Not sure if it’s fleet or driver related but between 4 and 5.30 today the 21 PVR seemed to drop off a cliff (it’s normally bad around school time)
The queue in Eldon Sq for the every 7 min service was diverted down Eldon Sq and down via Poundland to avoid blocking the main station. The poor nexus bloke looked sick of his life. He made an admirable effort to convince Chester bound folks to get on the 22 28 and 29 which all ran on time.
X-Lines DD out of action for the foreseeable after the incident in Bensham the other day, hope everyone involved are alright
Is that just to fix the crash damage or for the police investigation?
(04 Apr 2025, 3:50 pm)nova347 wrote [ -> ]Is that just to fix the crash damage or for the police investigation?
If as reported the driver had a medical episode, I would imagine it will be to repair the vehicle.
Nice to have 672 back on its old stomping ground
Hownsgill -
Tyne Valley 10 B9 sat at back of Depot, anyone know why.
The last 2 B5 Hybrids still sitting in the same place, with a few panels and lights missing.
Every bus on display (during school holidays) was a branded variant and a Decker. A mix of Durham Diamonds (a few) couple of Red kites & Xlines Deckers.
Not a corp decker or Voyager B9 in site, all in service!
(27 Mar 2025, 10:21 pm)Ambassador wrote [ -> ]Not sure if it’s fleet or driver related but between 4 and 5.30 today the 21 PVR seemed to drop off a cliff (it’s normally bad around school time)
The queue in Eldon Sq for the every 7 min service was diverted down Eldon Sq and down via Poundland to avoid blocking the main station. The poor nexus bloke looked sick of his life. He made an admirable effort to convince Chester bound folks to get on the 22 28 and 29 which all ran on time.
Ik the queues are insane for the 21.to be honest I haven’t seen that long of a line but the x10/x1 lines are awfully long.Bless that nexus bloke
(24 Apr 2025, 8:39 pm)BusEnthusiast.com wrote [ -> ]Ik the queues are insane for the 21.to be honest I haven’t seen that long of a line but the x10/x1 lines are awfully long.Bless that nexus bloke
The X10 either needs an increase to hourly (NCL > Peterlee) or X9 re-instated. Only trouble is......the vehicles which would be capable are likely carrying fresh air off peak through Whickham & Dunston, well over double the capacity pre Nov 2019 when ran by Omnicites!
On another note and I know there's a very valid argument keeping the Angel StreetDecks local on the 51/52/93/94, but if they were given heavy maintenance when replaced by the EV's and allocated on the 307/309, would 6101-17 given their charmed lives not provide some better 'stop gap' options such as providing something more reliable than 6356-63 on the X21?
Also after seeing something on FB although not related to GNE, I do wonder what the chassis' are like on 6101-17 with exposure down the Coast (sea air) especially on the 309? Would GNE possibly just keep these running at Percy Main for that reason?
If you concerned about Coastal erosion on a small batch of vehicles because they go to the coast for a few hours a day, then be more concerned about the allocation at Arriva's Blyth depot which is basically on the coast. The sea air isn't the main problem, the issue is mainly down to in the past the NE Council used to be quite generous when gritting the roads with Salt in the area, not sure it's the same these days as they don't seem to grit as much if or even at all in some cases.
When the new Angel EV's arrive, I'd personally go
StreetDeck:
- 6315-28 - Percy Main - 307/309
- 6329-31 - Percy Main - Spare
- 6332-33 - Washington - Spare
- 6356-63 - Deptford - X20 (incl 1 spare)
- 6377 - Riverside - X10 spare
B5TL:
- 6308-12 - Consett - X45
- 6313-14 - Consett - Spare
B9TL:
- 6043-48 - Consett - 16/16A/47
** 6043-48 into corporate livery
- 6101-08 - Riverside - X21
- 6109-16 - Consett - 16/16A/47
- 6117 - Consett - Spare
E400MMC:
- 6336-37 - Consett - Spare
- 6338-49 - Consett - X30s/X70s
- 6350-55 - Riverside - X10
** X10 increased to half hourly NCL > Peterlee
6117, 6313, 6314, 6336, 6337 deployed on X5/X15 if not required on other Consett services.
