(10 Sep 2023, 3:31 pm)L469 YVK wrote But if anything.....the 351 thrown in and coordinated along with an additional short 307 trip would sort the 33 minute layover situation out for Arriva's evening 306 journeys and although less impactful....GNE's 56  minute gap on the evening 307's.

(10 Sep 2023, 11:35 am)Storx wrote The 351 badly needs to run the full route, there's massive housing estates without an evening bus service at all currently and shouldn't be part of the Coast Road network.

imo the North Tyneside / SE Northumberland subsidised evening service should be the following:

1: Whitley Bay to wherever (Hourly)
19: North Shields to Cramlington (Hourly)
37: Cramlington to West End (Hourly)
41: Wallsend to Hadrian Park (Hourly)
57A: Whitley Bay to Bedlington (Hourly)
306: Extended to Whitley Bay (Hourly)
317: Whitley Bay to Wallsend (Hourly)
342: Killingworth to Wallsend (Hourly)
351: Whitley Bay to Newcastle (Hourly)
353: North Shields to Cramlington (Hourly)
359: Whitley Bay to Killingworth (Hourly)

351 -> 359 -> 342 -> 41 all interworking together.
1 / 306 - Interworking to provide 2 BPH between North Shields and Whitley Bay or thereabouts.

Everything else withdrawn or not replaced including the 54 (not a mistake). It would mean that everywhere would have a bus service 7 days a week, from early to late. There's absolutely no need for the 19 and 317 to be both 2 BPH as now either.

(10 Sep 2023, 3:39 pm)V514DFT wrote Wouldnt it be better to do something with the 335 and interwork that with the 41 infact now the 335 only go's as far as Hadrian Park you could can it altogether
335 Killingworth- Hadrian Park via Wallsend as now to Station Road then Wiltshire Drive/Wiltshire Gardens, West Street High Street West,Wallsend Interchange, Station Road, Mullen Road, Battle Hill Drive, Hadrian Park (The Bush), return same as Wallsend-Hadrian Park to Wallsend Interchange, then via Station Road (The Forum), Elton Street West, West Street, then the same route as Killingworth- Wallsend
342 would no longer serve West Street and High Street West, instead serving Station Road, The Forum, Wallsend Interchange, swapping with the 41/335

(10 Sep 2023, 5:58 pm)Thomas12 wrote Agree with that, although the 317 is relatively busy in the evening. Probably gets more passengers than the 1.

The 19 could be scrapped all together on an evening/Sunday as it's a waste of time in it's current form, if they could work out a way for the 319 to incorporate the Fish Quay.

(10 Sep 2023, 6:20 pm)Storx wrote Aye can't disagree tbh. The idea behind that 19 was to give East Cramlington a bus service as there's nothing along there currently and give Seghill a Metro link all night. 

Must admit I don't know about the 317 like just seems overkill to be subsidising it so much, same with the 1 every 30 minutes tbh.

(10 Sep 2023, 6:51 pm)Thomas12 wrote Yes, it would make sense to have a 19 running from Northumberland Park to Cramlington on an evening as opposed to North Shields to Northumberland Park where it carries mostly fresh air from what I've seen.

The evening journeys on the 1 that are subsidised are only hourly (it's just the 21:58, 22:58, 23:58 departures from Newcastle, and the 20:12, 21:12, 22:12, and 23:12 journeys from Whitley Bay) - not sure if the Newcastle to Metrocentre section is subsidised but that's only hourly too.

(17 Sep 2023, 1:08 pm)L469 YVK wrote Just thought about this. Some posters have mentioned about having an X39 doing the 309 route from Blyth to Cobalt, then only calling at Silverlink & Willington Square before Newcastle. Now....the big issue is that demand could fluctuate between Cobalt & Newcastle outside of the peak times. Now a fast service to the Cobalt would be a huge welcome by all accounts, it's just working out how it would be managed outside of the peak times to ensure the route can remain profitable. So I've come up with the following.........

https://maps.app.goo.gl/rUipZ9HiUqMY1Br56 (note that Silver Fox Way and Quicksilver Way would be served rather than The Silverlink North

Route would be all stops between Blyth and East Benton Rise, then completely non-stop to Newcastle (maybe additionally serving the Corner House and Cradlewell depending on timekeeping?).

I haven't worked out how to deal with the other parts of the Coast Road network yet but.....the 351 would still serve a purpose to some extent although would no longer need to serve Holystone Park.

