(10 Oct 2022, 6:28 pm)Andreos1 wrote I used to have the same mindset.

Then ticket prices increased, then journey times increased (due to the direct buses being cancelled) and then the later journies ceased to exist.

I dont use the bus now.

(10 Oct 2022, 7:16 pm)Unber43 wrote Another with the X1, the Dalton Park journeys the last one was at 16:31 towards Dalton Park and the first one was 9pm, and really extending it to Dalton Park makes no/little sense when Seaham via Deneside, possibly even upto Dawdon/Parkside is just another 20 mins, and if they are still at 15 mins the PVR should be enough, and extending it atleast along Princess Road (i think) should give back what the 62 lost)

(10 Oct 2022, 8:07 pm)ALavery wrote Why on earth would you take it to parkside? It’s an “express” service that should finish at the harbour leaving an easy route in and out of seaham. Realistically it would be better off going either the X6 route to the harbour or the 65 route. But then that could be also done by timing the X10 and 65 a bit better especially on an evening. 

About the parkside thing. Realistically there should be some sort of 60A which in my eyes would take the 61A route to B&M then follow the normal 60 route until new strangford roundabout where it would turn up into dawdon then to the harbour or dalton park if it really needed to. That gives a replacement to the 62.

(11 Oct 2022, 6:30 am)F114TML wrote What a lot of people in Dawdon moaned about when the 62 was cancelled was the loss of a direct bus to Peterlee and Easington.

None of these suggestions solve that, and short of diverting the X6 it'd have to be a new route.

(11 Oct 2022, 7:54 am)Unber43 wrote But then that adds say 10 mins either way, and extending it to easington is just creating the 62.

I don't know about you but the X6 has excellent loadings.

(11 Oct 2022, 8:56 am)Drifter60 wrote We’ve had this discussion before. Parkside has a more than adequate service, every 12 minutes (every 15 mins due to temporary reductions right now) giving 5 buses an hour. Parkside has one way in, one way out it’s only suitable for services terminating there. If you were to extend/ terminate other routes up there it have to be at the expense of some journeys on the 60. But the whole idea of when the 60 was introduced was to give a regular service to Parkside instead of a mismatch of routes/frequencies. Connections can be made at the harbour.

A true Newcastle express from Seaham I think would have to take 1 or 2 routes to be a true express, either via Station Road and Seaton to Houghton then route join the X1 route from there. Or limited stop via Ryhope and Tunstall to Doxford and then A19 to go either up to Heworth or along the A1231 to serve Washington. Going up to Dalton Park then through Murton to Hetton and then along the X1 route wouldn’t be an express service it’d be too slow. The X1 from Dalton Park wasn’t really a Newcastle express, the X10 does that. It was just a new direct link to Houghton and Washington which didn’t and now doesn’t anymore exist.

(11 Oct 2022, 9:26 am)Storx wrote There's already an express from Seaham it's ran by Class 156's and Class 158's and it's used by 140k people a year* which works out at about 20 people per vehicle which isn't bad.

* not all go to Newcastle

(11 Oct 2022, 9:51 am)col87 wrote It’s also quite full by the time it gets to Hartlepool never mind Seaham.

(11 Oct 2022, 9:26 am)Storx wrote There's already an express from Seaham it's ran by Class 156's and Class 158's and it's used by 140k people a year* which works out at about 20 people per vehicle which isn't bad.

* not all go to Newcastle

(11 Oct 2022, 9:59 am)Storx wrote Yeah agreed, it's just a shame were more obsessed about jamming as many Metro trains as we can between Pelaw and South Hylton which cart around fresh air half the time instead of providing extra trains South towards Middlesbrough.

