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+--- Thread: Politics (and other political stuff) (/showthread.php?tid=1001)
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - MurdnunoC - 17 Jun 2015
I've just this minute signed up so I can vote Jeremy Corbyn in the Labour leadership election.
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - Adrian - 03 Aug 2015
(02 Aug 2015, 9:55 pm)Adam wrote http://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/north-east-news/labour-leadership-list-who-north-9770973
I notice the Chronicle have compiled a list of the Labour leadership candidates and which North East Labour MPs, constituencies and affiliates are supporting them. Some interesting ones mind.
Note the exclusion of the forum's favourite local MP, Sharon Hodgson
See, this is what annoys me. Surely if a CLP votes (which they do) to endorse a particular candidate, then the MP (that the CLP elect as a candidate) should also endorse/nominate that candidate.
No real surprise that Sharon and Bridget have voted for Yvette, being the leading female candidate.
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - Adrian - 03 Aug 2015
I'm not one to post a Daily Mail link, but I found this article quite amusing: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3181924/How-militants-hijaking-Labour-Banned-Derek-Hatton-rejoined-party-force-Corbyn-victory-s-bungling-Red-Ed-s-fault.html
Basically, the Tory press are flapping over the thought of the ex-Militant Tendancy/Socialist Party, having an influence over Corbyn winning the leadership contest.
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - MurdnunoC - 03 Aug 2015
(03 Aug 2015, 6:49 pm)Adam wrote I see what you mean. You would think (and rather hope) that there would be some unity between the two, but there obviously isn't in this example. And consequently, it can insinuate possible divisions between the party's members, with many having different directions they want the party to go in.
There was also talk, albeit nationally, that if Corbyn wins with his far leftwing views, there may be a SDP-style breakaway from the Labour party started by those belonging to the centre-left. It was on some show the other week. I think it was the Daily Politics.
Today infact, the Shadow Chancellor (Chris Leslie is it?) said he will not serve under a Corbyn-led Shadow Government.
Those involved in the SDP breakaway in the early-80's weren't exactly missed. Labour managed to survive without them and I think, if there was another SDP-style breakaway, The Labour Party would be able weather the storm and survive again.
The problem with centrist politics, in my view, is that it becomes deeply undemocratic. Politics is supposed to be dynamic and oppositional, representative of all views contained within the political spectrum. If all the main parties drift towards the centre-ground they begin to alienate people originally sympathetic with their core values. Voters become disillusioned in the process creating a crisis where people don't engage because they don't feel represented. Fringe parties, both left and right, may gain a few voters here and there but, ultimately, voters become more apathetic over time, spanning across generations.
A (threatened) split in the Labour Party may be a good thing as it threatens the status-quo and forces the party to question both who it really represents and who are its members.
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - MrFozz - 12 Aug 2015
Quick question...
With everything going on with Labour at the moment, is it really possible a vote for Jeremy Corbyn will be the death of the Labour Party...
Anyone think Corbyn will win and will the likes of Blair be proved right about it if Corbyn is voted in
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - Adrian - 12 Aug 2015
(12 Aug 2015, 9:15 pm)MrFozz wrote Quick question...In my opinion - no. Scare tactics from those to the right of the Labour Party.
With everything going on with Labour at the moment, is it really possible a vote for Jeremy Corbyn will be the death of the Labour Party...
Anyone think Corbyn will win and will the likes of Blair be proved right about it if Corbyn is voted in
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - BusLoverMum - 12 Aug 2015
(12 Aug 2015, 9:15 pm)MrFozz wrote Quick question...
With everything going on with Labour at the moment, is it really possible a vote for Jeremy Corbyn will be the death of the Labour Party...
Anyone think Corbyn will win and will the likes of Blair be proved right about it if Corbyn is voted in
Blair needs to b... off back to Iraq or wherever he's working miracles, this week.
I'm rather enjoying the Corbyn effect. I was rather crushed when Ed couldn't deliver the votes and all the pundits blamed it on him being too left wing, amongst other things, such as his not uncommon inability to eat an undercooked bacon sandwich gracefully. While I find some of Corbyn's views a little extreme (he'd be all for uniform carbon copy state owned buses, wouldn't he?) I think it's rather refreshing that so many people are saying that the last thing that the labour party should do is give up and become Tory lite.
