(10 Jun 2023, 12:11 am)Andreos1 wrote Do the majority of residents in those areas travel to and from Newcastle? 

- Yes - Basically same services as now with frequency reductions but 51 properly amalgamated into the Coast Road corrdior. All 'slow' buses through Battle Hill Drive to further differentiate the X38.

Do the existing buses on the corridor get so full, they need to have this sort of frequency?

- Would reduce Newcastle - Station Road from 12x buses per hour to 10x (was a messy 18x per hour before QA) and Newcastle - Battle Hill from 9x buses per hour to 8x per hour.

Is there room for growth? 

- Yes, new housing developments in East Benton and Holystone creating demand especially between Holystone & Newcastle and also new housing developments near North Tyneside Hospital creating demand for quicker variant of the 308/309.

If you can answer yes to at least two of those questions, then you may have a point.

If you can't answer yes to more than one of those questions, then I declare the whole Coast Road discussion null and void

Have to say " new housing estae" used to justify more buses to an area leave me scratching my head. In hazlerigg there are new developments to the east on the west of the village. Most houses have a double if not treble drive so you would expect them to have a car. I've seen absolutely zero increase in passengers at the bus stops closest to the developments..... and if you say worked at silverlink you hardley going to get the 44 to town then wait for a 309 to work when you can use the car you already have to drive up sandy lane then down the a19.

(10 Jun 2023, 12:04 am)L469 YVK wrote Or.....an option to fully merge the 51 into the Coast Road network and shake off the 'Micky Mouse' route image
- 305 (every 30 minutes / 60 minutes) - Basically same as 51, half hourly Newcastle - Holystone Park, hourly to Whitley Bay
- 306 (every 30 minutes) - Newcastle to Tynemouth, additionally serves Hadrian Park
- 307 (every 30 minutes) - via Cobalt instead of Hadrian Park
- 308 (every 30 minutes) - Newcastle to Whitley Bay only, additionally serves Battle Hill Drive and via Marden Estate rather than Hillheads
- 309 (every 30 minutes) - Same route as now
- X38 (every 20 minutes) - Blyth to Coast Road / Wallsend Dene (same as current 308) then non-stop to Civic Centre, St Mary's Place and Haymarket
* Every 6 minutes Newcastle - Station Road
* Frequent Newcastle - Battle Hill service
* Relatively even 4x buses per hour Newcastle - Billy Mill
* Relatively even 4x buses per hour Newcastle - High Farm
* New X38 will be popular with 306/308 intentionally slowed down to 'encourage' passengers to use X38

See personally if I was going to do this I'd just scrap everything and start again, the routes now aren't ideal and are from yesteryear and change it to something like.

55 - Every 30 Minutes, Current Route
56 - Every 30 Minutes, Newcastle - South Gosforth - Four Lane Ends - Benton - Benton Rise - ASDA - Holystone - Shiremoor - Briardene - Whitley Bay
---
55/56 - Every 15 Minutes, Newcastle to Benton

57/57A - Whitley Bay to North Shields restored

Cobalt Connect
80 - Every 30 Minutes, Newcastle - Selby Gardens - Wallsend Dene - Silverlink (The Silverlink) - Cobalt - New York - NT Hospital - Whitley Bay - Blyth via Links Road
80A - Every 30 Minutes, Newcastle - Selby Gardens - Wallsend Dene - Silverlink (The Silverlink) - Cobalt - New York - NT Hospital - Whitley Bay - Blyth via South Beach
---
80/80A - Every 15 Minutes, Express Newcastle to Silverlink / Cobalt / Whitley Bay / Blyth

Coastal Loop
81 - Every 30 Minutes, Newcastle - Selby Gardens - Battle Hill - Silverlink (A1058) - Billy Mill - Lynn Road - NT Hospital - Morrisons - Marden - Cullercoats - Tynemouth
82 - Every 30 Minutes, Newcastle - Selby Gardens - Battle Hill - Silverlink (A1058) - Verne Road - Central Avenue - Landestown Terrace - Hawkeys Lane - North Shields - Tynemouth
---
81/82 - Every 15 Minutes, Express Newcastle to Battle Hill, Then serve all the coast - connect with each other in Tynemouth