(11 Oct 2022, 8:56 am)Drifter60 wrote We’ve had this discussion before. Parkside has a more than adequate service, every 12 minutes (every 15 mins due to temporary reductions right now) giving 5 buses an hour. Parkside has one way in, one way out it’s only suitable for services terminating there. If you were to extend/ terminate other routes up there it have to be at the expense of some journeys on the 60. But the whole idea of when the 60 was introduced was to give a regular service to Parkside instead of a mismatch of routes/frequencies. Connections can be made at the harbour.

A true Newcastle express from Seaham I think would have to take 1 or 2 routes to be a true express, either via Station Road and Seaton to Houghton then route join the X1 route from there. Or limited stop via Ryhope and Tunstall to Doxford and then A19 to go either up to Heworth or along the A1231 to serve Washington. Going up to Dalton Park then through Murton to Hetton and then along the X1 route wouldn’t be an express service it’d be too slow. The X1 from Dalton Park wasn’t really a Newcastle express, the X10 does that. It was just a new direct link to Houghton and Washington which didn’t and now doesn’t anymore exist

(11 Oct 2022, 4:31 pm)Unber43 wrote The only reason I brought up Parkside was to give Princess Road some service. But really you could do either

Seaham - Station Road - Ryhope - Sunderland - Doxford Park - Washington - Newcastle 
Seaham - Station Road - Seaton - Houghton - Washington - Newcastle 
Seaham - Station Road - Ryhope - Tunstall - Doxford - Follingsby - Heworth. 

You could also argue for an express from Sunderland going to Doxford Park/Follingsby/Heworth.

(12 Oct 2022, 10:40 am)ALavery wrote What’s this obsession with doxford park? It has plenty services running at peak times and if you miss those there’s an every 15 minute service to the town, houghton or Washington which you can then change buses there.

(12 Oct 2022, 11:19 am)Andreos1 wrote  

If I was living in say Penshaw and worked at Doxford Park, public transport isn't a viable or attractive alternative to walking, cycling or the car. 
Chuck in places that are a similar distance, such as Grindon, Pennywell, Seaham, Fencehouses and residents are all in a similar position. 
You're talking 2 or 3 buses in the wrong direction, the inevitable wait and a walk for the majority of them to get to work. The same home.

This is a key employment site. Not some backwater, 1980s industrial estate.
The fact they've had to invest more time and money in widening approaches to the site, again reinforces the need to improve public transport.

(12 Oct 2022, 11:38 am)Storx wrote There's already a works service for all of North Sunderland

https://bustimes.org/services/594-doxford-park-roker#map

There's no demand for more services, bus companies can't be forced to serve places built in the wrong place and sending other buses there will piss passengers off as no-one wants a merry go round drive around a business park for 10 minutes. There's also the 39A/39B from the West which most people could connect to.

It's not an easy fix but sending every bus around there on a 10 minute detour isn't the answer either. Mind there should be some works service from the South I agree with but there's the old council boundary problem there.

(12 Oct 2022, 12:59 pm)V514DFT wrote My step dad (god rest his soul) briefly worked at Doxford Park, and even he said he wouldn't of dreamt of travelling there by bus and was thankful that he could drive, and that was back in 2006/2007

(12 Oct 2022, 10:40 am)ALavery wrote What’s this obsession with doxford park? It has plenty services running at peak times and if you miss those there’s an every 15 minute service to the town, houghton or Washington which you can then change buses there.

(12 Oct 2022, 4:51 pm)Unber43 wrote Simply because Doxford Park doesn't have connections to Newcastle, same with Follingsby not having connections with Sunderland.

Say Fred who lives on the 58 route, he would get the 58 to Gateshead, then the X1 to Houghton then the 39A, and thats if everything is linked up. However if a new service was brought in 58 to Gateshead, then straight to Doxford.

Same for people who work at Follingbsy but might live on A690/Silksworth/Seaham, instead of going into SUnderland, then connecting to Houghton, then connecting to Follingbsy it would reduce the number of buses you would have to take.

Aswell with my 58 example if nothing is lined up e.g just miss a 39A, or the 39A gets to Doxford 5 mins after you're meant to start work you're not going to go to work an hour early.

