North East Buses

(07 Dec 2013, 12:34 pm)andreos1 wrote [ -> ]It isn't just Arriva.
One of the other big operators in the area have also closed depots and are in the process of consolidating another two.

Apparently the actual numbers of vehicles in the area have also dropped from previous years.

All do to with profit by the looks of it in the North West too.

the shift of power in Manchester has changed a few things, after i posted this i found out another none tendered route is to be cut back and another night bus in Liverpool is to be withdrawn, its odd when not long ago there was a lovley network of buses up here and now its getting reduced bit by bit.

So, the Pulsar Sapphires have launched. Which is most welcome but it's not the tattiest of the Darlington allocation that is changing as a result. I'm sure the X-GGO Darts are welcome for Redcar, but even these must be a stopgap - they are now 13 years old.
Does anyone know what comes next: the R-COO Darts, the S-KHN Darts and the older MPD's are all surely hanging by a thread, to say nothing of the Prestiges which are still plentiful in the area? .

More new buses are due next year, lots more in Sapphire specification im told, that will release the Prestiges currently residing in Redcar & Stockton to the scrapyard.

I think the X reg darts transfer to Redcar is also a way to try and help their engineering team out, as they are more reliable than some of their current stock.

(08 Dec 2013, 1:47 pm)9920up wrote [ -> ]So, the Pulsar Sapphires have launched. Which is most welcome but it's not the tattiest of the Darlington allocation that is changing as a result. I'm sure the X-GGO Darts are welcome for Redcar, but even these must be a stopgap - they are now 13 years old.
Does anyone know what comes next: the R-COO Darts, the S-KHN Darts and the older MPD's are all surely hanging by a thread, to say nothing of the Prestiges which are still plentiful in the area? .

Officially Redcar (and Whitby) should have lost all their remaining Prestiges this weekend, but obviously not as apparently 3 were out on 5s yesterday! That would leave only Stockton (with 15!) with more than 1. But are R-COO Darts an improvement on Prestiges? They were supposed to be fit for the knackers' yard when they left Stockton a couple of years ago!

(07 Dec 2013, 11:00 am)Coppercap40 wrote [ -> ]I notice a lack of front fleet numbers, are they going to put them on ?

They have them on the rear, and I'm told on the nearside near the door, though I never noticed them there.

The X reg darts were ok when they came from Scotland but as with most buses that transfer into Darlington they have collected repeat uncleared defects. So Redcar will have their work cut out to get them up to scratch

To be fair darlingtons fleet is in alot better condition mechanically than redcars tho could be exception.of some S KHN darts that are now worse for fair tho most of them were cascades frm other depots except for 1611/12

Just to confirm that the Versa Demonstrator is out again as today as expected on 64's.

(27 Nov 2013, 9:10 pm)busman101 wrote [ -> ]£300 grand a bus - what on earth would they be buying for that sort of money !!!

Not much rumpus from the regulars yet on the withdrawal of the early and late 685 journeys to/from Carlisle and the withdrawal completely from Gilsland. No doubt it'll all come out in the wash in the next couple of weeks along with will a bus really run empty all the way from Newcastle to Carlisle 6 days a week as the timetable seems to suggest.

Do Arriva outstation any vehicles for 85/X85/685 in Hexham? In new TT three start from there a.m. (0642 & 0732 X85 and 0757 85 - the 0627 85 is presumably worked by incoming 0535 ex Newcastle) plus there's the unbalanced 0907 from Carlisle (assuming all Arriva's match Stagecoach with a 71 min. layover in Carlisle) Then p.m. from Newcastle the 1710 & 1945 85's and 1720 X85 all have no return workings, so do they keep them in Hexham or run them all LT from Newcastle?

