North East Buses

(10 Sep 2023, 3:31 pm)L469 YVK wrote [ -> ]But if anything.....the 351 thrown in and coordinated along with an additional short 307 trip would sort the 33 minute layover situation out for Arriva's evening 306 journeys and although less impactful....GNE's 56  minute gap on the evening 307's.

It may make things much prettier, but there is obviously a reason why it works the way it does now.

(10 Sep 2023, 11:35 am)Storx wrote [ -> ]The 351 badly needs to run the full route, there's massive housing estates without an evening bus service at all currently and shouldn't be part of the Coast Road network.

imo the North Tyneside / SE Northumberland subsidised evening service should be the following:

1: Whitley Bay to wherever (Hourly)
19: North Shields to Cramlington (Hourly)
37: Cramlington to West End (Hourly)
41: Wallsend to Hadrian Park (Hourly)
57A: Whitley Bay to Bedlington (Hourly)
306: Extended to Whitley Bay (Hourly)
317: Whitley Bay to Wallsend (Hourly)
342: Killingworth to Wallsend (Hourly)
351: Whitley Bay to Newcastle (Hourly)
353: North Shields to Cramlington (Hourly)
359: Whitley Bay to Killingworth (Hourly)

351 -> 359 -> 342 -> 41 all interworking together.
1 / 306 - Interworking to provide 2 BPH between North Shields and Whitley Bay or thereabouts.

Everything else withdrawn or not replaced including the 54 (not a mistake). It would mean that everywhere would have a bus service 7 days a week, from early to late. There's absolutely no need for the 19 and 317 to be both 2 BPH as now either.

Agree with that, although the 317 is relatively busy in the evening. Probably gets more passengers than the 1.

The 19 could be scrapped all together on an evening/Sunday as it's a waste of time in it's current form, if they could work out a way for the 319 to incorporate the Fish Quay.

(10 Sep 2023, 3:39 pm)V514DFT wrote [ -> ]Wouldnt it be better to do something with the 335 and interwork that with the 41 infact now the 335 only go's as far as Hadrian Park you could can it altogether
335 Killingworth- Hadrian Park via Wallsend as now to Station Road then Wiltshire Drive/Wiltshire Gardens, West Street High Street West,Wallsend Interchange, Station Road, Mullen Road, Battle Hill Drive, Hadrian Park (The Bush), return same as Wallsend-Hadrian Park to Wallsend Interchange, then via Station Road (The Forum), Elton Street West, West Street, then the same route as Killingworth- Wallsend
342 would no longer serve West Street and High Street West, instead serving Station Road, The Forum, Wallsend Interchange, swapping with the 41/335

(10 Sep 2023, 5:58 pm)Thomas12 wrote [ -> ]Agree with that, although the 317 is relatively busy in the evening. Probably gets more passengers than the 1.

The 19 could be scrapped all together on an evening/Sunday as it's a waste of time in it's current form, if they could work out a way for the 319 to incorporate the Fish Quay.

Aye can't disagree tbh. The idea behind that 19 was to give East Cramlington a bus service as there's nothing along there currently and give Seghill a Metro link all night. 

Must admit I don't know about the 317 like just seems overkill to be subsidising it so much, same with the 1 every 30 minutes tbh.

(10 Sep 2023, 6:20 pm)Storx wrote [ -> ]Aye can't disagree tbh. The idea behind that 19 was to give East Cramlington a bus service as there's nothing along there currently and give Seghill a Metro link all night. 

Must admit I don't know about the 317 like just seems overkill to be subsidising it so much, same with the 1 every 30 minutes tbh.

Yes, it would make sense to have a 19 running from Northumberland Park to Cramlington on an evening as opposed to North Shields to Northumberland Park where it carries mostly fresh air from what I've seen.

The evening journeys on the 1 that are subsidised are only hourly (it's just the 21:58, 22:58, 23:58 departures from Newcastle, and the 20:12, 21:12, 22:12, and 23:12 journeys from Whitley Bay) - not sure if the Newcastle to Metrocentre section is subsidised but that's only hourly too.

Really the 1 should be every 30 mins, hourly evening routes are awful same with the 27

(10 Sep 2023, 6:51 pm)Thomas12 wrote [ -> ]Yes, it would make sense to have a 19 running from Northumberland Park to Cramlington on an evening as opposed to North Shields to Northumberland Park where it carries mostly fresh air from what I've seen.

The evening journeys on the 1 that are subsidised are only hourly (it's just the 21:58, 22:58, 23:58 departures from Newcastle, and the 20:12, 21:12, 22:12, and 23:12 journeys from Whitley Bay) - not sure if the Newcastle to Metrocentre section is subsidised but that's only hourly too.

Aye, tbh you could run the whole thing with the current PVR (19). If I'm right most those changes should be PVR neutral using what already exists or will be one extra bus max. I have a feeling if it was advertised well, you could always get a few kids travelling to/from the cinema in an evening.

Had a dumb moment, could've swore it was every 30 minutes from Whitley to North Shields, not a clue where that came from.