(12 Oct 2022, 2:42 pm)Andreos1 wrote I mean, why would he? Not unless he was some sort of sadist, who enjoyed putting himself through a bizarre torture ritual, day in/day out. 

No idea where he was travelling from, but unless he lived on a core route - public transport just wouldn't be an option.

(12 Oct 2022, 11:19 am)Andreos1 wrote  

If I was living in say Penshaw and worked at Doxford Park, public transport isn't a viable or attractive alternative to walking, cycling or the car. 
Chuck in places that are a similar distance, such as Grindon, Pennywell, Seaham, Fencehouses and residents are all in a similar position. 
You're talking 2 or 3 buses in the wrong direction, the inevitable wait and a walk for the majority of them to get to work. The same home.

This is a key employment site. Not some backwater, 1980s industrial estate.
The fact they've had to invest more time and money in widening approaches to the site, again reinforces the need to improve public transport.

(12 Oct 2022, 6:57 pm)ALavery wrote If having to change buses is what keeps you from using them then there was never any hope to start with. It’s not exactly a task to get the 60 then 39/A to doxford or for your penshaw example whichever bus into town and then the 39/A, X20 or X1 or even then like I said, bus to houghton and then bus to doxford. 

changing buses is a given of bus travel unless you’re lucky enough for the one you need to stop outside your door. There’s plenty of services go there with an every 15 minute frequency bar the service changes.

Screenshot_20221012_201936_com.google.android.apps.maps.jpg (Size 488.57 KB | Downloads 11)

(12 Oct 2022, 7:23 pm)I’ll Andreos1 wrote So because its always happened, changing buses in obscure locations needs to continue happening? Got ya.

I picked a random location in Penshaw and a random site at Doxford Park. Whacked it in to Google maps and got this:
It's a 5mile journey and assuming connections work, some of those options are taking just shy of an hour. 

Public transport is never going to win in those situations, numbers are going to continue to fall and road infrastructure is going to continue having millions spent on it.

(12 Oct 2022, 7:58 pm)ALavery wrote Ah yes, because an interchange or town/city centre is an obscure place. Got it. 

If you drove the 39 route it would take about half an hour also. So with that conclusion I’m assuming you want a direct bus from penshaw to doxford park picking up no one but you? Buses have routes for a reason, at the end of the day you’d still get there. It’s literally not a difficult job to change bus.

(12 Oct 2022, 7:58 pm)ALavery wrote Ah yes, because an interchange or town/city centre is an obscure place. Got it. 

If you drove the 39 route it would take about half an hour also. So with that conclusion I’m assuming you want a direct bus from penshaw to doxford park picking up no one but you? Buses have routes for a reason, at the end of the day you’d still get there. It’s literally not a difficult job to change bus.

...would open new direct links to newcastle instead of having to get one bus to get on another then get on the metro and then another bus etc

(12 Oct 2022, 8:24 pm)Andreos1 wrote And they wonder why passenger numbers keep on falling? Archaic, clueless views that fail to take in to account the reality of missed opportunities whilst holding on to the dream that things have to stay as they have done forever. Cos its always been like that.

I mean, it...

Isn't that what you wanted just the other week with multiple variations of the X1?

(12 Oct 2022, 7:58 pm)ALavery wrote Ah yes, because an interchange or town/city centre is an obscure place. Got it. 

If you drove the 39 route it would take about half an hour also. So with that conclusion I’m assuming you want a direct bus from penshaw to doxford park picking up no one but you? Buses have routes for a reason, at the end of the day you’d still get there. It’s literally not a difficult job to change bus.

(13 Oct 2022, 6:11 am)Storx wrote Couldn't someone from Penshaw walk to Shiney Row and get the 39B it's not that far :s

Mind I don't really get why the 39B is express between there and Washington rather than serving the estates.