Arriva North East: New buses 2022

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Rob44

1,508

18 Sep 2022, 8:16 am #221

Have arriva north east received some new small single decker's as well as those double decker's that are oin the x21 route. I was sitting in the hotspur drinking away and cant decide if i dreamt all these new buses or they were actually there as we've been told numerous times on here that arriva NE are being run into the ground and will get zero new equipment?

PS bee nice if i've just missed the post saying they were coming, i have a terrible hangover!!

Rob44

18 Sep 2022, 8:16 am #221

Andreos1

14,228

18 Sep 2022, 8:23 am #222

(18 Sep 2022, 8:16 am)Rob44 Have arriva north east received some new small single decker's as well as those double decker's that are oin the x21 route. I was sitting in the hotspur drinking away and cant decide if i dreamt all these new buses or they were actually there as we've been told numerous times on here that arriva NE are being run into the ground and will get zero new equipment?

PS bee nice if i've just missed the post saying they were coming, i have a terrible hangover!!

Aye, they've branded them as the 'Pink Elephant' Wink

'Illegitimis non carborundum'

Andreos1

18 Sep 2022, 8:23 am #222

(18 Sep 2022, 8:16 am)Rob44 Have arriva north east received some new small single decker's as well as those double decker's that are oin the x21 route. I was sitting in the hotspur drinking away and cant decide if i dreamt all these new buses or they were actually there as we've been told numerous times on here that arriva NE are being run into the ground and will get zero new equipment?

PS bee nice if i've just missed the post saying they were coming, i have a terrible hangover!!

Aye, they've branded them as the 'Pink Elephant' Wink

'Illegitimis non carborundum'

Rob44

1,508

18 Sep 2022, 8:50 am #223

(18 Sep 2022, 8:23 am)Andreos1 Aye, they've branded them as the 'Pink Elephant'

Now if only ANE did branding........and there was a zoo on the route...... the connotations ! Wink

Rob44

18 Sep 2022, 8:50 am #223

(18 Sep 2022, 8:23 am)Andreos1 Aye, they've branded them as the 'Pink Elephant'

Now if only ANE did branding........and there was a zoo on the route...... the connotations ! Wink

omnicity4659

5,591

18 Sep 2022, 9:48 am #224

(18 Sep 2022, 8:16 am)Rob44 Have arriva north east received some new small single decker's as well as those double decker's that are oin the x21 route. I was sitting in the hotspur drinking away and cant decide if i dreamt all these new buses or they were actually there as we've been told numerous times on here that arriva NE are being run into the ground and will get zero new equipment?

PS bee nice if i've just missed the post saying they were coming, i have a terrible hangover!!

Yes, loads of new E200MMCs to replace the Solos... unless I've spent too much time in The Five Swans and The Job Bulman and have also dreamt them...

omnicity4659

18 Sep 2022, 9:48 am #224

(18 Sep 2022, 8:16 am)Rob44 Have arriva north east received some new small single decker's as well as those double decker's that are oin the x21 route. I was sitting in the hotspur drinking away and cant decide if i dreamt all these new buses or they were actually there as we've been told numerous times on here that arriva NE are being run into the ground and will get zero new equipment?

PS bee nice if i've just missed the post saying they were coming, i have a terrible hangover!!

Yes, loads of new E200MMCs to replace the Solos... unless I've spent too much time in The Five Swans and The Job Bulman and have also dreamt them...

Rob44

1,508

18 Sep 2022, 11:11 am #225

(18 Sep 2022, 9:48 am)omnicity4659 Yes, loads of new E200MMCs to replace the Solos... unless I've spent too much time in The Five Swans and The Job Bulman and have also dreamt them...

Thankyou! I feel better now. Must remember not to take to much notice of what's put on here! Wink

Just waiting for arriva to confirm they are not binning any newcastle services off when jesmond closes....

Rob44

18 Sep 2022, 11:11 am #225

(18 Sep 2022, 9:48 am)omnicity4659 Yes, loads of new E200MMCs to replace the Solos... unless I've spent too much time in The Five Swans and The Job Bulman and have also dreamt them...

