(29 Jun 2022, 7:22 am)ALavery wrote I think they could definitely have made something really cool out of the new livery on the 56. Also im not sure if its been discussed already but how come the 56 and 60 just stayed the 56 and 60?Perhaps because the N21 goes to the University, and a different starting point in Newcastle, whereas with the 56 and 60, they just extended the timetable overnight, ergo no real need to change the number.
(29 Jun 2022, 7:22 am)ALavery wrote I think they could definitely have made something really cool out of the new livery on the 56. Also im not sure if its been discussed already but how come the 56 and 60 just stayed the 56 and 60?No idea and to be honest, I'm not sure even the most optimistic members in here ever thought they would work.
(29 Jun 2022, 2:04 pm)Andreos1 wrote No idea and to be honest, I'm not sure even the most optimistic members in here ever thought they would work.
It needed to be a variation of both routes imo. Someone living in Seaham and working at Nissan could be at work within 10mins via the A19 - whether that's driving or using some sort of car share.
Two buses via the world ahead or at the end of a long shift, can't even begin to compete. Regardless of the branding or promotion attached to its livery.
(29 Jun 2022, 5:03 pm)omnicity4659 wrote Night buses need looking at as a whole across the region... I'm sure that I've said it before, but bus operators struggle to meet the needs of those who travel late at night on Fridays and Saturdays, with roads heading out of the city almost as busy as during the day up until 2-3am, so what chance have they got at getting it right every other night?
I'm regularly driving around at night and there is some demand from looking at the numbers of cars and taxis on the road, not just for buses but for the likes of Metro too.
(29 Jun 2022, 4:35 pm)deanmachine wrote Why? The 56 gets a good load over it's whole route over night, hence why it's still running mostly come the changes, seems to work.Aye, but they thought the 60 would work on a night.
(29 Jun 2022, 6:10 pm)Andreos1 wrote Aye, but they thought the 60 would work on a night.I'm suprised they havent tried a night bus 10, 27 or X1, espically the 27 seen as theres no night metros.
It was never going to work based on the route it takes and the places it goes to/goes through.
If there's enough people to make a bus from Seaham to Nissan work, then it needs to be as quick or there abouts as a car.
Whatever the N56 does right, isn't because of its marketing Its because of the route its taken since its 187/188 days and the fact Nissan was built where it was.
(29 Jun 2022, 6:19 pm)ASX_Terranova wrote I'm suprised they havent tried a night bus 10, 27 or X1, espically the 27 seen as theres no night metros.Where would the demand for those routes come from? Apart from the nighttime economy in Newcastle, they wouldn't pass by any major employers who have a 24hr operation - like Nissan or Amazon.
(29 Jun 2022, 7:07 pm)Andreos1 wrote Where would the demand for those routes come from? Apart from the nighttime economy in Newcastle, they wouldn't pass by any major employers who have a 24hr operation - like Nissan or Amazon.Honestly I think you have 3 amazing ideas here.
It's telling that those sites are all near main roads (to aid distribution of goods) and it's also telling that public transport operators don't use the same road networks to help aid the workforce.
If there's a nighttime network that's going to work, operators need to think outside the box and maybe even offer something which is different to the daytime network.
Whilst a Seaham - Sunderland via Ryhope Road works during the day - a variation of that route in peaks or on a night would offer so much more.
60X: A morning and evening peak version of the 60 via the A19 and Doxford International in to Sunderland.
60N: Night time version via Nissan and Follingsby to Newcastle would offer so much more than what we see now and would could play a part in making a 24hr network successful.
Couple that with say a 27X and 27N between Shields and Newcastle via Monkton Business Park and/or Boldon Business Park, Nissan and/or Amazon and you've instantly opened up a network that has the potential to work during the day, peaks and night.
(29 Jun 2022, 7:07 pm)Andreos1 wrote Where would the demand for those routes come from? Apart from the nighttime economy in Newcastle, they wouldn't pass by any major employers who have a 24hr operation - like Nissan or Amazon.
It's telling that those sites are all near main roads (to aid distribution of goods) and it's also telling that public transport operators don't use the same road networks to help aid the workforce.
If there's a nighttime network that's going to work, operators need to think outside the box and maybe even offer something which is different to the daytime network.
Whilst a Seaham - Sunderland via Ryhope Road works during the day - a variation of that route in peaks or on a night would offer so much more.
60X: A morning and evening peak version of the 60 via the A19 and Doxford International in to Sunderland.
60N: Night time version via Nissan and Follingsby to Newcastle would offer so much more than what we see now and would could play a part in making a 24hr network successful.
Couple that with say a 27X and 27N between Shields and Newcastle via Monkton Business Park and/or Boldon Business Park, Nissan and/or Amazon and you've instantly opened up a network that has the potential to work during the day, peaks and night.
(29 Jun 2022, 8:58 pm)cbma06 wrote Don’t forget GNE and other bus companies are a business, and all businesses are there to make profit, only way night services will run is when the local authorities pay for those services, GNE took on those night services hoping to attract the right passengers, but only a handful of passengers are not going to pay for use and maintenance of the bus being used, plus drivers wages.
