(08 Jun 2016, 5:29 pm)mb134 wrote Ta, I'll check them out later on.
I think majority of my friends are voting 'In', and give me 'racist' comments on a daily basis as I show some support for leaving.
(08 Jun 2016, 5:15 pm)Andreos1 wrote It must be pointed out that us mere mortals weren't involved in electing Junker.
(08 Jun 2016, 5:33 pm)Adrian wrote The brexit NHS references are around TTIP. I'd suggest reading up on TTIP, but the NHS is likely to be excluded anyway. That doesn't stop, in my opinion, TTIP being a really bad thing for the UK.I saw Corbyns speech about TTIP the other day, and subsequently did some brief reading around it, it most certainly does not sound like a good thing.
However, if we left, then there's the potential a Tory majority Government could establish a TTIP scheme independently. Labour are opposed to it, and Jeremy Corbyn has vowed to kill such an agreement in Parliament.
On the other hand, John Major, former Tory PM, has put this on record. He reckons "the NHS would be as safe as a pet hamster in the presence of a hungry python if Boris Johnson, Michael Gove and Iain Duncan Smith rose to power following Brexit". It speaks volumes, for someone who worked for Mrs Thatcher.
(08 Jun 2016, 5:46 pm)mb134 wrote I saw Corbyns speech about TTIP the other day, and subsequently did some brief reading around it, it most certainly does not sound like a good thing.
One thing that has been on my mind throughout this Referendum campaign is, will Cameron stay as PM if we vote to leave, especially after supporting the 'Remain' side so strongly? If he doesn't stay on, am I right in thinking a General Election would occur?
(08 Jun 2016, 5:41 pm)MurdnunoC wrote But our elected representatives did which, as Adrian eludes, is not entirely different to how cabinet positions (once again, both Nationally and Locally) are decided here in the UK.
It must also be pointed out that we don't directly elect our heads of state. Lizzie aside, David Cameron is only the elected Member of Parliament for constituency of Witney. It is only by default that he happens to be the Prime Minister as us mere mortals (especially those in the North East) weren't involved in electing him either
Locally, nationally or supranationally - the application of democracy is arguably quite thin.
(08 Jun 2016, 5:54 pm)Adrian wrote No - a General Election can only be called every 5 years (due to fixed term Parliaments now), upon dissolution from the Monarch, or as the result of a vote of no confidence. Tories have a majority, so that latter is unlikely to happen or succeed unless called from within. I don't think they'd do that, as I think they'd just knife him like they did to Thatcher. That'd give the party the ability to elect a new leader, and subsequently a Prime Minister - alas the Blair / Brown situation back in 2007.
My opinion is that they'll knife him, if we vote to remain in.
(08 Jun 2016, 6:11 pm)mb134 wrote Ah okay. The reason I thought it occurred is that I seem to recall studying something like that happening in History last year, though I can't remember who, when or what happened.
So, if they elect a new leader, no General Election occurs, we just get a new PM?
(08 Jun 2016, 6:04 pm)Andreos1 wrote But it is different. The public and party members (of which it is easy to become), are involved at all stages of voting a prospective MP, leader and potential PM.
Whilst the people of Whitney may have voted Cameron in as their MP, we all know that they did so as they thought it was the right choice. Just as Labour party members chose Corbyn as their leader and potential PM.
We can just as easily vote them out.
Whilst we may have a say in who our MEP is going to be, we know that is the end of the road as far as public involvement and influence goes.
(08 Jun 2016, 6:21 pm)Adrian wrote James Callaghan in 1979(?) most likely? Labour minority Government at the time.
Yes - just a new PM.
(08 Jun 2016, 6:04 pm)Andreos1 wrote But it is different. The public and party members (of which it is easy to become), are involved at all stages of voting a prospective MP, leader and potential PM.
Whilst the people of Whitney may have voted Cameron in as their MP, we all know that they did so as they thought it was the right choice. Just as Labour party members chose Corbyn as their leader and potential PM.
We can just as easily vote them out.