Just thought about this. Some posters have mentioned about having an X39 doing the 309 route from Blyth to Cobalt, then only calling at Silverlink & Willington Square before Newcastle. Now....the big issue is that demand could fluctuate between Cobalt & Newcastle outside of the peak times. Now a fast service to the Cobalt would be a huge welcome by all accounts, it's just working out how it would be managed outside of the peak times to ensure the route can remain profitable. So I've come up with the following.........

https://maps.app.goo.gl/rUipZ9HiUqMY1Br56 (note that Silver Fox Way and Quicksilver Way would be served rather than The Silverlink North

Route would be all stops between Blyth and East Benton Rise, then completely non-stop to Newcastle (maybe additionally serving the Corner House and Cradlewell depending on timekeeping?).

I haven't worked out how to deal with the other parts of the Coast Road network yet but.....the 351 would still serve a purpose to some extent although would no longer need to serve Holystone Park.

The main driver behind the above idea is not only a faster alternative to the 308 & 309......but also targeting the "high car use" areas with a half-decent offering rather than a completely random hourly service.

(17 Sep 2023, 1:08 pm)L469 YVK wrote [ -> ]Just thought about this. Some posters have mentioned about having an X39 doing the 309 route from Blyth to Cobalt, then only calling at Silverlink & Willington Square before Newcastle. Now....the big issue is that demand could fluctuate between Cobalt & Newcastle outside of the peak times. Now a fast service to the Cobalt would be a huge welcome by all accounts, it's just working out how it would be managed outside of the peak times to ensure the route can remain profitable. So I've come up with the following.........

https://maps.app.goo.gl/rUipZ9HiUqMY1Br56 (note that Silver Fox Way and Quicksilver Way would be served rather than The Silverlink North

Route would be all stops between Blyth and East Benton Rise, then completely non-stop to Newcastle (maybe additionally serving the Corner House and Cradlewell depending on timekeeping?).

I haven't worked out how to deal with the other parts of the Coast Road network yet but.....the 351 would still serve a purpose to some extent although would no longer need to serve Holystone Park.

The main driver behind the above idea is not only a faster alternative to the 308 & 309......but also targeting the "high car use" areas with a half-decent offering rather than a completely random hourly service.

It's too long that imo. This is ignoring operator, as there's obviously operator issues with this and allocating things as, so this is assuming franchising.

1: Orange Line, Every 20 Minutes
X70: Purple Line, NON STOP Newcastle to Wallsend Dene, Every 20 Minutes - Future serve Murton Gap (Dashed Line)
71/72: Pink Line (NT Loop), Every 20 Minutes Each Direction
73: Blue Line, Every 30 Minutes

[attachment=10557]

71/72: Combine Every 10 Minutes through Battle Hill
1/X70: Combine Every 10 Minutes, Whitley Bay to Blyth

There's no need for 6 buses from Blyth to Newcastle doing the same route give or take and you've gave a Cullercoats a quicker route to Newcastle via the current 308 corridor.

Could make a scope for sending the 73 via Wiltshire Drive aswell and pulling the 351 from that corridor via Matthew Bank something like the below and withdraw the 354 in the process.

[attachment=10558]

Thought I'd post this given the time and year, and no about another set of changes come March. A simple idea without re-inventing the wheel, but gives a faster service to Newcastle and opens better links from the Marden Estate too including to NT Hospital. Furthermore, would also give GNE a more efficient pattern and driving hours. Will post sample times but in general, running & layover times improved.

306:
- Tynemouth to Newcastle only
- Omits Battle Hill Drive
- No change to frequency

307:
- No change including frequency

309:
- Whitley Bay Seafront to Newcastle only
- Via Marden Estate rather than Hillheads

306/307/309 Coast Road Station Road to Newcastle:
- Up to every 6-7 minutes Monday to Saturday - 9 buses per hour
- Up to every 15 minutes evenings (**including evening only 308)
- Up to every 10 minutes Sundays

307/309 Battle Hill to Newcastle:
- Up to every 7-13 minutes Monday to Saturday
- Up to every 30 minutes Evenings
- Up to every 10-20 minutes Sundays

NEW X38:
- Same as current 308 Blyth to Willington Square, then non stop to Corner House before obeserving all stops to Newcastle Haymarket
- Timed for easy connections to / from services 306 & 309 if requiring Cobalt or other stops along the Coast Road. Through fares available
- Monday to Saturday every 20 minutes
- Sundays every 30 minutes

308**:
- Evenings only running every 60 minutes. No route change


PVR's and interworking patterns

306/X38(308)
Monday to Saturday
X38 > 306 > 306 > X38
- PVR 13x
Evenings
308 > 306 > 306 > 308
- PVR 4x
Sunday daytimes
X10/X11 > 306 > 306 > X10/X11
- PVR 8x
X38
- PVR 5x

307/309
Monday to Saturday
309 > 307 > 307 > 309
- PVR 13x
Evenings
307 > 307
- PVR 2x
309 > 309
- PVR 2x
Sunday daytimes
309 > 307 > 307 > 309
- PVR 9x

Monday to Saturday total PVR would reduce by 3x. Evening total PVR would reduce by 1x. Sunday PVR would increase by 1x. Interworking the 306 with X10/X11 on Sundays and X38 standalone would be necessary to maintain connections with 306 & 309.

(14 Jan 2024, 10:28 pm)L469 YVK wrote [ -> ]Thought I'd post this given the time and year, and no about another set of changes come March. A simple idea without re-inventing the wheel, but gives a faster service to Newcastle and opens better links from the Marden Estate too including to NT Hospital. Furthermore, would also give GNE a more efficient pattern and driving hours. Will post sample times but in general, running & layover times improved.

