(10 Dec 2021, 4:02 pm)Rob44 wrote Fair enough... but as this happens more and more maybe GNE and other should look at making sure this doesn't happen or when it does have something in place  so the customer in Newcastle are not " stranded"!!

I agree, unfortunately I can't see the bus companies adding the extra buses into the PVR to make them more reliable, especially at the minute. Sometimes it just can't be helped though with road closures, diversions and incidents on the route.

(10 Dec 2021, 4:22 pm)deanmachine wrote I agree, unfortunately I can't see the bus companies adding the extra buses into the PVR to make them more reliable, especially at the minute. Sometimes it just can't be helped though with road closures, diversions and incidents on the route.

For me with better communication they drivers who do make it to Newcastle could ask passengers to board and then drop them off at Gateshead meaning the buses turning around at Gateshead get closers to there running time and the customers, even though having to board a bus to catch another one would get home..... rather than stand in the cold and rain of market street.

(10 Dec 2021, 4:28 pm)Rob44 wrote For me with better communication they drivers who do make it to Newcastle could ask passengers to board and then drop them off at Gateshead meaning the buses turning around at Gateshead get closers to there running time and the customers, even though having to board a bus to catch another one would get home..... rather than stand in the cold and rain of market street.

I think better communication is key. 
A 27 sweeping up passengers waiting for a 56 and dropping at Gateshead is surely a positive resolution to those punters.
Prior to route merging and consolidation, it may not have been too much of an issue. Chances are an alternative of sorts would have been available.

(10 Dec 2021, 5:03 pm)Andreos1 wrote I think better communication is key. 
A 27 sweeping up passengers waiting for a 56 and dropping at Gateshead is surely a positive resolution to those punters.
Prior to route merging and consolidation, it may not have been too much of an issue. Chances are an alternative of sorts would have been available.

Have a LIKE!

Good to see that this has generated some decent discussion

(10 Dec 2021, 10:27 am)cbma06 wrote You could get any x1 to Hetton then get the half hourly service 65 from Hetton to Dalton park

Where is that advertised? If I wasn't an enthusiast, how would I know that?

For those who have the GNE app, the journey planner advises you to wait on a random street somewhere for the 65, rather than at Hetton Interchange.

(10 Dec 2021, 11:13 am)Andreos1 wrote Owt on social media about it not running?

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It's an option I suppose, but could end up leaving customers out of pocket due to not being able to buy a single/return and depending on connection times, more than inconvenienced or delayed too.

Nothing on Social Media until it was questioned. I noticed on bustimes that the incoming journey was terminated at the Galleries, but no one had the sense to let the passengers waiting for it there that it had been pulled. Despite the stand being right outside of the canteen...

The lack of customer focus is shocking at times.

(10 Dec 2021, 11:44 am)cbma06 wrote Day tickets might be better , depends on the length of journey though, I’m sure GNE would prefer to sell there day tickets etc…

The extensions of x1 to Dalton park and Peterlee might look good through passengers eyes but since there are other services duplicating those extension sections by the same bus company and since the 65 have been turned into a bigger bus and frequency been doubled , GNE could advertise the 65 to Dalton Park connection on there X1 timetables and on the bus to promote the connection, same as the X1 to Easington lane and onward connection  with service 55 and 62 to Peterlee, probably more towards service 55 as it’s a bigger bus than the 62, I’m surprised GNE are duplicating there routes since there’s a pandemic on and it’s been said that there still making a loss or the money from the  government will shortly be going and there have to start making cut backs?.

The X1 extension that GNE should of looked into was extending some journeys from Easington Lane towards Haswell/Shotton/Wheatley Hill/side of Thornley and Ludworth back up the side of Haswell to Easington Lane, which would of been links between the villages and lost connection to Hetton/Houghton and towards Washington to Newcastle which were lost decades ago.

I'd actually purchased a day ticket, but I had went for the £4 City of Sunderland ticket. I'd have been out of pocket if I'd then went to Heworth for the X10, which I'd say is a better known connection than the X1/65 combo.

