(07 Dec 2022, 5:39 pm)streetdeckfan wrote And the ones that do work don't even provide enough power to charge a phone!

Fleet presentation seems to have gone downhill, and certainly since MG left.

As I've said in the past, one thing I did admire about him was he genuinely seemed to care about the passenger experience, probably because he actually uses public transport!

Certainly in regards to cleanliness I'd say its often been terrible over the years, pre, during and after MG, often made jibes at the "hospital grade cleaning" comments made during COVID times.

I think some of the features implemented during MG's tenure may or may not have helped improved the passenger experience onboard although I'm not a fan of the new fabric seats which show up too many hairs and dirt.

(07 Dec 2022, 9:46 pm)Jimmi wrote Certainly in regards to cleanliness I'd say its often been terrible over the years, pre, during and after MG, often made jibes at the "hospital grade cleaning" comments made during COVID times.

I think some of the features implemented during MG's tenure may or may not have helped improved the passenger experience onboard although I'm not a fan of the new fabric seats which show up too many hairs and dirt.

Cleanliness definitely increased during COVID, but it's definitely slipped back down to where it used to be. Ie. non existent.

Definitely agree with the seats. I personally prefer leather seats, both from a comfort perspective, and from a cleanliness perspective.
Like you say you can see all the hairs and dirt, but they also hide the arse sweat patches that you generally want to avoid!

I have to admit the state of the fleet is woeful…an inevitable cost of the cutbacks

I’ve been on the first 21 (post N21 days) and there’s been beer bottles and McDonald’s wrappers all over the top deck.

The window seals are the worst part for me, full of mould and gunk that I want nowhere near me.

Currently on one of the ex-GNW B9s and I'm fairly sure it's colder on the bus than outside!

I must admit though, I do quite like the purple interior, I actually prefer it to GNE's latest.

Sent from my SM-F721B using Tapatalk

(12 Dec 2022, 5:40 pm)streetdeckfan wrote Currently on one of the ex-GNW B9s and I'm fairly sure it's colder on the bus than outside!

I must admit though, I do quite like the purple interior, I actually prefer it to GNE's latest.

Sent from my SM-F721B using Tapatalk

Is it not just the First Barbie interior with orange grab rails and different seat covers?

(12 Dec 2022, 6:16 pm)Storx wrote Is it not just the First Barbie interior with orange grab rails and different seat covers?

Perhaps, I don't think think I've ever been on a First bus?

The front half is purple/green moquette, and the back half purple/grey leather

Sent from my SM-F721B using Tapatalk

(12 Dec 2022, 6:30 pm)streetdeckfan wrote Perhaps, I don't think think I've ever been on a First bus?

The front half is purple/green moquette, and the back half purple/grey leather

Sent from my SM-F721B using Tapatalk

Aye sounds like it is then, guessing it's like this the moquette.



Sounds like some of that one hasn't been refurbished at all bar grab rails.

It's much nicer than the new First interior which just sucks.

(12 Dec 2022, 6:53 pm)Storx wrote Aye sounds like it is then, guessing it's like this the moquette.



Sounds like some of that one hasn't been refurbished at all bar grab rails.

It's much nicer than the new First interior which just sucks.

Yeah, that's the one.
It looked exactly like that but with the orange grab rails.

Sent from my SM-F721B using Tapatalk

(12 Dec 2022, 6:30 pm)streetdeckfan wrote Perhaps, I don't think think I've ever been on a First bus?

The front half is purple/green moquette, and the back half purple/grey leather

Sent from my SM-F721B using Tapatalk

Weren't the Ex-GNW B9's Ex-First ones.

(12 Dec 2022, 7:27 pm)nova347 wrote Weren't the Ex-GNW B9's Ex-First ones.

Yes. 6188 even has the first logo on the stairwell.

If they want people to use the bus, make them more reliable, the number of breakdowns, and delayed operation all the time, no wonder people get the car or pay for the train.

(12 Dec 2022, 7:05 pm)streetdeckfan wrote Yeah, that's the one.
It looked exactly like that but with the orange grab rails.

Sent from my SM-F721B using Tapatalk

Aye that's First Barbie then. Mind I thought they all had been reupholstered. Pretty poor to be running around with one of your major competitors moquette 3 years after buying them over especially for the size of GoAhead.

https://www.passengertransport.co.uk/2022/09/17831/

I've been meaning to share this for a while to be honest.