Thankyou! I feel better now. Must remember not to take to much notice of what's put on here! Wink

Just waiting for arriva to confirm they are not binning any newcastle services off when jesmond closes....

L469 YVK

3,551

18 Sep 2022, 11:59 am #226

(18 Sep 2022, 8:16 am)Rob44 Have arriva north east received some new small single decker's as well as those double decker's that are oin the x21 route. I was sitting in the hotspur drinking away and cant decide if i dreamt all these new buses or they were actually there as we've been told numerous times on here that arriva NE are being run into the ground and will get zero new equipment?

PS bee nice if i've just missed the post saying they were coming, i have a terrible hangover!!

Maybe they had plans before covid? But got put on hold for obvious reasons.

Arriva's Northumbria network looks to have recovered mostly well bar a few rotten eggs that should hopefully be sorted in time.

Hopefully Blyth's turn next year......I'd say if anything for the 308 (and 306 if interworking), send 12x of whatever is due to Blyth to Ashington then let 7541-52 see out their time at Blyth on the 308. I doubt GNE will allocate anything newer than 67 reg StreetDecks on the 309/310/311 (cascaded presumably off the 21) unless they won some sort of Green Bus fund bid or GAG's new investors had a change of heart.

L469 YVK

18 Sep 2022, 11:59 am #226

(18 Sep 2022, 8:16 am)Rob44 Have arriva north east received some new small single decker's as well as those double decker's that are oin the x21 route. I was sitting in the hotspur drinking away and cant decide if i dreamt all these new buses or they were actually there as we've been told numerous times on here that arriva NE are being run into the ground and will get zero new equipment?

PS bee nice if i've just missed the post saying they were coming, i have a terrible hangover!!

Unber43

3,555

18 Sep 2022, 12:11 pm #227

(18 Sep 2022, 11:59 am)L469 YVK Maybe they had plans before covid? But got put on hold for obvious reasons.

Arriva's Northumbria network looks to have recovered mostly well bar a few rotten eggs that should hopefully be sorted in time.

Hopefully Blyth's turn next year......I'd say if anything for the 308 (and 306 if interworking), send 12x of whatever is due to Blyth to Ashington then let 7541-52 see out their time at Blyth on the 308. I doubt GNE will allocate anything newer than 67 reg StreetDecks on the 309/310/311 (cascaded presumably off the 21) unless they won some sort of Green Bus fund bid or GAG's new investors had a change of heart.

How profitable is the coast road honestly

Unber43

18 Sep 2022, 12:11 pm #227

(18 Sep 2022, 11:59 am)L469 YVK Maybe they had plans before covid? But got put on hold for obvious reasons.

Arriva's Northumbria network looks to have recovered mostly well bar a few rotten eggs that should hopefully be sorted in time.

Hopefully Blyth's turn next year......I'd say if anything for the 308 (and 306 if interworking), send 12x of whatever is due to Blyth to Ashington then let 7541-52 see out their time at Blyth on the 308. I doubt GNE will allocate anything newer than 67 reg StreetDecks on the 309/310/311 (cascaded presumably off the 21) unless they won some sort of Green Bus fund bid or GAG's new investors had a change of heart.

How profitable is the coast road honestly

L469 YVK

3,551

18 Sep 2022, 4:33 pm #228

(18 Sep 2022, 12:11 pm)Unber43 How profitable is the coast road honestly

Well other than Saturdays to help with the driver situation and evenings, Arriva haven't reduced any frequencies and are still charging the 'going fare'.

L469 YVK

18 Sep 2022, 4:33 pm #228

(18 Sep 2022, 12:11 pm)Unber43 How profitable is the coast road honestly

Well other than Saturdays to help with the driver situation and evenings, Arriva haven't reduced any frequencies and are still charging the 'going fare'.