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(29 Jun 2022, 9:55 pm)Drifter60 wrote Yes of course it’s got to make business sense - no one’s expecting a load of night buses going here, there and everywhere by next Tuesday. But perhaps looking at things a bit more realistically about who the target customers are and where they’re coming and going from. We’re told the 60 running to/from Parkside to Sunderland didn’t make enough money. Kudos to GNE for trying it, of course. But perhaps, as others have said, it wasn’t really an overly attractive proposition. There’s not that much in the way of employment sites, business parks or even nighttime leisure venues on the 60 route so I can certainly see why it hasn’t worked as well. Whereas the N21 serves Durham and Newcastle city centres bringing people to/from both locations, crucially at both end of the route so less scope for empty return trips. The same with 56 between Sunderland and Newcastle and also a main employment site with Nissan and on some trips connections at Concord to Follingsby Amazon iirc. So it’s easy to see where the 60 fell down. Having said that, I am surprised somewhat that some of the Saturday/Sunday early morning trips on the 60 haven’t managed to make some money - bringing people home after a night out in Sunderland.
(30 Jun 2022, 6:13 am)deanmachine wrote I am surprised that they haven't kept the Friday and Saturday 60s. Unless it's a quiet night in Sunderland they do take quite a lot of people in my experience.Many of the routes being cancelled are actually quite busy at times - the 28 at Beamish opening and closing times being one - but clearly don’t make enough money for GNE’s shareholders.
(29 Jun 2022, 9:55 pm)Drifter60 wrote Yes of course it’s got to make business sense - no one’s expecting a load of night buses going here, there and everywhere by next Tuesday. But perhaps looking at things a bit more realistically about who the target customers are and where they’re coming and going from. We’re told the 60 running to/from Parkside to Sunderland didn’t make enough money. Kudos to GNE for trying it, of course. But perhaps, as others have said, it wasn’t really an overly attractive proposition. There’s not that much in the way of employment sites, business parks or even nighttime leisure venues on the 60 route so I can certainly see why it hasn’t worked as well. Whereas the N21 serves Durham and Newcastle city centres bringing people to/from both locations, crucially at both end of the route so less scope for empty return trips. The same with 56 between Sunderland and Newcastle and also a main employment site with Nissan and on some trips connections at Concord to Follingsby Amazon iirc. So it’s easy to see where the 60 fell down. Having said that, I am surprised somewhat that some of the Saturday/Sunday early morning trips on the 60 haven’t managed to make some money - bringing people home after a night out in Sunderland.It's like fitting a square peg in a round hole and they act all surprised when it doesn't fit and they give up trying.
(30 Jun 2022, 9:17 am)morritt89 wrote I like the idea of night buses (and any public transport for that matter - a private car and a taxi is available 24/7 so why shouldn't public transport?) however I feel you would need a more substantial network than now to make it more user friendly.
On a side note, would a 24 hour metro service work/be more successful than a handful of buses?
(30 Jun 2022, 9:17 am)morritt89 wrote I like the idea of night buses (and any public transport for that matter - a private car and a taxi is available 24/7 so why shouldn't public transport?) however I feel you would need a more substantial network than now to make it more user friendly.I'd love it to happen. But for the reasons mentioned above and the lack of buses that will take people those last few miles, I can't see it happening.
On a side note, would a 24 hour metro service work/be more successful than a handful of buses?
(30 Jun 2022, 9:26 am)Storx wrote The problem with a 24 hour Metro is there's maintenance which happens overnight which would suddenly become very difficult such as leaf clearing in the winter or doing rail grinding etc. There's quite a bit which is done. It's why there's very limited rail anywhere overnight and most tracks have blockades for times, some which involve the wires being turned off.Nexus could, of course, secure Metro replacement bus services to provide a night service over the Metro routes if they thought they would attract passengers.
(30 Jun 2022, 10:43 am)busmanT wrote Nexus could, of course, secure Metro replacement bus services to provide a night service over the Metro routes if they thought they would attract passengers.
(30 Jun 2022, 10:43 am)busmanT wrote Nexus could, of course, secure Metro replacement bus services to provide a night service over the Metro routes if they thought they would attract passengers.Exactly this. If there was enough demand or "social need" then NEXUS would cover the Metro routes using "N" buses, like London with night buses shadowing tube lines. That was, until the late 2000s the extent of night buses in London anyway!
(30 Jun 2022, 10:43 am)busmanT wrote Nexus could, of course, secure Metro replacement bus services to provide a night service over the Metro routes if they thought they would attract passengers.
(30 Jun 2022, 3:37 pm)deanmachine wrote The only problem is the cost of funding the service using the existing ticketing, there's no way Nexus could afford it. I think it would work great however, have a bus run the North Tyneside loop, with an N27 complementing the existing 56 (no need to run a service on the Sunderland line, just allow metro tickets to be used on the existing 56). That could be a basis for an extended night bus network if it was successful.The 1 would be a good one since it does cover Monument to Whitley Bay but after that gne don't cover any of the stations (bar the 19 to Northumberland Park)
(30 Jun 2022, 3:40 pm)Aaron21 wrote The 1 would be a good one since it does cover Monument to Whitley Bay but after that gne don't cover any of the stations (bar the 19 to Northumberland Park)