The main driver behind the above idea is not only a faster alternative to the 308 & 309......but also targeting the "high car use" areas with a half-decent offering rather than a completely random hourly service.

(14 Jan 2024, 10:28 pm)L469 YVK wrote Thought I'd post this given the time and year, and no about another set of changes come March. A simple idea without re-inventing the wheel, but gives a faster service to Newcastle and opens better links from the Marden Estate too including to NT Hospital. Furthermore, would also give GNE a more efficient pattern and driving hours. Will post sample times but in general, running & layover times improved.

306:
- Tynemouth to Newcastle only
- Omits Battle Hill Drive
- No change to frequency

307:
- No change including frequency

309:
- Whitley Bay Seafront to Newcastle only
- Via Marden Estate rather than Hillheads

306/307/309 Coast Road Station Road to Newcastle:
- Up to every 6-7 minutes Monday to Saturday - 9 buses per hour
- Up to every 15 minutes evenings (**including evening only 308)
- Up to every 10 minutes Sundays

307/309 Battle Hill to Newcastle:
- Up to every 7-13 minutes Monday to Saturday
- Up to every 30 minutes Evenings
- Up to every 10-20 minutes Sundays

NEW X38:
- Same as current 308 Blyth to Willington Square, then non stop to Corner House before obeserving all stops to Newcastle Haymarket
- Timed for easy connections to / from services 306 & 309 if requiring Cobalt or other stops along the Coast Road. Through fares available
- Monday to Saturday every 20 minutes
- Sundays every 30 minutes

308**:
- Evenings only running every 60 minutes. No route change


PVR's and interworking patterns

306/X38(308)
Monday to Saturday
X38 > 306 > 306 > X38
- PVR 13x
Evenings
308 > 306 > 306 > 308
- PVR 4x
Sunday daytimes
X10/X11 > 306 > 306 > X10/X11
- PVR 8x
X38
- PVR 5x

307/309
Monday to Saturday
309 > 307 > 307 > 309
- PVR 13x
Evenings
307 > 307
- PVR 2x
309 > 309
- PVR 2x
Sunday daytimes
309 > 307 > 307 > 309
- PVR 9x

Monday to Saturday total PVR would reduce by 3x. Evening total PVR would reduce by 1x. Sunday PVR would increase by 1x. Interworking the 306 with X10/X11 on Sundays and X38 standalone would be necessary to maintain connections with 306 & 309.

(14 Jan 2024, 10:58 pm)Storx wrote Disagree with these, the 306 extension is about linking Tynemouth and Morrisons, not Newcastle. The vast majority of people in Cullercoats walk the small walk to the Metro and save around 30 minutes, especially since it's pretty much 12 TPH from there as you can realistically go either way.

The X38 also doesn't make sense. Any express route should be:
Newcastle - Corner House - NON STOP - Battle Hill (Coast Road) - Tyne Met College (Embleton Avenue) - Silverlink (The Silverlink) - Cobalt - Whitley Bay - Blyth

Cobalt is a destination in it's right heading away from Newcastle, and office workers don't want to go on a magical mystery tour around Battle Hill. You now don't have the problem with people having to change buses anymore.

The 306/307/308 then all could serve Battle Hill. Lynn Road really isn't that important to warrant an express service and you'd solve the 306/308 issue at Battle Hill.

(15 Jan 2024, 8:45 am)L469 YVK wrote I get the logic of a more 'full time' express route to Coablt. But, would it make money off peak?

At least via Billy Mill, it would still have a chance picking up reasonable loads plus....throw a busy shopping / event day in or a matchday, could easily leave Willington Square with an almost full double decker.

Going via Cobalt would lose the Social, Domestic and Pleasure traffic. Something that makes the 308 money on top of commuters.

(16 Jan 2024, 10:06 pm)Ambassador wrote Cobalt is probably at its peak for express services to be honest, the bigger employers are still  hybrid and office days a result tend to be a more traditional 8-4/9–5 approach. You’ll see 309s and 22s carry fresh air through cobalt during the day

The 22X and X39 tend to be well loaded and whilst the 39 used to be the busier, since the strike and integrated ticketing the 22X seem more popular (possibly because it doesn’t stop at all stops from Cradlewell into Newcastle which does slow the X39 down and limit the diversion options)

306_307_X38_308_309.pdf (Size 236.75 KB | Downloads 29)

(21 Jan 2024, 12:58 pm)L469 YVK wrote As promised 

Arriva times and Go North East times colour coordinated accordingly too. Note that Sunday daytime X10/X11's would need to interwork with service 306. Stand's L & M at Haymarket would also need barriers removed and merged into a bigger Stand L with 2x bays (you'll see what I mean in the timetable).