I'd agree about advertising onward connections better. You shouldn't have to have a good understanding of the bus network to use it. It's beyond me why we don't advertise the 21/X21 connections at Chester-le-Street for the 8/78 for example, or the 27/X9/X10 at Heworth for services into Newcastle, instead leaving people to think that the Metro is the only game in town.

We'll see what the BSIP has to offer in this respect, and hopefully not more of the same.

For the first im in ages Deptford have got some services cancelled tomorrow

(10 Dec 2021, 5:50 pm)Adrian wrote Where is that advertised? If I wasn't an enthusiast, how would I know that?

The lack of customer focus is shocking at times.

I'd agree about advertising onward connections better. You shouldn't have to have a good understanding of the bus network to use it. It's beyond me why we don't advertise the 21/X21 connections at Chester-le-Street for the 8/78 for example, or the 27/X9/X10 at Heworth for services into Newcastle, instead leaving people to think that the Metro is the only game in town.

We'll see what the BSIP has to offer in this respect, and hopefully not more of the same.

Advertising connections seems to be a major weak point in bus operators and not just at GNE however I feel it is poor for example the evening 239 which was recently split into two services at Wingate/Station Town with GNE running Peterlee to Station Town and a small taxi company running Wingate to Sedgefield also with the number 239 doesn't have advertised connections despite the timetables being designed to do so, GNE only show their journeys in the 239 timetable, no mention whatsoever of a bus beyond Station Town to the Trimdons, Fishburn and Sedgefield, wouldn't be surprised if when contracts apparently go out for tender next year that the taxibus portion of the 239 to Sedgefield gets binned off with the classic phrase "due to low passenger numbers" being cited which could well be the case due to lack of knowledge of the service and passengers being put off using it due to being a taxi and having to change buses should they require the full route.

(10 Dec 2021, 6:27 pm)Jimmi wrote Advertising connections seems to be a major weak point in bus operators and not just at GNE however I feel it is poor for example the evening 239 which was recently split into two services at Wingate/Station Town with GNE running Peterlee to Station Town and a small taxi company running Wingate to Sedgefield also with the number 239 doesn't have advertised connections despite the timetables being designed to do so, GNE only show their journeys in the 239 timetable, no mention whatsoever of a bus beyond Station Town to the Trimdons, Fishburn and Sedgefield, wouldn't be surprised if when contracts apparently go out for tender next year that the taxibus portion of the 239 to Sedgefield gets binned off with the classic phrase "due to low passenger numbers" being cited which could well be the case due to lack of knowledge of the service and passengers being put off using it due to being a taxi and having to change buses should they require the full route.

Anything to do with route or timetables or connections etc… for the 239 is up to the local authority and not GNE


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(10 Dec 2021, 6:27 pm)Jimmi wrote Advertising connections seems to be a major weak point in bus operators and not just at GNE however I feel it is poor for example the evening 239 which was recently split into two services at Wingate/Station Town with GNE running Peterlee to Station Town and a small taxi company running Wingate to Sedgefield also with the number 239 doesn't have advertised connections despite the timetables being designed to do so, GNE only show their journeys in the 239 timetable, no mention whatsoever of a bus beyond Station Town to the Trimdons, Fishburn and Sedgefield, wouldn't be surprised if when contracts apparently go out for tender next year that the taxibus portion of the 239 to Sedgefield gets binned off with the classic phrase "due to low passenger numbers" being cited which could well be the case due to lack of knowledge of the service and passengers being put off using it due to being a taxi and having to change buses should they require the full route.

I’m more surprised that GNE doesn’t advertise more about connections to other of there bus services , since travel from point A to B is not profitable as there share holders wanting more investment back into their bank accounts offshore and having the passenger having to travel A to B to C and even D to get to there destination, what happened about the 133 in Sunderland , decades ago used to be a 10 minute service with almost double deckers and full and now will be operated by 2 solo’s, no wonder many turning to cars at least there can get to A to B without traveling through the alphabet and not freezing cold at bus stops wondering if the bus will turn up, these days the bus services are for profits and not for passengers


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(10 Dec 2021, 6:56 pm)cbma06 wrote Anything to do with route or timetables or connections etc… for the 239 is up to the local authority and not GNE

What I meant was GNE's printed timetables on their website at least makes no references to the taxibus 239 existing.