(10 Dec 2013, 12:10 pm)Greg in Weardale wrote [ -> ]Do Arriva outstation any vehicles for 85/X85/685 in Hexham? In new TT three start from there a.m. (0642 & 0732 X85 and 0757 85 - the 0627 85 is presumably worked by incoming 0535 ex Newcastle) plus there's the unbalanced 0907 from Carlisle (assuming all Arriva's match Stagecoach with a 71 min. layover in Carlisle) Then p.m. from Newcastle the 1710 & 1945 85's and 1720 X85 all have no return workings, so do they keep them in Hexham or run them all LT from Newcastle?

Read somewhere they were running light from Jesmond - inc the one from Carlisle!

C265XEF only joined the forum last month, so it's an easy mistake to make given that all forums have different 'posting rules' as it were.
I have merged both threads together, so that the post about the Versa demonstrator vehicle appears in the "Arriva North East - Latest" thread.

(10 Dec 2013, 12:46 pm)andreos1 wrote [ -> ]Read somewhere they were running light from Jesmond - inc the one from Carlisle!

Believe the one from Carlisle runs light from Hexham, rather than Jesmond.

Why has the Arriva North East Latest Thread moved from Important Threads to Normal Threads Dan? Surely it should be at the top of the Important Threads for Arriva Notrh East?

(10 Dec 2013, 6:05 pm)peter wrote [ -> ]Why has the Arriva North East Latest Thread moved from Important Threads to Normal Threads Dan? Surely it should be at the top of the Important Threads for Arriva Notrh East?

Sorted - it's from when I merged the threads earlier, it was automatically demoted to a 'normal thread' again.

(10 Dec 2013, 4:56 pm)tyresmoke wrote [ -> ]Believe the one from Carlisle runs light from Hexham, rather than Jesmond.

So do they keep vehicles overnight in Hexham?

(10 Dec 2013, 7:12 pm)Greg in Weardale wrote [ -> ]So do they keep vehicles overnight in Hexham?

No everything runs from Jesmond, though I'm told that one does run light from Hexham to Carlisle to pick up service. Looking at the timetable I can't work out how they work. I think it might be the 0926 arrival in Hexham running to Carlisle to run the 1107 back to Newcastle. I'm not sure what would do the 0927 short back to Newcastle though, possibly one off a scholars working?

(10 Dec 2013, 7:56 pm)tyresmoke wrote [ -> ]No everything runs from Jesmond, though I'm told that one does run light from Hexham to Carlisle to pick up service. Looking at the timetable I can't work out how they work. I think it might be the 0926 arrival in Hexham running to Carlisle to run the 1107 back to Newcastle. I'm not sure what would do the 0927 short back to Newcastle though, possibly one off a scholars working?

Seems an awful amount of dead mileage, but for what reason?

(10 Dec 2013, 7:56 pm)tyresmoke wrote [ -> ]No everything runs from Jesmond, though I'm told that one does run light from Hexham to Carlisle to pick up service. Looking at the timetable I can't work out how they work. I think it might be the 0926 arrival in Hexham running to Carlisle to run the 1107 back to Newcastle. I'm not sure what would do the 0927 short back to Newcastle though, possibly one off a scholars working?

It must be uneconomic then, with the equivalent of three light runs a.m. Jesmond to Hexham and one to Carlisle, plus three in the evening Hexham to Jesmond. It's just Arriva's obsession with competing with Northern's Tynedalexpress. Although I generally agree with competition and am opposed to the Tyne & Wear "Quality Contracts" which would in the long run be unaffordable and give a worse service than now, Hexham to Newcastle is an example of where competition becomes silly, even more so than Arriva's 1/X1 v Northern's OK1 was.

Losing the service completely through Gilsland? Absolutely horrible. I live in a nearby village which has a lot of people that rely on the service; not any more. I love how Arriva describe these changes as 'improvements' - they're clearly not. I also like how they seem to express the changes as beneficial to everyone... the only people it is beneficial to is Arriva themselves as they are biting back to Go North East's X84/X85 competition!

