(03 Oct 2021, 9:40 pm)Jimmi wrote I feel like priorities in regards to public transport are a bit backwards in the UK these days, feels like the features are more important than the actual bus service these days, a lot of bus adverts now are saying lines like "cruise into town with our free WiFi" rather than advertising things to do along the route.

I honestly think binning off some of these features especially on shorter routes would actually be beneficial in some form to cut costs as I do wonder what percentage are using public transport purely on the bus having WiFi? Stagecoach has had WiFi disabled on the vast majority of its fleet for the last 12 months and I do wonder what impacts its REALLY had on passenger numbers as I can't see it being many, First might as well not have it with how low their data limit is but must still cost them a fortune just to have it.

Think the big influence of those like Ray Stenning of Best Impressions has led to operators feeling they need to have a livery that creates... desire... *shudders* and features are a MUST, yet Stagecoach despite how much enthusiasts twist about how revolting their new liveries are still seem to be doing about the best for numbers across the UK, admittedly the market isn't the same in all parts of the UK but you look at them (and Arriva) doing very little but still seems like they're doing better than those that are being more proactive with their fleets and service changes.

Could you imagine the reactions now if some buses were going round like they were around 15 or so years ago, I had Olympains and the like turn up with about 10 different moquettes at times and I can't imagine it dented numbers too badly, granted presentation should be kept up to a degree but I think the thing that needs to be worked on is actually provided a reliable service, can tart it up all you want but if that high spec Bus fails to turn up most days...?!

Agreed. Advertising things along the route, the frequency, the fares all seem to take a back seat in terms of placement and prominence to cheesy slogans on quite a few liveries these days - and adverts too. 

Absolutely. On a service where it's mainly small hops around a city, even if the route is 90 minutes long, by the time someone signs into the WiFi and plugs in their phone they're already getting off the bus - the money saved by not having those features could go into better overall experiences (running that last journey the full way, spending that bit more on nicer plastics on the interior, making sure there's adequate literature available etc). I get WiFi and chargers on services where folk tend to be on the bus for longer, but especially on city work I don't see the point. 

I think my posting history makes clear my opinion on Best Impressions. Aside from the copy and paste liveries, the attitude put across by whoever runs the Twitter account is beyond horrendous. There's the hypocritical stance on covering windows (fine when they design it, but any operator who isn't a member of the cult should be immediately shut down), bizarre comments on certain companies (some post about an Arriva bus having a failed door got the full treatment the other week), and being critical of independent operators helping out bigger companies when they faced driver shortages. Personally, I couldn't care less how 'desirable' the bus to work is as long as it's clean, comfortable, good value, and punctual - and I imagine most commuters are the same, very few commuters use the bus by choice especially in this part of the world. On your comments on Stagecoach and Arriva, I tend to find that both companies keep things very stable (possibly to their detriment at times), which reassures passengers and makes them more comfortable - it's better than the likes of First who love a good network overhaul for no apparent reason. 

Again, agreed. Some companies could do much better in terms of presentation, and no doubt it does have an impact on people's perceptions of bus travel. That said, the fares, timetables, punctuality, cleanliness, and reliability will always be more important. Very few people are going to choose a once an hour luxury bus which is £10 for the journey which doesn't run to time due to a poor timetable over the bus that comes every 10 minutes, always runs to time, and costs £5.

(03 Oct 2021, 10:51 pm)mb134 wrote Agreed. Advertising things along the route, the frequency, the fares all seem to take a back seat in terms of placement and prominence to cheesy slogans on quite a few liveries these days - and adverts too. 

Absolutely. On a service where it's mainly small hops around a city, even if the route is 90 minutes long, by the time someone signs into the WiFi and plugs in their phone they're already getting off the bus - the money saved by not having those features could go into better overall experiences (running that last journey the full way, spending that bit more on nicer plastics on the interior, making sure there's adequate literature available etc). I get WiFi and chargers on services where folk tend to be on the bus for longer, but especially on city work I don't see the point. 

I think my posting history makes clear my opinion on Best Impressions. Aside from the copy and paste liveries, the attitude put across by whoever runs the Twitter account is beyond horrendous. There's the hypocritical stance on covering windows (fine when they design it, but any operator who isn't a member of the cult should be immediately shut down), bizarre comments on certain companies (some post about an Arriva bus having a failed door got the full treatment the other week), and being critical of independent operators helping out bigger companies when they faced driver shortages. Personally, I couldn't care less how 'desirable' the bus to work is as long as it's clean, comfortable, good value, and punctual - and I imagine most commuters are the same, very few commuters use the bus by choice especially in this part of the world. On your comments on Stagecoach and Arriva, I tend to find that both companies keep things very stable (possibly to their detriment at times), which reassures passengers and makes them more comfortable - it's better than the likes of First who love a good network overhaul for no apparent reason. 