306:
- Tynemouth to Newcastle only
- Omits Battle Hill Drive
- No change to frequency

307:
- No change including frequency

309:
- Whitley Bay Seafront to Newcastle only
- Via Marden Estate rather than Hillheads

306/307/309 Coast Road Station Road to Newcastle:
- Up to every 6-7 minutes Monday to Saturday - 9 buses per hour
- Up to every 15 minutes evenings (**including evening only 308)
- Up to every 10 minutes Sundays

307/309 Battle Hill to Newcastle:
- Up to every 7-13 minutes Monday to Saturday
- Up to every 30 minutes Evenings
- Up to every 10-20 minutes Sundays

NEW X38:
- Same as current 308 Blyth to Willington Square, then non stop to Corner House before obeserving all stops to Newcastle Haymarket
- Timed for easy connections to / from services 306 & 309 if requiring Cobalt or other stops along the Coast Road. Through fares available
- Monday to Saturday every 20 minutes
- Sundays every 30 minutes

308**:
- Evenings only running every 60 minutes. No route change


PVR's and interworking patterns

306/X38(308)
Monday to Saturday
X38 > 306 > 306 > X38
- PVR 13x
Evenings
308 > 306 > 306 > 308
- PVR 4x
Sunday daytimes
X10/X11 > 306 > 306 > X10/X11
- PVR 8x
X38
- PVR 5x

307/309
Monday to Saturday
309 > 307 > 307 > 309
- PVR 13x
Evenings
307 > 307
- PVR 2x
309 > 309
- PVR 2x
Sunday daytimes
309 > 307 > 307 > 309
- PVR 9x

Monday to Saturday total PVR would reduce by 3x. Evening total PVR would reduce by 1x. Sunday PVR would increase by 1x. Interworking the 306 with X10/X11 on Sundays and X38 standalone would be necessary to maintain connections with 306 & 309.

Disagree with these, the 306 extension is about linking Tynemouth and Morrisons, not Newcastle. The vast majority of people in Cullercoats walk the small walk to the Metro and save around 30 minutes, especially since it's pretty much 12 TPH from there as you can realistically go either way.

The X38 also doesn't make sense. Any express route should be:
Newcastle - Corner House - NON STOP - Battle Hill (Coast Road) - Tyne Met College (Embleton Avenue) - Silverlink (The Silverlink) - Cobalt - Whitley Bay - Blyth

Cobalt is a destination in it's right heading away from Newcastle, and office workers don't want to go on a magical mystery tour around Battle Hill. You now don't have the problem with people having to change buses anymore.

The 306/307/308 then all could serve Battle Hill. Lynn Road really isn't that important to warrant an express service and you'd solve the 306/308 issue at Battle Hill.

(14 Jan 2024, 10:58 pm)Storx wrote [ -> ]Disagree with these, the 306 extension is about linking Tynemouth and Morrisons, not Newcastle. The vast majority of people in Cullercoats walk the small walk to the Metro and save around 30 minutes, especially since it's pretty much 12 TPH from there as you can realistically go either way.

The X38 also doesn't make sense. Any express route should be:
Newcastle - Corner House - NON STOP - Battle Hill (Coast Road) - Tyne Met College (Embleton Avenue) - Silverlink (The Silverlink) - Cobalt - Whitley Bay - Blyth

Cobalt is a destination in it's right heading away from Newcastle, and office workers don't want to go on a magical mystery tour around Battle Hill. You now don't have the problem with people having to change buses anymore.

The 306/307/308 then all could serve Battle Hill. Lynn Road really isn't that important to warrant an express service and you'd solve the 306/308 issue at Battle Hill.

I get the logic of a more 'full time' express route to Coablt. But, would it make money off peak?

At least via Billy Mill, it would still have a chance picking up reasonable loads plus....throw a busy shopping / event day in or a matchday, could easily leave Willington Square with an almost full double decker.

Going via Cobalt would lose the Social, Domestic and Pleasure traffic. Something that makes the 308 money on top of commuters.

(15 Jan 2024, 8:45 am)L469 YVK wrote [ -> ]I get the logic of a more 'full time' express route to Coablt. But, would it make money off peak?

At least via Billy Mill, it would still have a chance picking up reasonable loads plus....throw a busy shopping / event day in or a matchday, could easily leave Willington Square with an almost full double decker.

Going via Cobalt would lose the Social, Domestic and Pleasure traffic. Something that makes the 308 money on top of commuters.

Think it would be popular, if it went via The Silverlink.

Means people from Whitley Bay etc could get off the bus stop which is right next to Silverlink, rather than having to cross busy roundabouts, under a nasty underpass and walk for ages, especially if heading to the cinema. You could even make the case for looping around Osprey Drive and serving the bus stop directly behind the cinema.

There's only really Lynn Road which you'd lose, the rest of is covered by the X39 anyway (let's call it that).

Cobalt is probably at its peak for express services to be honest, the bigger employers are still hybrid and office days a result tend to be a more traditional 8-4/9–5 approach. You’ll see 309s and 22s carry fresh air through cobalt during the day

The 22X and X39 tend to be well loaded and whilst the 39 used to be the busier, since the strike and integrated ticketing the 22X seem more popular (possibly because it doesn’t stop at all stops from Cradlewell into Newcastle which does slow the X39 down and limit the diversion options)

(16 Jan 2024, 10:06 pm)Ambassador wrote [ -> ]Cobalt is probably at its peak for express services to be honest, the bigger employers are still  hybrid and office days a result tend to be a more traditional 8-4/9–5 approach. You’ll see 309s and 22s carry fresh air through cobalt during the day

The 22X and X39 tend to be well loaded and whilst the 39 used to be the busier, since the strike and integrated ticketing the 22X seem more popular (possibly because it doesn’t stop at all stops from Cradlewell into Newcastle which does slow the X39 down and limit the diversion options)

Yeah you're probably right. It'll be interesting how profitable the Coast Road services are really, whenever I see them at this end of the route between Blyth and Seaton Sluice usually it's much of the same running around empty and that includes peak times.

