Genuinely can't wait to have the 21 running round Brandon, its been along time coming and from someone who has been complaining to Arriva on a weekly basis about the minibusses (tin cans) they put on the 49 it's a welcome improvement.

(17 Aug 2021, 9:34 pm)DeltaMan wrote I am sure nobody could accuse Reading Buses of being held hostage by shareholders, corporate higher ups or running cap in hand to the council for money (imagine that...)

And yet MG made some hefty cuts to services around an area called Caversham towards the end of his time down there, including whole Sunday services being ditched. With no shareholders to worry about, I wonder why those changes were made? Do you think it may be the same reason the changes up north are being made?

Didn't MG state that those services to Caversham were going to be split in to a mixture of growth and cost saving measures?
Rather than continue to market and look to grow the services. 
https://www.inyourarea.co.uk/news/people...aled-back/
Indeed, they even started encouraging punters in parts of the area to use the TT services that pass through on their way to/from Oxford. 

About a year later, further changes were made due to traffic issues. 
https://twitter.com/MartijnGNE/status/96...53056?s=19 
I wonder if it was the good folk of Caversham and the public transport not taking them to/from where they needed to be?
I'm thinking Kennet Island and towards the M4, with the vast numbers of employers around there and where it is easier to drive in from one side of the river and out of Reading on the other, than it is changing buses in the town centre.

Just saw this on twitter is there any truth https://twitter.com/piggypics/status/142...48996?s=20

Doesn't appear to have gone down well in North Durham: https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/nor...s-21335376

(18 Aug 2021, 9:29 am)Andreos1 wrote Didn't MG state that those services to Caversham were going to be split in to a mixture of growth and cost saving measures?
Rather than continue to market and look to grow the services. 
https://www.inyourarea.co.uk/news/people...aled-back/
Indeed, they even started encouraging punters in parts of the area to use the TT services that pass through on their way to/from Oxford. 

About a year later, further changes were made due to traffic issues. 
https://twitter.com/MartijnGNE/status/96...53056?s=19 
I wonder if it was the good folk of Caversham and the public transport not taking them to/from where they needed to be?
I'm thinking Kennet Island and towards the M4, with the vast numbers of employers around there and where it is easier to drive in from one side of the river and out of Reading on the other, than it is changing buses in the town centre.

Do buses take people where they want to go?
Yes

Do buses take everybody where they want to go?
No

Why not?
There isn't enough resource available to do that. 
If I'm running a bus service and I am seeing 1 or 2% drop in passenger numbers each year and making a modest profit, yes I am thinking how I am going to get that back, but I cannot forget about my EXISTING customers - which still make up the bulk of my passengers. If I do a huge change in an attempt to get back some of that 2% or even get new customers then I am undoubtedly going to upset my existing customers, which means I could lose even more.

I actually think these GNE changes are pretty risky with that in mind.

(18 Aug 2021, 5:58 pm)Adrian wrote Doesn't appear to have gone down well in North Durham: https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/nor...s-21335376

The resident in the article does have a point above losing a direct service to the Roseberry Primary School however she could walk 9 Minutes to the stop on Burnthouse Bank as I am assuming they live on Glenside Terrace Estate given there is no other housing on Pelton Fell, she could then get the 703 to the School at 08:20 and be at the School at 08:23.

I would say the 703 is a good candidate to replace the 28/28A between Chester-Le-Street and Newfied but I would say route amendment would be needed so rather than it going up Burnthouse Bank and doing an Anti-Clockwise loop of Bernard Terrace, Church Road and North View before heading back to Chester. I would have it do a Clockwise Loop of Glenside Terrace Estate, Grange Villa (Pelton Lane) up to Newfield for the School and then Church Road, Bernard Terrace to Burnhouse Bank which would mean ommiting Church Road as a solution for this residents complaint whilst also increasing frequency to Every 30 Minutes given the 703 runs Hourly.

Or alternatively as Go North East feel the 28/28A is unviable in their current form then replace them by extending Service 82 from Birtley to Chester-Le-Street via Beamish opening up some new local links whilst also merging it with a more sustainable service whilst maintaining existing frequency and links for the local residents.