Another consideration.....would the X38/308 continue to run via Ridley Park, or could Ridley Park maybe be picked up by an alternative service so that the X38/308 can retain some of the links provided on the Broadway by service 309?

In a nutshell, the whole motives behind the suggested changes are:

* Reduce overbussing especially between NT Hospital and Blyth.
* Improve reliability especially between Blyth and North Tyneside - more robust timetables that should hopefully cover a 'sunny day'.
* Improved links for the Marden Estate and quicker journey time into Newcastle.
* Reduced wastage such as the long evening 306 & 307 layovers in Tynemouth & North Shields.

(21 Jan 2024, 2:28 pm)Storx wrote That 309 would carry around fresh air, it's literally resurrecting the X9 from around 2012, which failed miserably as it's way too long from Marden estate and serves nothing else in the process. Only someone mad would use it over the X38 as it's not competitive from Whitley Bay.

(21 Jan 2024, 12:58 pm)L469 YVK wrote As promised 

In a nutshell, the whole motives behind the suggested changes are:

* Reduce overbussing especially between NT Hospital and Blyth.
* Improve reliability especially between Blyth and North Tyneside - more robust timetables that should hopefully cover a 'sunny day'.
* Improved links for the Marden Estate and quicker journey time into Newcastle.
* Reduced wastage such as the long evening 306 & 307 layovers in Tynemouth & North Shields.

(21 Jan 2024, 6:05 pm)mb134 wrote The "X38" takes longer between Blyth and Newcastle than the current 308? How would they try and spin that as an express?

It's also slower than your proposed evening all stops 308?

(21 Jan 2024, 5:36 pm)L469 YVK wrote Each route would have a different purpose though, hence reducing the whole 'overlap'. If someone was travelling from Whitley Bay, Foxhunters (including parts Marden if able to walk) or Preston Grange to Newcastle, they'd likely use the X38/308.
306 purpose:
- Metro replacement if Metro is off
- Tynemouth, North Shields, Collingwood, Chirton, Silverlink
- All stops along the Coast Road (with some feed from the X38)
- Coast Road / Station Road to Newcastle
307 purpose:
- North Shields, Meadowell, Chirton, New York Hadrian Park, Battle Hill, High Farm
- Battle Hill > High Farm > Coast Road / Station Road to Newcastle
X38 purpose (evening 308 still serving all stops):
- Willington Square, Silverlink, Chirton, Preston Grange, Foxhunters, Hillheads, Whitley Bay, The Coast, Blyth
- Blyth to Cobalt (with change onto 309 at Whitley Bay or NT Hospital)
- Seaton Sluice, Whitley Bay, Hillheads, Foxhunters, Preston Grange, Chirton, Silverlink, Willington Square fast to High Heaton, Jesmond, Newcastle
309 purpose:
- Blyth to Cobalt link (in conjunction with X38)
- Marden to Newcastle (still faster than 306)
- Marden to NT Hospital direct link re-instated.
- Offers some locations or nearby locations previously covered by 308 and no longer observed by X38.
- Cobalt then Battle Hill > High Farm > Coast Road / Station Road to Newcastle
Also looking at current common corridors:
- Coast Road / Station Road to Newcastle - excluding the X38 from Corner House, reduced from 12bph to 9bph. Likely that 306, 307 and 309 will carry more passengers as a result along this stretch
- Battle Hill to Newcastle - reduced from 9bph to 6bph, 307 and 309 will carry more passengers
- Billy Mill to Newcastle - some will tend towards X38 although coincidentally still 'some' headway with 306. But the 306 would mainly be focussed on any passengers needing all stops along the Coast Road as opposed to more into High Heaton, Jesmond or Newcastle.
- Preston Grange, Foxhunters, Hillheads, Whitley Bay, The Coast, Blyth - Reduced from 6bph to 3bph. Therefore, X38 would likely carry more on this stretch.
Speaking of the Ridley Park or Broadway issue in Blyth, if GNE decided to do a u-turn for the umpteenth time on extending the Coaster to wherever in Gateshead and instead curtail at Gateshead Interchange or Newcastle.......could be an opportunity to open up a new full coastal link to Blyth and solve the Ridley Park issue out. Although, would need re-numbered 301 in-case some poor soul intending going to Bedlington Station or Ashington ended up in Wallsend or Walkergate haha!