I do believe there will be some major shakeup as a result of this, but, to be honest, it's necessary.
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - MrFozz - 12 Aug 2015
(12 Aug 2015, 9:39 pm)BusLoverMum wrote Blair needs to b... off back to Iraq or wherever he's working miracles, this week.Ed was never going to win the Election, whether David Milliband could have won or not I do not know.
I'm rather enjoying the Corbyn effect. I was rather crushed when Ed couldn't deliver the votes and all the pundits blamed it on him being too left wing, amongst other things, such as his not uncommon inability to eat an undercooked bacon sandwich gracefully. While I find some of Corbyn's views a little extreme (he'd be all for uniform carbon copy state owned buses, wouldn't he?) I think it's rather refreshing that so many people are saying that the last thing that the labour party should do is give up and become Tory lite.
I do believe there will be some major shakeup as a result of this, but, to be honest, it's necessary.
I am sick of it all to be honest, I dont trust any of them as far as I could spit
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - BusLoverMum - 12 Aug 2015
(12 Aug 2015, 10:10 pm)MrFozz wrote Ed was never going to win the Election, whether David Milliband could have won or not I do not know.
I am sick of it all to be honest, I dont trust any of them as far as I could spit
David was a Blair fan with dodgy facial hair that wasn't worth cultivating. And a career politician. I never trusted him.
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - MrFozz - 12 Aug 2015
(12 Aug 2015, 10:31 pm)BusLoverMum wrote David was a Blair fan with dodgy facial hair that wasn't worth cultivating. And a career politician. I never trusted him.I was never keen on Tonys cronies to be honest, I dont trust a man called Balls, everytime I think about Alistair Darling, it reminds me of Tim McInerney in Blackadder Goes Forth...I actually met Tony Blair once years ago at school, and once got into trouble at school because of him...[FACE WITH TEARS OF JOY]
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - BusLoverMum - 12 Aug 2015
Do spill...
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - MrFozz - 12 Aug 2015
(12 Aug 2015, 10:47 pm)BusLoverMum wrote Do spill...I went to the same school Tony Blair did(Durham Choristers), when he ran for Party Leader in 1994, there was some media interest in the school, a photographer came up to the school, he asked Me and a Couple of mates if he could take out photo, naturally, we said yes, so we were snapped running up the drive, the headmaster went absolutely mental, you would think we had murdered someone as he tore into us, and the photographer got an even bigger bollocking not just for taking our photo, but for trespassing as he had no permission to be there, the paper had not asked for the schools permission to set foot in the place.
At the time could not see what the problem was, was only a photo after all, and we saw the interest in Tony Blair as having some interest in us, so that is why I blame Blair for that little incident...Anyway it all got sorted, despite being told the photo may never have been used and after hammering the photographer and speaking to his editor, it was agreed the photo would be used after all, we made one of the first few pages of the paper, cant remember which paper it was...All I remember is, it was not a tabloid, possibly The Guardian, The Independent or The Times.
Of course 20 odd years on, I now understand why my Headmaster was upset, but being young, nothing sinister crossed our minds, never questioned him why he wanted to take 3 young boys picture as we took him at his word. While the Headmaster did over react a bit, I suppose questions would have been asked of him if he just let it slide.
So if Blair had not had not have joined the Leadership Campaign I would not have had the photo taken...So I blame him for thar
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - Andreos1 - 13 Aug 2015
I agree.with a lot of the things Corbyn says and after seeing him speak in Durham The other week, I would love him to sweep to power and shake things up.
However, he probably doesn't appeal to the floating middle England voters needed to win an Election nor the blue labour members that have infested the party.
A lot of the media seem to be against him too unfortunately - which only means one thing, particularly to those unable to see through spin.
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - MurdnunoC - 13 Aug 2015
(12 Aug 2015, 9:15 pm)MrFozz wrote Quick question...
With everything going on with Labour at the moment, is it really possible a vote for Jeremy Corbyn will be the death of the Labour Party...
