Is it true that the Temsas are getting withdrawn  and what gonna replace them as i know redcar are having a  rough patch

I think Temsa parts come from europe and that must be expensive and with them being older more so. I would just wait until arriva confirms it themselves before jumping to any conclusions.

(29 May 2023, 8:26 am)Bob5666 wrote Is it true that the Temsas are getting withdrawn  and what gonna replace them as i know redcar are having a  rough patch

Not true, no.

They have at least another five years of depreciable life.

However, I am told that the gas buses in Darlington are likely to be gone, as the work they need to ensure the ongoing gas safety, costs more than their book value now. Writing them off would make more sense than keeping them.

(29 May 2023, 11:59 am)NEbushopper wrote I think Temsa parts come from europe and that must be expensive and with them being older more so. I would just wait until arriva confirms it themselves before jumping to any conclusions.

They come from Turkey, which is part of Asia, which means that parts are becoming quite expensive and taking in excess of a month to arrive to Redcar. It is coming to the point in which all the modifications made to the Avenue's need replacing due to general wear and tare, along with other various items etc that need replacing. 


I am in no doubt whatsoever that in the coming years or even months, it is going to become financially unviable to Arriva, as they may start costing more than they are generating. Rendering them a economic write off.

Surely there might be a chance that some might go soon.

If there's 50 or so buses released with the rumoured 25 reduction or so at Durham County, the 14 Streetlites at Walkergate then the 43-47 electrics displacing things.

They're arguably next in line as I can't imagine them withdrawing the same aged Pulsars give or take a few months considering they're the group standard even if it means mothballing the earliest examples to keep the older ones going

(29 May 2023, 12:28 pm)Storx wrote Surely there might be a chance that some might go soon.

If there's 50 or so buses released with the rumoured 25 reduction or so at Durham County, the 14 Streetlites at Walkergate then the 43-47 electrics displacing things.

They're arguably next in line as I can't imagine them withdrawing the same aged Pulsars give or take a few months considering they're the group standard even if it means mothballing the earliest examples to keep the older ones going

You'd imagine after the withdrawal of the likes of the old B7's, the Solo's and the 57-plate E400's, the priority will move to the non-standard fleets namely the Centro's, Temsa's and Ecocity's especially if parts are becoming harder to source. Then like you say it would make sense for the older pulsars to start being withdrawn to keep the newer ones going.

(29 May 2023, 12:56 pm)peter wrote You'd imagine after the withdrawal of the likes of the old B7's, the Solo's and the 57-plate E400's, the priority will move to the non-standard fleets namely the Centro's, Temsa's and Ecocity's especially if parts are becoming harder to source. Then like you say it would make sense for the older pulsars to start being withdrawn to keep the newer ones going.

Yeah that's my trail of thoughts. I have a feeling that the Walkergate's Streetlites might end up at Darlington to see off the Ecocitys same number I believe of each and I haven't worked it out but wouldn't be surprised if Darlington be fully Streetlite then after the X1 cuts etc seeing the remaining Pulsars out.

Imo 7501 - 7507/7509 will see most the B7's off. 

After that you've got a ton of Pulsars going spare. There's at least 6 at Blyth which no doubt will be released then everything withdrawn with the changes. Would see a the Centro's, the Enviro 200's (Durham ones) and then start making inroads on the Temsa's. 

Be interesting to see if there's any Solos needed at Darlington after the changes aswell which would leave the PVR 4 at Ashington, Whitby and the 58 at Durham.

(29 May 2023, 12:02 pm)RobinHood wrote Not true, no.

They have at least another five years of depreciable life.

However, I am told that the gas buses in Darlington are likely to be gone, as the work they need to ensure the ongoing gas safety, costs more than their book value now. Writing them off would make more sense than keeping them.


Unfortunately a friend who lives in Darlington who works for arriva as comfom the gas buses aren't going anywhere 

That's great, but I can assure you, the people who advise me of these things are much higher up than drivers or local depot staff.

Although not 100% guaranteed, they are either withdrawing them from service, or moving the entire batch to Runcorn.

