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+--- Thread: Go North East: 2015/16 Financial Year Order Predictions (/showthread.php?tid=1483)
RE: Go North East: 2015/16 Financial Year Order Predictions - South Tyne Lad - 04 Sep 2015
(04 Sep 2015, 6:19 pm)Dan The 'K' is the mini version (ie the one which was looked at by Riverside engineering last year). The 'N' is the full-size version (ie the one which was on X66 and 8/78). Both are Euro 6, and both quite pricey. The 'K' will be a little less, given that it's a smaller bus.
Worth mentioning Volvo B8RLE 9108 or the Scania K Series Irizar , Which are both totally suited to the X84/X85
Scania K Series Irizar/E300 ( 9 Litre Engine - ZF Ecolife1 6 speed Gearbox )
Volvo B8RLE Wright/MCV ( Volvo D8K 7.7 Litre Engine - ZF Ecolife1 6 speed or Voith DIWA.6 4 Speed )
The ZF is far more suited to faster paced routes like the X84/X85 with different horsepower options in both the Volvo and the Scania .
"Performance of a Citaro but not the price tag"
RE: Go North East: 2015/16 Financial Year Order Predictions - mb134 - 04 Sep 2015
(04 Sep 2015, 9:13 pm)aureolin Suppose it depends really though. It's all good and well removing a limiter, and it's not exactly difficult, but does it go against manufacturer recommendations? Is the bus as efficient at that speed as it is at the capped speed? It may have worse fuel consumption that a comparable vehicle for example.
On certain routes though, it completely takes certain vehicles out of the equation when ordering, as Dan has said earlier. The vehicle obviously won't be as efficient at the higher speed (don't quote me on this figure, but while studying for my theory, I seem to remember reading that a vehicle is up to 30% less fuel efficient at 70 than it is at 50...), but then if services are constantly late because the thing can't exceed 50mph, then customers will get annoyed, even more so when more time has to be added into the timetable because the vehicles can't cope...
RE: Go North East: 2015/16 Financial Year Order Predictions - BusLoverMum - 04 Sep 2015
(04 Sep 2015, 9:09 pm)mb134 With regards to speed limiting on buses, I recall being on ANE's 7524 last year, and noticing a sticker in the cab informing the driver it was limited to 100Km/h (62mph), which is fair enough, it seems stupid to me that the Streetlites are limited to 50mph. Is there a way of changing the limiter on these, I know that it has been said on here that the limit on the B8RLE can be changed, if it can't on the Streetlite then that is surely a major oversight?
I think the Streetlite is really designed as a city bus. It copes well with routes like Arriva Co Durham 22 and GNE Coast and country which have short fast sections but would be a dead loss on anything with long high speed stretches - the same reasoning for not liking the Streetdeck on the X21, in fact.
The whole selling of something that's a bit limited as efficient gets my goat, really. It's not just buses. I bought my iron (of all tedious everyday things) for being lightweight so it doesn't hurt my arthritic hands, but it's sold as being an eco iron. It uses less energy if you use it on the cotton setting instead of the linen one, which makes it all efficient and eco friendly, like
RE: Go North East: 2015/16 Financial Year Order Predictions - G-CPTN - 05 Sep 2015
Specifying a vehicle for a particular route and application can be done by gearing a suitable engine.
Those intended for 'fast' interurban routes require adequate power and gearing to keep the engine speed below an inefficient value, whereas a 'city bus' can operate adequately at lower maximum roadspeeds.
Whether the Streetlites can be adjusted to cope with interurban use depends on whether the gearing will allow increased road-speed without compromising fuel economy.
I have remarked before that there are many options available when specifying vehicles other than the engine size, and, with suitable gearing a large capacity engine might well operate more efficiently than an overstressed lower-powered engine.
I quoted the example of Jaguar's back-to-back economy tests of 2.4 litre and 3.4 litre cars where the 3.4 litre one was more economical - partly due to the gearing and partly due to the smaller-engined car having to 'strain' to keep up with the larger one.
The same applies to buses, a 9 litre engine might be more fuel-efficient than a 5 litre one according to gearing and route characteristics.
Most manufacturers offer a choice of gearing (number of ratios and final-drive ratio) - as well as some transmission types having different 'economies', and a suitable initial choice of specification is essential if fuel economy (and performance) is paramount.
Whether simply increasing the governed speed from 50 mph to 58 mph is possible (and desirable) depends on the vehicle specification. It might be a simple task of adjusting the software that limits the maximum speed, or it might mean running the engine at an inefficient speed that negates the purpose of choosing that vehicle type.
