No where else to split X10 to put it on domestic hours. 

Personal opinion is that the route should be every 30 mins on Sunday route (ie all trips via Peterlee, Billingham and Stockton) allowing the split at Peterlee Bus Station, thus omitting Dalton Park.

Another solution for X10 could be to Run via A194(M), A182, Galleries, A182 to Hall Lane Estate then to Dalton Park.
or
X10 from Heworth via A194(M), A1(M), A183, A1052 to Houghton then via Hall Lane to Dalton Park.

After a quick look at googlemaps,would another solution for X10 be join A19 as normal from Norton,exit at Peterlee then via Burnhope Way to Peterlee BS,Up Easington Way then re-join the A19 at Little Thorpe (so the same as the X9 route) ? would still make the X10 Slightly quicker than the X9 by avoiding Billingham but not sure if it would be quicker than diverting it via Dalton Park

Aye you right there Michael, going southbound, you have to pass it to come off the A19 and then double back slightly don't you ?

Yes, you do (just checked with Husband. Not that being a man makes him more knowledgeable, more that he simply knows his way around there by road pretty well!!)

And the road into the retail park gets quite congested at times. The 22 is always late on Sundays when Dalton Park is busy.

On a normal day by the time the X10 pulls off the A19 and gone into dalton park and back on the A19, the X10 would of already passed Peterlee, if there's an event on at dalton park then the X10 would probably of reached norton or Stockton by the time it rejoined A19, can see this as a bad idea, what's wrong with passengers alighting at A19 northbound and then jump on the X6 to dalton park at the same bus stop and doing southbound get off at moorcock and walk around the corner to jump on the X10 southbound


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That would only work with 2 conditions:
1: The connection time between the X10 and X6 was short enough not to put people off, in both directions, and long enough not to be a right PITA if one of the buses is 10 minutes late. People don't want to be waiting around for an hour because they've missed their connection.
2: People particularly don't want to be waiting around in a location that has no shelter and nothing to do. (as an illustration I missed my connection at Durham bus station, by a minute, yesterday, leaving me with 29 minutes to kill. As it happened, I was carrying nothing, so the centre of Durham is easy enough to kill half an hour in, even after many of the shops have shut. If it had been raining, most of the bus station offers protection from that, so long as you avoid the holes in the rood and don't trip over the buckets! I would be less than comfortable if I had been stranded at the Moorcock at 5:30pm, though)

After a quick look at googlemaps,would another solution for X10 be join A19 as normal from Norton,exit at Peterlee then via Burnhope Way to Peterlee BS,Up Easington Way then re-join the A19 at Little Thorpe (so the same as the X9 route) ? would still make the X10 Slightly quicker than the X9 by avoiding Billingham but not sure if it would be quicker than diverting it via Dalton Park

Billingham's bus services have been decimated enough already. You need to remember that a bus route is more than its end points. There are two completely different Durham-Sunderland services, for example, but they have little more than a mile of their routes in common. The ANE 22 passes my front door. The GNE 20/20A passes no closer than 4 miles away and is no good to me unless I catch a 22 to meet it. (and yes, I'm aware that pedants will remind me that the 20 goes through Sunderland to South Shields, these days, but you can make the same comparison of the 20/20A and the 50 if the start and end points matter that much. They don't even have any of their respective routes through Durham in common!)

Bear in mind that although the X10 will serve Dalton Park, the long layover at Eldon Square (like the X21 at Bishop Auckland and the 10 at Hexham) would compensate for this as well as the PVR increase.

Are the new B5TLs equipped with Tachographs? Also, will the X9/X10 be driven by all drivers or just a dedicated rotas as now?

Bear in mind that although the X10 will serve Dalton Park, the long layover at Eldon Square (like the X21 at Bishop Auckland and the 10 at Hexham) would compensate for this as well as the PVR increase.

Are the new B5TLs equipped with Tachographs? Also, will the X9/X10 be driven by all drivers or just a dedicated rotas as now?

I can't see the B5TL been fitted with Tachos as the service been been split
X9 (X10) Newcastle - Peterlee Bus Station
X9 (X10) Dalton Park - Middlesbrough


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I can't see the B5TL been fitted with Tachos as the service been been split
X9 (X10) Newcastle - Peterlee Bus Station
X9 (X10) Dalton Park - Middlesbrough


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We'll be seeing South Tyne versas on those stints before too long, then!

