(14 Apr 2014, 9:25 am)Dan wrote A driver on the X36 this morning telling my mam that the service is incredibly unprofitable and that it won't exist for much longer. He said he was gutted because he quite likes doing the X36 too.

She came back home and asked what was going on as she likes to use the X36...

Nowt but a load of crap as far as I'm concerned (and that's what I've told her), but slightly annoying that drivers are telling passengers it's going to be axed (esp. when no VOSA registrations have been put in to cancel the service or revise it).

Can't see the X36 being withdrawn but I'd die laughing if they did as it was GNE's obsession with that which killed off X3

(14 Apr 2014, 11:29 am)Greg in Weardale wrote Can't see the X36 being withdrawn but I'd die laughing if they did as it was GNE's obsession with that which killed off X3

Was thinking it may have been the drivers opinion, rather than an official line.

The x3 decker (excellent use of resources) that has just passed me in Newcastle was carrying nowt but fresh air.

Mind, the x36's I have seen today weren't carrying decent loads either.

I don't know the process, but in my opinion, any review after 6 month should not see any service axed or massively changed. It should simply highlight that there's an issue, and an action plan should be put in place to review after month 9 and again at 12. Maybe it's as simple as the marketing being wrong, or departure times being inconvenient by minutes. Who knows?

There seemed to be issues with the 56.
Saw a number running in pairs and some being turned around short at Gateshead over the course of today.

(14 Apr 2014, 5:52 pm)Andreos Constantopolous wrote There seemed to be issues with the 56.
Saw a number running in pairs and some being turned around short at Gateshead over the course of today.

I've noticed that before as well, one time two were parked in their stand at Gateshead heading to Sunderland and as soon as they left with about ten seconds of each other a third one came in and was gone within thirty seconds. They probably all joined up again at Wrekenton Bus Link. Does the timetable need altering?, with the 21 they couldn't care less if two were waiting in the same stand at Chester because there's so many and so much frequency they almost don't have to worry about timetables (well, they obviously do because they have to do surveys and the timetables need to run to time, but you know what I mean )

Doesnt help that theres 2 sets of traffic lights at Nissan

(14 Apr 2014, 7:51 pm)Michael wrote Doesnt help that theres 2 sets of traffic lights at Nissan

And a Temporary Set at Springwell, and then a further Several Sets from there into Newcastle, And however many heading from Nissan into Sunderland.

(14 Apr 2014, 7:51 pm)Michael wrote Doesnt help that theres 2 sets of traffic lights at Nissan

It seemed to be loadings more than anything.
The one I was on, left on time and was caught up and overtaken 15mins into the trip - before any roadworks.

No idea if others had the same issues or if the lights at Nissan or Springwell were causing issues.
The x1s seemed ok, so Springwell mustn't be causing too many issues.

(14 Apr 2014, 7:49 pm)Marcus wrote I've noticed that before as well, one time two were parked in their stand at Gateshead heading to Sunderland and as soon as they left with about ten seconds of each other a third one came in and was gone within thirty seconds. They probably all joined up again at Wrekenton Bus Link. Does the timetable need altering?, with the 21 they couldn't care less if two were waiting in the same stand at Chester because there's so many and so much frequency they almost don't have to worry about timetables (well, they obviously do because they have to do surveys and the timetables need to run to time, but you know what I mean )

For the 21 I honestly think having some stop on Pilgrim Street would solve the Solution of them Running in 2 and 3's, even having the 21 operating to Durham Every 10 Minutes rather than Every 15 would perhaps solve the problem, Overall I would the Short Journeys to Chester are the Problem to be Honest.

As for the 56, basically depends on Traffic and how many sets of Traffic Lights it Hits along the way, and of course the amount of Passengers who get on/off at Every Single Stop also adds to the Journey Time, But looking at it from an Enthusiast point of view, there much you can do to then improve the Reliability of the Service, I can think of Two things, 1.) Limited Stopping Service - 2.) Dual Door Operation - I think GNE missed a Trick with the 56 in regards to that when it got B9's, you could argue the same for the 21 also.