(18 Aug 2021, 6:45 pm)Malarkey wrote The resident in the article does have a point above losing a direct service to the Roseberry Primary School however she could walk 9 Minutes to the stop on Burnthouse Bank as I am assuming they live on Glenside Terrace Estate given there is no other housing on Pelton Fell, she could then get the 703 to the School at 08:20 and be at the School at 08:23.

I would say the 703 is a good candidate to replace the 28/28A between Chester-Le-Street and Newfied but I would say route amendment would be needed so rather than it going up Burnthouse Bank and doing an Anti-Clockwise loop of Bernard Terrace, Church Road and North View before heading back to Chester. I would have it do a Clockwise Loop of Glenside Terrace Estate, Grange Villa (Pelton Lane) up to Newfield for the School and then Church Road, Bernard Terrace to Burnhouse Bank which would mean ommiting Church Road as a solution for this residents complaint whilst also increasing frequency to Every 30 Minutes given the 703 runs Hourly.

Or alternatively as Go North East feel the 28/28A is unviable in their current form then replace them by extending Service 82 from Birtley to Chester-Le-Street via Beamish opening up some new local links whilst also merging it with a more sustainable service whilst maintaining existing frequency and links for the local residents.

I definitely think that 82 idea is a good idea.

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Why didn't they just name the 41A the 40 or the 42?

(18 Aug 2021, 5:27 pm)Keeiajs wrote Just saw this on twitter is there any truth https://twitter.com/piggypics/status/142...48996?s=20

Surely not? 10 year old buses on the Angel? That would be as stupid as the Omnicities on the 21 era

(18 Aug 2021, 7:15 pm)Ambassador wrote Surely not? 10 year old buses on the Angel? That would be as stupid as the Omnicities on the 21 era

Well I mean GNE will happy put 3 omniDekka's on XLINES X21. And I mean if I am honest I wouldn't put it past GNE however my first thought was where are they going to go....20? 4 for X21.

(18 Aug 2021, 7:15 pm)Ambassador wrote Surely not? 10 year old buses on the Angel? That would be as stupid as the Omnicities on the 21 era

The geezer seems to have an issue with a vehicle upgrade on the X66 too. The B7s are more comfortable, more powerful, more spacious, and probably more reliable than the Streetlites they replace - yet he'd seem to prefer the significantly inferior vehicle because they're a couple of years younger?

(18 Aug 2021, 7:15 pm)Ambassador wrote Surely not? 10 year old buses on the Angel? That would be as stupid as the Omnicities on the 21 era

I doubt it considering the EV bid! Yes, perhaps as a 'temporary' measure until new EV's arrive if bid is successful but not a long term solution.

Would be interesting to see what happens with the Cobalt & Coast B9TLs if the Coast Road EV bid is also successful. Their interiors would allow for an easy cascade to another op-co (no interior or trim GNE branding other than glass on the stairs).

(18 Aug 2021, 6:45 pm)Malarkey wrote The resident in the article does have a point above losing a direct service to the Roseberry Primary School however she could walk 9 Minutes to the stop on Burnthouse Bank as I am assuming they live on Glenside Terrace Estate given there is no other housing on Pelton Fell, she could then get the 703 to the School at 08:20 and be at the School at 08:23.

I would say the 703 is a good candidate to replace the 28/28A between Chester-Le-Street and Newfied but I would say route amendment would be needed so rather than it going up Burnthouse Bank and doing an Anti-Clockwise loop of Bernard Terrace, Church Road and North View before heading back to Chester. I would have it do a Clockwise Loop of Glenside Terrace Estate, Grange Villa (Pelton Lane) up to Newfield for the School and then Church Road, Bernard Terrace to Burnhouse Bank which would mean ommiting Church Road as a solution for this residents complaint whilst also increasing frequency to Every 30 Minutes given the 703 runs Hourly.

Or alternatively as Go North East feel the 28/28A is unviable in their current form then replace them by extending Service 82 from Birtley to Chester-Le-Street via Beamish opening up some new local links whilst also merging it with a more sustainable service whilst maintaining existing frequency and links for the local residents.

How many people know about the 703 though? And how long would she have to wait at the school to make the return journey? I'm presuming around 50-55 minutes allowing for 5-10 minutes to see her children through the school doors safely.