(25 Apr 2025, 4:26 pm)L469 YVK wrote [ -> ]When the new Angel EV's arrive, I'd personally go
StreetDeck:
- 6315-28 - Percy Main - 307/309
- 6329-31 - Percy Main - Spare
- 6332-33 - Washington - Spare
- 6356-63 - Deptford - X20 (incl 1 spare)
- 6377 - Riverside - X10 spare
B5TL:
- 6308-12 - Consett - X45
- 6313-14 - Consett - Spare
B9TL:
- 6043-48 - Consett - 16/16A/47
** 6043-48 into corporate livery
- 6101-08 - Riverside - X21
- 6109-16 - Consett - 16/16A/47
- 6117 - Consett - Spare
E400MMC:
- 6336-37 - Consett - Spare
- 6338-49 - Consett - X30s/X70s
- 6350-55 - Riverside - X10
** X10 increased to half hourly NCL > Peterlee
6117, 6313, 6314, 6336, 6337 deployed on X5/X15 if not required on other Consett services.
What about updating the 56 for Sunderland Depot
(25 Apr 2025, 4:26 pm)L469 YVK wrote [ -> ]When the new Angel EV's arrive, I'd personally go
StreetDeck:
- 6315-28 - Percy Main - 307/309
- 6329-31 - Percy Main - Spare
- 6332-33 - Washington - Spare
- 6356-63 - Deptford - X20 (incl 1 spare)
- 6377 - Riverside - X10 spare
B5TL:
- 6308-12 - Consett - X45
- 6313-14 - Consett - Spare
B9TL:
- 6043-48 - Consett - 16/16A/47
** 6043-48 into corporate livery
- 6101-08 - Riverside - X21
- 6109-16 - Consett - 16/16A/47
- 6117 - Consett - Spare
E400MMC:
- 6336-37 - Consett - Spare
- 6338-49 - Consett - X30s/X70s
- 6350-55 - Riverside - X10
** X10 increased to half hourly NCL > Peterlee
6117, 6313, 6314, 6336, 6337 deployed on X5/X15 if not required on other Consett services.
Personally I'd do:
Angel Streetdeck's | Riverside (51/52/93/94)
6149 - 6158 | Sunderland (X20/56 Spares) - with a small refurbishment
B5TL | Withdrawn - these are a waste of space up here
6959 - 6966 | Consett (16/16A/X5/X15/Spares) - with the drug lights replaced with white lighting
B5TL to Hull in return for the 10x 11 Plate E400's, those 11 E400's doing
10x E400 | Consett (16/16A/47/X5/X15/Spares)
6043 - 6048 | Washington (34/Spares) - these are also shot to bits because of the X10, and as a result, unreliable.
Newer isn't always better and right now the B5TL's are just useless junk which were killed on the X10 and there's not enough of them to throw onto a city route so just get rid of them imo with something GoNorthEast might actually be able to keep on the road. The Streetdecks's which are as bad are much better being together aswell rather than 4 depots having them aswell. Personally I'd be looking for a replacement for 6301-7 at Washington aswell as these are just as bad as the B5's and throw them on the urban routes at Riverside aswell.
(25 Apr 2025, 5:16 pm)Storx wrote [ -> ]Personally I'd do:
Angel Streetdeck's | Riverside (51/52/93/94)
6149 - 6158 | Sunderland (X20/56 Spares) - with a small refurbishment
B5TL | Withdrawn - these are a waste of space up here
6959 - 6966 | Consett (16/16A/X5/X15/Spares) - with the drug lights replaced with white lighting
B5TL to Hull in return for the 10x 11 Plate E400's, those 11 E400's doing
10x E400 | Consett (16/16A/47/X5/X15/Spares)
6043 - 6048 | Washington (34/Spares) - these are also shot to bits because of the X10, and as a result, unreliable.
Newer isn't always better and right now the B5TL's are just useless junk which were killed on the X10 and there's not enough of them to throw onto a city route so just get rid of them imo with something GoNorthEast might actually be able to keep on the road. The Streetdecks's which are as bad are much better being together aswell rather than 4 depots having them aswell. Personally I'd be looking for a replacement for 6301-7 at Washington aswell as these are just as bad as the B5's and throw them on the urban routes at Riverside aswell.