(14 Apr 2014, 8:10 pm)Andreos Constantopolous wrote It seemed to be loadings more than anything.
The one I was on, left on time and was caught up and overtaken 15mins into the trip - before any roadworks.

No idea if others had the same issues or if the lights at Nissan or Springwell were causing issues.
The x1s seemed ok, so Springwell mustn't be causing too many issues.

Only issue I had with the X1 today was getting stuck behind 3 Horse/Carts from the top of Washington Highway to Wrekenton and also getting stuck at the Traffic Lights at Springwell as a Result, when taking my Nephew Home to my Brother.

(14 Apr 2014, 8:22 pm)NEBCD Malarkey wrote Only issue I had with the X1 today was getting stuck behind 3 Horse/Carts from the top of Washington Highway to Wrekenton and also getting stuck at the Traffic Lights at Springwell as a Result, when taking my Nephew Home to my Brother.

Neigh good that mind.

(14 Apr 2014, 8:28 pm)aureolin wrote Neigh good that mind.

Oh dear, are we going to wheeling all the puns out now?

(14 Apr 2014, 8:31 pm)tyresmoke wrote Oh dear, are we going to wheeling all the puns out now?

He is trotting them out

(14 Apr 2014, 7:49 pm)Marcus wrote I've noticed that before as well, one time two were parked in their stand at Gateshead heading to Sunderland and as soon as they left with about ten seconds of each other a third one came in and was gone within thirty seconds. They probably all joined up again at Wrekenton Bus Link. Does the timetable need altering?, with the 21 they couldn't care less if two were waiting in the same stand at Chester because there's so many and so much frequency they almost don't have to worry about timetables (well, they obviously do because they have to do surveys and the timetables need to run to time, but you know what I mean )

One problem I've witnessed with the 21 is at times in Eldon Square I've seen a Chester-Le-Street bound 21 arrive in the bus station and is closely followed by a Durham 21 which can't pull onto the stand so it either has to wait in one of the bays or leave the bus station then come back in again. On one occasion this happened the Durham bound journey left the bus station and didn't come back, so everyone ended up getting the Arriva X2 to Durham.

Also every time I've been on the X22 to Durham it has to leave from the wrong stand because a Chester-Le-Street 21 is sat on the stand.

I think the 21 should run on a 10 minute frequency across the whole route again.

(14 Apr 2014, 8:45 pm)Andreos Constantopolous wrote He is trotting them out

Stop horsing around, guys!

(14 Apr 2014, 8:50 pm)Jimmi wrote I think the 21 should run on a 10 minute frequency across the whole route again.

Perhaps this could be considered if the service was ever upgraded again - I'm sure it could easily be justified.
We've previously discussed which services would/would not be appropriate for the B5LHs to go on when they're due for cascade, but I can't remember if we ever came to a conclusion about which service(s) would be appropriate. This one's open to debate - does anyone think that the B5LHs would be appropriate on "Crusader" service 27? The numbers work brilliantly too; there are currently 15 B5LHs for a PVR of 14 on the "Crusader", allowing the service to have one spare.

Looking on ebay and this came up, first it was the Waggonway now the colbalt clipper

(14 Apr 2014, 8:59 pm)benambro wrote Looking on ebay and this came up, first it was the Waggonway now the colbalt clipper

Adsense perhaps?

(14 Apr 2014, 8:54 pm)Dan wrote Stop horsing around, guys!


Perhaps this could be considered if the service was ever upgraded again - I'm sure it could easily be justified.
We've previously discussed which services would/would not be appropriate for the B5LHs to go on when they're due for cascade, but I can't remember if we ever came to a conclusion about which service(s) would be appropriate. This one's open to debate - does anyone think that the B5LHs would be appropriate on "Crusader" service 27? The numbers work brilliantly too; there are currently 15 B5LHs for a PVR of 14 on the "Crusader", allowing the service to have one spare.

