I'd hope they'd do something with the Fab 56. The orange flower branding has seen its day in my opinion.

(12 Jan 2019, 12:52 pm)Adrian wrote I'd hope they'd do something with the Fab 56. The orange flower branding has seen its day in my opinion.

I 100% agree, time remove the flowers from the brand.

(12 Jan 2019, 12:52 pm)Adrian wrote I'd hope they'd do something with the Fab 56. The orange flower branding has seen its day in my opinion.

Think it's had its day for a few years now like

(12 Jan 2019, 12:52 pm)Adrian wrote I'd hope they'd do something with the Fab 56. The orange flower branding has seen its day in my opinion.

The night bus version looks quite smart. But after 10 years of association and integration, would a complete overhaul of the brand have the desired effect of patronage?

I think the only way to successfully implement such a change would be to overhaul the route as well such as introducing an X56 to enable faster journey times between Newcastle and Sunderland or a limited stop between Concord and Sunderland during the day

(12 Jan 2019, 1:17 pm)JP6004 wrote The night bus version looks quite smart. But after 10 years of association and integration, would a complete overhaul of the brand have the desired effect of patronage?

I think the only way to successfully implement such a change would be to overhaul the route as well such as introducing an X56 to enable faster journey times between Newcastle and Sunderland or a limited stop between Concord and Sunderland during the day

Could have one via Waterview Park and Enterprise Park by putting the 8 back to Chester Road and renumbering it 77.

(12 Jan 2019, 1:22 pm)S830OFT wrote Could have one via Waterview Park and Enterprise Park by putting the 8 back to Chester Road and renumbering it 77.

Metro is the express to Sunderland.

(12 Jan 2019, 1:17 pm)JP6004 wrote The night bus version looks quite smart. But after 10 years of association and integration, would a complete overhaul of the brand have the desired effect of patronage?

I think the only way to successfully implement such a change would be to overhaul the route as well such as introducing an X56 to enable faster journey times between Newcastle and Sunderland or a limited stop between Concord and Sunderland during the day

I quite like the X24 for that, but it perhaps works because its a completely new route, rather than trying to change an existing. That is the only way you could really introduce an X56, because you'd create capacity issues either on Old Durham Road in Gateshead or on the Southwick side in Sunderland, depending on which side you looked at to try and speed up journey times.

(12 Jan 2019, 1:22 pm)S830OFT wrote Could have one via Waterview Park and Enterprise Park by putting the 8 back to Chester Road and renumbering it 77.

I work down Hylton retail park way (more towards the Queen Alex Bridge) and i don't agree on re-routing the 8 from that area, even if hourly, if that happens, we'll only have the 36, which stops running after 6pm, that means they'll be no bus service until 8pm.

Currently the 8 and 36 come within about 5-10 minutes of each other.... i would like it so one of them is retimed so it'll be more spread out, although that means the 35 or 78 will have to be retimed too.

(12 Jan 2019, 1:25 pm)Jamie M wrote Metro is the express to Sunderland.

Yeah, but some people like to get to their destination

(12 Jan 2019, 1:38 pm)Adrian wrote I quite like the X24 for that, but it perhaps works because its a completely new route, rather than trying to change an existing. That is the only way you could really introduce an X56, because you'd create capacity issues either on Old Durham Road in Gateshead or on the Southwick side in Sunderland, depending on which side you looked at to try and speed up journey times.

Yes a limited stop on Old Durham Road would be detrimental as it's the only bus that stops at all stops. The 57, X1 58 and X25 are all limited stop or only cover half the stretch

(12 Jan 2019, 1:25 pm)Jamie M wrote Metro is the express to Sunderland.

And a flight is the express to London. Should we stop running any limited stop trains, as people can just fly instead? 

There are some very good examples of road express alternatives to train. Look at the Citylink network up in Scotland for example.

(12 Jan 2019, 1:43 pm)Adrian wrote And a flight is the express to London. Should we stop running any limited stop trains, as people can just fly instead? 

