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+--- Thread: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes (/showthread.php?tid=1031)
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RE: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - PH - BQA - 17 Dec 2023
(17 Dec 2023, 10:53 am)L469 YVK wrote The whole reason why the loop will likely be in place (subject to consultation) is so that running times can be increased. Effectively, the time saved interworking the X21 & 35 via the loop will be re-invested elsewhere in both routes.
Yes - so why would they swap the routes of them in Bedlington if they've identified the solution to late running as looping Newbiggin?
RE: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - L469 YVK - 17 Dec 2023
(17 Dec 2023, 3:08 pm)mb134 wrote Yes - so why would they swap the routes of them in Bedlington if they've identified the solution to late running as looping Newbiggin?That won't allow sufficient time alone to be added to journeys though to help keep things robust. Ashington to Newcastle on the current X21 route but via Hartford Road instead would need at least 60 minutes outbound and 58 minutes inbound. Effectively the 'old' X21 and X31/X32 route, one time only needing around 52 minutes on that stretch.
Add Nedderton into the equation then increases that to 65 and 63 minutes retrospectively. Then add any extra time onto the 35 needed. Not forgetting Sundays & Bank Holidays which really need to adpot the same running times as Mondays to Saturdays.
See the attached suggestion timetable and people will get what I mean about swapping back the X21/X22 in Bedlington.
RE: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - PH - BQA - 17 Dec 2023
(17 Dec 2023, 3:49 pm)L469 YVK wrote That won't allow sufficient time alone to be added to journeys though to help keep things robust.
Sitting for 17 minutes in Morpeth and 9 in Haymarket each cycle is massively overkill, given time is being put back into the routes.
Ultimately Arriva have consulted on a change to the route in Newbiggin and Newbiggin alone, not a pointless change in Bedlington. I think it's more than safe to assume that will be the only change to the route.
RE: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - L469 YVK - 17 Dec 2023
(17 Dec 2023, 5:05 pm)mb134 wrote Sitting for 17 minutes in Morpeth and 9 in Haymarket each cycle is massively overkill, given time is being put back into the routes.
Ultimately Arriva have consulted on a change to the route in Newbiggin and Newbiggin alone, not a pointless change in Bedlington. I think it's more than safe to assume that will be the only change to the route.
Could say the same for the 43/44/45 layovers too. And also the 306 layovers in Whitley Bay.
But the 17 and 9 minute layovers would help get things back on track should there be any moderate delays to services plus hugely help at peak times. Also have to take into account for a smooth change between the X21 and 35 in Newbiggin, anything more than 3 minutes will be off putting. Plus it wouldn't be the worst idea having a decent length layover in Morpeth after doing a full X21 and 35.
Don't forget either that Sundays & Bank Holidays also seem to be plagued with reliability issues. The X21 going back via Hartford Road would allow a clean and easy interworking pattern with the 35 & X22 on Sundays without any long layovers in Morpeth.
RE: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - PH - BQA - 17 Dec 2023
(17 Dec 2023, 6:46 pm)L469 YVK wrote Don't forget either that Sundays & Bank Holidays also seem to be plagued with reliability issues.
There have been more Sunday/BH boards introduced for this very reason.
Ultimately the X21 and X22 aren't swapping to the routes they did over a decade ago, and probably never will.
RE: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - L469 YVK - 17 Dec 2023
(17 Dec 2023, 9:06 pm)mb134 wrote There have been more Sunday/BH boards introduced for this very reason.
Ultimately the X21 and X22 aren't swapping to the routes they did over a decade ago, and probably never will.
Whereabouts have Arriva added the extra boards? Bar a few minutes added to the X22 unless remote reliefs are actively happening in Morpeth on Sundays? There's a few today I've noticed on bustimes.
RE: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - PH - BQA - 17 Dec 2023
(17 Dec 2023, 9:20 pm)L469 YVK wrote Whereabouts have Arriva added the extra boards? Bar a few minutes added to the X22 unless remote reliefs are actively happening in Morpeth on Sundays? There's a few today I've noticed on bustimes.
There are multiple additional boards, such as the one starting as the 1114 35.
RE: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - L469 YVK - 18 Dec 2023
(17 Dec 2023, 10:46 pm)mb134 wrote There are multiple additional boards, such as the one starting as the 1114 35.That's not an additional board though, that's just extra PVR being thrown in. A bit like what GNE used to do at Hexham & Bishop Auckland when the 10 & X21 had long layovers with a new bus sent out.
A PVR of 7x with the X22 > X21 > 35 > 35 > X21 > X22 interworking pattern would allow Sunday journeys to use the same running times as per Monday to Saturdays, improving reliability.