The B5LHs were ordered when the service still operated every 10 minutes so they should have the correct amount plus the two spares.

Also on Sundays I'd like the service run to Durham more than every 30 minutes.

(14 Apr 2014, 8:50 pm)Jimmi wrote One problem I've witnessed with the 21 is at times in Eldon Square I've seen a Chester-Le-Street bound 21 arrive in the bus station and is closely followed by a Durham 21 which can't pull onto the stand so it either has to wait in one of the bays or leave the bus station then come back in again. On one occasion this happened the Durham bound journey left the bus station and didn't come back, so everyone ended up getting the Arriva X2 to Durham.

Also every time I've been on the X22 to Durham it has to leave from the wrong stand because a Chester-Le-Street 21 is sat on the stand.

I think the 21 should run on a 10 minute frequency across the whole route again.

Interesting points.
We have probably seen it happen umpteen times, but I never thought about it.

With regard to the 21 and 56, I wonder how many passengers use them as local services versus a distance service?

If the two services were split in two (with an overlap):
21 Newcastle - Chester every 10mins
22 Birtley - Durham every 10mins
x21 Newcastle - Bishop every half hour.

55 Newcastle - Nissan/A19 every 10mins
56 Concord - Sunderland every 10mins
x56 Newcastle - Sunderland every half hour.

(14 Apr 2014, 8:54 pm)Dan wrote Stop horsing around, guys!


Perhaps this could be considered if the service was ever upgraded again - I'm sure it could easily be justified.
We've previously discussed which services would/would not be appropriate for the B5LHs to go on when they're due for cascade, but I can't remember if we ever came to a conclusion about which service(s) would be appropriate. This one's open to debate - does anyone think that the B5LHs would be appropriate on "Crusader" service 27? The numbers work brilliantly too; there are currently 15 B5LHs for a PVR of 14 on the "Crusader", allowing the service to have one spare.

Horse and carts on a mane road ain't a laughing matter. The tail backs, will be huge!

Drivers will have to hoof their vehicles around to catch up

(14 Apr 2014, 9:08 pm)Jimmi wrote The B5LHs were ordered when the service still operated every 10 minutes so they should have the correct amount plus the two spares.

Also on Sundays I'd like the service run to Durham more than every 30 minutes.

3965 and 3962 aren't spares, they get used every day. I believe the actual PVR is 17, hence why Chester had 17 B7s when they were brought up from London, and having a round number of 15 hybrids plus 2 that look very similar seems to suit GNE. I agree with the points made about Newcastle - Durham every 10 minutes, fair enough not as many people use it from Durham as they do from Chester, but it would certainly make the lives of the drivers a whole lot easier instead of having to check the laminated duty sheet before changing the blind everytime they pull into Eldon Square. Having too many running at once isn't good, but on the negative side some of the vinyls would need to be removed like the every 7/8 minutes ones on the rear and the inside advertisements, and people would likely complain about having to wait an extra two minutes!

(14 Apr 2014, 8:22 pm)NEBCD Malarkey wrote Only issue I had with the X1 today was getting stuck behind 3 Horse/Carts from the top of Washington Highway to Wrekenton and also getting stuck at the Traffic Lights at Springwell as a Result, when taking my Nephew Home to my Brother.

Nothing nags me more, but most of the time when I use X1 it normally takes neigh time at all

(14 Apr 2014, 9:08 pm)Andreos Constantopolous wrote Interesting points.
We have probably seen it happen umpteen times, but I never thought about it.

With regard to the 21 and 56, I wonder how many passengers use them as local services versus a distance service?

If the two services were split in two (with an overlap):
21 Newcastle - Chester every 10mins
22 Birtley - Durham every 10mins
x21 Newcastle - Bishop every half hour.

55 Newcastle - Nissan/A19 every 10mins
56 Concord - Sunderland every 10mins
x56 Newcastle - Sunderland every half hour.

Probably best not to split these routes because there are people who do the full route.