'The Slow Ones' Loop
83 - Every 30 Minutes, Newcastle - Wiltshire Drive - High Farm - Battle Hill - Middle Engine Lane - Norham Road - Billy Mill - Queen Alexander Road - North Shields
84 - Every 30 Minutes, Newcastle - Battle Hill - High Farm - Hadrian Park - Middle Engine Lane - Norham Road - Meadowell - North Shields
---
83/84 - Every 15 Minutes, Newcastle - Middle Engine Lane - Cobalt South - Norham Road, connect with each other in North Shields

Other Combined Corridors
57/57A/83, Every 15 Minutes Billy Mill to North Shields
80/80A/81/82 - Every 7.5 Minutes, Newcastle to Selby Gardens
81/82/83/84 - 8x buses, Newcastle to Battle Hill

It connects communities together much better than what's there now and makes more sense with the 306 extension and also reduces the overkill of buses at the Northern side. I'd imagine it's actually a PVR reduction from it but haven't worked it. Tynemouth etc still has the same buses but they just go in opposite directions for example and most people arguably should be using the Metro anyway. I know there's a few areas with reductions ie. Lynn Road and the 306 from Billy Mill to Tynemouth but somewhere had to take the hit and sadly it was them but most of it has gained the 57/57A to compensate for it for people doing local journeys.

New Service 90:
Newcastle, Team Valley, Portobello, Vigo Estate, Ayton, Lambton, The Galleries, Biddick, Fatfield, Barnwell, Penshaw, Shiney Row.

Couple of Questions:

• Could a bus be turned here (https://goo.gl/maps/qXaGyN1drVhwzcaz5)?
  
• Could use a full length single decker if the bus used this route.
  
• Is there justification to run the 91 all day.
  

(12 Jun 2023, 1:00 pm)ASX_Terranova wrote New Service 90:
Newcastle, Team Valley, Portobello, Vigo Estate, Ayton, Lambton, The Galleries, Biddick, Fatfield, Barnwell, Penshaw, Shiney Row.

Couple of Questions:

• Could a bus be turned here (https://goo.gl/maps/qXaGyN1drVhwzcaz5)? 
  
• Could use a full length single decker if the bus used this route.
  
• Is there justification to run the 91 all day.
  

It would be very tight. 

If you're going to have something on Success Road, I'd suggest some sort of one way loop myself.

Shiney Row Shops (where the 4 and 78 stop) - Chester Road - Golf Course Road - Success Road - Herrington Burn - Shiney Row (where the X1 stops).

Could it be extended as far as Easington Lane?

(12 Jun 2023, 1:22 pm)Andreos1 wrote It would be very tight. 

If you're going to have something on Success Road, I'd suggest some sort of one way loop myself.

Shiney Row Shops (where the 4 and 78 stop) - Chester Road - Golf Course Road - Success Road - Herrington Burn - Shiney Row (where the X1 stops).

Ii've only got 2 minutes turnaround at Shiney Row and 8 minutes at Eldon Square, so timing is tight. Its a half-hourly service with a PVR of 5.

With stagecoach withdrawing the 12, would it be worth extending the 33 to Doxford Park. Maybe drop the houghton and washington sections of the 39A/B and extend the 33 instead.

(18 Jun 2023, 5:34 pm)ASX_Terranova wrote With stagecoach withdrawing the 12, would it be worth extending the 33 to Doxford Park. Maybe drop the houghton and washington sections of the 39A/B and extend the 33 instead.