Anyone think Corbyn will win and will the likes of Blair be proved right about it if Corbyn is voted in
If Corbyn is voted in, and the party splits as a result, it won't be the Corbynites who'll be leaving. It will be those on the right on the party who'll spit their dummies out and either leave or end up poisoning Labour's election hopes by being overly negative towards any policies or views Corbyn chooses to adopt.
While Entryism may prove to be a very minor factor in getting Corbyn elected, we must not discount the fact that he is indeed popular amongst CLP's and Labour members. I think Blair overstates his popularity in the 1997 election anyway. While he may have appealed to some Tory voters, I think the combination of sleeze, stagnation and the fact that voters had grown tired of 18 years of Tory governance contributed heavily to his overall appeal.
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - MurdnunoC - 18 Aug 2015
Yvette Cooper tries to win over a Corbyn fan
Rather unconvincingly in my opinion.
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - Adrian - 18 Aug 2015
(18 Aug 2015, 6:14 pm)MurdnunoC wrote Yvette Cooper tries to win over a Corbyn fan
Rather unconvincingly in my opinion.
Fair play for her trying to give an explanation, but it's a load of cobblers in my eyes.
Standing orders put the amendment before the Government's bill, as that's the only realistic order the bills could be heard. The Government's bill would fall if the amendment was passed, and the amendment wouldn't have even been heard, if the Government bill was heard first.
She's made quite clear in that interview that she's 'against' the Government's bill, so I don't understand why she didn't vote accordingly? Some things are more important than the whip's office ruling.
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - MurdnunoC - 18 Aug 2015
(18 Aug 2015, 6:42 pm)aureolin wrote Fair play for her trying to give an explanation, but it's a load of cobblers in my eyes.
Standing orders put the amendment before the Government's bill, as that's the only realistic order the bills could be heard. The Government's bill would fall if the amendment was passed, and the amendment wouldn't have even been heard, if the Government bill was heard first.
She's made quite clear in that interview that she's 'against' the Government's bill, so I don't understand why she didn't vote accordingly? Some things are more important than the whip's office ruling.
While I understand the importance of the whip's role in government, I can't help but think it undermines the role of the MP in the eyes of both the party and their constituents.
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - Adrian - 19 Aug 2015
Corbyn-mania hits Newcastle
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/old-labour-young-labour-both-6276930
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - Andreos1 - 26 Aug 2015
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/watch-jeremy-corbyn-wind-up-rich-tories-in-the-1980s-10460843.html
Vintage politics, vintage fashions and vintage buses.
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - R852 PRG - 26 Aug 2015
This is what happens if you don't make it in the general election... http://i100.independent.co.uk/article/ed-miliband-is-wandering-around-australia-growing-a-beard-asking-people-if-they-want-a-selfie--W1eajPBzZHe
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - Adrian - 26 Aug 2015
(26 Aug 2015, 5:16 pm)Andreos1 wrote http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/watch-jeremy-corbyn-wind-up-rich-tories-in-the-1980s-10460843.htmlWhat a fantastic guy he is. I can't believe how many people have been reinvigorated by him running for leader.
Vintage politics, vintage fashions and vintage buses.
I predict a landslide in little over two weeks time.
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - MurdnunoC - 26 Aug 2015
(26 Aug 2015, 7:47 pm)aureolin wrote What a fantastic guy he is. I can't believe how many people have been reinvigorated by him running for leader.
I predict a landslide in little over two weeks time.
It's just a shame that most who hold either a position of power or influence with the party are doing their best to undermine or discredit him.
It's a real insult to the majority of Labour members, supporters and/or voters who have been invigorated by his campaign and only shows to illustrate how out of touch they really are. If Labour are indeed doomed to another decade in opposition, it won't be the fault of Corbyn.
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - Adrian - 26 Aug 2015
(26 Aug 2015, 7:52 pm)MurdnunoC wrote It's just a shame that most who hold either a position of power or influence with the party are doing their best to undermine or discredit him.
It's a real insult to the majority of Labour members, supporters and/or voters who have been invigorated by his campaign and only shows to illustrate how out of touch they really are. If Labour are indeed doomed to another decade in opposition, it won't be the fault of Corbyn.