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The X10 currently has very many passengers happy not serving Dalton Park. Increasing journey times will just push more passengers toward the train when Northern Connect starts.

I'd think to keep within the legislation every X10 will have to go through Dalton Park, including the early morning southbound journeys. Sounds pretty pointless, and potentially irritating, considering the shops and restaurants don't open until 10am.

I'd hazard a guess there will be more passenger inconvenienced by the route change than additional passengers attracted by it, despite the operational advantages GNE achieve.


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We'll be seeing South Tyne versas on those stints before too long, then!

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Not exactly, I think the pecking order depending on availabilty would go like this on the assumption that 3x ex-TTX  are allocated to the TVT with 3x spares (1x at Hexham + 2x at Riverside) with 6084 also spare:

1.) 6084
2.) 1x of the 2x corporate ex TTX B9s (2x at Riverside with the other at Hexham)
3.) TVT branded B9TL

On another note, will the ex TTX B9s be fitted with pushchair bays to make sure that prams can get on without having to potentially wait for the next bus if a Wheelchair or another pushchair is already on?

Billingham's bus services have been decimated enough already. You need to remember that a bus route is more than its end points. There are two completely different Durham-Sunderland services, for example, but they have little more than a mile of their routes in common. The ANE 22 passes my front door. The GNE 20/20A passes no closer than 4 miles away and is no good to me unless I catch a 22 to meet it. (and yes, I'm aware that pedants will remind me that the 20 goes through Sunderland to South Shields, these days, but you can make the same comparison of the 20/20A and the 50 if the start and end points matter that much. They don't even have any of their respective routes through Durham in common!)

BIB - Sorry if i didnt make it clear,but i ment Billingham would still have the X9 As like present,so they would not see a service reduction & Evenings/Sundays would still have the X10 also like present,i just ment that instead of diverting X10 Via Dalton Park,divert it Via Peterlee (maybe this would be better for the Service suggestion thread)

Bear in mind that although the X10 will serve Dalton Park, the long layover at Eldon Square (like the X21 at Bishop Auckland and the 10 at Hexham) would compensate for this as well as the PVR increase.

Are the new B5TLs equipped with Tachographs? Also, will the X9/X10 be driven by all drivers or just a dedicated rotas as now?

Dedicated rota as now - Could not fancy learning all of Gateshead drivers the route, just for 7 buses on it.

I wonder if GNE done a passenger consultation onboard the X10, or maybe there should and see what the response is.


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I wonder if GNE done a passenger consultation onboard the X10, or maybe there should and see what the response is.


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Sadly very much doubt it, as said previously I think a lot of passengers will be pushed onto the trains.

Sadly very much doubt it, as said previously I think a lot of passengers will be pushed onto the trains.

The flip side of the coin is that the X9/X10 services don't have enough layover time at either end to recover after incurring delays, and if a bus arrives in 10 minutes late, it's guaranteed to depart late by the time everyone alights and then boards again, meaning that a lot of journeys take more time than scheduled to, already.

This change would presumably only add around 5 minutes onto the timetable in either direction (i.e. roughly the same amount of time as what a lot of customers are being inconvenienced by already, due to lack of appropriate layover time), so in reality, this change would just provide a more realistic and achievable timetable, whilst also opening up new, direct links for passengers, which would hopefully grow the services in order to pay for the extra bus being added to the PVR.

Sadly very much doubt it, as said previously I think a lot of passengers will be pushed onto the trains.

Northern Connect is still 2 years away though, to be fair it won't just be the X10 impacted, the new Middlesbrough-Durham-Newcastle service will drive more people onto trains to Durham as the 158s will likely be hitting 90mph on the ECML, that's a threat to any express bus service (aside the twirlys who'll go with the freebie option) to Durham. 

Interesting times ahead, either way.

The flip side of the coin is that the X9/X10 services don't have enough layover time at either end to recover after incurring delays, and if a bus arrives in 10 minutes late, it's guaranteed to depart late by the time everyone alights and then boards again, meaning that a lot of journeys take more time than scheduled to, already.