33 has been done a few times to Doxford and never worked
Can’t drop the Washington and Houghton as I think nexus pays for them since these replaced the 37 and 55 routes

(19 Jun 2023, 11:13 pm)Acky81 wrote 33 has been done a few times to Doxford and never worked
Can’t drop the Washington and Houghton as I think nexus pays for them since these replaced the 37 and 55 routes

The Houghton-le-Spring extension is commercially operated.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Has there ever been a service that exists in which A to B gets busy and C-D get busy but the route needs to run A-B-C-D for operational convenience even though nobody would travel between B & C.

Pretty sure that was the whole idea of the X81

(05 Jul 2023, 5:30 pm)ASX_Terranova wrote Has there ever been a service that exists in which A to B gets busy and C-D get busy but the route needs to run A-B-C-D for operational convenience even though nobody would travel between B & C.

Well you could say the current Coaster 1 to an extent.

(05 Jul 2023, 9:22 pm)L469 YVK wrote Well you could say the current Coaster 1 to an extent.

a-b whitley to newcastle?

c-d gateshead to metrocentre?

B-C newcasatle to gateshead?

(10 Jun 2023, 6:20 pm)Storx wrote See personally if I was going to do this I'd just scrap everything and start again, the routes now aren't ideal and are from yesteryear and change it to something like.

55 - Every 30 Minutes, Current Route
56 - Every 30 Minutes, Newcastle - South Gosforth - Four Lane Ends - Benton - Benton Rise - ASDA - Holystone - Shiremoor - Briardene - Whitley Bay
---
55/56 - Every 15 Minutes, Newcastle to Benton

57/57A - Whitley Bay to North Shields restored

Cobalt Connect
80 - Every 30 Minutes, Newcastle - Selby Gardens - Wallsend Dene - Silverlink (The Silverlink) - Cobalt - New York - NT Hospital - Whitley Bay - Blyth via Links Road
80A - Every 30 Minutes, Newcastle - Selby Gardens - Wallsend Dene - Silverlink (The Silverlink) - Cobalt - New York - NT Hospital - Whitley Bay - Blyth via South Beach
---
80/80A - Every 15 Minutes, Express Newcastle to Silverlink / Cobalt / Whitley Bay / Blyth

Coastal Loop
81 - Every 30 Minutes, Newcastle - Selby Gardens - Battle Hill - Silverlink (A1058) - Billy Mill - Lynn Road - NT Hospital - Morrisons - Marden - Cullercoats - Tynemouth
82 - Every 30 Minutes, Newcastle - Selby Gardens - Battle Hill - Silverlink (A1058) - Verne Road - Central Avenue - Landestown Terrace - Hawkeys Lane - North Shields - Tynemouth
---
81/82 - Every 15 Minutes, Express Newcastle to Battle Hill, Then serve all the coast - connect with each other in Tynemouth

'The Slow Ones' Loop
83 - Every 30 Minutes, Newcastle - Wiltshire Drive - High Farm - Battle Hill - Middle Engine Lane - Norham Road - Billy Mill - Queen Alexander Road - North Shields
84 - Every 30 Minutes, Newcastle - Battle Hill - High Farm - Hadrian Park - Middle Engine Lane - Norham Road - Meadowell - North Shields
---
83/84 - Every 15 Minutes, Newcastle - Middle Engine Lane - Cobalt South - Norham Road, connect with each other in North Shields

Other Combined Corridors
57/57A/83, Every 15 Minutes Billy Mill to North Shields
80/80A/81/82 - Every 7.5 Minutes, Newcastle to Selby Gardens
81/82/83/84 - 8x buses, Newcastle to Battle Hill

It connects communities together much better than what's there now and makes more sense with the 306 extension and also reduces the overkill of buses at the Northern side. I'd imagine it's actually a PVR reduction from it but haven't worked it. Tynemouth etc still has the same buses but they just go in opposite directions for example and most people arguably should be using the Metro anyway. I know there's a few areas with reductions ie. Lynn Road and the 306 from Billy Mill to Tynemouth but somewhere had to take the hit and sadly it was them but most of it has gained the 57/57A to compensate for it for people doing local journeys.