Again, agreed. Some companies could do much better in terms of presentation, and no doubt it does have an impact on people's perceptions of bus travel. That said, the fares, timetables, punctuality, cleanliness, and reliability will always be more important. Very few people are going to choose a once an hour luxury bus which is £10 for the journey which doesn't run to time due to a poor timetable over the bus that comes every 10 minutes, always runs to time, and costs £5.

I must say some of the "Creative Desire" liveries are boring. I mean the S&D, they have a word and some icons on each side. What happened to liveries like the Drifter/Coaster(old)/Saltwell Parks. Now you have S&D Violet with violet and a flower on the side. Its like they have given up. Xlines have been good. 

What liveries in the past 2 years have Creative Desire have came up with. They should be commended there are some nice ones. But S&D are just like a half arsed attempt at a livery, same with the Coaster. And criticising A-Line for having seatbelts is totally ridiculous and no need for that. The twitter page as you say has went a bit down hill.

(03 Oct 2021, 10:51 pm)mb134 wrote Agreed. Advertising things along the route, the frequency, the fares all seem to take a back seat in terms of placement and prominence to cheesy slogans on quite a few liveries these days - and adverts too. 

Taking it somewhat off topic but sticking with Best Impressions, the reactions to those all over Kraken rum adverts is an interesting one due to how ghastly they're considered to be which let's face it they are but the fact they haven't gone unnoticed somewhat proves how effective the ad campaign has been as much as they wish to state how it doesn't produce desire and isn't considered sexy (that's literally how far it goes) because it doesn't advertise Bus travel and is just a moving billboard... here's a radical idea, let's combine the two, let's have a ghastly OTT advert advertising benefits to bus travel. I do wonder what the next move will be beyond vertical stripes in bus livery design? As you have to reinvent yourself constantly to keep people's attention in many cases in terms of advertising.

Alex Hornby of Transdev says its better to utilise advertising space to advertise yourself rather than a project, whilst to a point I think that makes perfect sense I can't help but think of the money they lose from not having these advertising boards & contracts.

(03 Oct 2021, 6:53 pm)Keeiajs wrote First of all I don't get why 55 isn't the 37, it follows the exact same route to Hetton. But I also think that the 35 should be split, Or there atleast should be like a 36 (a different one to now) Which begins at Sunderland goes the same way upto New Herrington, go up the A182 to Washington, then Birtley, down into Chester-Le-Street as 36 or X35. The name the 55 the 36 or 37. 

I would also change the 71, instead of station road, go upto Dalton park, along Seaham. Then 71 will be slightly faster than the X1, and retime it, by 30 mins then the Dalton park to Houghton will be every 30 mins., to provide connections to Sunderland which is faster than the 60, and Dalton Park. Aswell the 62 should go up parkside to provide connects to Dalton park/Peterlee/Easington/Sunderland.
But also the Gilesgate traffic something hast to be done, it is always sooo busy.

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Yeah, they do. 

I also think, Peterlee Purples, Little Coasters, Pinks, Berries, Drifters, 5/9. And they should start with USB-C's & Maybe USB-A.

You can’t change the 71 as it’s secured as it serves areas in Seaham ( northlea etc…)which is not profitable for GNE to provide a bus service, you can always get off the 71 on station road and then get the half hourly 65 to Dalton Park, otherwise stick to the hourly x1 from Houghton to Dalton park


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Can we just mention how the Venture Network has been decimated since its first day in 2013 with the Optare, they have lost half of them. 

in 2013 they have V1/V2/V3/V4/V5/V6/V7/V8/V9

Now V1/V2/V3 what is the point of the Venture Branding anymore. They could atleast brand the 30/31/730, name them V4-6. To add some more life into a lets face it a dieing decimated brand.

Also what on earth is going on with 646.

(05 Oct 2021, 2:35 pm)Keeiajs wrote Can we just mention how the Venture Network has been decimated since its first day in 2013 with the Optare, they have lost half of them. 

in 2013 they have V1/V2/V3/V4/V5/V6/V7/V8/V9

Now V1/V2/V3 what is the point of the Venture Branding anymore. They could atleast brand the 30/31/730, name them V4-6. To add some more life into a lets face it a dieing decimated brand.

Also what on earth is going on with 646.

Last time I was at Hownsgill 646 was a christmas tree.

(06 Oct 2021, 7:44 am)54APhotography wrote Last time I was at Hownsgill 646 was a christmas tree.

It’s waiting for a new engine.