See, the main reason why I'd be more inclined to use the Cobalt B9TLs and others as part of the cascades is:
- Improved fuel economy with StreetDecks on 307/309 including the misc 353/4/5/6 workings where a B9TL is overkill. Obviously the StreetDecks would need taken off the road and properly sorted before cascade.
- 6101-17 have had very charmed lives compared to the rest of GNE's B9TLs. x8 of these would be a decent stop-gap on the X21. They'd also handle the 16/16A/47 fine too.
- Clearly the X10 is struggling to meet demand on an hourly frequency. Increasing this to every 30 minutes Ncl > Peterlee could solve some issues.
- X30s/X70s keep the E400MMCs with x2 spares covering PVR of x12. Power kept on the more challenging Derwentside > Newcastle services as opposed to chancing StreetDecks / B5TLs.
- Other than a few fiddly bits between Shotley Bridge and Consett, the X45 isn't that challenging in comparison to the X30s/X70s. StreetLites coped fine on the 45/46/47 and the B5TLs would be fine with some heavy TLC before use. Also not forgetting that they'd likely be parked on Sundays due to the 6/12/X30/X45/X72 interworking patterns which nornally use E200MMC / E400MMC. There'd also be x2 B5TL spare covering a PVR of x5.
Also and although not ideal, some of the East Gateshead B9TLs when freed from the 58 could fill any stop gaps at Consett and effectively remove E400 classics from front line work at Consett. Other than 6377, there'd also be some manufacturer standardisation too for deckers on front line service
Consett - Volvo / ADL
Riverside - Volvo / ADL / TBC (EV)
Deptford - Volvo / WrightBus integral
Percy Main - WrightBus integral
Washington - WrightBus integral
(26 Apr 2025, 12:27 pm)L469 YVK wrote [ -> ]See, the main reason why I'd be more inclined to use the Cobalt B9TLs and others as part of the cascades is:
- Improved fuel economy with StreetDecks on 307/309 including the misc 353/4/5/6 workings where a B9TL is overkill. Obviously the StreetDecks would need taken off the road and properly sorted before cascade.
- 6101-17 have had very charmed lives compared to the rest of GNE's B9TLs. x8 of these would be a decent stop-gap on the X21. They'd also handle the 16/16A/47 fine too.
- Clearly the X10 is struggling to meet demand on an hourly frequency. Increasing this to every 30 minutes Ncl > Peterlee could solve some issues.
- X30s/X70s keep the E400MMCs with x2 spares covering PVR of x12. Power kept on the more challenging Derwentside > Newcastle services as opposed to chancing StreetDecks / B5TLs.
- Other than a few fiddly bits between Shotley Bridge and Consett, the X45 isn't that challenging in comparison to the X30s/X70s. StreetLites coped fine on the 45/46/47 and the B5TLs would be fine with some heavy TLC before use. Also not forgetting that they'd likely be parked on Sundays due to the 6/12/X30/X45/X72 interworking patterns which nornally use E200MMC / E400MMC. There'd also be x2 B5TL spare covering a PVR of x5.
Also and although not ideal, some of the East Gateshead B9TLs when freed from the 58 could fill any stop gaps at Consett and effectively remove E400 classics from front line work at Consett. Other than 6377, there'd also be some manufacturer standardisation too for deckers on front line service
Consett - Volvo / ADL
Riverside - Volvo / ADL / TBC (EV)
Deptford - Volvo / WrightBus integral
Percy Main - WrightBus integral
Washington - WrightBus integral
I get what you're saying but personally I'd be looking for electric funding for the 307/309 and if you're doing that then there's no point moving mid life buses across to move them again as the route who gets them next are getting life expired buses instead.
Also if you keep them on the 51/52/93/94 and the Streetdeck conversion trials go well, I'd be tempted to look at upgrading them to electrics. You kill 2 birds with one stone with more electric vehicles and getting rid of the Daimler useless engines.