I'm getting tired of seeing some of the moderate members come out with the old "it'll make us unelectable" line. Obviously they've had their eyes closed for the last two general elections.
I reckon if Corbyn gets in, then Burnham will feature, but I also reckon Cooper and Kendal will resume life in the back benches. The way they're going on, in an attempt to undermine Corbyn, really has no place in the party.
The whole Labour purge thing is annoying me too. It was quite clearly quoted from Harriet's mouth about who can vote, but that now seems to have become that you can only vote for the right candidates. It's funny how they only apply democracy when it suits.
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - MurdnunoC - 26 Aug 2015
(26 Aug 2015, 8:00 pm)aureolin wrote I'm getting tired of seeing some of the moderate members come out with the old "it'll make us unelectable" line. Obviously they've had their eyes closed for the last two general elections.
I reckon if Corbyn gets in, then Burnham will feature, but I also reckon Cooper and Kendal will resume life in the back benches. The way they're going on, in an attempt to undermine Corbyn, really has no place in the party.
The whole Labour purge thing is annoying me too. It was quite clearly quoted from Harriet's mouth about who can vote, but that now seems to have become that you can only vote for the right candidates. It's funny how they only apply democracy when it suits.
Agreed. It's the Blue Labour movement which has made the party unelectable over the years. As I've said elsewhere in the thread, politics needs to be oppositional and dynamic - this, in my opinion, is not what we have now. Why choose Tory-lite when you can have the real thing?
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - Andreos1 - 26 Aug 2015
(26 Aug 2015, 7:47 pm)aureolin wrote What a fantastic guy he is. I can't believe how many people have been reinvigorated by him running for leader.Hopefully you are right.
I predict a landslide in little over two weeks time.
He has inspired people to stand up to the alternative and that should be applauded.
No doubt he will have to bat away the negative spin that comes his way.
(26 Aug 2015, 7:52 pm)MurdnunoC wrote It's just a shame that most who hold either a position of power or influence with the party are doing their best to undermine or discredit him.
It's a real insult to the majority of Labour members, supporters and/or voters who have been invigorated by his campaign and only shows to illustrate how out of touch they really are. If Labour are indeed doomed to another decade in opposition, it won't be the fault of Corbyn.
The party should listen to the people who vote and voice an opinion.
Listening to those in a higher position and towing the line, isn't in the longer term interests of the organisation.
I said a while back, there needed to be a well oiled, left leaning alternative. Hopefully this is it.
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - LeeCalder - 28 Aug 2015
Controlling your own borders and looking after your own people first isn't righ-wing or left-wing, it's plain common sense.
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - MurdnunoC - 28 Aug 2015
(28 Aug 2015, 9:46 pm)LeeCalder wrote Controlling your own borders and looking after your own people first isn't righ-wing or left-wing, it's plain common sense.
But aren't we all human? Shouldn't we show compassion to those seeking a better life away from poverty and war? Is this not the shadows of imperialistic conquest coming back to haunt the western world for the resources we've plundered and the image of 'betterness' we like to promote? Do we not have a sense responsibility?
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - Andreos1 - 01 Sep 2015
(30 Aug 2015, 10:52 am)Adam wrote https://corporate.sky.com/media-centre/news-page/2015/sky-news-to-host-decisive-labour-leadership-debateNah, I would have liked to have gone. But wont be able to make it.
The four Labour leadership candidates are to visit The Sage on Thursday for the final debate before the new leader is elected. It begins at 7pm. Sky news will be broadcasting it live.
I would like to attend, but unfortunately none of my friends are really into politics. Is anyone else going?
In other news, does anyone want to let number 10 know they missed a bit off the map?
https://mobile.twitter.com/Number10gov/status/638252605379100672
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - Adrian - 01 Sep 2015
I'd have attended, but I'm in Edinburgh, and won't be back until about half 8.
RE: Politics (and other political stuff) - R852 PRG - 05 Sep 2015
I see a petition has been started to replace Katie Hopkins with 50,000 Syrian refugees. I've signed up.