The times between both 239's allow connections from one another, its just a pity GNE doesn't make anyone aware of this.

John Crake & Sons Mini Buses Ltd who run the other half of the 239 do show the connections on their timetables on their Facebook page at least

It's a bit like when ANE/GNE run a daytime service commercially but then don't show the evening journeys who are run by another operator (for example GNE running the 86 to Toft Hill on a night and Arriva who do the daytime journeys produce printed timetables not showing this, or at least haven't in the past).

(10 Dec 2021, 11:33 pm)Jimmi wrote What I meant was GNE's printed timetables on their website at least makes no references to the taxibus 239 existing.

The times between both 239's allow connections from one another, its just a pity GNE doesn't make anyone aware of this.

John Crake & Sons Mini Buses Ltd who run the other half of the 239 do show the connections on their timetables on their Facebook page at least

It's a bit like when ANE/GNE run a daytime service commercially but then don't show the evening journeys who are run by another operator (for example GNE running the 86 to Toft Hill on a night and Arriva who do the daytime journeys produce printed timetables not showing this, or at least haven't in the past).

I’m not sure why they should?!

The 239 has no relation to the main Go North East network, it is a Durham County Council secured contract, and is up to them to promote it. Go North East do well to promote the 239 as it is, they’re under no obligation to do so.

Aside from clinging onto history of that being a through bus (used by very very very few people!) I’m not sure why this link would continue to be promoted.

The document you’ve shown there is what came from the county council when the services were split at the request of Go North East following a prolonged period of vandalism and huge cost that wasn’t factored into their contract bid.


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(11 Dec 2021, 3:15 am)Dan wrote I’m not sure why they should?! 

The 239 has no relation to the main Go North East network, it is a Durham County Council secured contract, and is up to them to promote it. Go North East do well to promote the 239 as it is, they’re under no obligation to do so.

Aside from clinging onto history of that being a through bus (used by very very very few people!) I’m not sure why this link would continue to be promoted.

The document you’ve shown there is what came from the county council when the services were split at the request of Go North East following a prolonged period of vandalism and huge cost that wasn’t factored into their contract bid.


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Because it's about the passengers perhaps? 
Unsure of the difference in promoting non-GNE services to/from Team Valley, but not this or the 86.

I was quite impressed at the work done to include mention of secured services off the Valley (93/94 timetable I think). Can't see why it wouldn't be the case here. Historic or not.

(11 Dec 2021, 8:50 am)Andreos1 wrote Because it's about the passengers perhaps? 
Unsure of the difference in promoting non-GNE services to/from Team Valley, but not this or the 86.

I was quite impressed at the work done to include mention of secured services off the Valley (93/94 timetable I think. Can't see why it wouldn't be the case here. Historic or not.

Surely it’s down to Arriva to promote the evening journeys on the 86, in the same way that Go North East promote the evening journeys operated by Gateshead Central Taxis on their daytime services?

I disagree with Go North East being the responsible party for promoting connections to Sedgefield on a service they no longer operate - because they no longer wished to operate it - which also sat completely outside of the main network, and was used by incredibly few people. Again this feels more like an area usually served by Arriva, who would be best promoting this service, if not of course the County Council who procured the service in the first instance.

Agree it was a huge positive for Go North East to further promote services they do not operate to Team Valley - but the huge difference with Team Valley is that the 93/94 are the only services to run through there during the day, and the 92 (for example, whose timetable is included in this guide) operates through areas which are predominantly served by Go North East buses during the day.

It’s also a huge positive to see printed material for services like the 33/33A, and indeed most of the services in areas such as Peterlee and Hexham, where the services are not commercially operated and despite the time, effort and cost of this printed material not being factored into Go North East’s original bid price. I suspect most operators (and businesses in general) wouldn’t incur cost they really don’t need to incur.


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(11 Dec 2021, 9:11 am)Dan wrote Surely it’s down to Arriva to promote the evening journeys on the 86, in the same way that Go North East promote the evening journeys operated by Gateshead Central Taxis on their daytime services?