The 306/7/8/9 is the sort of route which is rife for an upgrade in terms of electrics considering there's no electrics in North Tyneside or Northumberland (I'm not counting the 43) and it's arguably their turn next. With Blyth being already electrified then you're half way in terms of infrastructure aswell and the 309/10 were in an earlier bid which they didn't win so it's obviously doable.
Bit off topic for this but I'd personally be looking at doing every single bus at Blyth, similar to Stockton. They're all perfect routes for upgrades; currently have expired stock, serve important destinations including 2 major business park at Quorum and Cobalt and all serve very visible corridors to get attention ie A1/A19/A189/Coast Road. If you done all them you'd have a very good electric network North of the Tyne and they all need new vehicles anyway so I'm sure Arriva would be keen on taking part. Doing the Coast Road together also shows they're working together which gets them some more kudo points aswell.
With regards to increasing the X10 frequency or bringing back a variation of the X9, do you think GNE would go back into Hartlepool as whilst the town is in a state so is the bus network from what I seen when I was down a few weeks back with no service north of Peterlee and alternatives are get the train or go via Stockton on the 36 or Durham on the 59.
This would be what I would do with route attached below.
X9 - Middlesbrough - Stockton - Norton - Billingham - Seaton Carew - Hartlepool - Crimdon - Blackhall Colliery - Peterlee Non-Stop to Gateshead Interchange - Newcastle Eldon Square
[
attachment=10961]
(26 Apr 2025, 1:11 pm)Storx wrote [ -> ]The 306/7/8/9 is the sort of route which is rife for an upgrade in terms of electrics considering there's no electrics in North Tyneside or Northumberland (I'm not counting the 43) and it's arguably their turn next. With Blyth being already electrified then you're half way in terms of infrastructure aswell and the 309/10 were in an earlier bid which they didn't win so it's obviously doable.
Only problem is, would there be anyone left at GNE willing to drive them? If Percy Main can't take the infrastructure, then it's off to Riverside and we all know how the CLS move went down!
(26 Apr 2025, 7:36 pm)L469 YVK wrote [ -> ]Only problem is, would there be anyone left at GNE willing to drive them? If Percy Main can't take the infrastructure, then it's off to Riverside and we all know how the CLS move went down!
They'll have to find some way to make it work there eventually as there needs to be a depot in North Tyneside for franchising anyway. The obvious choice would be for NECA to build a new site and just lease it back to GNE until the franchising comes in.
They've already got the land where the Howdon Metro Depot is currently to build this depot so there's no land costs needed as that's coming surplus to requirements soon anyway. Heck they could potentially just convert the existing building to do buses instead and use some of the space where the Metro tracks are to park buses instead.
It could potentially cheaper than buying a depot, then having to build a new depot pretty much instantly anyway with the inconvenience coming in during franchising rather than being prepared and the Metro land is pretty much worthless.
(26 Apr 2025, 9:53 pm)DaveFromUpNorth wrote [ -> ]Anyone fancy buying an open top bus? £16k toon tour branded?
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/226692410922?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=qxUCSaaETwi&sssrc=4429486&ssuid=korihdcur4y&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY
You’d have to pay me £16k to sit in those seats…
Daft question.....why doesn't 6338-40 have bike racks installed to bring them in line with the rest of the E400MMC's?
How much would it cost to retrofit given that 6336-37 had the retrofit done?
6356 and 6956 both on the hard shoulder of the A1, northbound between Durham and Chester.
Maybe a mile, 2 miles apart from each other.
6353 expired at Gateshead on a boro bound X10
6317 was pulled off the 21 to operate in its place whilst 6377…stays on the 2
Question......but are 6308-14 and 6356-63 that badly goosed now? Or could they have a second chance with some heavy TLC if taken off the road?
How did 6356-63 perform during their initial use on the X45/X46?
(30 Apr 2025, 6:45 pm)L469 YVK wrote [ -> ]Question......but are 6308-14 and 6356-63 that badly goosed now? Or could they have a second chance with some heavy TLC if taken off the road?
How did 6356-63 perform during their initial use on the X45/X46?