Really interesting read, with a summary at the end which really does sum up the state of public transport.

the bitter truth is that we need an order of magnitude of change and matching investment across transport and that this is a gargantuan task. We need to deploy all the means possible to make transport accessible and available and easy for all, so that in this crisis – which is unlikely to end any time soon – people can travel without it costing them (or all of us) the earth.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-64117338

Begging bowl out again i see

Without a long term funding mechanism and/or structural change, coupled with an improvement within those operators which are not very good, there are only a few operators that could get away with running truly commercial bus operations right now. We do not have a functioning commercial bus sector in some areas due to the economics caused by Covid and WFH, as well as poor management in some areas.

The industry cannot go from cliff edge to cliff edge with withdrawal warnings. It can be debated for ages about the whys and what fors, but somebody in authority right now needs to make the decision that we either keep funding services as they are in order to keep the 80% of pre covid passengers OR it all gets thrown up in the air and start afresh, with the risk of potentially losing existing customers with redepolyed resource, but possibly gaining new customers.

Both of which will cost tax-payers money.

There is are no other alternatives in my eyes.

(06 Dec 2022, 12:25 pm)Ambassador wrote Yes someone asked where the X21 was and if there were any delays and he replied 

'We just drive this bus - not the other buses so can't help there'

Whilst not a factually inaccurate response it's indicative of the awful levels of customer service prevalent especially on the 21 lately

I've voted with my feet - pity those who can't

I did the same months ago, and will continue to do as long as I get away with it. I think I've had 3 or 4 office days in as many months.

new mayor public buses!

https://www.itv.com/news/tyne-tees/2023-...ic-control

I think it's a good thing that buses are put under public control as it means the public are the ones who say where services go and at the right frequencies. Instead of private companies who want to make a profit while cutting services to the bare bones and not caring that most passengers don't want a conga line of multi coloured buses on Gosforth High Street and want to go from suburb to suburb.

But I think we should be careful about getting into the trap of when buses are under public control it will magically fix the problems overnight. Because It won't. It needs time and cooperation to work.

(05 Jan 2023, 7:42 pm)NEbushopper wrote I think it's a good thing that buses are put under public control as it means the public are the ones who say where services go and at the right frequencies. Instead of private companies who want to make a profit while cutting services to the bare bones and not caring that most passengers don't want a conga line of multi coloured buses on Gosforth High Street and want to go from suburb to suburb.

But I think we should be careful about getting into the trap of when buses are under public control it will magically fix the problems overnight. Because It won't. It needs time and cooperation to work.

Personally I think it would be a disaster. We don't have the people to run them up here and the likes of Gannon would just make things worse.

Manchester is going to be disaster imo as it's politically motivated rather than anything else and there's no evidence at all anywhere it's going to save any money. True public ownership is banned under the Bus Services Act but then again it's not like Edinburgh has a world class transport network either (that's publically owned).

The bus partnership which we are going for is the best compromise. Most the issues with public transport are beyond buses; no-one wants to travel longer than 20 - 25 minutes on one, using the same road you drive along and should be using a train or other form of rapid transport - but they don't exist.

Some of those quotes are just absolute cringe. There's an argument to be won about franchising or more public control. Banging in about non-existent profits and setting a high bar for success is NOT a way to do it.

(05 Jan 2023, 7:52 pm)Storx wrote Personally I think it would be a disaster. We don't have the people to run them up here and the likes of Gannon would just make things worse.

Manchester is going to be disaster imo as it's politically motivated rather than anything else and there's no evidence at all anywhere it's going to save any money. True public ownership is banned under the Bus Services Act but then again it's not like Edinburgh has a world class transport network either (that's publically owned).

The bus partnership which we are going for is the best compromise. Most the issues with public transport are beyond buses; no-one wants to travel longer than 20 - 25 minutes on one, using the same road you drive along and should be using a train or other form of rapid transport - but they don't exist.

I've been to most city's in GB and outside London I found Edinburgh to have an excellent transport system. Maybe not " world class" but it a million, no a billion times better then here!!

(06 Jan 2023, 9:29 am)Rob44 wrote I've been to most city's in GB and outside London I found Edinburgh to have an excellent transport system. Maybe not " world class" but it a million, no a billion times better then here!!

Edinburgh does have an excellent system however the trams were a financial disaster and we won't get that level of investment here.

Lothian are excellent on core routes but they've been slashing and burning in ways that would make MG proud.

(06 Jan 2023, 11:54 am)Ambassador wrote Edinburgh does have an excellent system however the trams were a financial disaster and we won't get that level of investment here.

Lothian are excellent on core routes but they've been slashing and burning in ways that would make MG proud.

The metro up here isn't exactly making money either.