(29 May 2023, 4:39 pm)RobinHood wrote That's great, but I can assure you, the people who advise me of these things are much higher up than drivers or local depot staff.

Although not 100% guaranteed, they are either withdrawing them from service, or moving the entire batch to Runcorn.

You would think perhaps the Runcorn move would make more sense. 

Given that they recently halted the repaint programme half way through as they considered whether they should be withdrawn, the fact they resumed and have worked their way through repainting the rest (assuming 4808 is heading off) suggests that there must be some longer-term plan for them within the group.

Travelled on 4726 and what a state they are all in.
Just like the prestige. Smells of diesel fumes. And the air pump caused the whole bus to shudder.

These are in an awful state. Surely someone, somewhere should be doing something about this

(29 May 2023, 12:27 pm)petermorrisne wrote They come from Turkey, which is part of Asia

Turkey certainly isn't part of Asia!

(25 Jul 2023, 10:10 am)RobinHood wrote Turkey certainly isn't part of Asia!

Turkey is in both Europe and Asia.

(25 Jul 2023, 10:23 am)RMF1254 wrote Turkey is in both Europe and Asia.

And Adana (where the majority of the Temsa buses are made) is definitely in the Asian part of Turkey.
Cracking kebabs there too.

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(25 Jul 2023, 10:10 am)RobinHood wrote Turkey certainly isn't part of Asia!

You sure?

(25 Jul 2023, 10:40 am)Andreos1 wrote And Adana (where the majority of the Temsa buses are made) is definitely in the Asian part of Turkey.
Cracking kebabs there too.

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You sure?

I checked on line before I put my comment on. Instanbul is divided by the Bosphorus Strait into the Europe side and Asia side and you can cross between the two by the Galata bridge. I don’t know where Temsa are built but the largest part of Turkey is in Asia.

(25 Jul 2023, 12:56 pm)RMF1254 wrote I checked on line before I put my comment on. Instanbul is divided by the Bosphorus Strait into the Europe side and Asia side and you can cross between the two by the Galata bridge. I don’t know where Temsa are built but the largest part of Turkey is in Asia.

Aye, 90 odd percent off memory. 

Adana is in the south east of Turkey. Basically as far from mainland Europe as you can get in Turkey

Surely when Arriva bought the Temsa's, they would've known they were non-standard vehicles and maintenance/parts would be difficult to source as time went on. They had a few buses at Arriva Bus & Coach they were trying to sell but had no interest.

But they must've got them at a bargain price to start with, I'd imagine, otherwise what was the point?

(25 Jul 2023, 5:58 pm)tvd wrote Surely when Arriva bought the Temsa's, they would've known they were non-standard vehicles and maintenance/parts would be difficult to source as time went on.  They had a few buses at Arriva Bus & Coach they were trying to sell but had no interest.

But they must've got them at a bargain price to start with, I'd imagine, otherwise what was the point?

They were just a new bus on the market. I assume they had plans at the time to buy more if they went well but obviously went against in the end and no-one else bought them. 

Hard to judge stuff like that in hindsight. The Gemini 2's could be the same if they decided to buy something else as Arriva are the only company to have DB300's pretty much.

(25 Jul 2023, 5:58 pm)tvd wrote Surely when Arriva bought the Temsa's, they would've known they were non-standard vehicles and maintenance/parts would be difficult to source as time went on.  They had a few buses at Arriva Bus & Coach they were trying to sell but had no interest.

But they must've got them at a bargain price to start with, I'd imagine, otherwise what was the point?

Weren't they the dealer? Similar to when they were selling the VDL products.

Arriva were indeed the dealer for VDL, Temsa and Van Hool until they closed it down a few years back.

Made more business sense sending the demo / dealer Temsa Avenues to Arriva North East rather then them sitting rotting away in a field for many years hoping someone might buy them out of desperate need. Plus they needed an area to try out the Temsas to see if it was worthwile buying more for use elsewhere in the UK, and as you well know, considering the Temsa Avenues at Redcar are the only ones in the UK, they weren't considered a success. Therefore Arriva stuck with the tried and tested VDL SB200 before switching to the Wright Streetlite.