The biggest problem with them is they're on the wrong work. The Streetdeck and B5TL were designed for stuff like the Stagecoach Newcastle urban routes where they'd be ideal - but they're not. The 5L engine, is never going to be good on long distance stuff with 70 mph running in parts or hills.
The X20, in particular, is a stupid route for them to be on after they were wrecked on the X10. It's no wonder they're absolutely useless at Deptford - not sure who signed that off personally.
It's why the B5's need to leave the region imo as there's nowhere useful for them as they're a microfleet and a microfleet which offers nothing useful for anywhere.
(30 Apr 2025, 7:15 pm)Storx wrote [ -> ]The biggest problem with them is they're on the wrong work. The Streetdeck and B5TL were designed for stuff like the Stagecoach Newcastle urban routes where they'd be ideal - but they're not. The 5L engine, is never going to be good on long distance stuff with 70 mph running in parts or hills.
The X20, in particular, is a stupid route for them to be on after they were wrecked on the X10. It's no wonder they're absolutely useless at Deptford - not sure who signed that off personally.
It's why the B5's need to leave the region imo as there's nowhere useful for them as they're a microfleet and a microfleet which offers nothing useful for anywhere.
If GNE changed the Derwentside interworking patterns meaning only a low height PVR of x4 was needed, subsequently freeing up most E400MMC for the X10 & X21, would 6356-63 & 6308-14 have issues on the X32/X45/X70/X73 even if they had some heavy TLC?
Have 2 of the Cobalt and Coasts had prangs with something, 6111 (I think), but 6116 is missing its branding on the passenger side (the side with the doors in), makes no difference to me, just thought it was worth a mention
(01 May 2025, 11:22 am)L469 YVK wrote [ -> ]If GNE changed the Derwentside interworking patterns meaning only a low height PVR of x4 was needed, subsequently freeing up most E400MMC for the X10 & X21, would 6356-63 & 6308-14 have issues on the X32/X45/X70/X73 even if they had some heavy TLC?
Not too sure, don't use the routtes much really. It's quite hilly over there though. They'd probably be alright though since it's not constant 60/70mph.
If, and big if, you wanted to move the E400MMC's I'd say do this:
X21 70 Plates -> Washington (50/X1)
50 16 Plates -> Riverside (51/52/93/94)
X20 B5TL -> Riverside (51/52/93/94)
62 Plate B9TL's -> Deptford (X20)
Angel Streetdeck's -> Consett
It means the two depots which are struggling right now get more newer vehicles and the really knackered vehicles are at Riverside doing easy work. It also gives Washington the ability to switch things around and a decent reserve for the X1, as the 50 isn't a badly loaded service tbh.
Consett gaining 16 Streetdeck's for a trade off for the MMC's is probably a fair compromise and means you'd have enough buses to actually do the work, with the X5/X15 upgraded in the process which would also release the E200MMC's to do a route which deserves them, 60 maybe?
(01 May 2025, 7:08 pm)Storx wrote [ -> ]Not too sure, don't use the routtes much really. It's quite hilly over there though. They'd probably be alright though since it's not constant 60/70mph.
If, and big if, you wanted to move the E400MMC's I'd say do this:
X21 70 Plates -> Washington (50/X1)
50 16 Plates -> Riverside (51/52/93/94)
X20 B5TL -> Riverside (51/52/93/94)
62 Plate B9TL's -> Deptford (X20)
Angel Streetdeck's -> Consett
It means the two depots which are struggling right now get more newer vehicles and the really knackered vehicles are at Riverside doing easy work. It also gives Washington the ability to switch things around and a decent reserve for the X1, as the 50 isn't a badly loaded service tbh.
Consett gaining 16 Streetdeck's for a trade off for the MMC's is probably a fair compromise and means you'd have enough buses to actually do the work, with the X5/X15 upgraded in the process which would also release the E200MMC's to do a route which deserves them, 60 maybe?
As a starting point, I'd go for this to keep the E200MMC & E400MMC together:
Routes:
- X30/X71 moved to Riverside, interworks with 1x X21 per-hour so that meal breaks can happen in Gateshead.