RE: Go North East: 2015/16 Financial Year Order Predictions - grandad - 05 Sep 2015
(04 Sep 2015, 6:29 pm)Dan Worth mentioning that I believe the Scania L94s on the Tynedalexpress are limited to 58 or 59mph, whereas Streetlites are limited to 50mph. The allocation of Streetlites to service X85 would make the timetable completely unachievable, and therefore, I can't see this vehicle type as a likely choice for investment.
Remember also that the X85 is in direct competition with the train so extending the timetable would be a no-no.
RE: Go North East: 2015/16 Financial Year Order Predictions - L469 YVK - 12 Sep 2015
Just with reference to buss14's post on the main page for GNE, I think that although I love the B9TL, they're a wasted bus on the Cobalt Clipper as none of the routes need such power and it is a lot of fuel to use for not too demanding work. At the end of the day, if Volvo B5LH can cope on the 308 albeit a tight timetable courtesy of Arriva, then I think the Streetdeck could cope alright with the 309 / 310 / X39 with no issues.
I personally think that if the Streetdeck was to use less fuel than a GKN modded B9TL, bearing in mind that only one of the Cobalt B9s (I think) have already been done, then I've got a sneaky feeling that GNE could order Streetdecks for the Cobalt Clipper and put the B9's to good use elsewhere like this depending upon what changes happen to the West Durham Express services. The Fab 56 could also go back upto every 10 minutes too:
6085 to 6098 = 14x GKN B9TL / Deptford / Fab 56
6099 to 6100 = 2x B9TL / Deptford / Spare
6101(T) = B9TL / Riverside (or Hexham) / Spare
6102 = B9TL / Riverside (or Hexham) / TEN
6103 to 6104 = 2x GKN B9TL / Deptford / Fab 56
6105 to 6111 = 7x B9TL / Crook / Pronto
6112 to 6117 = 6x B9TL / Stanley / West Durham
________________________________________________
Further Cascades and allocations:
6084(T) = B9TL / Riverside (or Hexham) / Spare
3941 (T) = B7TL / Riverside (or Hexham) / Spare
3942 (T) = B7TL / Crook / Spare
3963 (T) = B7TL / Stanley / Spare
3964 (T) = B7TL / CLS / Angel Spare
3962 and 3965 already part of the Angel PVR.
RE: Go North East: 2015/16 Financial Year Order Predictions - Adrian - 13 Sep 2015
(12 Sep 2015, 11:16 am)DaveyBowyer The Fab 56 could also go back upto every 10 minutes too:
Why? It was slightly decreased to resolve reliability issues, which it's done. I don't see why they'd go back to every 10 minutes, and end up having to face the same issues again?
RE: Go North East: 2015/16 Financial Year Order Predictions - L469 YVK - 02 Oct 2015
13 minutes ago
Order prediction:
- 15+2 spare Deckers for Red Arrows service X1.
Cascades:
- 6001 to 6007 = Crook Pronto service X21.
- 6049 (T) = Riverside as a spare.
- 6050 = Riverside as a spare.
- 6051 to 6055 = Stanley Northern service 6
- 3941 = Crook spare
- 3942 = Stanley Spare
- 3943 = Wherever needed
Or............
- 16 or 17+2 spare Streetdecks for Cobalt Clipper.
Cascades:
- 3941 = Crook spare
- 3962 and 3965 = Percy Main DFDS
- 6084 = Riverside Spare
- 6101 (T) = Riverside / Hexham TEN (just needs new vinyls)
- 6102 to 6108 (6104 [GKN Modded] swapped with 1x from Deptford) = Crook Pronto service X21
- 6109 to 6112 = Riverside Red Kite service 47 to maintain commonality with the 45 / 46 specification
- 6113 to 6117 = Stanley Northern service 6 (only 3x need repainted as 6116 / 6117 already red)
- 6118 to 6119 = CLS Angel service 21
- 6120 to 6121 = CLS spare
RE: Go North East: 2015/16 Financial Year Order Predictions - pdiddy - 02 Oct 2015
No... can't see that happening
RE: Go North East: 2015/16 Financial Year Order Predictions - Davie - 02 Oct 2015
(02 Oct 2015, 6:48 pm)DaveyBowyer 13 minutes agoWhy would the Cobalt Clipper B9s be replaced when they have only been in service for about 18 months (Just a guess) and why would the Red Kite examples be replaced when they have been on for a few months?
Order prediction:
- 15+2 spare Deckers for Red Arrows service X1.
Cascades:
- 6001 to 6007 = Crook Pronto service X21.
- 6049 (T) = Riverside as a spare.
- 6050 = Riverside as a spare.
- 6051 to 6055 = Stanley Northern service 6
- 3941 = Crook spare
- 3942 = Stanley Spare
- 3943 = Wherever needed
Or............
- 16 or 17+2 spare Streetdecks for Cobalt Clipper.
