(07 Feb 2014, 6:01 pm)citaro5284 wrote Looks like they want to give it a bit of an uplift.....

http://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/north-east-news/5millon-could-allocated-revamping-durham-6682720

(07 Feb 2014, 6:06 pm)gtom wrote Doesn't help it opens up onto North Road which is the arse end carbuncle of a beautiful city like Durham (well that and the IPS Offices)

(07 Feb 2014, 7:13 pm)CatsFast101 wrote This is an a step in the right direction, tbh I'd like to see a new bus station completely for Durham as the current area is just awful. Once inside it feels a bit run down, but outside from North Road it looks terrible.
On the subject of a possible new bus station there's not really many sites for a new one is there.

(07 Feb 2014, 7:17 pm)aureolin wrote Will be in the same location I would have thought, but if they demolished the empty shops and offices joined to it, there'd be a lot more space to work with.

(08 Feb 2014, 12:07 am)gtom wrote Imagine this will involve compulsory purchase orders? Potentially costly!

(08 Feb 2014, 7:38 am)aureolin wrote My understanding is that they already own the freehold.

(16 Mar 2014, 12:52 pm)palatine3833 wrote Work on the new bus station in Durham is expected to start soon, expected to take 18 months to complete. I can only but imagine the utter chaos that's going to be caused.

(16 Mar 2014, 1:25 pm)aureolin wrote Any plans of it anywhere? I'd assume services would use a mixture of Sutton Street, and then North Road/Millburngate as a temporary measure. Still be utter chaos as you say though.

(16 Mar 2014, 1:34 pm)Andreos Constantopolous wrote Beat me to it!
Was just about to say the same thing - maybe adding that a couple of stands in the bus station are taken out at a time for work, rather than shut the whole place down completely (if only to aid the surrounding area).

(16 Mar 2014, 2:15 pm)cbma06 wrote Cant find anything about proposed applications for anything to do with Durham Bus Station on County Durham Planning Applications?.

(16 Mar 2014, 2:27 pm)Andreos Constantopolous wrote The only thing I can find (apart from newspaper reports from the budget meeting), is this: http://www.cyclescape.org/issues/957-durham-bus-station-redevelopment

(16 Mar 2014, 3:17 pm)cbma06 wrote The County Durham Plan has been ongoing for a few years but nothing concrete at present its mostly up in the air with chit chat, it states that the Durham bus station will be relocated, but where could it go?

Cant see nothing happening with Durham bus station for at least years to come. Just wish Sunderland Interchange got blown away at least then their would try and build the bus station with so called bricks and maybe a Middlesbrough design bus station instead.

(16 Mar 2014, 3:25 pm)Kuyoyo wrote Funny, I rank Park Lane along with Middlesbrough and Gateshead as one of the better laid-out Bus Stations in the North East. Admittedly it could do with being enclosed but then the same could be said about Bishop Auckland 'Bus Station'.

(16 Mar 2014, 3:25 pm)Kuyoyo wrote Funny, I rank Park Lane along with Middlesbrough and Gateshead as one of the better laid-out Bus Stations in the North East. Admittedly it could do with being enclosed but then the same could be said about Bishop Auckland 'Bus Station'.

(16 Mar 2014, 3:48 pm)Dan wrote The main problem is with multiple buses trying to use the same stands at the same time. Granted; operators could make an effort to rectify this issue, and sometimes things happen which truly are unpredictable, but Park Lane is far from perfect.

To make the following anecdote a little clearer, do refer to this map throughout.
An example of this was demonstrated on Friday night at 16:00. Three Houghton-bound "Laser" 35s came into Park Lane together, causing chaos. One occupied the correct stand (L), with another occupying Stand M. Luckily, the "Fast Cats" X35 which should have been sat on Stand M in preparation for the 16:05 departure was still laying over. A "Prince Bishops" 20 was already pulled into Stand N (its correct stand), so the final "Laser" 35 in the trio had to wait behind the crossing until one of the vehicles had pulled out of Stands L/M. In turn, the E2 which was trying to depart from Stand P couldn't - the following Economic service was already trying to pull in front of the Shields-bound "Laser" 35 I was on, and another Shields-bound "Laser" 35 was stuck next to Stand R - jamming in the President which was operating the 16:04 #9 departure from that stand.
It was truly chaotic for that two or three minute period - of course the lettering of services on "Laser" 35 confused things even more. Some passengers wanted to get on one bus, while others wanted to get on another. Some thought, "I'm going to wait here for the next 35 which won't be as packed"...

A similar example of this happened at about 8am earlier this week. Three 56s (two branded and a red one) occupied Stands S, T and V. Drivers of the "Lime" and "Silver Arrows" often drop off at those stands if they have a good amount of layover (especially the former) which allows other drivers to get past Stands K and J with greater ease. There was also the usual service departures from those stands which were affected and ended up sitting behind Stand V, blocking Stands L-R in the process.