There are some very good examples of road express alternatives to train. Look at the Citylink network up in Scotland for example.

I just don't think it's easy to compete for what is a short journey in reality. I don't think there's much room to compete, I don't think a new bus service that's slightly quicker will add any new users. What I'd like to see is more unification of systems and more sensible fare structures, cause I think that's the hardest thing to understand and the biggest push factor from public transport as a service.

(12 Jan 2019, 1:25 pm)Jamie M wrote Metro is the express to Sunderland.

Actually Northern Trains is taking just 20 minutes.

(12 Jan 2019, 2:33 pm)S830OFT wrote Actually Northern Trains is taking just 20 minutes.

Also accepts pop cards and metro tickets so could be hard to compete, especially if they introduce new stops at popular stations like Fellgate, East Boldon and Seaburn

Metro is only 10 minutes slower than Northern between Sunderland and Newcastle, but is more frequent and gets people further into Newcastle City Centre for exactly the same price.

I see no need for Northern to add any extra stops when there is a much more convenient option available.

(12 Jan 2019, 3:02 pm)JM03 wrote Also accepts pop cards and metro tickets so could be hard to compete, especially if they introduce new stops at popular stations like Fellgate, East Boldon and Seaburn

The problem with Northern is they mainly use 2x Car Class 142s on the Durham Coast Line with very hard seats. If only LNER brought more services to Sunderland or Grand Central Trains extending to Newcastle.

(12 Jan 2019, 3:34 pm)S830OFT wrote The problem with Northern is they mainly use 2x Car Class 142s on the Durham Coast Line with very hard seats. If only LNER brought more services to Sunderland or Grand Central Trains extending to Newcastle.

LNER is going to add a double daily service soon. GC and Northern along with CC are all owned by arriva so it would make sense. GC are tight on time with about trains and still on a tight schedule so doubt that would work. Would make sense if CC went with a extension. Same if TPE could too.

What gne nexus services are getting re-tendered in march

(12 Jan 2019, 1:17 pm)JP6004 wrote The night bus version looks quite smart. But after 10 years of association and integration, would a complete overhaul of the brand have the desired effect of patronage?

I think the only way to successfully implement such a change would be to overhaul the route as well such as introducing an X56 to enable faster journey times between Newcastle and Sunderland or a limited stop between Concord and Sunderland during the day

I've read this a couple of times now and can see your point regarding branding.
There are many examples of established brands being replaced or refreshed and I can't think of many examples where that re-brand hasnt worked.

A corporate re-brand for an operator can have a positive effect.
A change to a brand which people have become blind to, may stimulate growth. 
The 56 has only had a couple of tweaks since the branding was launched and it could be argued that people are blind to the garish orange bus coming towards them, using a term that went out of fashion with flares.
I've no idea what could be used, but something that stimulates local pride (27 branding for example has the potential to do that) or something that says exactly what the service does (in a succinct manner) could work.
Along with a change of colour.

(13 Jan 2019, 10:56 am)Andreos1 wrote A corporate re-brand for an operator can have a positive effect.
A change to a brand which people have become blind to, may stimulate growth. 
The 56 has only had a couple of tweaks since the branding was launched and it could be argued that people are blind to the garish orange bus coming towards them, using a term that went out of fashion with flares.
I've no idea what could be used, but something that stimulates local pride (27 branding for example has the potential to do that) or something that says exactly what the service does (in a succinct manner) could work.
Along with a change of colour.

Is this a pull factor for public transport? At least from what I've heard from people, people mainly only identify with the colour of the bus.

Why not just paint the buses different colours per route with a bit of vinyl on locations served/etc and skip the idea of names.

(13 Jan 2019, 11:06 am)Jamie M wrote Is this a pull factor for public transport? At least from what I've heard from people, people mainly only identify with the colour of the bus.

Why not just paint the buses different colours per route with a bit of vinyl on locations served/etc and skip the idea of names.

