(10 Oct 2019, 10:31 pm)Olympian3521 wrote

There’s 6 Toonlink B9’s at Consett which could transfer and go on the Loop now the PVR is 6 but I’m not sure if the Wrightbus issue has affected what happens at Consett.

We were due 30 streetdecks, so just slightly. But also other depots are affected by the knock on of those B9s and streetlites we’re going to replace older vehicles. Still hope a deal might be reached for wrights and the streetdecks arrive.

(11 Oct 2019, 12:18 pm)JP6004 wrote GNE website states emissions of E200 like 4 average cars. A lot better than I thought

I wonder what they use as the 'average car'

(11 Oct 2019, 12:19 pm)streetdeckfan wrote

I wonder what they use as the 'average car'

Presumably not a matchbox one

(11 Oct 2019, 12:22 pm)JP6004 wrote

Presumably not a matchbox one

I'm sceptical of all these official emissions figures, if they're saying it emits the equivalent of 4 average cars, then it probably emits at least the equivalent of 10-12 average cars in the real world, once you take into account all the stopping and starting.

Plus, that figure is probably an empty bus with no seats with just enough fuel to complete the test

(11 Oct 2019, 12:40 pm)streetdeckfan wrote

I'm sceptical of all these official emissions figures, if they're saying it emits the equivalent of 4 average cars, then it probably emits at least the equivalent of 10-12 average cars in the real world, once you take into account all the stopping and starting.

Plus, that figure is probably an empty bus with no seats with just enough fuel to complete the test

Yeah but that bus will be there if whether there's passengers or not. A car will only be polluting if you choose to make that Journey in a car, thus instead of using a bus that's already there, you're adding extra emissions to the environment. 4 average cars sounds about right too, an Enviro 200 has what a 5 litre engine? Which is about the equivalent of 4 car engines, but more efficient because it is only powering 1 individual machine rather than 4 separate ones, not to mention large commercial diesel engines are very very efficient these days. It's basic maths that a bus carrying only a few people is much, much better than 4 cars carrying 1 single person each, I don't know where you're grasping 12 cars from, that's not realistic at all.

(11 Oct 2019, 12:49 pm)deanmachine wrote

Yeah but that bus will be there if whether there's passengers or not. A car will only be polluting if you choose to make that Journey in a car, thus instead of using a bus that's already there, you're adding extra emissions to the environment. 4 average cars sounds about right too, an Enviro 200 has what a 5 litre engine? Which is about the equivalent of 4 car engines, but more efficient because it is only powering 1 individual machine rather than 4 separate ones, not to mention large commercial diesel engines are very very efficient these days. It's basic maths that a bus carrying only a few people is much, much better than 4 cars carrying 1 single person each, I don't know where you're grasping 12 cars from, that's not realistic at all.

I was going off the fact that research shows that stopping 3 times per mile and getting back up to speed triples emissions.

The E200 weighs roughly 6 times the 'average' car when empty and like you say has an engine the equivalent size of 4 cars. Once you take into account the increased drag from the aerodynamics of a brick I fail to see how the emissions can only be equivalent to 4 cars.

I'm not saying that a bus is worse for the environment than a car, far from it, all I'm saying is with manufacturers doing everything in their power to cheat their way through emissions regulations, I don't see how anyone can trust the 'official' figures.

I'm happy to be proven wrong through independent tests, but I honestly don't see it happening

(11 Oct 2019, 12:58 pm)streetdeckfan wrote

I was going off the fact that research shows that stopping 3 times per mile and getting back up to speed triples emissions.

The E200 weighs roughly 6 times the 'average' car when empty and like you say has an engine the equivalent size of 4 cars. Once you take into account the increased drag from the aerodynamics of a brick I fail to see how the emissions can only be equivalent to 4 cars.

I'm not saying that a bus is worse for the environment than a car, far from it, all I'm saying is with manufacturers doing everything in their power to cheat their way through emissions regulations, I don't see how anyone can trust the 'official' figures.

I'm happy to be proven wrong through independent tests, but I honestly don't see it happening

It's better than 4 cars because large diesel engines are a lot more efficient than small passenger car engines. They're above 50% thermal efficiency these days, where a normal petrol/diesel engine struggles to get 35%, I don't have time to dig out all the research I did when I was on placement to Cummins Turbo Technologies at the minute, but I learned a lot about large diesel engines and how good they actually are at converting fossil fuels into energy. This was in 2014, so the technology in a brand new Cummins powered E200 I imagine is getting even better.

I'd also say a bus ran by a company such as GNE has vehicles that are in much better condition than some of the diesel passenger cars driving around with their dirty black smoke coming out of the back of them, so there's another advantage to a bus. I'd be willing to hear an argument that a modern plug in hybrid or electric car is better for the environment than a bus, but they're expensive, and a bus pass is probably better compared to a dirty old diesel car that we should be trying to get off the road.

(11 Oct 2019, 1:27 pm)deanmachine wrote

It's better than 4 cars because large diesel engines are a lot more efficient than small passenger car engines. They're above 50% thermal efficiency these days, where a normal petrol/diesel engine struggles to get 35%, I don't have time to dig out all the research I did when I was on placement to Cummins Turbo Technologies at the minute, but I learned a lot about large diesel engines and how good they actually are at converting fossil fuels into energy. This was in 2014, so the technology in a brand new Cummins powered E200 I imagine is getting even better.

I'd also say a bus ran by a company such as GNE has vehicles that are in much better condition than some of the diesel passenger cars driving around with their dirty black smoke coming out of the back of them, so there's another advantage to a bus. I'd be willing to hear an argument that a modern plug in hybrid or electric car is better for the environment than a bus, but they're expensive, and a bus pass is probably better compared to a dirty old diesel car that we should be trying to get off the road.

