(16 Nov 2023, 2:27 pm)xpm wrote I bet Ben is chomping at the bit to put out a disparaging internal memo to be leaked.

Meanwhile - view from the Unite side of the negotiating table.  Some of you may be a bit too young to get the reference.

(16 Nov 2023, 11:15 am)xpm wrote A bit of an overreaction there perhaps, and stupid, really?

Cost of living excluding everything you mention above has caused outgoings for everyone to go up, but GNEs stance is we're not making enough profit (asides the £85 million we made in group).  Things which employees have little control over like gas, electric, petrol/diesel prices, food, etc has all gone up massively - these are essentials - not optional.

Staff buses run from high density driver areas - a lot of drivers areas have no service at all - so that is an essential cost to them.

Employment in an ideal world should be based on mutual respect - not a one way transaction where the employer throws you some bones at the end of the week grudgingly and tries its best to get out of doing so, and tries to find ways to make you work longer for the same pay, and lambast and degrade you at every possible opportunity.

An employer has a responsibility to ensure that none of it's employees are forced to work overtime just to meet their day to day needs.  When overtime does dry up GNE are quite happy to cut off employees like junkies needing their fix with no thought for the help they have given the company, either at short notice, or the fact they rely on the extra to make ends meet (and any manager who says they don't know who those people are, are lying).  I'm not going to even enter into the discussion about children - it's quite clear from what you've written you do not have any, or appreciate any of the ups and downs of family life in that regard.

(16 Nov 2023, 1:56 pm)TEN 6083 wrote

Update from today


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(16 Nov 2023, 3:11 pm)Iamtheone8483748 wrote Is there a possibility that they are now close to an agreement given nothing is being said publicly now? or is the situation just worsening?

(16 Nov 2023, 1:14 pm)deanmachine wrote That's not true.

(16 Nov 2023, 1:33 pm)mb134 wrote So would you be advocating the bus drivers to look for alternate employment to improve their income? 

Obviously the outcome of that is a shortage of drivers, which is what we've witnessed these past few years.

Making the job unappealing, through poor compensation packages and (allegedly) deteriorating terms and conditions is the fault of the companies, and should probably be a top priority to fix.

I think there needs to be a change of how people view salaries in this country. The amount of comments you see on social media slating the drivers for wanting a better wage because "x workers are only paid £x" is quite sad. There are a decent chunk of people who still view what was deemed a good salary 10-15 years ago as good today - when that's not the case at all.

(16 Nov 2023, 2:38 pm)MurdnunoC wrote Since your post as already been ripped apart by others, I'll pick up on this.

Liz Truss did cause our economy to nosedive, no allegedly about it.

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(16 Nov 2023, 3:28 pm)streetdeckfan wrote Yes, if they're in the situation where they need more money, they should look for a job that will pay them more.

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(16 Nov 2023, 6:04 pm)tvd wrote Some drivers must be enjoying what is similar to a furlough scheme that they weren't able to enjoy during Covid - paid to stay off work.

While they're within their rights to strike and ask for better pay and conditions, having a permanent strike is way over the top and is treating the passengers terribly, in my opinion.

Nor will it help the drivers in the long run, because it will only mean their customer base shrinks as people make alternative arrangements, and/or more services will be cut to help pay for pay increases. Inflation coming down doesn't help their argument either.

(16 Nov 2023, 7:56 pm)MurdnunoC wrote Inflation going down makes absolutely no difference in the current dispute as prices rose by 10% over the past year, due to inflation, and are still rising - albeit by less than before.

All the inflation figure means is that, when it comes negotiating the next pay rise, the percentage increase will be less than it is now, providing inflation continues to fall.

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(15 Nov 2023, 9:56 pm)Dan wrote Oh, absolutely. Each individual has a different motivation.

Some will genuinely be on strike because they feel the pay offer isn’t acceptable, others are on strike because they have seen how ‘scabs’ have been treated by their colleagues, and however unlikely you deem the scenario to be, it is the truth that some are using this as an opportunity for ‘free holiday’.

Most of us on this forum are bus users, are directly employed by the company, or have friends/family who are employed by the company. This means that the strike is affecting almost all of us on this forum. One thing that we can all agree on is that the company and Unite need to resolve the dispute as soon as possible.

(16 Nov 2023, 8:04 am)F114TML wrote Yup. One of the drivers at our depot went in otherwise he would've defaulted on his debts. Not only is he nearly universally hated, you can get yourself on the hitlist for even talking to him.

Hell, after the first strike we did, everyone who wasn't on strike got blanked, including the engineers and the woman who runs the canteen.

(16 Nov 2023, 11:15 am)xpm wrote Employment in an ideal world should be based on mutual respect - not a one way transaction where the employer throws you some bones at the end of the week grudgingly and tries its best to get out of doing so, and tries to find ways to make you work longer for the same pay, and lambast and degrade you at every possible opportunity.

An employer has a responsibility to ensure that none of it's employees are forced to work overtime just to meet their day to day needs.  When overtime does dry up GNE are quite happy to cut off employees like junkies needing their fix with no thought for the help they have given the company, either at short notice, or the fact they rely on the extra to make ends meet (and any manager who says they don't know who those people are, are lying).  I'm not going to even enter into the discussion about children - it's quite clear from what you've written you do not have any, or appreciate any of the ups and downs of family life in that regard.

(16 Nov 2023, 5:16 pm)Ambassador wrote I give up....

(16 Nov 2023, 8:56 pm)Ambassador wrote I’m intrigued how escalation leverage will work. Unite themselves call it the nuclear options, but some observations.

They target shareholders, the wider group is returning a solid profit. Sharon Graham turning up with a placard and some reps outside an office in Canada would cause bemusement.