Driver 1 would do GHD > WA > GHD (X21) with Driver 2 then doing GHD > NCL > CON > NCL > STA > NCL > GHD (X21>X71>X30>X21). There'd be over 20 minutes layover in Consett which would allow things to get back on time should anything happen on the earlier X21.
- Evening & Sunday X30's either remain Consett operated using single deckers, or move to Riverside if alternative interworking pattern can be formed.
- 12 moved to Consett interworking with 6.
- X45 interworks with 1x X32 per-hour and X73.
- X70 interworks with the other X32 per-hour. X70 serves Lobley Hill estate instead of X32.
- X31 dropped.
Vehicles:
- All E400MMC at Riverside for X10, X21, X30, X71.
- All E200MMC to Consett for 6 & 12 with X66 getting stop-gap until EV's arrive.
(01 May 2025, 7:40 pm)L469 YVK wrote [ -> ]As a starting point, I'd go for this to keep the E200MMC & E400MMC together:
Routes:
- X30/X71 moved to Riverside, interworks with 1x X21 per-hour so that meal breaks can happen in Gateshead.
Driver 1 would do GHD > WA > GHD (X21) with Driver 2 then doing GHD > NCL > CON > NCL > STA > NCL > GHD (X21>X71>X30>X21). There'd be over 20 minutes layover in Consett which would allow things to get back on time should anything happen on the earlier X21.
- Evening & Sunday X30's either remain Consett operated using single deckers, or move to Riverside if alternative interworking pattern can be formed.
- 12 moved to Consett interworking with 6.
- X45 interworks with 1x X32 per-hour and X73.
- X70 interworks with the other X32 per-hour. X70 serves Lobley Hill estate instead of X32.
- X31 dropped.
Vehicles:
- All E400MMC at Riverside for X10, X21, X30, X71.
- All E200MMC to Consett for 6 & 12 with X66 getting stop-gap until EV's arrive.
Aye could do, I don't know the routes too well to comment there though.
The important thing to me imo is getting 6301-6314 off long distance stuff and onto town work asap. They're all shot to bits and are causing bother at both Deptford and Washington. What you replace them with there's loads of options but imo they're the biggest issues in the fleet, right now.
Consett also desperately need something newer aswell since they're relying on the battered X10 B9's and ex Yorkshire / Manchester junk and the reliability is coming with it.
Riverside is hard to comment as anything that touches that place is unreliable lately so it's hard to say whether it's the vehicles or the engineers or a bit of both.
(01 May 2025, 8:43 pm)Storx wrote [ -> ]Aye could do, I don't know the routes too well to comment there though.
The important thing to me imo is getting 6301-6314 off long distance stuff and onto town work asap. They're all shot to bits and are causing bother at both Deptford and Washington. What you replace them with there's loads of options but imo they're the biggest issues in the fleet, right now.
Consett also desperately need something newer aswell since they're relying on the battered X10 B9's and ex Yorkshire / Manchester junk and the reliability is coming with it.
Riverside is hard to comment as anything that touches that place is unreliable lately so it's hard to say whether it's the vehicles or the engineers or a bit of both.
How about something like the following once EV's arrive for 21, 58 and X66?
E400MMC:
- 6336-37 - Riverside - Spare
- 6338-55 - Riverside - X10**, X21, X30/X71
** X10 increased half-hourly NCL > Peterlee
StreetDeck:
- 6301-07 - Percy Main - 307/309 (incl 2x spare)
- 6315-23 - Percy Main - 307/309
- 6324-31 - Consett - X32/X45/X70/X73 (incl 2x spare)
- 6332-33 - Washington - Spare
- 6356-76 - Washington - 34/50/X1 (incl 1x spare)
- 6377 - Riverside - Spare
B5TL:
- 6308-14 - Consett - X32/X45/X70/X73
B9TL:
- 6043-48
* 1x Deptford - X20
* 3x Deptford - Spare
* 2x Consett - Spare
- 6100-17- Consett - 16/16A/47/X5/X15
- 6149-54 - Deptford - X20
E200MMC:
- 5488, 5490-98 - Consett - 6/12 (incl 1x spare)