I'm not disagreeing with you there, in fact I personally rarely travel by car anymore, I'd much rather take the bus even if the car is more convenient.

Our car is a 12 plate Diesel X-Trail that I'm fairly sure was modded by the previous owner for better economy as it get's better MPG than Nissan claims, and that's with my mother driving who is the literal definition of an uneconomical driver, so there is no doubt that travelling by bus is better for the environment, especially since all the buses that I travel on are Euro 6.

If I do ever decide to get a car myself, it will almost certainly be fully electric, because they are far more efficient in terms of both emissions and energy usage. Plus, the fact that they cost a hell of a lot less to run, have instant torque (a quick car is better than a fast car IMO) and are quiet mean I have no desire to own an ICE car.

What I do disagree with is people wanting to get diesel cars off the road surely it's better to keep the car running, even if it produces more emissions than it is to manufacture a new car.

(11 Oct 2019, 1:45 pm)streetdeckfan wrote

I'm not disagreeing with you there, in fact I personally rarely travel by car anymore, I'd much rather take the bus even if the car is more convenient.

Our car is a 12 plate Diesel X-Trail that I'm fairly sure was modded by the previous owner for better economy as it get's better MPG than Nissan claims, and that's with my mother driving who is the literal definition of an uneconomical driver, so there is no doubt that travelling by bus is better for the environment, especially since all the buses that I travel on are Euro 6.

 If I do ever decide to get a car myself, it will almost certainly be fully electric, because they are far more efficient in terms of both emissions and energy usage. Plus, the fact that they cost a hell of a lot less to run, have instant torque (a quick car is better than a fast car IMO) and are quiet mean I have no desire to own an ICE car.

What I do disagree with is people wanting to get diesel cars off the road surely it's better to keep the car running, even if it produces more emissions than it is to manufacture a new car.

https://www.wired.co.uk/article/lithium-batteries-environment-impact

Heard an interesting presentation a few months back about the negative effects of electric cars and their batteries.

(11 Oct 2019, 1:51 pm)Andreos1 wrote

https://www.wired.co.uk/article/lithium-batteries-environment-impact

Heard an interesting presentation a few months back about the negative effects of electric cars and their batteries.

But as with everything, there are both positives and negatives, even more so with electric cars (I'll see myself out...)

There are more environmentally friendly battery technologies currently being developed, but I don't think any of them are anywhere near mass production status yet

(11 Oct 2019, 12:40 pm)streetdeckfan wrote

I'm sceptical of all these official emissions figures, if they're saying it emits the equivalent of 4 average cars, then it probably emits at least the equivalent of 10-12 average cars in the real world, once you take into account all the stopping and starting.

Plus, that figure is probably an empty bus with no seats with just enough fuel to complete the test

Well our car was doing its fair share of stopping and starting as we headed back from Newcastle to Durham, this afternoon. We needed to bring some big stuff back, so took the car, today, but if the occupants of 12 cars who could catch the bus, did catch the bus, there would be a whole lot less stopping and starting for everyone.

(11 Oct 2019, 5:41 pm)Michael wrote GNE have released a post about the new buses on the 97, this caught my eye:

The buses build on the operator’s existing investment, which has already seen 170 low-emission buses join the fleet in recent years, and a total of £12 million set to be invested in further better buses over the next 12 months.

http://newsroom.gonortheast.co.uk/news/out-with-the-old-and-in-with-the-new-as-go-north-east-invests-1-pounds-8-pence-million-in-state-of-the-art-environmentally-friendly-buses-for-its-green-arrow-dot-dot-dot-384391

Wonder if that includes the new buses for the Red Arrow?

It will do. Go North East are definitely getting new buses for Red Arrows – that's for certain.

(11 Oct 2019, 7:21 pm)BeachBoy99 wrote

It will do. Go North East are definitely getting new buses for Red Arrows – that's for certain.

(11 Oct 2019, 7:22 pm)Michael wrote Ye, wonder what buses though, some reason i'm thinking E400MMC.

I'm still thinking they may end up going for the 6 cylinder StreetDeck

(11 Oct 2019, 10:17 pm)BusLoverMum wrote Grabbed my phone to snap one of the green arrow E200s on Clayton street, this afternoon and got a salute from the driver. Have a feeling that they've had a lot of attention!

Well, considering GNE's social media has been all aboard the hype bus for them I'd be surprised if there is anyone who hasn't been paying attention to them!

(11 Oct 2019, 10:17 pm)BusLoverMum wrote Grabbed my phone to snap one of the green arrow E200s on Clayton street, this afternoon and got a salute from the driver. Have a feeling that they've had a lot of attention!

And how did the photo come out!

(12 Oct 2019, 10:58 am)Michael wrote 5489, 5490, 5492 are now tracking on the 97


4944, 5228, 5253, 8309 is also out on the 97, so not all of the E200's have entered service yet.

There seems to be a few not tracking, which could be the new Enviro's, can anyone confirm which E200's have entered service (apart from the above ones)

Had 5495

(12 Oct 2019, 6:50 am)citaro5284 wrote

And how did the photo come out!

About as you'd expect for a quickly snapped phone pic.

(12 Oct 2019, 6:34 pm)Adtrainsam wrote Are the next stop announcements working on the E200 MMCs yet?

Nope, would've been more surprised if they were tbh.

(12 Oct 2019, 7:03 pm)pbjd wrote

Nope, would've been more surprised if they were tbh.

How come, they’ve been promoting these new buses as having NSAs?