Apparently so. 
It was something that was claimed would happen when the branding was initially introduced 13 years ago. 
I will try and find the link/article.

(13 Jan 2019, 11:17 am)Andreos1 wrote Apparently so. 
It was something that was claimed would happen when the branding was initially introduced 13 years ago. 
I will try and find the link/article.

I wonder what the results would be 13 years on of some research into the matter. How they thought people would react vs How people actually have reacted. I like the idea of some branding but I couldn't tell you why. Some have cool designs I guess, but I just feel it'd be boring if we all had the buses the same colour. Not sure of consequences of going down that line would mean though. Stagecoach don't seem to have any issues.

(13 Jan 2019, 11:06 am)Jamie M wrote Is this a pull factor for public transport? At least from what I've heard from people, people mainly only identify with the colour of the bus.

Why not just paint the buses different colours per route with a bit of vinyl on locations served/etc and skip the idea of names.

I'm sure I read somewhere after the new buses and Castles Express brand was launched, passenger numbers increased by 13% on the X21

(13 Jan 2019, 11:38 am)JP6004 wrote I'm sure I read somewhere after the new buses and Castles Express brand was launched, passenger numbers increased by 13% on the X21

How much of this was to do with there being new buses?

(13 Jan 2019, 11:28 am)Jamie M wrote I wonder what the results would be 13 years on of some research into the matter. How they thought people would react vs How people actually have reacted. I like the idea of some branding but I couldn't tell you why. Some have cool designs I guess, but I just feel it'd be boring if we all had the buses the same colour. Not sure of consequences of going down that line would mean though. Stagecoach don't seem to have any issues.

I wonder. 
GNE openly knicked a lot of ideas from Nottingham, who would have had figures to support their own branding excercises. 

(13 Jan 2019, 11:40 am)Jamie M wrote How much of this was to do with there being new buses?

Would the ordinary public have noticed the new colour scheme, new branding/imagery or new vehicles?

(13 Jan 2019, 11:44 am)Andreos1 wrote I wonder. 
GNE openly knicked a lot of ideas from Nottingham, who would have had figures to support their own branding excercises. 


Would the ordinary public have noticed the new colour scheme, new branding/imagery or new vehicles?

Could you apply a fresh lick of paint to an old bus and expect people to treat it as a new one? The pronto brand and the 13% increase with there being new vehicles/brand of similar colour suggests not to me. The V reg buses would have been over 12 years old when painted into blue.

(13 Jan 2019, 11:38 am)JP6004 wrote I'm sure I read somewhere after the new buses and Castles Express brand was launched, passenger numbers increased by 13% on the X21

It is worth remembering that the X21 was amended to serve Low Fell at the same time the new buses were introduced, so I wouldn't look too much into the headline figure.

(13 Jan 2019, 11:40 am)Jamie M wrote How much of this was to do with there being new buses?

Yes a vast improvement to the presidents prior. However I think the striking new brand peaked people's interest and would of been associated as being a reliable source of transport compared to the previous allocation; hence increased footfall. I don't think the same increase would of been observed if corporate livery vehicles had been used. The branding in itself is a marketing campaign for the route, the added bonus of new reliable vehicles with WiFi plug sockets tables etc would only enhance the quality of the new brand and get people onboard

(13 Jan 2019, 11:47 am)Jamie M wrote Could you apply a fresh lick of paint to an old bus and expect people to treat it as a new one? The pronto brand and the 13% increase with there being new vehicles/brand of similar colour suggests not to me. The V reg buses would have been over 12 years old when painted into blue.

I would suggest so.
Just look at the refurbs carried out on the Mercs. Passengers thought they were new vehicles.

(13 Jan 2019, 11:49 am)Adrian wrote It is worth remembering that the X21 was amended to serve Low Fell at the same time the new buses were introduced, so I wouldn't look too much into the headline figure.

I thought this a few months after the launch. I'm sure it used to go down A1 straight to Chester...