Cascades:
- 3941 = Crook spare
- 3962 to 3965 = Percy Main DFDS
- 6084 = Riverside Spare
- 6101 (T) = Riverside / Hexham TEN (just needs new vinyls)
- 6102 to 6108 (6104 [GKN Modded] swapped with 1x from Deptford) = Crook Pronto service X21
- 6109 to 6112 = Riverside Red Kite service 47 to maintain commonality with the 45 / 46 specification
- 6113 to 6117 = Stanley Northern service 6 (only 3x need repainted as 6116 / 6117 already red)
- 6118 to 6119 = CLS Angel service 21
- 6120 to 6121 = CLS spare
RE: Go North East: 2015/16 Financial Year Order Predictions - L469 YVK - 02 Oct 2015
(02 Oct 2015, 7:49 pm)Davie Why would the Cobalt Clipper B9s be replaced when they have only been in service for about 18 months (Just a guess) and why would the Red Kite examples be replaced when they have been on for a few months?
- Whilst there is nothing wrong as such with the B9s on the Cobalt Clipper, unless GNE cough up for an E400 either bodied and powered by ADL or bodied by ADL with a Scania Chassis / Engine coupled, then GNE have no alternative to the Streetdeck or the B5TL which for reasons previously stated, would not be suitable for the X21 in the long term. Also, GNE are very loyal to Wrightbus and therefore, would be unlikely to buy from ADL.
- Although the Cobalt Clipper routes are fairly profitable, the 309 / 310 are hardly demanding, just very intense and therefore, fuel costs could be reduced by using Streetdecks whilst not losing too much performance whereas if fuel costs on the Pronto were reduced in this way, then performance and reliability could be affected in the long term. Also, the fuel savings would be more apparent on the 309 / 310 due to the stop / start nature of these routes.
- The Volvo B9 is a very proven vehicle and despite having a few issues here and there on a very demanding route (TTX), they generally perform well and therefore, it would make sense to put these on a route like the X21 rather than risking the use of Streetdecks. Furthermore, unless GNE were to use ZF gearboxes which haven't bee used widespread yet on the Streetdeck, then the Voith gearbox would not be at it's best use for this route.
- The addition of power sockets on this route would GNE at an advantage over Arriva's X12 which has been just recently upgraded to MAX spec and despite the X21 being the more stronger and profitable of these two routes, it would prevent Arriva from taking any passengers from GNE in the long term.
- The use of B9s on the Pronto would tie the route over for the next 5 or so years ensuring that the service remains reliable, as punctual as possible and always one step ahead of the competition. To help this, 3941 would also be available as a spare vehicle due to 1x extra B9 being available at Riverside as well as 6101.
- The TEN would be able to operate with a full PVR of 14x B9s with the TTX having 6084 as a spare too and 1x ex Deptford B9 as well as 3x B7 Geminis acting as spares for the TEN, Red Kite 47 between Hexham / Riverside.
- The addition of upgraded vehicles on service 6 would create further growth on this route and encourage more people to use this service.
- The addition of upgraded vehicles on service 47 would bring the service in line with the other 2x Red Kite services minus the leather seating.
- The use of 2x 15 plate B9s on the Angel would not only allow the DFDS work to become DDA compliant thanks to , these would also bring the Angel up to a modern standard which was compromised when the frequency of this service was increased back in 2012 after ordering the Hybrids. Furthermore, GNE could even retrofit the GKN mods on these vehicles which are available. The specification of these vehicles are ideal for the 21 too due to the more hop on hop nature eliminating the need for high back seating. Free Wi-Fi would be available and Chester Le Street would also benefit from 2x corporate spare 15 reg B9s due to the sometimes frequent regulation of this service particularly at peak times.
RE: Go North East: 2015/16 Financial Year Order Predictions - Michael - 02 Oct 2015
Re-post...
Why should Deptford loose a B9 for Hexham and Riverside though?
RE: Go North East: 2015/16 Financial Year Order Predictions - Diamond One - 02 Oct 2015
(02 Oct 2015, 6:48 pm)DaveyBowyer 13 minutes ago
Order prediction:
- 15+2 spare Deckers for Red Arrows service X1.
Cascades:
- 6001 to 6007 = Crook Pronto service X21.
- 6049 (T) = Riverside as a spare.
- 6050 = Riverside as a spare.
- 6051 to 6055 = Stanley Northern service 6
- 3941 = Crook spare
- 3942 = Stanley Spare
- 3943 = Wherever needed
Or............
- 16 or 17+2 spare Streetdecks for Cobalt Clipper.