This change would presumably only add around 5 minutes onto the timetable in either direction (i.e. roughly the same amount of time as what a lot of customers are being inconvenienced by already, due to lack of appropriate layover time), so in reality, this change would just provide a more realistic and achievable timetable, whilst also opening up new, direct links for passengers, which would hopefully grow the services in order to pay for the extra bus being added to the PVR.

I think going into Dalton Park is an interesting move for GNE and the extra bus added to the PVR will, as Dan says, allow for a good amount of layover time at each end of the route. This will be the bigger bonus for the X9/X10 in terms of reducing delays as buses that come in late will depart on time 90% of the time.
Expecting Dalton Park to pay for the extra bus added to the PVR may be expecting a bit much though. I wonder whether going half hourly via the Sunday route would have attracted a higher amount of growth? Admittedly this would have increased the journey time further, however I think this would be more than offset by the half hourly frequency attracting people.

PB0002400/629 Cancelled (Short notice)
GO NORTHERN LTD
Route: Chester-Le-Street, Ropery Lane/Durham County Cricket Ground to Newcastle, Eldon Square Bus Station
Service number: 21
Service type: Normal Stopping
Effective date: 25 Jul 2017


PB0003954/825 Registered (Short notice)
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Chester-Le-Street, Ropery Lane/Durham Cricket Ground to Newcaste, Eldon Square Bus Station
Service number: 21
Service type: Normal Stopping
Effective date: 25 Jul 2017

The flip side of the coin is that the X9/X10 services don't have enough layover time at either end to recover after incurring delays, and if a bus arrives in 10 minutes late, it's guaranteed to depart late by the time everyone alights and then boards again, meaning that a lot of journeys take more time than scheduled to, already.

This change would presumably only add around 5 minutes onto the timetable in either direction (i.e. roughly the same amount of time as what a lot of customers are being inconvenienced by already, due to lack of appropriate layover time), so in reality, this change would just provide a more realistic and achievable timetable, whilst also opening up new, direct links for passengers, which would hopefully grow the services in order to pay for the extra bus being added to the PVR.

I agree with this.

Apart from the Heworth-Newcastle stint, the X9 an X10 are entirely different route, which means that each one is effectively only hourly for the vast majority of its customers. A missing X9 or X10 is more than a daily occurrence, currently, which amounts to a 2 hour gap in service (because Newcastle - Heworth is more than adequately duplicated by the 27, even if you need to use different stops in Newcastle city centre)

Even if you live in Peterlee and work in Newcastle, if your X9 is a no show (ignoring the X10 because it barely skirts by), either because of a faulty vehicle (hopefully will be fixed, by September) or bad traffic (less controllable) then if you have the necessary GNE pass, you're shafted. it's either idle to Sunderland on the 56, be lucky enough to get on an X36 or make your way to Sunderland via Washington (assuming the pass you have covers the relevant zones). Stil takes well over an hour. By the time you've crawled into Peterlee on the X5/6/7, your journey time has more than doubled from the reasonable just under an hour you were banking on. OK if you have no commitments and a strong baldder, but not good if you need to pick up kids from childcare or get to another job or caring role.

The only way to speed it up is to pay for a Metro or Stagecoach ticket. 5 extra minutes to reach Dalton park, as annoying as it is is a small consideration, really.

PB0002400/629 Cancelled (Short notice)
GO NORTHERN LTD
Route: Chester-Le-Street, Ropery Lane/Durham County Cricket Ground to Newcastle, Eldon Square Bus Station
Service number: 21
Service type: Normal Stopping
Effective date: 25 Jul 2017


PB0003954/825 Registered (Short notice)
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Chester-Le-Street, Ropery Lane/Durham Cricket Ground to Newcaste, Eldon Square Bus Station
Service number: 21
Service type: Normal Stopping
Effective date: 25 Jul 2017

T20 Blast buses

http://newsroom.gonortheast.co.uk/news/e...nts-243999

I agree with this.


The only way to speed it up is to pay for a Metro or Stagecoach ticket. 5 extra minutes to reach Dalton park, as annoying as it is is a small consideration, really.

They could just add another bus into the PVR without diverting via Dalton Park, and they could continue the service 'whole' rather than splitting it. Costly, but not impossible. There seems to be an assumption passengers have to sacrifice something (in this case journey times) in exchange for a reliable service.