When Durham Road can only sustain 6 buses an hour (9 with the X12/X21 at points), serves multiple large towns and 2 cities with no real competition. You really start to question whether they still needs to be 12 buses an hour along there, especially when there's not really any large towns at either end as they're served by the Metro or quicker buses to Blyth, and like you said, Cobalt is still part time working. Peak times maybe, off peak I'm not too sure.

6 buses in particular from Rake Lane to Blyth is just complete overkill imo.

As promised [attachment=10643]

Arriva times and Go North East times colour coordinated accordingly too. Note that Sunday daytime X10/X11's would need to interwork with service 306. Stand's L & M at Haymarket would also need barriers removed and merged into a bigger Stand L with 2x bays (you'll see what I mean in the timetable).

Another consideration.....would the X38/308 continue to run via Ridley Park, or could Ridley Park maybe be picked up by an alternative service so that the X38/308 can retain some of the links provided on the Broadway by service 309?

In a nutshell, the whole motives behind the suggested changes are:

* Reduce overbussing especially between NT Hospital and Blyth.
* Improve reliability especially between Blyth and North Tyneside - more robust timetables that should hopefully cover a 'sunny day'.
* Improved links for the Marden Estate and quicker journey time into Newcastle.
* Reduced wastage such as the long evening 306 & 307 layovers in Tynemouth & North Shields.

(21 Jan 2024, 12:58 pm)L469 YVK wrote [ -> ]As promised 

Arriva times and Go North East times colour coordinated accordingly too. Note that Sunday daytime X10/X11's would need to interwork with service 306. Stand's L & M at Haymarket would also need barriers removed and merged into a bigger Stand L with 2x bays (you'll see what I mean in the timetable).

Another consideration.....would the X38/308 continue to run via Ridley Park, or could Ridley Park maybe be picked up by an alternative service so that the X38/308 can retain some of the links provided on the Broadway by service 309?

In a nutshell, the whole motives behind the suggested changes are:

* Reduce overbussing especially between NT Hospital and Blyth.
* Improve reliability especially between Blyth and North Tyneside - more robust timetables that should hopefully cover a 'sunny day'.
* Improved links for the Marden Estate and quicker journey time into Newcastle.
* Reduced wastage such as the long evening 306 & 307 layovers in Tynemouth & North Shields.

That 309 would carry around fresh air, it's literally resurrecting the X9 from around 2012, which failed miserably as it's way too long from Marden estate and serves nothing else in the process. Only someone mad would use it over the X38 as it's not competitive from Whitley Bay.

(21 Jan 2024, 2:28 pm)Storx wrote [ -> ]That 309 would carry around fresh air, it's literally resurrecting the X9 from around 2012, which failed miserably as it's way too long from Marden estate and serves nothing else in the process. Only someone mad would use it over the X38 as it's not competitive from Whitley Bay.

Each route would have a different purpose though, hence reducing the whole 'overlap'. If someone was travelling from Whitley Bay, Foxhunters (including parts Marden if able to walk) or Preston Grange to Newcastle, they'd likely use the X38/308.

306 purpose:
- Metro replacement if Metro is off
- Tynemouth, North Shields, Collingwood, Chirton, Silverlink
- All stops along the Coast Road (with some feed from the X38)
- Coast Road / Station Road to Newcastle

307 purpose:
- North Shields, Meadowell, Chirton, New York Hadrian Park, Battle Hill, High Farm
- Battle Hill > High Farm > Coast Road / Station Road to Newcastle

X38 purpose (evening 308 still serving all stops):
- Willington Square, Silverlink, Chirton, Preston Grange, Foxhunters, Hillheads, Whitley Bay, The Coast, Blyth
- Blyth to Cobalt (with change onto 309 at Whitley Bay or NT Hospital)
- Seaton Sluice, Whitley Bay, Hillheads, Foxhunters, Preston Grange, Chirton, Silverlink, Willington Square fast to High Heaton, Jesmond, Newcastle

309 purpose:
- Blyth to Cobalt link (in conjunction with X38)
- Marden to Newcastle (still faster than 306)
- Marden to NT Hospital direct link re-instated.
- Offers some locations or nearby locations previously covered by 308 and no longer observed by X38.
- Cobalt then Battle Hill > High Farm > Coast Road / Station Road to Newcastle

Also looking at current common corridors:
- Coast Road / Station Road to Newcastle - excluding the X38 from Corner House, reduced from 12bph to 9bph. Likely that 306, 307 and 309 will carry more passengers as a result along this stretch
- Battle Hill to Newcastle - reduced from 9bph to 6bph, 307 and 309 will carry more passengers
- Billy Mill to Newcastle - some will tend towards X38 although coincidentally still 'some' headway with 306. But the 306 would mainly be focussed on any passengers needing all stops along the Coast Road as opposed to more into High Heaton, Jesmond or Newcastle.
- Preston Grange, Foxhunters, Hillheads, Whitley Bay, The Coast, Blyth - Reduced from 6bph to 3bph. Therefore, X38 would likely carry more on this stretch.