(24 Feb 2024, 11:27 am)L469 YVK wrote Thought of this after taking into account some other ideas posted by other members. This one also includes some of the ex-Arriva secondary services, but the PVR re-allocated and also forms an interworking pattern.

306/307/308/309 (Newcastle - Coast Road - Selby Gardens - Battle Hill Drive)
- Every 30 mins each
- Every 7-8 minutes combined

306 - Go North East (PVR 4x)
- No longer operates between Tynemouth and Whitley Bay
- Same route but additionally serves North Shields interchange
- Better coordination with revised 307

307 - Go North East (PVR 3x)
- Same route as 306 to Silverlink then via Norham Road, Verne Road, The Quadrant, Delaval Avenue, Billy Mill Avenue and Albion Road toNorth Shields Interchange
- Better coordination with 306 to and from North Shields....actually slightly faster by a few minutes

308 - Go North East (PVR 4x)
- Same route as 309 after Battle Hill Drive to Cobalt then New York Road, Norham Road North, Westminster Avenue, NT Hospital and Marden Estate to Whitley Bay
- Up to 15 minute frequency NT Hospital to Newcastle via New York & Cobalt

309 - Arriva Northumbria (PVR 5x**)
- Same 309 route as now after Battle Hill Drive
- Provides upto 15 minute service with X38 NT Hospital to Blyth

X38 - Arriva Northumbria (PVR 5x**)
- Every 30 minutes
- Same as current 308 Blyth to Wallsend Dene then non stop to Civic Centre, St Mary's Place and Haymarket
- Provides upto 15 minute service with 309 NT Hospital to Blyth

** X38 & 309 interwork in Blyth

Arriva would lose a PVR of 5x, but would also lose most of their dead mileage

The other ideas.....

300 - Go North East (PVR 4.5x***)
- Every 30 minutes
- Newcastle to North Shields via Coast Road, Cross Avenue, Wiltshire Drive, High Farm, Battle Hill, Hadrian Park, Middle Engine Lane, Norham Road, Wallsend Road, Ripley Avenue and Meadowell

36 - Go North East (PVR 4.5***)
- Re-numbered from 353 and increased to every 30 minutes
- Every 15 minutes combined with Stagecoach's 37 Killingworth to Cramlington with ticket acceptance on both services

*** Services 300 & 36 interwork in North Shields

The other ex-Arriva services
- 351 - Omits Wiltshire Drive
- 352 - Withdrawn
- 354 - Can be replaced by............

* 359 which does the old 335 loop in New York & Murton.
* X63 > becomes service 356 doing the Killingworth loop then old 54/356 route to Newcastle. X63 still runs during peaks.

- 355 replaced by 38 and 356. X7/X8 observe all stops Matthews Bank to Newcastle all day as per current evening arrangements.

- Through fares on service 359 & 335 as far as Four Lane Ends to keep some connections from the 354.

(24 Feb 2024, 11:27 am)L469 YVK wrote Thought of this after taking into account some other ideas posted by other members. This one also includes some of the ex-Arriva secondary services, but the PVR re-allocated and also forms an interworking pattern.

306/307/308/309 (Newcastle - Coast Road - Selby Gardens - Battle Hill Drive)
- Every 30 mins each
- Every 7-8 minutes combined

306 - Go North East (PVR 4x)
- No longer operates between Tynemouth and Whitley Bay
- Same route but additionally serves North Shields interchange
- Better coordination with revised 307

307 - Go North East (PVR 3x)
- Same route as 306 to Silverlink then via Norham Road, Verne Road, The Quadrant, Delaval Avenue, Billy Mill Avenue and Albion Road toNorth Shields Interchange
- Better coordination with 306 to and from North Shields....actually slightly faster by a few minutes

308 - Go North East (PVR 4x)
- Same route as 309 after Battle Hill Drive to Cobalt then New York Road, Norham Road North, Westminster Avenue, NT Hospital and Marden Estate to Whitley Bay
- Up to 15 minute frequency NT Hospital to Newcastle via New York & Cobalt

309 - Arriva Northumbria (PVR 5x**)
- Same 309 route as now after Battle Hill Drive
- Provides upto 15 minute service with X38 NT Hospital to Blyth

X38 - Arriva Northumbria (PVR 5x**)
- Every 30 minutes
- Same as current 308 Blyth to Wallsend Dene then non stop to Civic Centre, St Mary's Place and Haymarket
- Provides upto 15 minute service with 309 NT Hospital to Blyth

** X38 & 309 interwork in Blyth

Arriva would lose a PVR of 5x, but would also lose most of their dead mileage

The other ideas.....