There's no dressing the change up other than efficiencies for GNE. That in itself is fine, Go-Ahead operate for profit - but it's always irritating when they advertise things like frequency reductions and additional running time as for the customer's benefit.

They could just add another bus into the PVR without diverting via Dalton Park, and they could continue the service 'whole' rather than splitting it. Costly, but not impossible. There seems to be an assumption passengers have to sacrifice something (in this case journey times) in exchange for a reliable service.

There's no dressing the change up other than efficiencies for GNE. That in itself is fine, Go-Ahead operate for profit - but it's always irritating when they advertise things like frequency reductions and additional running time as for the customer's benefit.

Splitting the route will mean the drivers (& buses) will no longer be on EU tachograph regulations. Therefore it'll give them flexibility in what vehicles can be used on the route (everything, basically). No longer will they have to scrap around for tacho fitted buses to replace breakdowns or help with delays etc. No waiting for one to come back in off a 97 or whatever to pinch, they'll be able to send any bus out. This will help massively with flexibility and should help solve some delays at very little cost to the passengers.

PB0003954/809 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Chester-Le-Street, Waldridge Park to Chester-Le-Street, Waldridge Park
Service number: 34,34A (834)
Service type: Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/808 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Gateshead Interchange to Metro Retail Park via Team Street, Metrocentre Interchange
Service number: X66
Service type: Limited Stop
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/806 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Front Street, Low Moorsley to Heworth Interchange via Hetton Le Hole, Houghton Le Spring, Silksworth, Sunderland, Hylton, Boldon
Service number: 35 (35A)
Service type: Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/803 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Sunderland Docks, Barrack Street to Silksworth, Church View
Service number: 33 (33A)
Service type: Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/797 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Easington Lane, High Street to Newcastle, Eldon Square Bus Station
Service number: X1 (X1A)
Service type: Limited Stop, Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/779 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Park Lane Interchange, Sunderland to New Bridge St, Newcastle via Monkwearmouth, Hylton Castle, Wrekenton
Service number: 56 (56A, N56)
Service type: Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/776 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Park Lane Interchange, Sunderland to Station Est, Murton via Grangetown, Ryhope, New Seaham
Service number: 61
Service type: Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/775 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Consett Bus Station to Park Lane Interchange, Sunderland via Leadgate, South Stanley, Grange Villa, Shiney Row
Service number: 78 (78A, X78)
Service type: Limited Stop, Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/772 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Concord to Brady Square/Waterview Park, Mandarin Way
Service number: 85 (86)
Service type: Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/766 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Sunderland, Park Lane Interchange to Hartlepool, Marina Way
Service number: X5 (X5A)
Service type: Limited Stop, Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/763 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Durham Bus Station to Metrocentre Interchange
Service number: X22 (937)
Service type: Limited Stop, Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/703 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Wallsend, Redesdale Park/Wiltshire Drive to Billy Mill, St Thomas More Catholic School
Service number: 678
Service type: Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/690 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Great Park Village, Waggonway Drive to Wallsend Metro
Service number: Q3
Service type: Hail & Ride, Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/687 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Gateshead Interchange to Lobley Hill, Cragside Gardend
Service number: 95
Service type: Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/254 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Hadrian Park to Burnside School, Wallsend via High Farm
Service number: 665
Service type: Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/186 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: North Shields, Christ Church to Longbenton DSS, Tyneview Park via Hadrian Park
Service number: 391
Service type: Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/86 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Gateshead Metro to Gateshead Metro via Team Valley, Heworth
Service number: 93 (94)
Service type: Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/809 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Chester-Le-Street, Waldridge Park to Chester-Le-Street, Waldridge Park
Service number: 34,34A (834)
Service type: Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/808 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Gateshead Interchange to Metro Retail Park via Team Street, Metrocentre Interchange
Service number: X66
Service type: Limited Stop
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/806 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Front Street, Low Moorsley to Heworth Interchange via Hetton Le Hole, Houghton Le Spring, Silksworth, Sunderland, Hylton, Boldon
Service number: 35 (35A)
Service type: Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/803 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Sunderland Docks, Barrack Street to Silksworth, Church View
Service number: 33 (33A)
Service type: Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/797 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Easington Lane, High Street to Newcastle, Eldon Square Bus Station
Service number: X1 (X1A)
Service type: Limited Stop, Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/779 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Park Lane Interchange, Sunderland to New Bridge St, Newcastle via Monkwearmouth, Hylton Castle, Wrekenton
Service number: 56 (56A, N56)
Service type: Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/776 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Park Lane Interchange, Sunderland to Station Est, Murton via Grangetown, Ryhope, New Seaham
Service number: 61
Service type: Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/775 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Consett Bus Station to Park Lane Interchange, Sunderland via Leadgate, South Stanley, Grange Villa, Shiney Row
Service number: 78 (78A, X78)
Service type: Limited Stop, Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/772 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Concord to Brady Square/Waterview Park, Mandarin Way
Service number: 85 (86)
Service type: Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/766 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Sunderland, Park Lane Interchange to Hartlepool, Marina Way
Service number: X5 (X5A)
Service type: Limited Stop, Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/763 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Durham Bus Station to Metrocentre Interchange
Service number: X22 (937)
Service type: Limited Stop, Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/703 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Wallsend, Redesdale Park/Wiltshire Drive to Billy Mill, St Thomas More Catholic School
Service number: 678
Service type: Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/690 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Great Park Village, Waggonway Drive to Wallsend Metro
Service number: Q3
Service type: Hail & Ride, Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/687 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Gateshead Interchange to Lobley Hill, Cragside Gardend
Service number: 95
Service type: Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/254 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Hadrian Park to Burnside School, Wallsend via High Farm
Service number: 665
Service type: Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/186 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: North Shields, Christ Church to Longbenton DSS, Tyneview Park via Hadrian Park
Service number: 391
Service type: Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