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It does occasionally gets moved around at Hownsgill, it has been off the road since March, and it had been laid up in the South East corner, and at some point was dragged to the front of the depot in June as seen here (where you can also see the empty engine bay). I believe it has been dragged elsewhere in the depot since for a change of scenery. Probably so they don't mistake it for the portacabin that had been painted into Roadstripe livery. As a side note, it's also the only rebranded Venture Solo I haven't photoed in service, the rest I've managed to get out on the road at least once.

(06 Oct 2021, 10:05 pm)Rapidsnap wrote It does occasionally gets moved around at Hownsgill, it has been off the road since March, and it had been laid up in the South East corner, and at some point was dragged to the front of the depot in June as seen here (where you can also see the empty engine bay). I believe it has been dragged elsewhere in the depot since for a change of scenery. Probably so they don't mistake it for the portacabin that had been painted into Roadstripe livery. As a side note, it's also the only rebranded Venture Solo I haven't photoed in service, the rest I've managed to get out on the road at least once.

It's like many long term repair jobs, they donate parts to keep the rest going, trouble is on occasion with some companies that has got to the point where it becomes uneconomical to return to service, in one case with a leased vehicle an operator robbed it to the extent it was scrap, then they had to rebuild it when it went off lease 

646 is still a want for me as well

How does the X6/62 work, which one does what?

Which one turns into the 62, which one turns into the X6, which ones turns into 38A can someone explain this pleae?

(07 Oct 2021, 2:47 pm)Keeiajs wrote How does the X6/62 work, which one does what?

Which one turns into the 62, which one turns into the X6, which ones turns into 38A can someone explain this pleae?

There need to do something with the timetable for the 62,55 and X1 between Easington Lane and Peterlee (yes I know the 62 goes via Easington colliery)otherwise the data going to show empty everyday , the 55 and 62 are running together within a few minutes of each other, can the 55 or 62 be retimed by 15 minutes to even out the space, the X1 was also following along side of a 55 also, should take the x1 out of Peterlee and GNE use the Peterlee connection between Peterlee and Easington lane for advertising the Peterlee connection with half hourly service 55 and connect with the X1 at Easington lane or anywhere between the Lane and Houghton Church.


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(07 Oct 2021, 2:47 pm)Keeiajs wrote How does the X6/62 work, which one does what?

Which one turns into the 62, which one turns into the X6, which ones turns into 38A can someone explain this pleae?

A very quick check of BusTimes tells you that starting from Sunderland it does an X6 to Peterlee and back, followed by a 38A and then a 62 to Peterlee and back and then it goes back on to an X6.

(07 Oct 2021, 3:20 pm)peter wrote A very quick check of BusTimes tells you that starting from Sunderland it does an X6 to Peterlee and back, followed by a 38A and then a 62 to Peterlee and back and then it goes back on to an X6.

Ah thanks. It also seems that on the 50/26, it does 2 50's then a 26.

(07 Oct 2021, 3:09 pm)cbma06 wrote There need to do something with the timetable for the 62,55 and X1 between Easington Lane and Peterlee (yes I know the 62 goes via Easington colliery)otherwise the data going to show empty everyday , the 55 and 62 are running together within a few minutes of each other, can the 55 or 62 be retimed by 15 minutes to even out the space, the X1 was also following along side of a 55 also, should take the x1 out of Peterlee and GNE use the Peterlee connection between Peterlee and Easington lane for advertising the Peterlee connection with half hourly service 55 and connect with the X1 at Easington lane or anywhere between the Lane and Houghton Church.


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You have to wonder if the timetables are actually this badly worked out or if there’s other motives at play. There’s now four buses an hour along the Easington Lane to Peterlee route, two 55’s one X1 one 62. But 55s seem to follow in the shadows of 62s and X1s for large parts of the day, the 55 seems destined to be withdrawn…

(07 Oct 2021, 3:09 pm)cbma06 wrote There need to do something with the timetable for the 62,55 and X1 between Easington Lane and Peterlee (yes I know the 62 goes via Easington colliery)otherwise the data going to show empty everyday , the 55 and 62 are running together within a few minutes of each other, can the 55 or 62 be retimed by 15 minutes to even out the space, the X1 was also following along side of a 55 also, should take the x1 out of Peterlee and GNE use the Peterlee connection between Peterlee and Easington lane for advertising the Peterlee connection with half hourly service 55 and connect with the X1 at Easington lane or anywhere between the Lane and Houghton Church.


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I get that that section of the route is made of services coming from different directions, but surely its not beyond the wit of man or beast, to create a timetable that spreads the frequency more evenly?
It's almost as if its been done deliberately.
If not deliberately, then the co-ordination, planning and implementation of these services between the two points has been non existent.