Speaking of the Ridley Park or Broadway issue in Blyth, if GNE decided to do a u-turn for the umpteenth time on extending the Coaster to wherever in Gateshead and instead curtail at Gateshead Interchange or Newcastle.......could be an opportunity to open up a new full coastal link to Blyth and solve the Ridley Park issue out. Although, would need re-numbered 301 in-case some poor soul intending going to Bedlington Station or Ashington ended up in Wallsend or Walkergate haha!

(21 Jan 2024, 12:58 pm)L469 YVK wrote [ -> ]As promised 

In a nutshell, the whole motives behind the suggested changes are:

* Reduce overbussing especially between NT Hospital and Blyth.
* Improve reliability especially between Blyth and North Tyneside - more robust timetables that should hopefully cover a 'sunny day'.
* Improved links for the Marden Estate and quicker journey time into Newcastle.
* Reduced wastage such as the long evening 306 & 307 layovers in Tynemouth & North Shields.

The "X38" takes longer between Blyth and Newcastle than the current 308? How would they try and spin that as an express?

It's also slower than your proposed evening all stops 308?

(21 Jan 2024, 6:05 pm)mb134 wrote [ -> ]The "X38" takes longer between Blyth and Newcastle than the current 308? How would they try and spin that as an express?

It's also slower than your proposed evening all stops 308?

That's with reliability improvements too and an achievable timetable! Both are 67 minutes end to end ex Blyth but the X38 is 61 minutes ex Newcastle as opposed to the current 66 minutes with the 308.

308 only currently gets 40 minutes from Blyth to Billy Mill. That would increase to 44 minutes, helping with any reliability issues and keep the timetable as robust as possible. You know when Whitley Bay seafront is wall to wall with traffic when the sun comes out? Will be unsustainable for GNE & Arriva to keep adding time and resources onto the 308 & 309 due to NTC's anti-motorist attitude and poor traffic management.

If the 308 was to run with revised running times during the day, it would be 72 minutes ex Blyth. Okay, X38 would still only be 5 minutes faster but.....that's with all stops observed between Corner House and Newcastle as it would be too much of a jump to make it a 'hard' express only saving a further 2-3 minutes in the process.

(21 Jan 2024, 5:36 pm)L469 YVK wrote [ -> ]Each route would have a different purpose though, hence reducing the whole 'overlap'. If someone was travelling from Whitley Bay, Foxhunters (including parts Marden if able to walk) or Preston Grange to Newcastle, they'd likely use the X38/308.
306 purpose:
- Metro replacement if Metro is off
- Tynemouth, North Shields, Collingwood, Chirton, Silverlink
- All stops along the Coast Road (with some feed from the X38)
- Coast Road / Station Road to Newcastle
307 purpose:
- North Shields, Meadowell, Chirton, New York Hadrian Park, Battle Hill, High Farm
- Battle Hill > High Farm > Coast Road / Station Road to Newcastle
X38 purpose (evening 308 still serving all stops):
- Willington Square, Silverlink, Chirton, Preston Grange, Foxhunters, Hillheads, Whitley Bay, The Coast, Blyth
- Blyth to Cobalt (with change onto 309 at Whitley Bay or NT Hospital)
- Seaton Sluice, Whitley Bay, Hillheads, Foxhunters, Preston Grange, Chirton, Silverlink, Willington Square fast to High Heaton, Jesmond, Newcastle
309 purpose:
- Blyth to Cobalt link (in conjunction with X38)
- Marden to Newcastle (still faster than 306)
- Marden to NT Hospital direct link re-instated.
- Offers some locations or nearby locations previously covered by 308 and no longer observed by X38.
- Cobalt then Battle Hill > High Farm > Coast Road / Station Road to Newcastle
Also looking at current common corridors:
- Coast Road / Station Road to Newcastle - excluding the X38 from Corner House, reduced from 12bph to 9bph. Likely that 306, 307 and 309 will carry more passengers as a result along this stretch
- Battle Hill to Newcastle - reduced from 9bph to 6bph, 307 and 309 will carry more passengers
- Billy Mill to Newcastle - some will tend towards X38 although coincidentally still 'some' headway with 306. But the 306 would mainly be focussed on any passengers needing all stops along the Coast Road as opposed to more into High Heaton, Jesmond or Newcastle.
- Preston Grange, Foxhunters, Hillheads, Whitley Bay, The Coast, Blyth - Reduced from 6bph to 3bph. Therefore, X38 would likely carry more on this stretch.
Speaking of the Ridley Park or Broadway issue in Blyth, if GNE decided to do a u-turn for the umpteenth time on extending the Coaster to wherever in Gateshead and instead curtail at Gateshead Interchange or Newcastle.......could be an opportunity to open up a new full coastal link to Blyth and solve the Ridley Park issue out. Although, would need re-numbered 301 in-case some poor soul intending going to Bedlington Station or Ashington ended up in Wallsend or Walkergate haha!

See personally, I still think the Coast Road is still way overbused, there's no need for 12 buses along there during the day. Personally, I'd send everything through Battle Hill and seriously look at having the Saturday timetable all week with the 308/307 swapped around so the Whitley Bay services are every 15 minutes with some express X38's at peak times only running non-stop from Billy Mill to Newcastle.