PB0003954/86 Registered
GO NORTH EAST LIMITED
Route: Gateshead Metro to Gateshead Metro via Team Valley, Heworth
Service number: 93 (94)
Service type: Normal Stopping
Effective date: 03 Sep 2017

Wonder if the X5A is the journeys on a night?

Splitting the route will mean the drivers (& buses) will no longer be on EU tachograph regulations. Therefore it'll give them flexibility in what vehicles can be used on the route (everything, basically). No longer will they have to scrap around for tacho fitted buses to replace breakdowns or help with delays etc. No waiting for one to come back in off a 97 or whatever to pinch, they'll be able to send any bus out. This will help massively with flexibility and should help solve some delays at very little cost to the passengers.

I understand why GNE are splitting the route. I'm saying we shouldn't discuss the splitting & re-route like it's the only solution the reliability problem. 

A customer-focused approach could be to leave the route as an express, add an extra bus into the PVR. I'd have thought the ratio of tacho'ed vehicles available as spares will go up when the B9s currently used are deployed onto other duties. If not, retro-fit tachos into as many vehicles as required to ensure a tacho'd spare is usually available on-call at Riverside (or better, stabled at Gateshead Metro during service hours)

A cost-focused approach would be the upcoming changes; splitting the route, not ordering a dedicated spare & opting to buy a service bus over a coach.

Clearly the cost-focused solution won-out in this case, or at least a compromise weighted towards cost-saving. That said, it's good there is a solution at all - the investment into the TTX is still sizeable, though it'd not a 'risky' investment as such. The TTX has a solid customer base and presumably a consistent revenue that justifies new buses every X number of years.

I like how they've set up the new timetables for the Hexham area.

Example: https://assets.goaheadbus.com/media/cms_...17_WEB.pdf

I like how they've set up the new timetables for the Hexham area.

Example: https://assets.goaheadbus.com/media/cms_...17_WEB.pdf

Assume they've been taken from the new 'Explore More' Hexham booklet Go North East have produced. More of a tourist guide rather than timetables for the everyday punter.

Assume they've been taken from the new 'Explore More' Hexham booklet Go North East have produced. More of a tourist guide rather than timetables for the everyday punter.

Good idea, Go North Should make a booklet for the "Black Cat" services, same as the "Toonlink", then all the services would be under one booklet.

With the buses changing in Sunderland, i hope we don't see any drastic cuts.

Anyone know what the 8 change is?, as i get this to and from work.

Farewell the 554. You shall...absolutely not be missed

I had meant to ride the final 687 journey, but I got involved looking for a lens for tomorrow's Airshow.

Just got an email from Go North East about the changes:

http://newsroom.gonortheast.co.uk/news/s...017-248135

A reminder these changes happen todayyyy.