Why does everyone think there should be a link between Marden and Battle hill. Why not have X38 Whitley Bay to Newcastle via old 44 route non stop along the Coast Rd. from Norham Rd. and keep the 308 as it is.

(06 Jul 2023, 10:06 am)ian foster wrote Why does everyone think there should be a link between Marden and Battle hill. Why not have X38 Whitley Bay to Newcastle via old 44 route non stop along the Coast Rd. from Norham Rd. and keep the 308 as it is.

There's way too much transport between Blyth / Whitley Bay and Newcastle via Seaton Sluice.

There's absolutely no need for 6 buses and 12 metro trains an hour between Whitley Bay and Newcastle. It doesn't need more along there, the 308 just isn't needed imo - it's just a legacy route from yesteryear before Cobalt was built. That was more about making the 306 actually useful (same again way too much transport between Tynemouth and Whitley Bay, 6 buses and 6 Metro's doing the same area give or take).

That was about linking more areas and creating better links to the local area but creating a loop, ie. Marden to NT Hospital for example.

The diagram below probably shows it better (Red: 80/80A, Blue: 81/82, Green: 83/84, Pink: 57/57A), (Thick Line: Every 15 Minutes, Thin Line: Every 30 Minutes).

I cannot be the only one who wishes the 51/52/93/94 would be proper loops similar to the 53/54.

(05 Jul 2023, 5:30 pm)ASX_Terranova wrote Has there ever been a service that exists in which A to B gets busy and C-D get busy but the route needs to run A-B-C-D for operational convenience even though nobody would travel between B & C.

Can't imagine there's any bus service like that as it just doesn't make sense.

There's plenty of services where people would do A - B, B - C, and C - D but no-one unless they're mentally insane would do A - D. The 10, 27, 56 (all GNE), 43 (Morpeth) and X18 (both Arriva) to pick some.

(06 Jul 2023, 11:19 am)Unber43 wrote I cannot be the only one who wishes the 51/52/93/94 would be proper loops similar to the 53/54.

Are they not?

(06 Jul 2023, 11:27 am)Storx wrote Can't imagine there's any bus service like that as it just doesn't make sense.

There's plenty of services where people would do A - B, B - C, and C - D but no-one unless they're mentally insane would do A - D. The 10, 27, 56 (all GNE), 43 (Morpeth) and X18 (both Arriva) to pick some.

There’s a few examples like the 1, whereby really the cross city link is often just the best way to operate it. Things like the 20 and 2/2A are two separate services just merged together, that’s not say cross city links aren’t used though. But I’m the 2/2A case if you wanted to go Silksworth to Royal Hospital you’d probably save time using the 33 or Stagecoach. And clearly the 20 is operational reasons as otherwise Durham and Langley Park is miles from the nearest GNE depot. 

The X21 is a bit like that also, despite what is sometimes spoke about on this forum is there many people really going from Bishop Auckland to Newcastle?! It exists a through route for two reasons, 1) there’s not depot in Durham so makes operational sense to tack it on the end of something else 2) Bonus, of the cross Durham links to the Arnison Centre & Hospital.   

The 50 is another route which sorts of two stretches Washington to South Shields and then Washington to Durham. But if someone did want to go Durham to South Shields the 50 would probably the best way, but I don’t think it’s a common travel link?  

And The 4 is the closest to what you say, there wouldn’t be much reason of anyone using it from Houghton to Washington point to point as the X1 does it quicker. If you were going Houghton to Heworth, you’d be best going X1 to Galleries then the 4, that what I used to do.

(06 Jul 2023, 11:42 am)Iamtheone8483748 wrote Are they not?

No, the 51/52 interwork, the 93/94 currently do aswell.

So if you wanted to go from say Gateshead Stadium to Bensham, you have to go all the way around on the 93 or pay twice and get the 94, get off at Gateshead and wait for the next 94.

(06 Jul 2023, 10:57 am)Storx wrote There's way too much transport between Blyth / Whitley Bay and Newcastle via Seaton Sluice.