I'd also say add an extra route like https://maps.app.goo.gl/XLCiN86FCqaYyw3B8 so the 307 can run the 306 route from Newcastle to Norham Road, then maybe run direct from The Quadrant to North Shields via Chirton to get the 306/307 more equal with the 307 extended to Tynemouth to give a 4 BPH from Tynemouth to Newcastle and also the 309 also omitting High Farm. You might also have to make some changes here and there elsewhere, 308 through Silverlink maybe? So they're equal aswell.

It would mean you'd have a nice clean service from Battle Hill via Selby Gardens every 7.5 minutes rather than the 3, 7, 10 I believe it is currently and 15 minute service from Tynemouth/North Shields or Whitley Bay from Newcastle rather than the 5/15 currently which is just crap timetabling.

If there becomes too much demand on the 308/309 side of the route (it won't be coming from the other side) then look at introducing the X38 all day and curtail the 308 short at Whitley Bay.

See I would spin this service on the head.

I would re-introduce the service 311 and create it as an express service

Newcastle - Corner House -CHILLINGHAM Road Roundabout then express to chicken Road ramp area but direct then every stop through battlehill then a bizarre loop along to the B&Q roundabout where the Police station and Wallsend pub is loop round the roundabout then head up to hadrian Park and do the loop

This random loop is key ( it's about 1min added journey at present it's worth it)

We have then created an express route and dealt with Hadrian Park

307 doesn't go round the the loop at haridan Park and becomes an express except at night
Every bus 306 307 308 309 (311 example service) serves the link to serve police station B&Q Wallsend pub

We then create a mini hub/bus station to interlink with services

It also means using the 311 service it can create an express service but act as a feeder service to reuglate a later running service eg...

A 311 service could have the driver say anyone want the 308 service is to board this bus we will meet the bus at battlehill for your onward journey (the 308 could even terminate at Chillingham Road and meet the service

The purpose of the 311 is to create an express service but also a service to regulate a late service

Thought of this after taking into account some other ideas posted by other members. This one also includes some of the ex-Arriva secondary services, but the PVR re-allocated and also forms an interworking pattern.

306/307/308/309 (Newcastle - Coast Road - Selby Gardens - Battle Hill Drive)
- Every 30 mins each
- Every 7-8 minutes combined

306 - Go North East (PVR 4x)
- No longer operates between Tynemouth and Whitley Bay
- Same route but additionally serves North Shields interchange
- Better coordination with revised 307

307 - Go North East (PVR 3x)
- Same route as 306 to Silverlink then via Norham Road, Verne Road, The Quadrant, Delaval Avenue, Billy Mill Avenue and Albion Road toNorth Shields Interchange
- Better coordination with 306 to and from North Shields....actually slightly faster by a few minutes

308 - Go North East (PVR 4x)
- Same route as 309 after Battle Hill Drive to Cobalt then New York Road, Norham Road North, Westminster Avenue, NT Hospital and Marden Estate to Whitley Bay
- Up to 15 minute frequency NT Hospital to Newcastle via New York & Cobalt

309 - Arriva Northumbria (PVR 5x**)
- Same 309 route as now after Battle Hill Drive
- Provides upto 15 minute service with X38 NT Hospital to Blyth

X38 - Arriva Northumbria (PVR 5x**)
- Every 30 minutes
- Same as current 308 Blyth to Wallsend Dene then non stop to Civic Centre, St Mary's Place and Haymarket
- Provides upto 15 minute service with 309 NT Hospital to Blyth

** X38 & 309 interwork in Blyth

Arriva would lose a PVR of 5x, but would also lose most of their dead mileage

The other ideas.....

300 - Go North East (PVR 4.5x***)
- Every 30 minutes
- Newcastle to North Shields via Coast Road, Cross Avenue, Wiltshire Drive, High Farm, Battle Hill, Hadrian Park, Middle Engine Lane, Norham Road, Wallsend Road, Ripley Avenue and Meadowell

36 - Go North East (PVR 4.5***)
- Re-numbered from 353 and increased to every 30 minutes
- Every 15 minutes combined with Stagecoach's 37 Killingworth to Cramlington with ticket acceptance on both services

*** Services 300 & 36 interwork in North Shields

The other ex-Arriva services
- 351 - Omits Wiltshire Drive
- 352 - Withdrawn
- 354 - Can be replaced by............

* 359 which does the old 335 loop in New York & Murton.
* X63 > becomes service 356 doing the Killingworth loop then old 54/356 route to Newcastle. X63 still runs during peaks.

- 355 replaced by 38 and 356. X7/X8 observe all stops Matthews Bank to Newcastle all day as per current evening arrangements.

- Through fares on service 359 & 335 as far as Four Lane Ends to keep some connections from the 354.

(24 Feb 2024, 11:27 am)L469 YVK wrote [ -> ]Thought of this after taking into account some other ideas posted by other members. This one also includes some of the ex-Arriva secondary services, but the PVR re-allocated and also forms an interworking pattern.