Unber43

3,555

18 Sep 2022, 4:45 pm #229

(18 Sep 2022, 4:33 pm)L469 YVK Well other than Saturdays to help with the driver situation and evenings, Arriva haven't reduced any frequencies and are still charging the 'going fare'.

That didn't answer my questions.

ANE, GNE are pushing the coast road GNE every 7 mins, so it must be profitable.

Unber43

18 Sep 2022, 4:45 pm #229

(18 Sep 2022, 4:33 pm)L469 YVK Well other than Saturdays to help with the driver situation and evenings, Arriva haven't reduced any frequencies and are still charging the 'going fare'.

That didn't answer my questions.

ANE, GNE are pushing the coast road GNE every 7 mins, so it must be profitable.

Storx

4,595

18 Sep 2022, 4:58 pm #230

(18 Sep 2022, 11:59 am)L469 YVK Maybe they had plans before covid? But got put on hold for obvious reasons.

Arriva's Northumbria network looks to have recovered mostly well bar a few rotten eggs that should hopefully be sorted in time.

Hopefully Blyth's turn next year......I'd say if anything for the 308 (and 306 if interworking), send 12x of whatever is due to Blyth to Ashington then let 7541-52 see out their time at Blyth on the 308. I doubt GNE will allocate anything newer than 67 reg StreetDecks on the 309/310/311 (cascaded presumably off the 21) unless they won some sort of Green Bus fund bid or GAG's new investors had a change of heart.

Don't see the point in moving those to Blyth.

imo a sensible investment for Blyth would be

2023: X7/X8/X9 - 14 Streetdeck + 1 Spare, 7601 - 7608 moved onto 306/308/X10/X11 (officially X7/X8/X9 on paper); 1490, 1493, 1495, 1496, 1500 - 1505 moved elsewhere (no space for Pulsar's at Blyth with the new depot plans so need to move if the Streetlite's move there - possibly the 43/44/45 to replace the 57/58 plate Enviro's)
2024: X10/X11 - 8 Streetdeck + 1 Spare, 7601 - 7608, 7611 - 7615 moved to reserve role
2026: 306/308 - Whatever buses are around then, replace all Gemini's

The X7, X8, X9 are going to be affected by the Blyth and Tyne line the most so you might want to improve the service before it turns it up otherwise they could be in big trouble.

Storx

18 Sep 2022, 4:58 pm #230

(18 Sep 2022, 11:59 am)L469 YVK Maybe they had plans before covid? But got put on hold for obvious reasons.

Arriva's Northumbria network looks to have recovered mostly well bar a few rotten eggs that should hopefully be sorted in time.

Hopefully Blyth's turn next year......I'd say if anything for the 308 (and 306 if interworking), send 12x of whatever is due to Blyth to Ashington then let 7541-52 see out their time at Blyth on the 308. I doubt GNE will allocate anything newer than 67 reg StreetDecks on the 309/310/311 (cascaded presumably off the 21) unless they won some sort of Green Bus fund bid or GAG's new investors had a change of heart.

mb134

4,151

18 Sep 2022, 5:19 pm #231

(18 Sep 2022, 4:45 pm)Unber43 That didn't answer my questions.

ANE, GNE are pushing the coast road GNE every 7 mins, so it must be profitable.

Surely it did?

You asked how profitable it is, nobody is going to be able to give you an exact answer (those that do know aren't going to come on here and give a precise figure). So the reponse stating that frequency hasn't been dropped, and that ANE are still charging standard fares, surely gives an indication that it is at least making some amount of money? It's likely not as profitable as pre-2020, but ANE and GNE aren't going to be running that many buses along there if they're barely breaking even.

Personally, while I'd expect some rationalisation when government funding ends, I certainly still see it as one of the main money making corridors in the NE when you think about the places it serves.

mb134

18 Sep 2022, 5:19 pm #231

(18 Sep 2022, 4:45 pm)Unber43 That didn't answer my questions.

ANE, GNE are pushing the coast road GNE every 7 mins, so it must be profitable.

mb134

4,151

18 Sep 2022, 7:42 pm #232

(18 Sep 2022, 11:59 am)L469 YVK Maybe they had plans before covid? But got put on hold for obvious reasons.