(18 Aug 2021, 7:29 pm)MurdnunoC wrote How many people know about the 703 though? And how long would she have to wait at the school to make the return journey? I'm presuming around 50-55 minutes allowing for 5-10 minutes to see her children through the school doors safely.

I'd imagine the small minority of elderly passengers at Newfield would be aware of it otherwise not many as it's not a publicised route and you're bang on for the wait time coming back however it would take 20 minutes to walk back according to Google Maps.

(18 Aug 2021, 6:18 pm)DeltaMan wrote Do buses take people where they want to go?
Yes

Do buses take everybody where they want to go?
No

Why not?
There isn't enough resource available to do that. 
If I'm running a bus service and I am seeing 1 or 2% drop in passenger numbers each year and making a modest profit, yes I am thinking how I am going to get that back, but I cannot forget about my EXISTING customers - which still make up the bulk of my passengers. If I do a huge change in an attempt to get back some of that 2% or even get new customers then I am undoubtedly going to upset my existing customers, which means I could lose even more.

I actually think these GNE changes are pretty risky with that in mind.

Is that the case though?
I've mentioned the impact the 71 has on the 21 in the past.
Another poster mentioned something similar recently.
Axeing a 21a and introducing a 71, to link in to the 21 - but then reducing early morning runs on the 71, isn't thinking of the bigger picture with the 21 nor the 2% of passengers who used the 21a.
To then look at culling the 71 altogether, doesn't think of the bigger picture with the 21 nor those 2% who need to connect to the 21.

Using your logic, of that 2% and applying to GNE commercial decisions... Well, I think it says it all. Don't you?
It's those existing customers you mention.

(18 Aug 2021, 6:52 pm)Keeiajs wrote I definitely think that 82 idea is a good idea.

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Why didn't they just name the 41A the 40 or the 42?

I said that,minus the 42 bit as there is already a 42

(18 Aug 2021, 10:12 pm)V514DFT wrote I said that,minus the 42 bit as there is already a 42

Oh yeah I forogt.

(17 Aug 2021, 6:23 pm)Andreos1 wrote Do those services take residents to the places they need to be?
I'm thinking work, pleasure and education and of my limited knowledge of up that way - I'd say, probably not.
Despite all those bus lanes heading down the Great North Road and in to the town, I reckon a big percentage will be heading off somewhere else that doesn't involve driving through Gosforth.

(17 Aug 2021, 8:05 pm)Andreos1 wrote I'm thinking the Quorums, Great Parks, Cobalts and Silverlinks of the world.
Appreciate there's Cramlington Town centre nearby, there's the mainline links and the new hospital too (not familiar with the schools).

You mention changing at the Regent Centre for a variety of other places. Would that be viable for a daily commute and/or getting little Jonny to school? 

Car vs public transport and its proximity to the A1, A189 and A19, indicate to me that there's one immediate winner and unless ANE step it up (offering a viable alternative), I can't see much changing.
Particularly with all of the major supermarkets offering online delivery. Can't see that estate being made up of the bread and milk brigade.

Sorry I'd missed these yesterday. 

I'd say they take people to most places they could realistically need to go within the NE either directly, or within one change at pretty large interchanges (either Regent Centre or Haymarket). There are direct buses to the following places within SE Northumberland: Ashington, Bedlington, Bedlington Station, Blyth, Cramlington, Guide Post, Gosforth, Newbiggin, Newcastle. One change at Regent Centre/Haymarket opens up the entire Metro network, direct buses to Quorum, Cobalt, Great Park, Silverlink, Whitley Bay, Tynemouth, Gateshead etc. 

I'd also say it's unlikely that a family living in an estate on the outskirts of Cramlington would be sending their kids to school too far afield? It's likely to be in Cramlington if we're honest - and CLV is easily within walking distance of the X9 route. 

In terms of direct buses to the places you've mentioned, I've got a suggestion for at least one of them but I'll post that at some point tomorrow when I'm a bit more awake!

(18 Aug 2021, 7:15 pm)Ambassador wrote Surely not? 10 year old buses on the Angel? That would be as stupid as the Omnicities on the 21 era

10 year old battery buses at that.  Be a brave operator that would take that on!

Is there space at Chester for the associated infrastructure to support the 21 going electric?

(19 Aug 2021, 12:25 pm)Chris 1 wrote 10 year old battery buses at that.  Be a brave operator that would take that on!