I had my suspicions that the 55 wasn't meant to exist beyond these September changes. Certainly not in its current guise. Pretty sure the X20 was to replace it around Doxford Park (omitting Rainton Bridge) and a combined X1/62 replace it between Easington Lane and Peterlee.

(07 Oct 2021, 3:34 pm)Drifter60 wrote You have to wonder if the timetables are actually this badly worked out or if there’s other motives at play. There’s now four buses an hour along the Easington Lane to Peterlee route, two 55’s one X1 one 62. But 55s seem to follow in the shadows of 62s and X1s for large parts of the day, the 55 seems destined to be withdrawn…

Really the 55 is quite busy from Sunderland, however I would rename it the 36, and change it's end stop, get the 35 extended to South hetton via easington lane & elmone lane, 36 High Herrington - Chester Le Street- Whickham - Metro.

Also the X6/62 are so badly timed, within 10 mins at Sunderland, 10 mins at Seaham, 2 at Dalton Park.

Have there been modifications made to the X21 B5s? They seem to be more refined and considerably less rattly the last few times I've been on them

(07 Oct 2021, 3:46 pm)Keeiajs wrote Really the 55 is quite busy from Sunderland, however I would rename it the 36, and change it's end stop, get the 35 extended to South hetton via easington lane & elmone lane, 36 High Herrington - Chester Le Street- Whickham - Metro.

Also the X6/62 are so badly timed, within 10 mins at Sunderland, 10 mins at Seaham, 2 at Dalton Park.

The fact the 55 got a brand and the citaro's were repainted suggests it my be around for a while.

Also, does anyone have mileage ranges for all GNE Routes.

(14 Oct 2021, 1:59 pm)ASX_Terranova wrote The fact the 55 got a brand and the citaro's were repainted suggests it my be around for a while.

Also, does anyone have mileage ranges for all GNE Routes.

I give the S&D brand 2 years.

Are 6301-6307 being painted to Xlines Spare or GNE Corporate Livery 2019

6301 and 6303 are in corporate livery seen them.on service 50.

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(15 Oct 2021, 5:24 pm)atlantean560 wrote 6301 and 6303 are in corporate livery seen them.on service 50.

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6301-6303 were already in corporate livery - I can't see that changing. I imagine 6304-6307 might just get a partial X-Lines spare repaint - certainly saves on the cost of repainting the whole vehicles.

(15 Oct 2021, 5:38 pm)peter wrote 6301-6303 were already in corporate livery - I can't see that changing. I imagine 6304-6307 might just get a partial X-Lines spare repaint - certainly saves on the cost of repainting the whole vehicles.

hmmm they could do that but then they still have to go through debranding the interior etc. so they might aswell paint them, there is only 4 of them

(15 Oct 2021, 6:55 pm)KingSlayerRBLX wrote hmmm they could do that but then they still have to go through debranding the interior etc. so they might aswell paint them, there is only 4 of them

For the role they are going to take - spares for X-Lines services - it would be more cost-effective to simply repaint the rear end black than the whole bus.

(15 Oct 2021, 5:24 pm)atlantean560 wrote 6301 and 6303 are in corporate livery seen them.on service 50.

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6301, does a 50/26 for Durham college. Its on from like 0550 till 18:00, I wanted to try and catch it but has been unable to.

(15 Oct 2021, 6:55 pm)KingSlayerRBLX wrote hmmm they could do that but then they still have to go through debranding the interior etc. so they might aswell paint them, there is only 4 of them

If they are going to be spares for the X1, X21 and to operate the peak time X21s then it would make sense to turn them into grey generic spares

If they are going to be spares for the 21, 25, well then they’d be no good in X Lines livery

(15 Oct 2021, 11:05 pm)Wybus wrote If they are going to be spares for the X1, X21 and to operate the peak time X21s then it would make sense to turn them into grey generic spares

If they are going to be spares for the 21, 25, well then they’d be no good in X Lines livery

I imagine 6304-7 will be split between Washington and Chester-le-Street in X-Lines grey and then 6301-3 will be at Chester-le-Street for the 21.

(15 Oct 2021, 11:23 pm)peter wrote I imagine 6304-7 will be split between Washington and Chester-le-Street in X-Lines grey and then 6301-3 will be at Chester-le-Street for the 21.

50 needs 1. But I also think Deptford need a few more spares, they need 11 for the 56, 2 for schools. And that is the only Euro 6's at Deptford.

Wouldn't mind seeing one of them go into Voyger

(15 Oct 2021, 11:23 pm)peter wrote I imagine 6304-7 will be split between Washington and Chester-le-Street in X-Lines grey and then 6301-3 will be at Chester-le-Street for the 21.

Why when 6302-03 are already at Washington??