300 - Go North East (PVR 4.5x***)
- Every 30 minutes
- Newcastle to North Shields via Coast Road, Cross Avenue, Wiltshire Drive, High Farm, Battle Hill, Hadrian Park, Middle Engine Lane, Norham Road, Wallsend Road, Ripley Avenue and Meadowell

36 - Go North East (PVR 4.5***)
- Re-numbered from 353 and increased to every 30 minutes
- Every 15 minutes combined with Stagecoach's 37 Killingworth to Cramlington with ticket acceptance on both services

*** Services 300 & 36 interwork in North Shields

The other ex-Arriva services
- 351 - Omits Wiltshire Drive
- 352 - Withdrawn
- 354 - Can be replaced by............

* 359 which does the old 335 loop in New York & Murton.
* X63 > becomes service 356 doing the Killingworth loop then old 54/356 route to Newcastle. X63 still runs during peaks.

- 355 replaced by 38 and 356. X7/X8 observe all stops Matthews Bank to Newcastle all day as per current evening arrangements.

- Through fares on service 359 & 335 as far as Four Lane Ends to keep some connections from the 354.

(24 Feb 2024, 12:50 pm)MurdnunoC wrote

Sent from my SM-A526B using Tapatalk

(24 Feb 2024, 1:27 pm)Aaron21 wrote How it feels always a service suggestion for the coast road for whatever reason

(24 Feb 2024, 11:51 am)Storx wrote For once, don't really disagree with the Coast Road changes, the only thing I'd personally say is terminate the 309 short at Whitley Bay and instead the extend the 306 through from Tynemouth to Blyth.

I actually think in the leisure months having a Coastal bus which runs the whole stretch from North Shields to Blyth via Tynemouth, Seaton Sluice and Whitley Bay could actually be quite popular. It's some different destinations from Blyth than 'another' bus to Newcastle.

Personally though I'd keep the 354 but change it and run it something like this every 30 minutes, every hour on the two separate sections:


It would open quite a few links up especially to Gosforth which is quite difficult to get to without doubling back via Newcastle and also sort out the 351 without it going anywhere near the Coast Road. At the same time, you could cancel the W2 and 335 as neither are really needed anymore, I know there'll be the odd moan from the likes of Hadrian Park to ASDA but it's not worth the tax payers money, all the unique sections which are currently unserved at all are covered. The 335 could however maybe run once a day as a workers service to Quorum - maybe extending to Cobalt to open those links

(24 Feb 2024, 5:44 pm)L469 YVK wrote Haha, fair enough. But there is a serious issue though. GNE & Arriva have added running time for March's changes. And that's without thousands of homes propped up. The traffic siutation is only going to get worse and ever since the 44 was withdrawn, the east of North Tyneside has been crying out for an express.

If GNE, Arriva & NOTCA/TNE get it right, it could create future growth.

---

Only issue with the 354 replacement if the 359 wasn't to run, would be the lack of NT Hospital to Backworth / Killingworth service.

Only thing is could the 359 still run, or maybe interwork with one of the 351/354 replacements?

(24 Feb 2024, 6:27 pm)Storx wrote I'd probably see what could be done with the 359, could you run it through Monkseaton for example maybe instead and give links to the hospital from there for example. 

If you pull it out of the 351/335 though it could be ran with breadvans which would save money. There's absolutely no need for Streetlites on there. There's still need for the hospital links either way or maybe it could be an extended 342 with the 342 curtailed between to only Killingworth and Wallsend. It's a right dog leg route right now and the 342 is not busy West of Killingworth either whenever I see it.

(24 Feb 2024, 7:00 pm)Shrek wrote The 342 between Kingston Park and Wideopen is often busy. It's a popular shopping route for people in Hazlerigg/Wideopen/Seaton Burn to either Tesco at Kingston Park or Morrisons at Killingworth.