306/307/308/309 (Newcastle - Coast Road - Selby Gardens - Battle Hill Drive)
- Every 30 mins each
- Every 7-8 minutes combined

306 - Go North East (PVR 4x)
- No longer operates between Tynemouth and Whitley Bay
- Same route but additionally serves North Shields interchange
- Better coordination with revised 307

307 - Go North East (PVR 3x)
- Same route as 306 to Silverlink then via Norham Road, Verne Road, The Quadrant, Delaval Avenue, Billy Mill Avenue and Albion Road toNorth Shields Interchange
- Better coordination with 306 to and from North Shields....actually slightly faster by a few minutes

308 - Go North East (PVR 4x)
- Same route as 309 after Battle Hill Drive to Cobalt then New York Road, Norham Road North, Westminster Avenue, NT Hospital and Marden Estate to Whitley Bay
- Up to 15 minute frequency NT Hospital to Newcastle via New York & Cobalt

309 - Arriva Northumbria (PVR 5x**)
- Same 309 route as now after Battle Hill Drive
- Provides upto 15 minute service with X38 NT Hospital to Blyth

X38 - Arriva Northumbria (PVR 5x**)
- Every 30 minutes
- Same as current 308 Blyth to Wallsend Dene then non stop to Civic Centre, St Mary's Place and Haymarket
- Provides upto 15 minute service with 309 NT Hospital to Blyth

** X38 & 309 interwork in Blyth

Arriva would lose a PVR of 5x, but would also lose most of their dead mileage

The other ideas.....

300 - Go North East (PVR 4.5x***)
- Every 30 minutes
- Newcastle to North Shields via Coast Road, Cross Avenue, Wiltshire Drive, High Farm, Battle Hill, Hadrian Park, Middle Engine Lane, Norham Road, Wallsend Road, Ripley Avenue and Meadowell

36 - Go North East (PVR 4.5***)
- Re-numbered from 353 and increased to every 30 minutes
- Every 15 minutes combined with Stagecoach's 37 Killingworth to Cramlington with ticket acceptance on both services

*** Services 300 & 36 interwork in North Shields

The other ex-Arriva services
- 351 - Omits Wiltshire Drive
- 352 - Withdrawn
- 354 - Can be replaced by............

* 359 which does the old 335 loop in New York & Murton.
* X63 > becomes service 356 doing the Killingworth loop then old 54/356 route to Newcastle. X63 still runs during peaks.

- 355 replaced by 38 and 356. X7/X8 observe all stops Matthews Bank to Newcastle all day as per current evening arrangements.

- Through fares on service 359 & 335 as far as Four Lane Ends to keep some connections from the 354.

For once, don't really disagree with the Coast Road changes, the only thing I'd personally say is terminate the 309 short at Whitley Bay and instead the extend the 306 through from Tynemouth to Blyth.

I actually think in the leisure months having a Coastal bus which runs the whole stretch from North Shields to Blyth via Tynemouth, Seaton Sluice and Whitley Bay could actually be quite popular. It's some different destinations from Blyth than 'another' bus to Newcastle.

Personally though I'd keep the 354 but change it and run it something like this every 30 minutes, every hour on the two separate sections:
[attachment=10673]

It would open quite a few links up especially to Gosforth which is quite difficult to get to without doubling back via Newcastle and also sort out the 351 without it going anywhere near the Coast Road. At the same time, you could cancel the W2 and 335 as neither are really needed anymore, I know there'll be the odd moan from the likes of Hadrian Park to ASDA but it's not worth the tax payers money, all the unique sections which are currently unserved at all are covered. The 335 could however maybe run once a day as a workers service to Quorum - maybe extending to Cobalt to open those links

(24 Feb 2024, 11:27 am)L469 YVK wrote [ -> ]Thought of this after taking into account some other ideas posted by other members. This one also includes some of the ex-Arriva secondary services, but the PVR re-allocated and also forms an interworking pattern.

306/307/308/309 (Newcastle - Coast Road - Selby Gardens - Battle Hill Drive)
- Every 30 mins each
- Every 7-8 minutes combined

306 - Go North East (PVR 4x)
- No longer operates between Tynemouth and Whitley Bay
- Same route but additionally serves North Shields interchange
- Better coordination with revised 307

307 - Go North East (PVR 3x)
- Same route as 306 to Silverlink then via Norham Road, Verne Road, The Quadrant, Delaval Avenue, Billy Mill Avenue and Albion Road toNorth Shields Interchange
- Better coordination with 306 to and from North Shields....actually slightly faster by a few minutes

308 - Go North East (PVR 4x)
- Same route as 309 after Battle Hill Drive to Cobalt then New York Road, Norham Road North, Westminster Avenue, NT Hospital and Marden Estate to Whitley Bay
- Up to 15 minute frequency NT Hospital to Newcastle via New York & Cobalt

309 - Arriva Northumbria (PVR 5x**)
- Same 309 route as now after Battle Hill Drive
- Provides upto 15 minute service with X38 NT Hospital to Blyth

X38 - Arriva Northumbria (PVR 5x**)
- Every 30 minutes
- Same as current 308 Blyth to Wallsend Dene then non stop to Civic Centre, St Mary's Place and Haymarket
- Provides upto 15 minute service with 309 NT Hospital to Blyth

** X38 & 309 interwork in Blyth

Arriva would lose a PVR of 5x, but would also lose most of their dead mileage

The other ideas.....