I disagree with Go North East being the responsible party for promoting connections to Sedgefield on a service they no longer operate - because they no longer wished to operate it - which also sat completely outside of the main network, and was used by incredibly few people. Again this feels more like an area usually served by Arriva, who would be best promoting this service, if not of course the County Council who procured the service in the first instance.

Agree it was a huge positive for Go North East to further promote services they do not operate to Team Valley - but the huge difference with Team Valley is that the 93/94 are the only services to run through there during the day, and the 92 (for example, whose timetable is included in this guide) operates through areas which are predominantly served by Go North East buses during the day.

It’s also a huge positive to see printed material for services like the 33/33A, and indeed most of the services in areas such as Peterlee and Hexham, where the services are not commercially operated and despite the time, effort and cost of this printed material not being factored into Go North East’s original bid price. I suspect most operators (and businesses in general) wouldn’t incur cost they really don’t need to incur.


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What's the potential ROI in promoting these links and connections?
Or is it the mindset that they (points in the direction of ANE) won't, so we won't either?

I don't get why the 93/94 is any different in the bigger scheme of things than the 86 or 239.
The 93/94 are the only option during the day - so it's OK to mention the 92.
The 86 is the only service and 'it's operated by a competitor during the day, we can't mention them at all' mindset, isnt proactive, doesn't promote usage on an evening (when surely you would want that to be the case) for those needing to travel in one direction, but being unaware there's a bus back later in the day. Never mind that it feeds nicely in to the X21.

The same applies to the 239. Because very, very, very few people used it when GNE had the entire portion, doesn't mean it needs to stay like that going forward. The more people who are aware of connections, the greater chance the GNE bit grows.

It's that race to the bottom again.

I may have been drunk or dreaming but im sure on one of the big 3;s app when i went to plan a journey it gave me the details for the other company to get me to where i was going. i've just tried the arriva and GNE app and from work the arriva appt want me to walk to low fell for the x12 then get the 44 from haymarket. the GNE app want me to walk up to old durham road and get the x1 then get the Q3 to great park and walk through a field to my destination! Not much help from either company there

(11 Dec 2021, 11:06 am)Rob44 wrote I may have been drunk or dreaming but im sure on one of the big 3;s app when i went to plan a journey it gave me the details for the other company to get me to where i was going. i've just tried the arriva and GNE app and from work the arriva appt want me to walk to low fell for the x12 then get the 44 from haymarket. the GNE app want me to walk up to old durham road and get the x1 then get the Q3 to great park and walk through a field to my destination! Not much help from either company there

That was the old GNE journey planner which basically used Google Maps.

To be honest, it was so much better than the absolute shite that they have now.
I don't use the new journey planner because I just don't trust it to connect to even GNE's other services.
Plus, 99% of the time it tells me to make connections in stupid places, like changing at TGI Fridays or Handy Drive Bus Depot instead of at MetroCentre, despite both services being at the MetroCentre ~1 minute after/before

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MG on BBC complaining that processes aren't good enough and other people need to sort out their driver shortage quicker. 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-tyne-59613709

(11 Dec 2021, 12:22 pm)streetdeckfan wrote That was the old GNE journey planner which basically used Google Maps.

To be honest, it was so much better than the absolute shite that they have now.
I don't use the new journey planner because I just don't trust it to connect to even GNE's other services.
Plus, 99% of the time it tells me to make connections in stupid places, like changing at TGI Fridays or Handy Drive Bus Depot instead of at MetroCentre, despite both services being at the MetroCentre ~1 minute after/before

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agree the new app isnt great. Espically when the bus is full but the app saying quiet

(12 Dec 2021, 2:25 pm)Andreos1 wrote MG on BBC complaining that processes aren't good enough and other people need to sort out their driver shortage quicker. 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-tyne-59613709

The disputes at the DVLA have caused monumental problems, the MSM seems to skip that fact in most of their stories

(12 Dec 2021, 3:47 pm)Rob44 wrote agree the new app isnt great. Espically when the bus is full but the app saying quiet

Isn’t that down to the driver to press a button on the ticket machine for every time the passenger gets on or off the bus?, I’m sure I read on here before


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is it? ive noticed the driver pressing the machine a few times even though only one passenger with a concessionary?? pass got on. The app does ask you if the bus is still quite. Ive put replied that it was near full on Saltwell road but by the time it got to market street it was still coming up as quiet even though standing room only?