Arriva's Northumbria network looks to have recovered mostly well bar a few rotten eggs that should hopefully be sorted in time.

Hopefully Blyth's turn next year......I'd say if anything for the 308 (and 306 if interworking), send 12x of whatever is due to Blyth to Ashington then let 7541-52 see out their time at Blyth on the 308. I doubt GNE will allocate anything newer than 67 reg StreetDecks on the 309/310/311 (cascaded presumably off the 21) unless they won some sort of Green Bus fund bid or GAG's new investors had a change of heart.

There were absolutely plans before Covid, unsure if they involved the E200s but definitely deckers of some sort.

Northumbria's core network seems pretty robust if we're honest:

The 1/2 are constantly busy with short hop journeys and, when you take into account ANE fare pricing, must make a decent chunk of money. £6.50 for anyone in Blyth going to Ashington and back, for example. I can't remember any exactly, but the single fares from Bebside/Cowpen into Blyth are relatively high too. You can frequently see decent crowds waiting to board both in Blyth Bus Station.

The 35 again is busy with short hops, predominantly concessions during the day though. Is likely helped by school traffic and workers, and again the fares. There have been quite a few times where I've got off a Woodhorn bound 35 at Ashington with another 10-15 people, with another 10-15 waiting to board, and then the one behind is exactly the same.

The 43 seems to be a consistent route, helped by large loadings in the peaks. The morning peak journeys into Gosforth and Newcastle are always rammed, even with a decker, and from what I've seen the northbound PM peaks aren't much quieter. Forget about using it on a Newcastle match day unless you absolutely need to, and loadings on "normal" Saturdays and Sundays also look quite strong.

The 44/45, compared to the others so far, look to be quite feast or famine. Peaks are quite busy, but they seem very quiet outside of that. Matchdays, same as above though.

The 57/57A from what I've seen always have respectable loadings, and I imagine helped by almost being two separate routes (Ashington - Cramlington, and then Cramlington to Whitley Bay, don't imagine many do end to end). Don't think they'll set the world alight with revenue, but an hourly service using minibuses and minibus driver wages probably doesn't need to be taking full loads to make some money. New buses on there now so reliability should improve, which will only help it further.

I'll group the X10/11 and X21/22 together. They all look very strong in the peaks, full seated loads for the main ones into town on a morning. Weekend and match day loadings are also ridiculous, with the only outlier really being the X22 which is very hit/miss and seems to be more reliant on concessionary travel during the day compared to the rest. With all though, decent amount of shorter journeys between towns in-between the peaks which no doubt helps massively. All that said, I imagine that (outside of the peaks) putting the X21/22 down to every 30 could make them a bit stronger financially too - difficult balance to strike though and I wouldn't be surprised at all if they kept them every 20 once funding ends. X21/22 are also massively helped by workers to/from Nelson Industrial Estates.

The X9 seems to be a funny one, always seems busy enough (particularly during the peaks) but I'm not sure if the route change has had much of an impact? That said, with the growing estates around Cramlington it's one that looks like it has quite a bit of potential if managed correctly.

Then there's the Morpeth express work. Morpeth to Newcastle, all of them are busy, obviously in the peaks but also during the day they carry decent loadings. Now that the X14 is every 2 hours north of Morpeth, the ones I've seen during the day seem healthy. The X15/18s, while somewhat seasonal, from what I've seen carry decent numbers - and when they're busy they are very busy. Obviously NCC subsidies will help too, especially in the case of the X14. The X20 is similar, trips from Ashington in the morning are very busy, and there's always reasonable usage between Ashington and Alnwick (mainly split between Ash-Widdrington, and Widdrington-Alnwick).

I can't comment on the 51-4/X7/X8/Newcastle minibus work as I don't have reason to use them, and don't see them regularly enough to pass comment (and I'm not going to comment on the Coast Road as I think it's been done by now).