As well as the issue of it being immensely cold, there's also the issue of an accident occurring at the entrance/exit of Park Lane. If one thing blocks that part of Park Lane, you're guaranteed chaos for at least an hour. Perfect example of this happening around this time last year:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/danielgrahamm/8693086409/in/photostream/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/danielgrahamm/8694201902/in/photostream/
Doesn't happen often, but enough to prove that Park Lane really isn't suitable.

(16 Mar 2014, 3:57 pm)Kuyoyo wrote If you're using that as a 'issue', then it's applied to every bus station in the area with the exception of Hartlepool Interchange (only because it's only used once an hour by one bus service) and Wallsend Bus Station. You can't get more than one bus on stands in Middlesbrough and, as witnessed by the accident on Monday, there's also the issue of the bus station getting blocked if buses end up blocked onto the stands. Same happens at Gateshead, well know for a queue to built up for Stand H as there always seems to be a timing clash with the X9 or X10 a 56 a 57 and the X25. Middlesbrough Bus Station also has the problem that the roundabout at the entrance/exit can cause major problems if the queue to exit.

For 'lay-out', I was more referring to the fact it has two separate parts unlike Eldon Square plus there's very little of the 'saw tooth' bays there (and of what there are of those bays, they have plenty of room to reverse unlike Durham, Eldon Square and Haymarket).

(16 Mar 2014, 4:04 pm)Dan wrote That's exactly what the problem is. Bus stations should be designed with these things in mind, but in my opinion, they haven't been.

Stands A-G at Park Lane probably work a lot better than Stands H-V as there appears to be a lot less issues. Breakdowns/vehicle issues have been known to occur on Stands A-G too mind, but drivers have in the past been able to work around it (I recall when 4920 had problems with changing from reverse to drive, an Arriva bus just decided to cut over the layover bays to get to its usual stand).

Durham, Eldon Square and Haymarket are far too compact. When you compare the sizes of those bus stations compared to the 'better' bus stations you gave as examples, is it any wonder that those are far superior?

(16 Mar 2014, 4:12 pm)Kuyoyo wrote But how can you design bus stations for occasional 'issues' like late buses? The simple matter is you can't.

(16 Mar 2014, 4:12 pm)Kuyoyo wrote But how can you design bus stations for occasional 'issues' like late buses? The simple matter is you can't.

The issue with Middlesbrough is the fact some drivers (for all companies not just one) seem only to be able to try using Stand 11 (the one slap bang in the middle of the horseshoe) to set down (it is the official set-down stand) however when you've got buses turning up all the time, there's plenty more stands to be used. The only other problem is the doors - the 'In' and 'Out' way doesn't work in my mind and all stands (bar stand 1/2/20/21 as those bring issues) should have been done with one set of double doors as on Stand 11. Although the key problem is the fact the refurbishment was done on the cheap (hence the reason it was completed 2 weeks earlier than originally forecast and the door issues were there on the first day).

(16 Mar 2014, 4:18 pm)aureolin wrote I'd hardly say that late buses are an occasional issue. Maybe they're not 'late' in the operator's definition of the word (up to 5 minutes late), but when you've got, in some cases, three buses due to depart the same stand in the space of 5 minutes, then it's a persistent problem.

(16 Mar 2014, 4:24 pm)Kuyoyo wrote The general rule for most bus stations is that there must be a 5 minutes gap between services off stands for companies (hence why one trip of Stagecoach on Teesside's 13 service goes off stand 19 in Middlesbrough during the week as there's a Hartlepool service 1 timed to leave the normal stand (20) at the same time).

And there lies another problem that could be mentioned about Park Lane but not Gateshead and Middlesbrough - there's little layover space there compared to Gateshead and a lot less than in Middlesbrough. Not uncommon for buses in Middlesbrough to sit in the layover bays while waiting for their stand to clear and that includes (the very limited) number of services that don't terminate there (which is now down to just 4 Stagecoach services and no Arriva services).

(16 Mar 2014, 4:23 pm)Dan wrote Why can't you? Late running buses is not an 'occasional' thing, it's a daily occurrence. Buses using the wrong stands is a daily occurrence (I'd go as far to suggest it happens every hour each day) - again, this could be prevented by operators choosing which stands to have buses serve on the basis of when they're actually going to be there, but it's a problem nevertheless.
The design of the perfect bus station would factor the daily issues into plans - things like the issue with the blockage of the entrance/exit owing to an accident is going to be factored into the decision less because that truly is an occasional thing.
Granted, this will inflict a greater cost - but you'd be providing minimal disruption to customers and hopefully things would operate with greater ease. As a customer, I hate it when my bus driver can't get to the right stand and I have to panic that the driver isn't actually going to stop to let me on when he does eventually get to my stand as he expected me to walk over to the bus itself.

Yes, I hate the in/out door system at Middlesbrough too. As an occasional visitor, I've never understood it. I hate that I'm forced to use specified entrances/exits - I'd prefer to navigate around the station at my own will, providing it is safe to do so.