(27 Aug 2023, 9:02 pm)Theboyle92 wrote It would be alright if they removed the 2A to biddick and back on an evening as it very very rarely picks anybody up would save around 12/13 minutes that could be split at both ends to allow for any late running diversions etc

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Could the 8 not be extended from Chester to Washington on an evening. Could be timed to give a 30 minute frequency with the 50 and routed through biddick instead as an 8E or something similar. Could be done with 1 extra PVR.

(27 Aug 2023, 9:02 pm)Theboyle92 wrote It would be alright if they removed the 2A to biddick and back on an evening as it very very rarely picks anybody up would save around 12/13 minutes that could be split at both ends to allow for any late running diversions etc

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I use that 2A sparingly, but there always seems to be 3-4 others on, most of the time. I'm not sure I'd expect more than that, given it only serves one stop.

I may be wrong, but I've got a feeling that Nexus pay for that short 2A extension on an evening, as they do with the 84/85. It maintains a half hour evening frequency, without sticking an extra bus into the schedule. 

(28 Aug 2023, 7:30 am)User2613 wrote Could the 8 not be extended from Chester to Washington on an evening. Could be timed to give a 30 minute frequency with the 50 and routed through biddick instead as an 8E or something similar. Could be done with 1 extra PVR.

They tried that recently under the 'Better than Ever' gimmick, but it didn't last long. I'd have to dig the timetables out, but I recall the issue was that it ran within 10 minutes of the 50, rather than providing a clock-face half hourly service from Chester-le-Street.

(29 Aug 2023, 8:30 am)Adrian wrote I use that 2A sparingly, but there always seems to be 3-4 others on, most of the time. I'm not sure I'd expect more than that, given it only serves one stop.

I may be wrong, but I've got a feeling that Nexus pay for that short 2A extension on an evening, as they do with the 84/85. It maintains a half hour evening frequency, without sticking an extra bus into the schedule. 


They tried that recently under the 'Better than Ever' gimmick, but it didn't last long. I'd have to dig the timetables out, but I recall the issue was that it ran within 10 minutes of the 50, rather than providing a clock-face half hourly service from Chester-le-Street.

I would say in the dozen ive done over the past month I've taken about 3 people to biddick or back to me i would increase the pvr to 4 and have 2x2 and 2x2A on an evening.

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(29 Aug 2023, 9:10 am)Theboyle92 wrote I would say in the dozen ive done over the past month I've taken about 3 people to biddick or back to me i would increase the pvr to 4 and have 2x2 and 2x2A on an evening.

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Not surprised, given the fact (a. its only a 5-10 minute walk from the galleries anyway) and (b. it doesn't stop round the back of parkway).  

Also, if Washington-Sunderland evenings need to be half-hourly, what about running the 81 on evening like on a Sunday.

(29 Aug 2023, 11:50 am)ASX_Terranova wrote Not surprised, given the fact (a. its only a 5-10 minute walk from the galleries anyway) and (b. it doesn't stop round the back of parkway).  

Also, if Washington-Sunderland evenings need to be half-hourly, what about running the 81 on evening like on a Sunday.

About 10 minutes from the Bus Station to the Junction of Titchfield Road, but up to double that depending on where you're then walking from the bus stop to.

I don't think they need to be half hourly. It's more that the 2 has so much time trimmed off it for an evening, yet it's still got to contend with the same sets of traffic lights.

(29 Aug 2023, 9:10 am)Theboyle92 wrote I would say in the dozen ive done over the past month I've taken about 3 people to biddick or back to me i would increase the pvr to 4 and have 2x2 and 2x2A on an evening.

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2x2A, so thats a 4A then, im sorry, that was supposed to be a joke, wasnt funny, al shut up now

(29 Aug 2023, 1:14 pm)Adrian wrote About 10 minutes from the Bus Station to the Junction of Titchfield Road, but up to double that depending on where you're then walking from the bus stop to.