I try to get up there 2 or three times a year and have a choice of 4 hotels in different areas of the city and have to say each one of them has a fantastic bus service. that may have changed but im going at end of month so i'll report back here to see if its any worse

I also wouldn't call Edinburgh's buses world class but with flat fares (£1.80 Adult, 90p Child) and Cheap day tickets (£4.50 Adult, £2.20 Child, £9.50 Family) it makes the buses a lot more attractive from the fares and with frequent service going to all corners of the city and Night Services (Which is something Newcastle is lacking) it makes it better then what we have here where normally it would cost £3.10 from Morpeth to Pegswood (2 Mile) with all the service cuts and only two night buses in Newcastle (Used to be more but they were cut just before Covid)

(06 Jan 2023, 12:01 pm)Rob44 wrote The metro up here isn't exactly making money either.

I try to get up there 2 or three times a year and have a choice of 4 hotels in different areas of the city and have to say each one of them has a fantastic bus service. that may have changed but im going at end of month so i'll report back here to see if its any worse

It's more about what happened during construction why the trams were an absolute disaster. Went way way way over budget and I could be typing those ways for hours. There was a meant to be a full system built but because of it 1/2 of it got built. It's one of the biggest infrastructure disasters the UK has ever had.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vgOpj_sjFR0 - There's a good video here about it btw.

To be fair though from a tourist point of view you'd probably be quite impressed here. Most the core corridors in Newcastle have tonnes of buses, there's the Metro which is decent and it's not that expensive. The problem is we're local and we go further afield where it's the opposite. Edinburgh always seems similar to me where places like Morningside with tonnes of buses go further out it starts to decrease fast. Stagecoach Newcastle is similar to Lothian really and it's no worse imo.

(06 Jan 2023, 8:56 pm)Storx wrote It's more about what happened during construction why the trams were an absolute disaster. Went way way way over budget and I could be typing those ways for hours. There was a meant to be a full system built but because of it 1/2 of it got built. It's one of the biggest infrastructure disasters the UK has ever had.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vgOpj_sjFR0 - There's a good video here about it btw.

To be fair though from a tourist point of view you'd probably be quite impressed here. Most the core corridors in Newcastle have tonnes of buses, there's the Metro which is decent and it's not that expensive. The problem is we're local and we go further afield where it's the opposite. Edinburgh always seems similar to me where places like Morningside with tonnes of buses go further out it starts to decrease fast. Stagecoach Newcastle is similar to Lothian really and it's no worse imo.

Yeah that tram line was one of the biggest blunders in Scottish infrastructure. They only got half built, they got more trams than needed (which should be used on Newhaven line) and cost overrun after cost overrun the list goes on and on and on. One thing I don't understand is the Trams and Buses are not integrated. The same company runs the 100 skylink and the trams to the Airport which operate different fare structures and different frequencies. I can complain all day about how things aren't Integrated. Sort of like how things are back here with the Buses and the Metro but at least the buses don't compete with the Metro for going to the Airport

(06 Jan 2023, 9:26 pm)NEbushopper wrote Yeah that tram line was one of the biggest blunders in Scottish infrastructure. They only got half built, they got more trams than needed (which should be used on Newhaven line) and cost overrun after cost overrun the list goes on and on and on. One thing I don't understand is the Trams and Buses are not integrated. The same company runs the 100 skylink and the trams to the Airport which operate different fare structures and different frequencies. I can complain all day about how things aren't Integrated. Sort of like how things are back here with the Buses and the Metro but at least the buses don't compete with the Metro for going to the Airport

To be fair, the tram isn't supposed to be an express link from the City Centre to the airport, and I'd be very surprised if people opt to make that journey versus using the quicker Airlink 100. The airport was never planned to be the terminus for the network, and id imagine if it was built as planned, only half at most of the trams would have termined there.

In terms of integration, I'm not sure what your measure of that is, but I'd say it works really well. It compliments the existing bus network and of course the integrated ticketing provides value for money for customers. We'll very likely see changes to routes and services, once the Newhaven extension opens.



Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

I agree that an Oyster style scheme with zones covering the north east would be a good idea eventually, but maybe they should market day or weekly tickets a bit more?

Talking in particular about Arriva, they'll have route branding on their buses which are more often than not running on a different service, but no advertising the day/weekly tickets. For £6.60 I had a day from East Cleveland to Middlesbrough and Darlington and back again, very good value and for me if that sort of thing was advertised on the side of buses it wouldn't matter as much which route the bus ended up on.

Incidentally, the Explorer ticket is something else that I don't think I've ever seen promoted on any bus, internally or externally, since the days of United!

I was on the 44 going to town yesteray for a liquid lunch and there were loads of adverts including a 12 day ticket that could be used on separate days

I've been out today and i've never really heard massive complaints about the service, obviously there is a one of comment every now and then, but every bus I went on all people were doing was complaining about the disgraceful services, and the state of public transport being abysmal.

I wonder if you offered people free driving lessons how many of them would actually still chose to take the bus, my guess would be around 10%