300 - Go North East (PVR 4.5x***)
- Every 30 minutes
- Newcastle to North Shields via Coast Road, Cross Avenue, Wiltshire Drive, High Farm, Battle Hill, Hadrian Park, Middle Engine Lane, Norham Road, Wallsend Road, Ripley Avenue and Meadowell

36 - Go North East (PVR 4.5***)
- Re-numbered from 353 and increased to every 30 minutes
- Every 15 minutes combined with Stagecoach's 37 Killingworth to Cramlington with ticket acceptance on both services

*** Services 300 & 36 interwork in North Shields

The other ex-Arriva services
- 351 - Omits Wiltshire Drive
- 352 - Withdrawn
- 354 - Can be replaced by............

* 359 which does the old 335 loop in New York & Murton.
* X63 > becomes service 356 doing the Killingworth loop then old 54/356 route to Newcastle. X63 still runs during peaks.

- 355 replaced by 38 and 356. X7/X8 observe all stops Matthews Bank to Newcastle all day as per current evening arrangements.

- Through fares on service 359 & 335 as far as Four Lane Ends to keep some connections from the 354.

Sent from my SM-A526B using Tapatalk

(24 Feb 2024, 12:50 pm)MurdnunoC wrote [ -> ]

Sent from my SM-A526B using Tapatalk

How it feels always a service suggestion for the coast road for whatever reason

(24 Feb 2024, 1:27 pm)Aaron21 wrote [ -> ]How it feels always a service suggestion for the coast road for whatever reason

Haha, fair enough. But there is a serious issue though. GNE & Arriva have added running time for March's changes. And that's without thousands of homes propped up. The traffic siutation is only going to get worse and ever since the 44 was withdrawn, the east of North Tyneside has been crying out for an express.

If GNE, Arriva & NOTCA/TNE get it right, it could create future growth.

---

(24 Feb 2024, 11:51 am)Storx wrote [ -> ]For once, don't really disagree with the Coast Road changes, the only thing I'd personally say is terminate the 309 short at Whitley Bay and instead the extend the 306 through from Tynemouth to Blyth.

I actually think in the leisure months having a Coastal bus which runs the whole stretch from North Shields to Blyth via Tynemouth, Seaton Sluice and Whitley Bay could actually be quite popular. It's some different destinations from Blyth than 'another' bus to Newcastle.

Personally though I'd keep the 354 but change it and run it something like this every 30 minutes, every hour on the two separate sections:


It would open quite a few links up especially to Gosforth which is quite difficult to get to without doubling back via Newcastle and also sort out the 351 without it going anywhere near the Coast Road. At the same time, you could cancel the W2 and 335 as neither are really needed anymore, I know there'll be the odd moan from the likes of Hadrian Park to ASDA but it's not worth the tax payers money, all the unique sections which are currently unserved at all are covered. The 335 could however maybe run once a day as a workers service to Quorum - maybe extending to Cobalt to open those links

Only issue with the 354 replacement if the 359 wasn't to run, would be the lack of NT Hospital to Backworth / Killingworth service.

Only thing is could the 359 still run, or maybe interwork with one of the 351/354 replacements?

(24 Feb 2024, 5:44 pm)L469 YVK wrote [ -> ]Haha, fair enough. But there is a serious issue though. GNE & Arriva have added running time for March's changes. And that's without thousands of homes propped up. The traffic siutation is only going to get worse and ever since the 44 was withdrawn, the east of North Tyneside has been crying out for an express.

If GNE, Arriva & NOTCA/TNE get it right, it could create future growth.

---

Only issue with the 354 replacement if the 359 wasn't to run, would be the lack of NT Hospital to Backworth / Killingworth service.

Only thing is could the 359 still run, or maybe interwork with one of the 351/354 replacements?

I'd probably see what could be done with the 359, could you run it through Monkseaton for example maybe instead and give links to the hospital from there for example. 

If you pull it out of the 351/335 though it could be ran with breadvans which would save money. There's absolutely no need for Streetlites on there. There's still need for the hospital links either way or maybe it could be an extended 342 with the 342 curtailed between to only Killingworth and Wallsend. It's a right dog leg route right now and the 342 is not busy West of Killingworth either whenever I see it.

(24 Feb 2024, 6:27 pm)Storx wrote [ -> ]I'd probably see what could be done with the 359, could you run it through Monkseaton for example maybe instead and give links to the hospital from there for example. 

If you pull it out of the 351/335 though it could be ran with breadvans which would save money. There's absolutely no need for Streetlites on there. There's still need for the hospital links either way or maybe it could be an extended 342 with the 342 curtailed between to only Killingworth and Wallsend. It's a right dog leg route right now and the 342 is not busy West of Killingworth either whenever I see it.

The 342 between Kingston Park and Wideopen is often busy. It's a popular shopping route for people in Hazlerigg/Wideopen/Seaton Burn to either Tesco at Kingston Park or Morrisons at Killingworth.

(24 Feb 2024, 7:00 pm)Shrek wrote [ -> ]The 342 between Kingston Park and Wideopen is often busy. It's a popular shopping route for people in Hazlerigg/Wideopen/Seaton Burn to either Tesco at Kingston Park or Morrisons at Killingworth.

Aye that's fair, I must admit I always see it around the Burradon / Annitsford area and it's pretty much constantly dead whenever it goes by. Maybe I just see it at the wrong times, who knows. Don't believe I've ever seen it at the other extreme, mind I'm surprised it doesn't serve Great Park for the Morrison's store there which is pretty much inaccessible other than from Gosforth.

Abort abort abort

Why in gods name would you change bus service routes numbers

Changing route numbers create complications

Changing routes adds to passengers not using services as they are confused

Even if it is a yearly leisure trip