Losing the 0555 ex-Newcastle straight through to Carlisle because of 'low passenger numbers' is complete nonsense. I get that bus into Carlisle to get to work whenever I can't get a lift - was perfect, got into Carlisle at 8, 30 minutes before I start work. Every time I've used that bus it has been very well used, especially from Low Row onwards.

In their message ( http://www.arrivabus.co.uk/uploadedImage...20new2.jpg ) they have said that "an alternative Stagecoach bus is available between Brampton and Carlisle" - what about the people that live inbetween Hexham and Brampton (ie me)? The earliest I can get into Carlisle by bus is now 9am so I will be using the train from now on.

The local area manager was on a bus I was on once and he was explaining the changes; how Arriva are going to liaise with Cumbria County Council for the likes of Gilsland and Low Row to put on a mini-bus connecting the A69 with the villages. Not a word has been said since, as I said they are in it for the money. Not the people.
He also suggested Arriva would work the Sunday service straight through to Carlisle instead of having a non-guaranteed connection between Arriva and Stagecoach at Hexham. That hasn't changed so no doubt people will still miss their bus. Same with the 1845 ex-Newcastle! Daft!

Anyway, slight rant over - I notice in that flyer, Arriva said that they have got another Omnicity spare at Newcastle for a replacement instead of the Pulsars (I don't blame them) - is this 4663 and has it moved to Jesmond yet?



Re dead mileage...
The Mon-Fri 0632 Hexham Dickson Drive X85 to Newcastle seems to run empty from Newcastle,

Mon-Fri and Sat (10 mins later) 0635 85/685 ex-Newcastle surely can't then form the 0907 out from Carlisle with it terminating at 0846 due to drivers needing their break?

The last Arriva service out of Newcastle for Carlisle direct is the 1745 which gets to Carlisle for 1956. This surely can't form the 2007 out (the last service of the day) so if so, it must then run to Jesmond(!)

The last Arriva service out of Newcastle for Hexham is the 1945, which gets to Hexham for 2030. There are no Hexham to Newcastle journeys after 1937 which means that would have to run back to Jesmond too!


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Going on that basis that 2 buses run empty to/from Hexham and Jesmond and one from Carlisle to Jesmond;
Hexham to Jesmond is 22.5 miles or 31mins and
Carlisle to Jesmond is 58.3 miles or 1hour 17mins.

In total that is approximately 105 'dead' miles every day!


Sean

(10 Dec 2013, 9:45 pm)Greg in Weardale wrote [ -> ]It must be uneconomic then, with the equivalent of three light runs a.m. Jesmond to Hexham and one to Carlisle, plus three in the evening Hexham to Jesmond. It's just Arriva's obsession with competing with Northern's Tynedalexpress. Although I generally agree with competition and am opposed to the Tyne & Wear "Quality Contracts" which would in the long run be unaffordable and give a worse service than now, Hexham to Newcastle is an example of where competition becomes silly, even more so than Arriva's 1/X1 v Northern's OK1 was.

Arriva's obsession with competing with the Tynedale Express?! I thought I had mis-read that ridiculous comment, but upon re-reading it I realised I hadn't. So what you are saying is that Arriva should pack up and leave as soon as competition appears? I suspect not. GNE have decided to have a bite on this, so surely they have the obsession for competing (like with the OK1).

I agree competition does become silly from the passenger perspective, but both the recent 1/X1 v OK1 and the recent 685 v X85 service battles were instigated by one operator and one operator alone, who evidently saw a perceived gap in the market. Arriva are simply responding to the competition. Any company out in the real world would do the same, whether it be a bus company responding to a bus company or a supermarket responding to a competitor building a store next door.

The Hexham to Newcastle corridor cannot and will not support the level of competition that exists now. Arriva, Stagecoach and GNE will definitely be hitting minimal profit margins or more likely taking a loss. Come 18 months time, I suspect 1 or more operators will have withdrawn from this section as it cannot be sustainable in the current form for all operators involved.