There's absolutely no need for 6 buses and 12 metro trains an hour between Whitley Bay and Newcastle. It doesn't need more along there, the 308 just isn't needed imo - it's just a legacy route from yesteryear before Cobalt was built. That was more about making the 306 actually useful (same again way too much transport between Tynemouth and Whitley Bay, 6 buses and 6 Metro's doing the same area give or take).

That was about linking more areas and creating better links to the local area but creating a loop, ie. Marden to NT Hospital for example.

The diagram below probably shows it better (Red: 80/80A, Blue: 81/82, Green: 83/84, Pink: 57/57A), (Thick Line: Every 15 Minutes, Thin Line: Every 30 Minutes).

308 is still popular because at least it is a direct route unlike the tedious 309 and 306. certainly Marden, Preston Grange, New York the Metro is of little or no use. It  needs an express bus along the Coast Rd. to tempt people out of their cars like the 44 used to.

(06 Jul 2023, 11:56 am)Drifter60 wrote There’s a few examples like the 1, whereby really the cross city link is often just the best way to operate it. Things like the 20 and 2/2A are two separate services just merged together, that’s not say cross city links aren’t used though. But I’m the 2/2A case if you wanted to go Silksworth to Royal Hospital you’d probably save time using the 33 or Stagecoach. And clearly the 20 is operational reasons as otherwise Durham and Langley Park is miles from the nearest GNE depot. 

The X21 is a bit like that also, despite what is sometimes spoke about on this forum is there many people really going from Bishop Auckland to Newcastle?! It exists a through route for two reasons, 1) there’s not depot in Durham so makes operational sense to tack it on the end of something else 2) Bonus, of the cross Durham links to the Arnison Centre & Hospital.   

The 50 is another route which sorts of two stretches Washington to South Shields and then Washington to Durham. But if someone did want to go Durham to South Shields the 50 would probably the best way, but I don’t think it’s a common travel link?  

And The 4 is the closest to what you say, there wouldn’t be much reason of anyone using it from Houghton to Washington point to point as the X1 does it quicker. If you were going Houghton to Heworth, you’d be best going X1 to Galleries then the 4, that what I used to do.

Aye totally, there's still quite a few who cross across though like the B - C for the 50 would arguably be Washington to CLS. Can't think of any routes where they'd be busy like South Shields - Washington then CLS to Durham but no-one at all does CLS to Washington. Be an odd route.

(06 Jul 2023, 1:03 pm)ian foster wrote 308 is still popular because at least it is a direct route unlike the tedious 309 and 306. certainly Marden, Preston Grange, New York the Metro is of little or no use. It  needs an express bus along the Coast Rd. to tempt people out of their cars like the 44 used to.

I know what you say but any express route should go via Cobalt imo for the opposite flow. It's absolutely ridiculous that the biggest business park is connected via a bus that goes around High Farm and Battle Hill, it's just unattractive. Miss out Cobalt and you'll have empty buses against the peak.

Any express needs to serve Cobalt, if you really wanted to serve Marden then something like the below would be the best with a Blyth to North Shields coast bus going wherever after as there's probably no need for more than 2 buses beyond Whitley via the Coast Road, especially with the X7 aswell up there and opens more links especially along the Coast for leisure users with a new North Shields - Fish Quay - Tynemouth - Longsands - Cullercoats - Whitley Bay - Lighthouse - Seaton Sluice - Blyth Beach bus which are all disconnected atm.



With the other buses all serving Battle Hill etc to cover the remaining 308, 310 and 311. It's the best compromise for people in both directions.

New Express Versions of GNE Services.