RE: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - PH - BQA - 18 Dec 2023
(18 Dec 2023, 10:15 am)L469 YVK wrote That's not an additional board though, that's just extra PVR being thrown in. A bit like what GNE used to do at Hexham & Bishop Auckland when the 10 & X21 had long layovers with a new bus sent out.
No it literally, physically, is an additional board.
RE: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - L469 YVK - 18 Dec 2023
(18 Dec 2023, 10:36 am)mb134 wrote No it literally, physically, is an additional board.
As in a duplicate or a new bus & driver sent out from Morpeth?
RE: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - L469 YVK - 18 Dec 2023
I suppose it would be do-able keeping Bedlington to Newcastle as it is now on both routes, although wouldn't leave much scope for decent layovers at Newcastle or Morpeth with 65 / 63 minute running times between Newcastle & Ashington plus the rest of added time thrown in.
The main advantage running the X21 via Hartford Road however is that it could potentially win over / retain customers who aren't going around Central Station and don't want the hassle of changing onto the Metro or walking. On the flipside however, Red House Farm and Nedderton could keep the X21 viable on a 30 minute frequency (X22 won't be as affected) should most passengers around the Bedlington Station area deflect to the train. Completely unknown territory at the moment although Arriva did make the move swapping around the X8 & X9 between Blyth and Cramlington for that exact reason to try and retain customers.
RE: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - PH - BQA - 18 Dec 2023
(18 Dec 2023, 2:09 pm)L469 YVK wrote As in a duplicate or a new bus & driver sent out from Morpeth?
As in it's the start of a board, thus will always be a new bus and driver.
RE: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - thw1008 - 19 Dec 2023
Early days but does anyone have an idea of how the new 777 route may look? Seems quite a rural route unless you end up around the doors and doubling back the odd time.
Possible #1
https://maps.app.goo.gl/SGXLNQDpkN2RRSYn9
- Fairly direct not but a lot of traffic between Morpeth & Ponteland.
Possible #2
https://maps.app.goo.gl/p2WTWSCMjz2AZsy76
- Less direct, but taking in Stannington & Dinnington.
Possible #3
https://maps.app.goo.gl/dG72Yf1hvjdWNDPD9
- Too much? But you can catch Whitehouse Farm, St Mary's, Stannington & Dinnington (to name a few!)
Time will tell I guess!
RE: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - Aaron21 - 19 Dec 2023
I wonder if the 57/57A route change would be extended the 57/57A to North Shields full time Monday to Saturday
Still confused why it goes there on an evening & Sundays. Would give people from Whitley to North Shields via Rake Lane of which a bus from. Yea the 317 goes there but do wonder if the 57/57A will go there
RE: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - PH - BQA - 19 Dec 2023
(19 Dec 2023, 9:20 pm)Aaron21 wrote I wonder if the 57/57A route change would be extended the 57/57A to North Shields full time Monday to Saturday
Still confused why it goes there on an evening & Sundays. Would give people from Whitley to North Shields via Rake Lane of which a bus from. Yea the 317 goes there but do wonder if the 57/57A will go there
Think that would require yet another PVR increase on the service?
Given there seems to be lots of focus on improving evening services, I wonder if providing Ashington with an evening link to Cramlington would be on the cards - which of course is PVR neutral?
RE: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - Storx - 19 Dec 2023
(19 Dec 2023, 9:20 pm)Aaron21 wrote I wonder if the 57/57A route change would be extended the 57/57A to North Shields full time Monday to Saturday
Still confused why it goes there on an evening & Sundays. Would give people from Whitley to North Shields via Rake Lane of which a bus from. Yea the 317 goes there but do wonder if the 57/57A will go there
I highly doubt it will be but I wish they'd change the Whitley end so it runs like this:
https://www.google.com/maps/dir/55.0425333,-1.4581905/55.0419745,-1.4606969/@55.0442241,-1.4576186,15.5z/data=!4m9!4m8!1m5!3m4!1m2!1d-1.4474218!2d55.0442368!3s0x487e6c288e3c5721:0x54bf6253228af672!1m0!3e0?entry=ttu
Instead of pissing about going around the back of the Firestation and getting stuck at numerous traffic lights for absolutely no benefit. Would open links to the beach and Spanish City area aswell, plus save time. So it's win/win. The bus stop the 57/57A stops at near Sainsbury's is unused so it laying over there wouldn't be an issue if needed.
RE: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - Storx - 19 Dec 2023
(19 Dec 2023, 9:27 pm)mb134 wrote Think that would require yet another PVR increase on the service?
Given there seems to be lots of focus on improving evening services, I wonder if providing Ashington with an evening link to Cramlington would be on the cards - which of course is PVR neutral?