Whilst we may have a say in who our MEP is going to be, we know that is the end of the road as far as public involvement and influence goes.
(08 Jun 2016, 6:26 pm)Adrian wrote Going over the same ground here, but it's going to be a matter of opinion. I've absolutely no influence who Witney Conservatives and the constituents select and elect as their MP, nor do I have any say over Cameron becoming the Prime Minister as a result of his party gaining a Commons majority.
The same as a Conservative party member has no influence over Labour elects as their leader. They can't join, become a supporter or affiliate to the Labour Party, under chapter 2 of the rule book.
Like I say though, it's a matter of opinion.
(08 Jun 2016, 6:42 pm)MurdnunoC wrote Glad you bring up Corbyn and the Labour Leadership election here as, in my opinion, it exemplifies the lack of public and party involvement in choosing a party leader (and potential PM) due to the politicking of those in the Parliamentary Labour Party.
While Corbyn has the overwhelming support of party members, he certainly did not have the support of those responsible of putting him on the ballot paper. If the PLP didn't underestimate his popularity with certain MP's nominating him despite having no intention of backing him, it's doubtful he would have made it as we've heard from the likes of Margaret Beckett and such.
Party politics aside, this has a direct effect on the electorate as the will of the party is not reflected in its leader, or potentially, the PM. If Labour happens to win the next General Election, one can argue Corbyn's assertion is accidental win due the nature of his appointment. If he ousted before then due to a vote of no confidence by the PLP, one can argue that his dismissal is against the will of party members and therefore undemocratic.
Either way, his position is dependant on the few and not the many.
(16 Jun 2016, 4:55 pm)beefcake wrote http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-36550304Just seen it on Twitter...
Labour MP dies after being shot and stabbed in her constituency. Absolutely horrific news. Thoughts with her family.
(16 Jun 2016, 4:55 pm)beefcake wrote http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-36550304
Labour MP dies after being shot and stabbed in her constituency. Absolutely horrific news. Thoughts with her family.
(16 Jun 2016, 4:55 pm)beefcake wrote http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-36550304
Labour MP dies after being shot and stabbed in her constituency. Absolutely horrific news. Thoughts with her family.
(16 Jun 2016, 4:55 pm)beefcake wrote http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-36550304
Labour MP dies after being shot and stabbed in her constituency. Absolutely horrific news. Thoughts with her family.
(16 Jun 2016, 7:33 pm)Adrian wrote Horrifying news. Thoughts are with her family and friends.
It's disgusting that in a civilised society, someone can be murdered in cold blood on our streets. Not to mention doing one of the most important jobs of all; democratically elected to public duty, to represent her thousands of constituents on a national platform.
(16 Jun 2016, 9:05 pm)MrFozz wrote I second that Adrian...
Makes me sick, it is sad enough to hear about things like this in places like the Middle East or Central and Latin America, it is horrible when it happens in our own back yard.
Whoever did this and I believe the Police have someone for it, they should fry for it, whatever our political beliefs, we all need to stand together and unite against the kind of hatred we have seen on this terrible day...Sad enough a woman being murdered in cold blood, even sadder that her children lost there mother.
I have a little recollection of the last serving MP to die in office, Ian Gow, I believe, and iirc correctly, that was absolutely shocking as well ?
Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk
(19 Jun 2016, 6:14 pm)Adrian wrote Nope - I'm sick of it all now to be honest. I've voted, so I'll not be watching anything else on it until the vote closes.
(19 Jun 2016, 6:21 pm)Michael wrote I'm sick of hearing it to but i wanted to watch it as i wanted to know why they want me to stay but David is swinging me towards leaving, hes just hopeless and not answering questions.
The audience is asking questions which we all want to hear and hes just avoiding some and giving a total different answer..........
Sick of all the scaremongering from BOTH sides....we don't know what will happen if we leave, it could be the best decision ever but then it could be the worst....
(19 Jun 2016, 6:14 pm)Adrian wrote Nope - I'm sick of it all now to be honest. I've voted, so I'll not be watching anything else on it until the vote closes.