(12 Dec 2021, 4:47 pm)54APhotography wrote The disputes at the DVLA have caused monumental problems, the MSM seems to skip that fact in most of their stories

The DVLA are the primary cause of the short term issues faced by operators training new staff. I know for a fact that some companies have up to 50 new starters pencilled in, but they cant process them fast enough due to backlogs. That is just a fact.

Companies dont help themsleves by allowing staff to leave with one weeks notice while it takes up to a month to train a new starter. I don't know any other steady jobs where that would be allowed. 

There are obviously wider, structural issues such as what customers think they should pay for a bus service vs what they expect from a bus service vs what drivers want to work (hint hint, mostly early shifts), and thats obviously the next big thing which needs to be tackled as an industry.

(12 Dec 2021, 5:17 pm)cbma06 wrote Isn’t that down to the driver to press a button on the ticket machine for every time the passenger gets on or off the bus?, I’m sure I read on here before


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I don't think so, I was on a X1 trying to get on a Wreckton it had 6 seats left it said it was completely empty on the GNE Website Tracker & App

(12 Dec 2021, 5:17 pm)cbma06 wrote Isn’t that down to the driver to press a button on the ticket machine for every time the passenger gets on or off the bus?, I’m sure I read on here before


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The way I understand it is when a ticket is bought or scanned it automatically increases the passenger count by 1 (even with group tickets), and the driver just has to tap the button on the screen when someone alights.

As I'm a nosey bugger, I always look at the screen when I'm waiting to get off, and the passenger count displayed has always been pretty much spot in, give or take 1 or 2.

(12 Dec 2021, 6:45 pm)streetdeckfan wrote The way I understand it is when a ticket is bought or scanned it automatically increases the passenger count by 1 (even with group tickets), and the driver just has to tap the button on the screen when someone alights.

As I'm a nosey bugger, I always look at the screen when I'm waiting to get off, and the passenger count displayed has always been pretty much spot in, give or take 1 or 2.

In my experience it is normally Washington & Deptford drivers who don't use the screen properly.

(12 Dec 2021, 6:45 pm)streetdeckfan wrote The way I understand it is when a ticket is bought or scanned it automatically increases the passenger count by 1 (even with group tickets), and the driver just has to tap the button on the screen when someone alights.

As I'm a nosey bugger, I always look at the screen when I'm waiting to get off, and the passenger count displayed has always been pretty much spot in, give or take 1 or 2.

I’m sure Dan or one of the GNE drivers on this forum will clarify how it works


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(12 Dec 2021, 4:47 pm)54APhotography wrote The disputes at the DVLA have caused monumental problems, the MSM seems to skip that fact in most of their stories

Day to day management within the operators have led to a high turnover of staff for years and years. 
That's been brushed over by the MSM too or turned in to a political football when strike action is brought up.

Regarding the passenger counter on the ticket machines

Family tickets add 3 passengers on IIRC
Same with concessionary carers passes adds 2

The button at bottom is green with the amount of passengers you have on, turns to Amber when nearing full capacity and red when your full

There's a page in options that allows you to add a passenger or alight passengers and also to choose if the wheelchair bay is occupied, it also shows the bus seated and standing capacity

All this can be seen by the staff at Riverside Control and the leading drivers

(12 Dec 2021, 11:12 pm)Andreos1 wrote Day to day management within the operators have led to a high turnover of staff for years and years. 
That's been brushed over by the MSM too or turned in to a political football when strike action is brought up.

Aye, that's true. MSM only interested in negative spin.

(12 Dec 2021, 2:25 pm)Andreos1 wrote MG on BBC complaining that processes aren't good enough and other people need to sort out their driver shortage quicker. 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-tyne-59613709

I was told by GNE that the DVLA were sorting out their licence applications within 1-2 weeks, because of a fast-track system they have in place.