(09 Oct 2022, 9:34 am)Unber43 wrote Where are Stagecoach going to take their services when Blacklett Street shuts, because its only going to add to Congestion are they going to end up Granger Street, market Street then New Bridge Street and stopping in between as that is just going to add to Congestion and the queues which are already long enough.

(10 Oct 2022, 12:21 am)Starscream wrote The council are being very disingenuous in calling this a bus loop. A true bus loop has the benefits that someone above mentioned - it matters not how far it is to walk across the loop to change from one service to another, since, if it is really necessary, passengers with luggage or children or mobility issues can just stay on the bus a little longer, until the bus has arrived at the stop or street where their connecting service also calls at, as it makes its own way around the loop.

Stagecoach are rightly upset because it surely has to already be the case that of all the major cities with supposedly well served and efficient bus networks, expecting people with luggage or kids or mobility issues to walk from Blackett Street to Haymarket is already quite ridiculous, especially for people who perhaps already do have alternative means of travel, means that are far less environmentally and socially responsible than a good old bus. Adding a few hundred yards to that journey, and envisioning it to be through crowds apparently, all in the name of progress, surely takes the biscuit.

It wouldn't be so bad if the council had a solid track record of creating and managing pedestrianised areas in the city centre that are clean, safe and actually pleasant to walk through or even linger, but, well, they don't, do they?

(10 Oct 2022, 4:52 pm)Unber43 wrote Its not really a loop for GNE services anyway as all of them except the Q3 terminate in Newcastle, and some interwork with other service e.g X45/30/31 really it would be great if you could get on from John Dobson Street instead of walking all the way to Eldon Square.  

I know passengers when the 50/26 interworked at Sheilds a few of them stayed on the 26 as it turned into the 50.

(10 Oct 2022, 6:31 pm)Andreos1 wrote But surely that's up to them to manage appropriately and make it more attractive? 

When getting to somewhere such as Central Station via the metro from Gateshead is easier and more convenient (for a vast proportion of the population that side of the river) than using a combination of buses and seeing that very little is being done about filling those gaps, then there's serious questions need asking.

(10 Oct 2022, 7:10 pm)DeltaMan wrote What gaps? Gateshead and Heworth Interchanges were built exactly for this sort of trip.

(10 Oct 2022, 8:08 pm)Andreos1 wrote Aye, but then 1986 happened and then a few years later, the High Level Bridge ended up being one-way... 

Hence those gaps. That need exploiting or filling.

20221010_202941.jpg (Size 4.49 MB | Downloads 18)

(10 Oct 2022, 8:21 pm)DeltaMan wrote 1986 is totally irrelevant (see attached for example of a commercial operator exploiting the infrastructure avaliable)

The High Level Bridge and Neville Street/Bewick Street remodelling are highly relevant though.

(10 Oct 2022, 8:29 pm)Andreos1 wrote If course 1986 is relevant. 
It's why those metro stations you mention above stopped working as effectively and ultimately why we see a conga of multi-coloured vehicles following each other in to and ont of the town.

(10 Oct 2022, 8:40 pm)DeltaMan wrote If they've stopped "working". Why are people using them every day to travel to Central Station?

I was one of them for 10 years and can I tell you exactly why it works!

(10 Oct 2022, 8:47 pm)Andreos1 wrote Working or working as effectively?

If it's an integrated travel system, with co-ordinated fares and timetables or the exact opposite, then it's not working as effectively is it?

• Changing Neville Street so there's an extra lane heading East by using the space currently loading bays and bus stops (there won't be any West buses anymore)
  
• Reverse The Bigg Market so heads South to North
  
• Reverse Clayton Street so it heads North to South
  
• Reverse Newgate Street so it heads East to West.
  

(10 Oct 2022, 9:08 pm)DeltaMan wrote No system is perfect. This isn't the Truman Show or Transport Tycoon where everything works to the second.

Indeed, my very worst experience of "integration" have actually been in London where evening services outside zone 1 and 2 (the part the politicians don't or won't see) are hopelessly uncoordinated.

I am not sure what this has to do with Blackett Street other than my original point demonstrating what NCC did at Neville Street and Bewick Street can lead unforeseen outcomes

(11 Oct 2022, 11:24 am)Andreos1 wrote I'm not sure anyone ever said it was The Truman Show or Transport Tycoon

However, when an integrated system works better than an un-integrated system and passengers are still forced to use the model that proceeded 1986 because of a total lack of an alternative - then something is seriously wrong.

(11 Oct 2022, 2:45 pm)DeltaMan wrote So you'd quite merrily chuck up to 500k per SERVICE in order to put extra resource in order for services crossing the Tyne to also serve the Rail Station? I'd love to see the expected ROI of that...   Or what would you cut to in order to avoid a "conga line" of even more buses crossing the river? I'd like to know, as those are the things that would dictate such as request.

Or maybe, Gateshead and Heworth Interchange works.....

(11 Oct 2022, 8:02 pm)Andreos1 wrote Who has mentioned anything about cutting or spending additional resource?

Youre making lots of assumptions here mind. 

It's not about that and never has been about that.
It is about a network of services that haven't filled a gap. A gap created by de-reg, but one that is still filled by the system set up prior to de-reg.

Let's make the network better. Let's improve what we've got, rather than stagnate and put up with the same old.

(12 Oct 2022, 12:06 pm)DeltaMan wrote They aren't assumptions, they are facts.

If I'm Bobs Buses and run a route making 100k profit a year between Wideopen and Haymarket, why should I spend an extra 500k on extra buses and drivers to extend it to the Central Station? Despite my route being intergrated with the Metro at Regent Centre and Haymarket?

I know exactly would happen. My reliability would go down the toilet for most of my customers due to the mess NCC are making of the roads and I'd lose a load of money to boot as i'd run virtually empty beyond Haymarket as there is no way you would generate extra customers to cover the shortfall..

These are the same issues Stagecoach will face when it comes to Blackett Street and Go Ahead faced when the HLB closed/NCC made a horlicks of Neville Street. You can't just poo poo these important issues just to get a soundbite about de-regulation or gaps that may cost a fortune to fill.

(12 Oct 2022, 10:38 pm)logidoodah wrote https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/north-east-news/council-shelves-controversial-plans-pedestrianise-25248003

Thought I'd leave this here, totally did not see this coming.

The cabinet report admits that the change in plans means some funding already secured by the council for the Blackett Street, including from the Levelling Up Fund, will be “placed at risk” of being clawed back and will now have to be redirected to other projects.