Bridges to use the Toilets there, than use the Toilets in Park Lane.
RE: Bus Station Designs - Andreos1 - 24 Oct 2014
(24 Oct 2014, 3:52 pm)NEBCD Malarkey wrote I would rather Risk Shitting Myself whilst walking to Debenhams or The Bridges to use the Toilets there, than use the Toilets in Park Lane.
Speaking of toilets, have you returned to Eldon Square toilets recently or are you still scarred from getting locked in that time?
As for modifications, I have wondered about using the part of Park Lane dedicated to taxis for some services.
As it stands, the road layout isn't wide enough to allow the vehicles to turn, but with the purchase of land on the site of Food Giant (no idea whether this would be possible), the road could be widened.
It would also allow the utilisation of the space which is used very rarely behind the kiosk (https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@54.9027128,-1.3842122,3a,90y,252.28h,76.72t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sMhJKNolDG4v2Zn2OgmtfVg!2e0).
The services using these stands, would create additional space within the main interchange and would reduce some of the bunching, crowding and delays that take place currently.
RE: Bus Station Designs - Malarkey - 24 Oct 2014
(24 Oct 2014, 4:18 pm)Andreos1 wrote Speaking of toilets, have you returned to Eldon Square toilets recently or are you still scarred from getting locked in that time?
I have used them on several occasions, just not the ones down by the Apple Store where I ended up locked inside for 10-15 Minutes before booting the Door off the Hinges.
RE: Bus Station Designs - MurdnunoC - 24 Oct 2014
I preferred the design of the old Park Lane. Buses seemed to move about more freely without the problems encountered today. However, I do appreciate it was open to all the elements.
Re: RE: Bus Station Designs - MrFozz - 11 Nov 2014
(24 Oct 2014, 3:52 pm)NEBCD Malarkey wrote I would rather Risk Shitting Myself whilst walking to Debenhams or The Bridges to use the Toilets there, than use the Toilets in Park Lane.I nearly did shit myself a while back when I had a case of the Russian Revolutions, I barely made it to Ladbrokes at the top of Blandford Street
RE: Bus Station Designs - Adrian - 07 Jan 2015
So following on from Memories of the 183 in the Metrocentre bus station, can anyone remember what was the old Eldon Square bus station? Anyone got any fond memories (or stories!) of it?
http://newcastlephotos.blogspot.co.uk/2009/05/eldon-square-bus-concourse.html
RE: Bus Station Designs - MurdnunoC - 07 Jan 2015
Loved the old concourse too.
My bus-stop moved from the side where Boots was located (outside of the Newsagents and Flower Shop - I want to say Stand J but I'm probably wrong) to the other side outside of Bainbridges.
There was a cheap cafe located on that side too.
RE: Bus Station Designs - Andreos1 - 07 Jan 2015
The skanky pub.
Had a door off the green and a door off the bus station.
Also, the access up to the middle of Eldon Square. Off the bus, up the stairs and in the shops within seconds.