4X: Would be limited stop (Heworth - Shiney Row) then all stops to Houghton-Le-Spring.
10X: Would be limited stop (Newcastle - Prudhoe) then all stops to Hexham.
16X: Would be limited stop on full route.
27X: Would be limited stop (Newcastle - Jarrow), then all stops to South Shields.
39X: Same as normal 39, then Non Stop from Doxford Int to Washington.
49X: Would be limited stop (Gateshead - Blaydon), then all stops to Winlaton.
50X: Would be Fast Boldon - Washington (via A19/A1231), Ayton - CLS (via A1) and would skip Waldridge Park & Arnison Centre.
57X: Would be limited stop (Newcastle - Beacon Lough), then all stops to Wardley or maybe skip Fewster Square.
60X Would be limited stop (Sunderland - Seaham), then all stops to Parkside.
65X: Would be limited stop (Durham - Hetton), then all stops to Seaham.
78X: Would be limited stop on full route.

(06 Aug 2023, 4:27 pm)ASX_Terranova wrote New Express Versions of GNE Services.

4X: Would be limited stop (Heworth - Shiney Row) then all stops to Houghton-Le-Spring.
10X: Would be limited stop (Newcastle - Prudhoe) then all stops to Hexham.
16X: Would be limited stop on full route.
27X: Would be limited stop (Newcastle - Jarrow), then all stops to South Shields.
39X: Same as normal 39, then Non Stop from Doxford Int to Washington.
49X: Would be limited stop (Gateshead - Blaydon), then all stops to Winlaton.
50X: Would be Fast Boldon - Washington (via A19/A1231), Ayton - CLS (via A1) and would skip Waldridge Park & Arnison Centre.
57X: Would be limited stop (Newcastle - Beacon Lough), then all stops to Wardley or maybe skip Fewster Square.
60X Would be limited stop (Sunderland - Seaham), then all stops to Parkside.
65X: Would be limited stop (Durham - Hetton), then all stops to Seaham.
78X: Would be limited stop on full route.

The only ones which would make money are 

4X/10X/ possibly 27X/ 50X/ 78X

the 16x would bleed money same with the 39, 57, 65, 60 (which is basically the X6)

(06 Aug 2023, 6:48 pm)Unber43 wrote The only ones which would make money are 

4X/10X/ possibly 27X/ 50X/ 78X

the 16x would bleed money same with the 39, 57, 65, 60 (which is basically the X6)

Out of curiosity what would a 51X/52X look like and also a 93X/94X. I was thinking also about a 61X given the decimation of this route.

I'm going to open this suggestion to the floor.

I want to create a network of routes covering Most of Washington, Houghton, Hetton, Chester-Le-Street, East Gateshead, South Tyneside & Newcastle City Centre.

There are several rules.

• All services must be operated by a EVM Cityline. 
  
• Connections should be provided if possible.
  
• All PVR's must be between 3 & 8.
  
• Interworking is allowed. 
  
• The network already contains the 14 (Waldridge Park, Chester-Le-Street, North Lodge, Barley Mow, Portobello, Birtley & Northside Estate), the 15 (Hall Lane Estate, Houghton, Burnside Estate, Fence Houses, Great Lumley, Chester-Le-Street, Pelton Fell & Newfield) & the 19 (Gateshead, Whitehall Road, Bensham Hospital, Team Valley, Harlow Green & Wrekenton).
  

Good luck!!!

Didnt know where to put this but occacianly the X10 goes via marsh house avenue, Billingham instead of Wolviston Road (Its normal route) Usually on sunday mornings and Once on a weekday evening. Is it meant to?

I was looking in the Bygone Era, but I can't find any examples of express buses on the 25 or 52 routes from Wrekenton to Gateshead.

I was thinking half hourly from Newcastle to Eighton Banks running express from Newcastle to Wrekenton via Gateshead & Low Fell.
From wrekenton, one bus a hour would replace the tb22/tb23 but additionally operate via donwell bus link.
The other bus would operate to portmeads, portobello, the drive, ayton, lambton and the galleries running in the other half hour to the 82.

If gne proposed that the 58 was omitting Fewster Square and the 57 was to become an express from Gateshead to the Q.E but re-doubled back to every 15 minutes, how would that go down in east gateshead.