Cascades:
- 3941 = Crook spare
- 3962 and 3965 = Percy Main DFDS
- 6084 = Riverside Spare
- 6101 (T) = Riverside / Hexham TEN (just needs new vinyls)
- 6102 to 6108 (6104 [GKN Modded] swapped with 1x from Deptford) = Crook Pronto service X21
- 6109 to 6112 = Riverside Red Kite service 47 to maintain commonality with the 45 / 46 specification
- 6113 to 6117 = Stanley Northern service 6 (only 3x need repainted as 6116 / 6117 already red)
- 6118 to 6119 = CLS Angel service 21
- 6120 to 6121 = CLS spare
are you for real? it won't happen DFDS Seaways will probs be getting new buses probs Next Year the Cobalt Clipper, Ten, Red Arrows, Red Kite and the red spares do not need new buses you must having a laugh the Cobalt Clipper ones were only new in Service in early 2014, Ten early 2013, Red Arrows Mid 2011/2012, Red Kite almost 6 months ago so these won't happen ask anyone
RE: Go North East: 2015/16 Financial Year Order Predictions - L469 YVK - 02 Oct 2015
(02 Oct 2015, 8:56 pm)Michael Re-post...
Why should Deptford loose a B9 for Hexham and Riverside though?
They won't.
Because 6104 has already been modified, this would transfer to Deptford and in turn, Deptford would give one which has not been modified to Riverside / Hexham.
RE: Go North East: 2015/16 Financial Year Order Predictions - L469 YVK - 02 Oct 2015
(02 Oct 2015, 9:10 pm)Diamond One are you for real? it won't happen DFDS Seaways will probs be getting new buses probs Next Year the Cobalt Clipper, Ten, Red Arrows, Red Kite and the red spares do not need new buses you must having a laugh the Cobalt Clipper ones were only new in Service in early 2014, Ten early 2013, Red Arrows Mid 2011/2012, Red Kite almost 6 months ago so these won't happen ask anyone
No chance of the DFDS shuttle getting new buses. DDA compliant at best but not worthy of new vehicles. And did I mention the Red Arrows? I did earlier on but not on the second post.
Also, the TEN would only receive an extra permanant B9 in the form of 6101 (not shared with the TTX unless an absolute emergency), nothing else unless GNE were willing to repaint an extra bus in the form of an Ex-Deptford B9 to allow 6101 to become a dedicated spare vehicle. Got to remember that the B9s purchased for the Cobalt Clipper were bought in a bulk of 34 vehicles and although this was cracking value for money at the time (I think), alot has changed since then and due to the emergence of lightweight vehicles unless GNE are willing to part ways with Wrightbus and migrate to ADL and Scania, then they will struggle for finding replacement vehicles for the likes of the Pronto.
RE: Go North East: 2015/16 Financial Year Order Predictions - Diamond One - 02 Oct 2015
(02 Oct 2015, 9:20 pm)DaveyBowyer No chance of the DFDS shuttle getting new buses. DDA compliant at best but not worthy of new vehicles. And did I mention the Red Arrows? I did earlier on but not on the second post.
Also, the TEN would only receive an extra permanant B9 in the form of 6101 (not shared with the TTX unless an absolute emergency), nothing else unless GNE were willing to repaint an extra bus in the form of an Ex-Deptford B9 to allow 6101 to become a dedicated spare vehicle. Got to remember that the B9s purchased for the Cobalt Clipper were bought in a bulk of 34 vehicles and although this was cracking value for money at the time (I think), alot has changed since then and due to the emergence of lightweight vehicles unless GNE are willing to part ways with Wrightbus and migrate to ADL and Scania, then they will struggle for finding replacement vehicles for the likes of the Pronto.
more than likely DFDS Seaways are to receive new buses but you think that Gemini 2 are to be replaced on them routes there already on when there only young some they won't happen most enthusiasts will probs agree with me on this one well gemini 2 will not be replaced end of
RE: Go North East: 2015/16 Financial Year Order Predictions - DanPicken - 03 Oct 2015
(02 Oct 2015, 11:58 pm)Diamond One more than likely DFDS Seaways are to receive new buses but you think that Gemini 2 are to be replaced on them routes there already on when there only young some they won't happen most enthusiasts will probs agree with me on this one well gemini 2 will not be replaced end of
What about 6084 that was only on the 56 for a year so there's nothing stopping the buying now buses for their most prestigious services.
RE: Go North East: 2015/16 Financial Year Order Predictions - S813 FVK - 03 Oct 2015
(03 Oct 2015, 6:27 am)DanPicken What about 6084 that was only on the 56 for a year so there's nothing stopping the buying now buses for their most prestigious services.
That was down to Go North East wanting to improve the service which meant the PVR decreased by one. Nothing to do with getting new buses for a service.
RE: Go North East: 2015/16 Financial Year Order Predictions - Michael - 05 Oct 2015
Hope GNE order some Volvo 7900H's this year.
RE: Go North East: 2015/16 Financial Year Order Predictions - busspotterdean - 07 Oct 2015
does anyone know which depots are due new buses next year?