I don't think they need to be half hourly. It's more that the 2 has so much time trimmed off it for an evening, yet it's still got to contend with the same sets of traffic lights.

You could spilt the 2 at sunderland and give the washington part extra running time if traffic is a problem.

What were the loadings when the 8 ran to sunderland in the evenings?

(29 Aug 2023, 8:30 am)Adrian wrote I use that 2A sparingly, but there always seems to be 3-4 others on, most of the time. I'm not sure I'd expect more than that, given it only serves one stop.

I may be wrong, but I've got a feeling that Nexus pay for that short 2A extension on an evening, as they do with the 84/85. It maintains a half hour evening frequency, without sticking an extra bus into the schedule. 


They tried that recently under the 'Better than Ever' gimmick, but it didn't last long. I'd have to dig the timetables out, but I recall the issue was that it ran within 10 minutes of the 50, rather than providing a clock-face half hourly service from Chester-le-Street.

Was that not wen it ran all the way through to Sunderland while they had the contract for the Sunderland end so ran it the full length until end of service? I was thinking only extend as far as galleries.

(29 Aug 2023, 7:55 pm)User2613 wrote Was that not wen it ran all the way through to Sunderland while they had the contract for the Sunderland end so ran it the full length until end of service? I was thinking only extend as far as galleries.

If it was contracted all the way to sunderland wouldn't the 81 or 83 run to sunderland during the evenings, i assumed it was fully commercial except on a sunday.

(29 Aug 2023, 5:58 pm)ASX_Terranova wrote You could spilt the 2 at sunderland and give the washington part extra running time if traffic is a problem.

What were the loadings when the 8 ran to sunderland in the evenings?

I'd suspect the issue here is about covering as much, with as little resource as possible. Splitting the 2 in Sunderland is not only an extra bus, but it's significant waste in layover time, and it's confusing for passengers who have a through service all day.

(29 Aug 2023, 7:55 pm)User2613 wrote Was that not wen it ran all the way through to Sunderland while they had the contract for the Sunderland end so ran it the full length until end of service? I was thinking only extend as far as galleries.

Yes, I recall it (the 8) ran all the way to Sunderland, but I believe it was fully commercial.

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(29 Aug 2023, 10:33 pm)Adrian wrote I'd suspect the issue here is about covering as much, with as little resource as possible. Splitting the 2 in Sunderland is not only an extra bus, but it's significant waste in layover time, and it's confusing for passengers who have a through service all day.
Yes, I recall it (the 8) ran all the way to Sunderland, but I believe it was fully commercial.

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It could go back to the way it was many moons ago when it was there was the 2A/C and the 42 i seem to remember on an evening the 42 use to work onto a 60 at park lane and vise versa, the 78 already covers Chester Rd to Shiney Row roundabout and the 4 does penshaw to The galleries , the only missing link would be along Bonemill Ln through to Harraton and Lambton, unless the 4 on an evening went along Bonemill Ln turned onto Biddick lane then onto Fallowfield way. Penshaw would still have a link to Biddick club and it would keep the coffin dodgers that drink in there happy.

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(29 Aug 2023, 10:33 pm)Adrian wrote I'd suspect the issue here is about covering as much, with as little resource as possible. Splitting the 2 in Sunderland is not only an extra bus, but it's significant waste in layover time, and it's confusing for passengers who have a through service all day.
Yes, I recall it (the 8) ran all the way to Sunderland, but I believe it was fully commercial.

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I thought it was when GNE won the contact for evening Sunderland-Castletown instead of stagecoach that the 8 was extended to cover the full route. When they then lost it again it was cut back.

Let’s add Arriva Redcar’s 63 to this list as very rarely do all 13 boards actually run, leaving gaps all over the place. Often down to 10 or 11 most days which just ruins the reliability as the ones behind the gaps get late then drop out leaving a bigger gap and the problem just snowballs. Nothing ever changes though and with Redcar’s fleet getting smaller it’s not going to improve any time soon…!