Is there space at Chester for the associated infrastructure to support the 21 going electric?

Tbh I don't really think any depot has extra space or space to expand bar Riverside & Hownsgill. 

Deptford Definitely doesn't, Peterlee erm...., Percy Main no, Chester-Le-Street No, Washington no. GNE need bigger depots.

I was thinking more space for the charging infrastructure, rather than expanding.

One would assume given the paint is still wet at Howsgill, the majority of the infrastructure is in place and just needs connecting when the time comes?

(19 Aug 2021, 1:14 pm)Keeiajs wrote Tbh I don't really think any depot has extra space or space to expand bar Riverside & Hownsgill. 

Deptford Definitely doesn't, Peterlee erm...., Percy Main no, Chester-Le-Street No, Washington no. GNE need bigger depots.

Deptford has space to extend , when new there was an option to extend at the rear and now there’s land next to on the side at the new junction, could easily put Washington and Peterlee operations from deptford


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(19 Aug 2021, 1:43 pm)cbma06 wrote Deptford has space to extend , when new there was an option to extend at the rear and now there’s land next to on the side at the new junction, could easily put Washington and Peterlee operations from deptford


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Ah I thought that space was taken.

You could feasibly run the short 21's from Riverside and use that infrastructure if needed

I don't know how many people would like this idea however I saw some old buses on Flickr and it said "Drifter 62" so I was thinking It would be nice to see like
Drifter 60 [Sunderland - Parkside] (Blue - Red Back) Streetlites
Drifter 61 [Sunderland - Murton](Green - Red Back) Mercedes
Drifter 62 [Peterlee - Sunderland] (Purple - Red Back) Solos
Drifter 65 [Seaham-Durham] (Orange - Red Back) Versa's

(19 Aug 2021, 4:19 pm)Keeiajs wrote Drifter Drifter 60 [Sunderland - Parkside] (Blue - Red Back) Streetlites

Drifter Drifter 60 seems like a bit of a mouthful.

How about just 'Drifter 60' or, better still, just '60'?

(19 Aug 2021, 4:19 pm)Keeiajs wrote I don't know how many people would like this idea however I saw some old buses on Flickr and it said "Drifter 62" so I was thinking It would be nice to see like Drifter Drifter 60 [Sunderland - Parkside] (Blue - Red Back) Streetlites
Drifter 61 [Sunderland - Murton](Green - Red Back) Mercedes
Drifter 62 [Peterlee - Sunderland] (Purple - Red Back) Solos
Drifter 65 [Seaham-Durham] (Orange - Red Back) Versa's

I’m sure I read somewhere that the 62 will be operated by bigger buses than what’s used on the 208 at present, but the 62A will still be operated by a solo, I’m thinking 09 versas either on the 62 or 65 or both?


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(19 Aug 2021, 7:04 pm)cbma06 wrote I’m sure I read somewhere that the 62 will be operated by bigger buses than what’s used on the 208 at present, but the 62A will still be operated by a solo, I’m thinking 09 versas either on the 62 or 65 or both?


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The 65 is the only one being upgraded in capacity.


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(19 Aug 2021, 7:04 pm)cbma06 wrote I’m sure I read somewhere that the 62 will be operated by bigger buses than what’s used on the 208 at present, but the 62A will still be operated by a solo, I’m thinking 09 versas either on the 62 or 65 or both?


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I do think the 62 will get bigger capacity eventually as surprising the 62 is faster to Sunderland than the 60. From Dawdon/Seaham.

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(19 Aug 2021, 6:40 pm)MurdnunoC wrote Drifter Drifter 60 seems like a bit of a mouthful.

How about just 'Drifter 60' or, better still, just '60'?

Sorry I missed that dulipate.

Am I the only one that doesn't really like the 'Drifter' brand?

Surely there are negative connotations with a drifter being "a person who is continually moving from place to place, without any fixed home or job", implying to me that it's an unreliable service that doesn't run to a timetable

(18 Aug 2021, 5:27 pm)Keeiajs wrote Just saw this on twitter is there any truth https://twitter.com/piggypics/status/142...48996?s=20

Martjin has confirmed and I quote "Nope, that’s utter nonsense and not happening!"