They target customers and suppliers. It’s unlikely an already stretched industry supplier network will boycott GNE. It’s unlikely a PTE like Nexus will suddenly stop dealing with GNE, partly as there’s no real alternative in some cases.

From a people perspective I’m intrigued how it plays out. We moved on from a union model to a colleague forum model last year and I personally find a more local approach more beneficial…from both sides

(16 Nov 2023, 9:18 pm)Adrian wrote They'll naturally keep most of the cards close to their chest, I'd imagine, but I'd see it similar options to what you've suggested being played out. Targeting of shareholders, customers (not Joe Public) and suppliers, and pretty much anyone connected to the business.

Interested that you've moved to a colleague forum model. Is that alongside relations with your Trade Unions? I'm assuming you haven't gone through statutory derecognition! Without going too off-topic, I've been a member of both, although elected to a colleague forum (works council as a TU rep). Employers tend to like colleague forums better, but the rights an independent trade union has in comparison, usually makes them look rather toothless.

(16 Nov 2023, 3:28 pm)streetdeckfan wrote Yes, if they're in the situation where they need more money, they should look for a job that will pay them more.

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(16 Nov 2023, 10:41 pm)Unber43 wrote Why do you think we have a drivers shortage

(17 Nov 2023, 9:11 am)streetdeckfan wrote Because they're doing what they should be doing and looking for a higher paid job instead of begging for more money

(17 Nov 2023, 9:11 am)streetdeckfan wrote Because they're doing what they should be doing and looking for a higher paid job instead of begging for more money

(17 Nov 2023, 9:11 am)streetdeckfan wrote Because they're doing what they should be doing and looking for a higher paid job instead of begging for more money

(17 Nov 2023, 2:55 pm)MurdnunoC wrote Out of interest, do you still use the bus? I know a while back you indicated you were tempted to purchase an electric vehicle of some kind; did this ever transpire?

(17 Nov 2023, 2:55 pm)MurdnunoC wrote Out of interest, do you still use the bus? I know a while back you indicated you were tempted to purchase an electric vehicle of some kind; did this ever transpire?

(17 Nov 2023, 4:24 pm)Andreos1 wrote I heard they couldn't afford one. But hasn't gone and got a new job with a bigger wage. 
Don't know how true it is.

(17 Nov 2023, 8:44 pm)streetdeckfan wrote On the contrary actually, I dropped down to part time on my main job and took up another lower paid job just to get out the house (and have less responsibility). As much as I like the benefits of WFH, 10 years of it was enough.

(17 Nov 2023, 8:44 pm)streetdeckfan wrote Yes, I do in fact still use the bus.
As for the EV, it's still on the cards but I'm probably going to end up moving house first due to some completely insufferable neighbours! It's got to the point where I've even considered renting temporarily!

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On the contrary actually, I dropped down to part time on my main job and took up another lower paid job just to get out the house (and have less responsibility). As much as I like the benefits of WFH, 10 years of it was enough.

(17 Nov 2023, 8:49 pm)Unber43 wrote Could you not have done WFW a few days a week?

(17 Nov 2023, 8:58 pm)Andreos1 wrote So I was right about not going for a bigger wage? 

How dare you. 
How dare you have a job that pays less. 
Disgusting.

(17 Nov 2023, 8:58 pm)streetdeckfan wrote We haven't had a physical office for many years now, and even if we still had it I wouldn't fancy trekking all the way to Jarrow.

Plus, the lack of responsibility is also nice, I just turn up, do my bit, then leave.

Less working late into the evenings because the clients suddenly decided they wanted the report to be completely different and the boss for some reason won't tell them to GFY.

(17 Nov 2023, 8:58 pm)streetdeckfan wrote I don't know how to say this without sounding like a tory, but frankly I didn't need the extra money.

In fact, I could very easily survive on just the part time second job I have because I don't waste money on unnecessary things like friends and family.

If I did for some reason need more money, I would in fact look for a better paying job, I could probably earn a lot more in the same industry by switching companies, but I choose not to.

(17 Nov 2023, 8:44 pm)streetdeckfan wrote Yes, I do in fact still use the bus.
As for the EV, it's still on the cards but I'm probably going to end up moving house first due to some completely insufferable neighbours! It's got to the point where I've even considered renting temporarily!

(17 Nov 2023, 4:24 pm)Andreos1 wrote I heard they couldn't afford one. But hasn't gone and got a new job with a bigger wage. 
Don't know how true it is.

(17 Nov 2023, 9:13 pm)MurdnunoC wrote So if all the bus drivers go and get better paid jobs, and you don't want to work from home due to being bored (or whatever), who is going to drive you to work? 

It's a pretty oxymoronic argument to make from your predicament. A lack of bus drivers means a lack of buses. And a lack of buses means people will migrate to other modes of transport thus less passengers. Less passengers means service reductions which, ultimately, restricts your ability to travel freely. So, like strike action, bus drivers seeking better wages elsewhere has the same overall outcome, so why wouldn't you want the people you rely on to be paid better in order to service your needs?   

As for me, well, I very rarely use the bus so neither strike action or a shortage of bus drivers affects me.


Whether he can afford it or not doesn't matter to me, personally. However, I am reminded of a quote sometimes attributed to the late, and allegedly great, Margaret Thatcher:

"anyone on a bus over the age of 25 is a failure"

As someone who likes espouse Thatcherite ideologies, I hope he moves on the EV pretty soon otherwise he's going to end up a failure, if he isn't already.

(17 Nov 2023, 9:27 pm)streetdeckfan wrote Unfortunately I've been a failure for a while now.

Guess I might as well just jump in front of a bus!

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