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Go North East's 16/16A has been terrible today, guessing it's something to do with the diversion in place.

(31 Aug 2023, 4:27 pm)Iamtheone8483748 wrote Go North East's 16/16A has been terrible today, guessing it's something to do with the diversion in place.

The A692 was closed between Flint Hill and the junction of the A693 resulting in a lengthy diversion.


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Ah, I can imagine it being a pain! Don't regularly use that side of the route so was unaware

The Hartlepool service 7 ( by default the 6 as well) has become completely unreliable since it changed to every 12 minutes. Buses are now coming in 2s more often than they used to they are constantly late now as well meaning they can get full a lot quicker than they used to not helped by the 58/09 plate 397xx Manviros often been put on them. For a what is supposed to be every 12 minutes they are often of up to 20 - 25 minutes now it gone from a decent service to been lucky if it only a few minutes late.

21/X21 have to be in contention aswell

(30 Aug 2023, 5:28 am)tyresmoke wrote Let’s add Arriva Redcar’s 63 to this list as very rarely do all 13 boards actually run, leaving gaps all over the place. Often down to 10 or 11 most days which just ruins the reliability as the ones behind the gaps get late then drop out leaving a bigger gap and the problem just snowballs. Nothing ever changes though and with Redcar’s fleet getting smaller it’s not going to improve any time soon…!


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Monday they were down to just 7 of them out there… literally half of the service missing! And completely unusable as a result. At one point they had 4 in Middlesbrough and 3 in Redcar and nothing in the hour journey either way


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(05 Sep 2023, 10:34 pm)Unber43 wrote 21/X21 have to be in contention aswell

The early morning services are particularly bad. They obviously get caught in traffic getting to Chester from riverside and they’ve not built this into the timetable

(06 Sep 2023, 9:10 pm)Ambassador wrote The early morning services are particularly bad. They obviously get caught in traffic getting to Chester from riverside and they’ve not built this into the timetable

They get (or once got) twenty minutes to run light between the two. An hour for West, fifty-five for Bishop, and forty for Durham, the lattermost of which I think is perhaps overgenerous compared to twenty minutes to Chester.

(06 Sep 2023, 9:49 pm)R852 PRG wrote They get (or once got) twenty minutes to run light between the two. An hour for West, fifty-five for Bishop, and forty for Durham, the lattermost of which I think is perhaps overgenerous compared to twenty minutes to Chester.

Once the A1 and the Birtley cycle way (words fail me!) are completed that should be more than enough. The 6.40 out of Chester seems to be especially hopeless when it gets to me at low fell whereas pre chester closing it was one of few buses to run spot on time.

Wonder if any of the X21 dead runs would go through Tow Law/Lanchester rather than the A1, probably faster if there is a lot of traffic on the A1

(06 Sep 2023, 10:41 pm)Unber43 wrote Wonder if any of the X21 dead runs would go through Tow Law/Lanchester rather than the A1, probably faster if there is a lot of traffic on the A1

The dead running path for those terminating at West is to take the A688 past Thinford and then connect onto the A1 at Bowburn. Those that terminate at Bishop return through Bondgate, up the bank on Durham Road then connect onto the above route at Coundon Gate roundabout.

That said, I once recall seeing a driver terminating at Bishop head down Newgate Street, as if heading out to West in service, to join the A688 from the roundabout at Watling Road akin to those returning light from West.

(06 Sep 2023, 10:24 pm)Ambassador wrote Once the A1 and the Birtley cycle way (words fail me!) are completed that should be more than enough. The 6.40 out of Chester seems to be especially hopeless when it gets to me at low fell whereas pre chester closing it was one of few buses to run spot on time.

0640 was on a split shift, hence its consistent non-Angel allocation in Chester's final couple of years. Seem to recall it running onto the 50 dupe during the pandemic.