(14 Apr 2014, 9:25 pm)Jimmi wrote Probably best not to split these routes because there are people who do the full route.

Enough people to justify a ten min frequency for the entire route?
I have kept an express version of the route, which would obviously call at key points on a limited stop and have some sort of variation of the route to miss potential pinch points or traffic jams.

(14 Apr 2014, 9:29 pm)Andreos Constantopolous wrote Enough people to justify a ten min frequency for the entire route?
I have kept an express version of the route, which would obviously call at key points on a limited stop and have some sort of variation of the route to miss potential pinch points or traffic jams.

I would want more Durham - Newcastle buses than every hour and this would lead to people to use the Arriva X2 as well.

Perhaps the 22/X21 could run every 20 minutes giving a roughly combined 10 minute frequency.

(14 Apr 2014, 9:40 pm)Jimmi wrote I would want more Durham - Newcastle buses than every hour and this would lead to people to use the Arriva X2 as well.

Perhaps the 22/X21 could run every 20 minutes giving a roughly combined 10 minute frequency.

The 22 hasnt ran for years :p

I dont live on the route so i cant comment on the numbers etc but last time i seen it, it was packed, it was at chester heading to newcastle.

(14 Apr 2014, 9:40 pm)Jimmi wrote I would want more Durham - Newcastle buses than every hour and this would lead to people to use the Arriva X2 as well.

Perhaps the 22/X21 could run every 20 minutes giving a roughly combined 10 minute frequency.

There are more buses in my suggestion than currently if you look - just less direct than currently, to aid with reliability.

(14 Apr 2014, 9:18 pm)Marcus wrote 3965 and 3962 aren't spares, they get used every day. I believe the actual PVR is 17, hence why Chester had 17 B7s when they were brought up from London, and having a round number of 15 hybrids plus 2 that look very similar seems to suit GNE. I agree with the points made about Newcastle - Durham every 10 minutes, fair enough not as many people use it from Durham as they do from Chester, but it would certainly make the lives of the drivers a whole lot easier instead of having to check the laminated duty sheet before changing the blind everytime they pull into Eldon Square. Having too many running at once isn't good, but on the negative side some of the vinyls would need to be removed like the every 7/8 minutes ones on the rear and the inside advertisements, and people would likely complain about having to wait an extra two minutes!

ah the joys of 3965 one of my now favourite double deckers in the fleet had the best driver on there while in Chester-le-Street for 2 Targets that day to see where the former Wear Tees Express Renowns were (Accidentaly found out), Whey Aye Five 0 which i knew about and Venture on 78 plus am glad it was one of my good old friends giving me a lift

From Facebook:

Incidents Tyne & Wear
45 secs ·
Delays on Market Street due to a incident involving a bus.

The 21 isn't an easy solve for anyone, in fact it probably can't be solved.

The 221 had the same problems and that ran Newcastle - Chester, the Classic 21 always came in bunches. There's never been a reliable on time service because its impossible.

You can't remove the traffic congestion from Birtley, Low Fell or Gateshead. No amount of route splitting or frequency change will help that.

The Angel has been alright of late but with heavy loadings and traffic even during the daytime its a losing battle

(14 Apr 2014, 9:57 pm)Michael wrote The 22 hasnt ran for years :p

I dont live on the route so i cant comment on the numbers etc but last time i seen it, it was packed, it was at chester heading to newcastle.

Although the 22 came down from Waldridge Park, I would say most people have just gotten to grips with that and used a 34 (which I think actually led to some kind of service boost) to come down to Chester and just board whichever Angel they could see heading northbound . Now though, as well as having that, most people who go to say college in Newcastle, and those in general from up at Waldridge have just adapted to use the X25. What drives me NUTS about the 21 these days, is when in the past I've been coming home from school, and it's been so late due to traffic and congestion before and after picking me up that two Durham 21's pull in and we have to get on 'the one infront'. Then the one I was on runs NIS to the Black Horse and just goes back to Newcastle. It's happened to me countless times and it drives me insane