Obviously the Ashington & Blyth line will pose a threat to some of the above, but realistically I don't think it'll have much of an impact on the shorter journeys, and the bus is still going to be the best option for those commuting from the centre of Blyth, Bedlington, Newbiggin, Cramlington etc. If I'm honest, I think it'll have a much bigger impact on the amount of people commuting by car.

Arriva North East's main issues seem to be with Durham County, and it's been that way for as long as I can remember unfortunately.

mb134

18 Sep 2022, 7:42 pm #232

(18 Sep 2022, 11:59 am)L469 YVK Maybe they had plans before covid? But got put on hold for obvious reasons.

Arriva's Northumbria network looks to have recovered mostly well bar a few rotten eggs that should hopefully be sorted in time.

Hopefully Blyth's turn next year......I'd say if anything for the 308 (and 306 if interworking), send 12x of whatever is due to Blyth to Ashington then let 7541-52 see out their time at Blyth on the 308. I doubt GNE will allocate anything newer than 67 reg StreetDecks on the 309/310/311 (cascaded presumably off the 21) unless they won some sort of Green Bus fund bid or GAG's new investors had a change of heart.

L469 YVK

3,551

18 Sep 2022, 7:48 pm #233

(18 Sep 2022, 4:58 pm)Storx Don't see the point in moving those to Blyth.

imo a sensible investment for Blyth would be

The X7, X8, X9 are going to be affected by the Blyth and Tyne line the most so you might want to improve the service before it turns it up otherwise they could be in big trouble.

To be honest, the X8 is a bit of a basket case.

The X9 to give credit to Arriva and for service to the North of Blyth, they have improved it. But if they really wanted to give the train good competition, they could go..........

- X7 - same route as now every 20 mins.
- X8 - dropped and replaced by 43 and 43A.
- X9 - Same as now Blyth to Shankhouse, then X10 route to Newcastle.
- X10 - Same route and frequency as now.
- X11 - Same route and frequency as now.
(Note that X9/X10/X11 would combine every 10 mins)
- 43 - Morpeth to Cramlington as now, then via High Pit, Annitsford and Fern Drive before picking up normal route. Every 30 mins Newcastle to Cramlington then hourly to Morpeth.
(Note Dudley Lane would still be covered by 52 & 53 as well as the Northern part by X9/X10/X11)
- 43A - Basically the 'old' X9/X13 route from Blyth to Newcastle but all stopping between Fisher Lane and Newcastle via Seaton Burn and Wide Open. Every 30 mins.
- 44/45 - Re-instated to every 30 mins each.

L469 YVK

18 Sep 2022, 7:48 pm #233

(18 Sep 2022, 4:58 pm)Storx Don't see the point in moving those to Blyth.

imo a sensible investment for Blyth would be

The X7, X8, X9 are going to be affected by the Blyth and Tyne line the most so you might want to improve the service before it turns it up otherwise they could be in big trouble.

Shrek

200

18 Sep 2022, 10:07 pm #234

Regarding the 44/45, they had generally been getting good passenger numbers, but it's noticeable that there's been a drop recently since the emergency timetable was put in place and the regular cancellations on top of that. With hundreds of new houses under construction, if they can get some reliability back to the services they will likely see good use again.

Shrek

18 Sep 2022, 10:07 pm #234

Rob44

1,508

19 Sep 2022, 7:10 am #235

(18 Sep 2022, 10:07 pm)Shrek Regarding the 44/45, they had generally been getting good passenger numbers, but it's noticeable that there's been a drop recently since the emergency timetable was put in place and the regular cancellations on top of that. With hundreds of new houses under construction, if they can get some reliability back to the services they will likely see good use again.

arnt the new houses in those area built with drives to fit several cars on? If you could afford one of those the last thing you'll care about is whether the 44 runs every 30 minutes - you'll no not want to mix with the bus passages when you've got you x5 or merc on the drive.

