(09 Feb 2023, 6:15 pm)Adrian wrote How long can you continue to throw money at a private business to generate profits, without an acknowledgement that the current system has completely failed and is dead.

(27 Feb 2023, 10:43 pm)James101 wrote Arriva and Cheshire West/East Councils have gone some way to answering this question by announcing the closure of their Winsford depot and Macclesfield outstation with all services withdrawn.

Cheshire have always been ahead of the curve with decay of bus services so I expect this to be increasingly common elsewhere in the future.

The closures will see the vast majority of bus services in the towns of Northwich, Winsford, Sandbach & Macclesfield withdrawn. At present there are no proposed replacements though it seems likely something will be forthcoming.

It seems no buyer could be found for the operations. Given D&G (Centrebus) bought Arriva’s Cannock depot in 2020, it’s a safe assumption conversations were had about Cheshire but it looks as it isn’t an attractive proposition for them. It is established that their Cannock purchase has hardly been a roaring success. Given Centrebus (D&G & High Peak) already have some ops in the area it may well be the case they pick up some work. Given their two small Cheshire depots are at capacity and they clearly weren’t interested in a ready built facility in Winsford, I’m not convinced they will pick up much work unless it comes with the security of tendering.

Arriva’s statement is that they have already had talks with both local authorities they operate in with no success. Perhaps the authorities are waiting to see what is picked up commercially before seeing what they can afford to tender.

There are really very little options for other replacement operators. Stagecoach have a tiny presence at the very north of Cheshire but given that franchising in Greater Manchester poses a threat to their Stockport HQ, it’s unlikely a thinly spread punt in Cheshire will be attractive. Chester is a long way to operate Macclesfield buses from. 

A region of around 300’000 people about to loose most of their bus services. As you say, the system has completely failed and dead.

(28 Feb 2023, 7:24 pm)Storx wrote Don't agree with it of course, but not surprised at all that they're closing shop down there. The area has been leaking money for years, similar with Arriva Midlands. Cheshire and Staffordshire have always been a bit of a minefield, I know First have totally wrecked the network in Stoke aswell but then I guess that's what happens in affluent areas where people won't be seen on buses.

North Yorkshire is just as bad across the board.

Be interesting to see where the buses end up, hopefully not up here though as there's all old wrecks pretty much.

(28 Feb 2023, 10:40 pm)James101 wrote It really is a result of the toxic combination of apathetic authorities and operator. This is surely the end for deregulation? When an entire county can’t sustain a bus service any longer.

There are of course extremely affluent pockets of Cheshire, but towns like Winsford & Northwich are not wealthy areas. Stoke on Trent and Newcastle-under-Lyme are akin to Sunderland and Washington in their populations, ex-industrial base and satellite town set up. Difference is the combined PVR of all operations in the Potteries is less than just Deptford, without even considering Wheatsheaf. 

The Cheshire debacle has highlighted the ignorance of many people in their understanding of bus operators. A change.org to prevent the closures and umpteen comments online for the ‘contract’ to be awarded to someone else. Clearly people don’t realise they have as little power in this as their local Pizza Hut closing down. If Joe Public is already under the impression that buses are franchised, why not pursue the system anyway?

(28 Feb 2023, 11:28 pm)streetdeckfan wrote Would it really be much better if those same 'apathetic authorities' had full control though?

(28 Feb 2023, 10:40 pm)James101 wrote It really is a result of the toxic combination of apathetic authorities and operator. This is surely the end for deregulation? When an entire county can’t sustain a bus service any longer.

There are of course extremely affluent pockets of Cheshire, but towns like Winsford & Northwich are not wealthy areas. Stoke on Trent and Newcastle-under-Lyme are akin to Sunderland and Washington in their populations, ex-industrial base and satellite town set up. Difference is the combined PVR of all operations in the Potteries is less than just Deptford, without even considering Wheatsheaf. 

The Cheshire debacle has highlighted the ignorance of many people in their understanding of bus operators. A change.org to prevent the closures and umpteen comments online for the ‘contract’ to be awarded to someone else. Clearly people don’t realise they have as little power in this as their local Pizza Hut closing down. If Joe Public is already under the impression that buses are franchised, why not pursue the system anyway?

(01 Mar 2023, 8:25 am)Storx wrote One thing that can't be ignored is the relatively decent railway service around there which won't help matters.

It's an awkward area as unless you plow millions and millions of pounds of tax payers money in the area it'll never really work and then again you'll have one bus going to the wrong place on an hourly frequency which isn't useful and people still won't use them and it'll carry around fresh air.

We need a new solution for places like it, what it is I'm not sure. DRT on paper is the answer but so far they haven't worked because they're complicated and confusing to use for Joe Public. It's not unique, North Yorkshire is just as bad and most other rural areas.

(01 Mar 2023, 9:12 am)streetdeckfan wrote As a wise man once said, car sized problems require car sized solutions.

If there's not enough passengers to support a bus service, then a DRT system using buses isn't going to work either. 

Maybe integrating it into the taxi 'network' would be a better use of resources?

Sent from my SM-F721B using Tapatalk

(01 Mar 2023, 9:12 am)streetdeckfan wrote As a wise man once said, car sized problems require car sized solutions.

If there's not enough passengers to support a bus service, then a DRT system using buses isn't going to work either.

Maybe integrating it into the taxi 'network' would be a better use of resources?

Sent from my SM-F721B using Tapatalk

(07 Jun 2023, 8:49 am)citaro5284 wrote I see the BSIP funding can now be used to support existing services.

https://www.route-one.net/news/bsip-funding-can-be-used-to-support-existing-services/

if approval from the Department for Transport (DfT) is gained. 

(07 Jun 2023, 11:24 am)Andreos1 wrote Reckon operators can get some funding for some new begging bowls when they're on?
The old one must be worn out by now.

(01 Mar 2023, 9:12 am)streetdeckfan wrote As a wise man once said, car sized problems require car sized solutions.

If there's not enough passengers to support a bus service, then a DRT system using buses isn't going to work either.

Maybe integrating it into the taxi 'network' would be a better use of resources?

Sent from my SM-F721B using Tapatalk