Not sure how they'd do it but if it's evening services I wouldn't be surprised if it's East Cramlington instead, the area has no bus service at all beyond 6pm or on a Sunday, it's not really a small area since the new housing development and the hospital aswell which is completely unserved without a quite long walk including under the pretty grim Spine Road underpass.
With all these new train connections popping up, I wouldn't be surprised if that's part - how it's done, I'm not sure tbh but I wouldn't be surprised the Hospital <> Seaton Delaval station is one of the big selling points of the Northumberland Line which is every 30 minutes during the day (19/57).
RE: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - L469 YVK - 19 Dec 2023
(19 Dec 2023, 9:27 pm)mb134 wrote Think that would require yet another PVR increase on the service?Or maybe both.....Billy Mill Lane / New York to North Shields has always carried a fair amount dating back to the days of the 356 & 442 especially with the Twirlies. Plus good opportunity to capitalise on GNE's short notice cancellations.
Given there seems to be lots of focus on improving evening services, I wonder if providing Ashington with an evening link to Cramlington would be on the cards - which of course is PVR neutral?
RE: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - Aaron21 - 19 Dec 2023
Isn't the 57/57A become void of solos from this change. Heard it earlier when the 57A went to Ashington full time that the 57/57A wasn't gonna be solos anymore
RE: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - PH - BQA - 20 Dec 2023
(19 Dec 2023, 10:54 pm)Aaron21 wrote Isn't the 57/57A become void of solos from this change. Heard it earlier when the 57A went to Ashington full time that the 57/57A wasn't gonna be solos anymore
Not yet, believe it was mentioned on here that this change is planned in the New Year.
They received no extra Solo when the 57A was extended to Ashington, so if any are VOR (which is common...) then a full size vehicle is allocated.
To be honest, I saw a couple of Pulsars on there on Cramlington on Saturday on my way into/back from town and they looked to have very healthy loads to the level that would probably be uncomfortable on a Solo.
RE: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - OrangeArrow49 - 21 Dec 2023
(15 Dec 2023, 3:28 pm)busmanT wrote All day, every day at a regular frequency.
I'm assuming you've seen the 777 timetable. How frequent is regular, like hourly or every 10 minutes? Can surely only be hourly on Sundays?
Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - tyresmoke - 22 Dec 2023
Full details have now been posted!
https://www.arrivabus.co.uk/latest-news/changes-in-northumberland-and-tyne-and-wear-jan-24
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
RE: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - omnicity4659 - 22 Dec 2023
Finally a decent service on the 1 on evenings and Sundays!
RE: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - L469 YVK - 22 Dec 2023
Although the weekend timetables look far more generous for the X21 & X22, still no real running time enhancements IMO. Layover times on the Monday to Friday X21 / 35 boards don't seem to be enough with 5 minutes at each end of route!
Unless Arriva are anticipating that they can sustain a 30 minute service on each when the line goes live and will simply reduce the frequency to every 30 minutes each once that happens to address any reliability issues.
RE: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - L469 YVK - 22 Dec 2023
Also, could there be scope to possibly increase the 35 to every 15 minutes in the future? Whilst passenger numbers will inevitably drop on the X21/X22, surely there will be more demand going into Ashington from both Newbiggin and Morpeth with connections onto the rail line.
RE: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - solsburian - 22 Dec 2023
I've heard that the 57a changes will involve extra extensions to Ashington on Sundays. Edit, d'oh missed then announcement.
RE: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - Storx - 22 Dec 2023
Guessing the purpose of the 777 is more so to give the North side of Ponteland a bus service (it currently has nothing bar the once daily X79) and link Ponteland to Kingston Park for shopping needs as much as the airport link.
Not surprised at it taking that route.
RE: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - OrangeArrow49 - 22 Dec 2023
(22 Dec 2023, 7:51 pm)Storx wrote Guessing the purpose of the 777 is more so to give the North side of Ponteland a bus service (it currently has nothing bar the once daily X79) and link Ponteland to Kingston Park for shopping needs as much as the airport link.
Not surprised at it taking that route.
Single decker?
Can't see it being a busy route.
RE: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - Jimmi - 22 Dec 2023
(22 Dec 2023, 8:33 pm)OrangeArrow49 wrote Single decker?
Can't see it being a busy route.
Would imagine so, looks as if it will interwork with the X16 too.
RE: Arriva North East: Upcoming Service Changes - OrangeArrow49 - 22 Dec 2023
(22 Dec 2023, 8:43 pm)Jimmi wrote Would imagine so, looks as if it will interwork with the X16 too.
The X16 has been a mixed allocation so far. How will the interworking pattern look?