Be nice for Dinnington to have 4 bus per hour though if it returned to normal

Rob44

19 Sep 2022, 7:10 am #235

(18 Sep 2022, 10:07 pm)Shrek Regarding the 44/45, they had generally been getting good passenger numbers, but it's noticeable that there's been a drop recently since the emergency timetable was put in place and the regular cancellations on top of that. With hundreds of new houses under construction, if they can get some reliability back to the services they will likely see good use again.

ne14ne1

1,517

24 Sep 2022, 3:26 pm #236

Have all the new single decks arrived yet? I noticed one or two solos still knocking about today. When are they due to be withdrawn/sent elsewhere?

ne14ne1

24 Sep 2022, 3:26 pm #236

Have all the new single decks arrived yet? I noticed one or two solos still knocking about today. When are they due to be withdrawn/sent elsewhere?

wibblejunior

278

24 Sep 2022, 5:15 pm #237

According to Bustimes 2701-14 have all entered service, which I believe is all of them.

[Image: imageHandler.php?user=wibblejunior]

wibblejunior

24 Sep 2022, 5:15 pm #237

According to Bustimes 2701-14 have all entered service, which I believe is all of them.

mb134

4,151

24 Sep 2022, 5:30 pm #238

(24 Sep 2022, 3:26 pm)ne14ne1 Have all the new single decks arrived yet? I noticed one or two solos still knocking about today. When are they due to be withdrawn/sent elsewhere?

Think the only one I've seen left is the Quorum branded one? Possible they're keeping it to cover for teething issues (given they're new, it'll be a case of waiting for ADL to fix any issues under warranty so might not be as quick as a depot could do it), or for the entry into service of their deckers (I've not seen any of 7515/6/53/54 in service there, and 7556 is/was dead at Ashington last week).

mb134

24 Sep 2022, 5:30 pm #238

(24 Sep 2022, 3:26 pm)ne14ne1 Have all the new single decks arrived yet? I noticed one or two solos still knocking about today. When are they due to be withdrawn/sent elsewhere?

Kuyoyo

6,853

24 Sep 2022, 5:44 pm #239

(24 Sep 2022, 5:30 pm)mb134 Think the only one I've seen left is the Quorum branded one? Possible they're keeping it to cover for teething issues (given they're new, it'll be a case of waiting for ADL to fix any issues under warranty so might not be as quick as a depot could do it), or for the entry into service of their deckers (I've not seen any of 7515/6/53/54 in service there, and 7556 is/was dead at Ashington last week).

2837 is the only one of Northumbria’s M950s being retained - the 555 doesn’t enter the CAZ zone so does not need to be operated by a Euro6 vehicle. Likewise, 2601-3 are being retained for the 553 for the same reason.

Kuyoyo

24 Sep 2022, 5:44 pm #239

(24 Sep 2022, 5:30 pm)mb134 Think the only one I've seen left is the Quorum branded one? Possible they're keeping it to cover for teething issues (given they're new, it'll be a case of waiting for ADL to fix any issues under warranty so might not be as quick as a depot could do it), or for the entry into service of their deckers (I've not seen any of 7515/6/53/54 in service there, and 7556 is/was dead at Ashington last week).

mb134

4,151

24 Sep 2022, 5:57 pm #240

(24 Sep 2022, 5:44 pm)Kuyoyo 2837 is the only one of Northumbria’s M950s being retained - the 555 doesn’t enter the CAZ zone so does not need to be operated by a Euro6 vehicle. Likewise, 2601-3 are being retained for the 553 for the same reason.

Forgot about those 3 staying for that - assume Arriva are planning on still running the 553/555 when they move to Ashington/Blyth.

mb134

24 Sep 2022, 5:57 pm #240

(24 Sep 2022, 5:44 pm)Kuyoyo 2837 is the only one of Northumbria’s M950s being retained - the 555 doesn’t enter the CAZ zone so does not need to be operated by a Euro6 vehicle. Likewise, 2601-3 are being retained for the 553 for the same reason.

Forgot about those 3 staying for that - assume Arriva are planning on still running the 553/555 when they move to Ashington/Blyth.

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