(13 Mar 2021, 12:28 am)Rapidsnap wrote I'm sure there's plenty of demand from Newcastle for people wanting to go to Whitby and Scarborough. TBH those places have a lot more to offer then the Coastal resorts around here at least.

And from past experience when Arriva ran the service it was pretty full. Caught it from Whitby to Boro once and was lucky to get a seat (on a Urban 90 Lowlander).

As for pensioner passes, if the bus departs Newcastle before 9am, they would have to pay anyway Monday to Friday.

On Weekends though, when it is more likely to be used, it will be full of zero fare paying passengers, whom on average will earn GNE significantly less in revenue than if they paid normal fares.
I recall when the X60 was withdrawn, Arriva were crystal clear that ENCTS killed the service. I really cant see what has changed in the meantime.

Fair play, trying something new, but even super fast links to Whitley Bay from Durham (example) or really fast link to Seahouses/Bamburgh from Newcastle etc somewhere like that would have provided more lucrative options. Its not painfully long, a few trips per day could operate to make worthwhile (i.e. spend a few hours at the coast rather than half a day).

The more I view it, the more it appears to be a bite at Arriva, similar to the 21 extension to Brandon. Stick a bus on (funded by the tax payer) and see what happens.

(13 Mar 2021, 5:08 pm)RobinHood wrote On Weekends though, when it is more likely to be used, it will be full of zero fare paying passengers, whom on average will earn GNE significantly less in revenue than if they paid normal fares.
I recall when the X60 was withdrawn, Arriva were crystal clear that ENCTS killed the service. I really cant see what has changed in the meantime.

Fair play, trying something new, but even super fast links to Whitley Bay from Durham (example) or really fast link to Seahouses/Bamburgh from Newcastle etc somewhere like that would have provided more lucrative options. Its not painfully long, a few trips per day could operate to make worthwhile (i.e. spend a few hours at the coast rather than half a day).

The more I view it, the more it appears to be a bite at Arriva, similar to the 21 extension to Brandon. Stick a bus on (funded by the tax payer) and see what happens.

If it was a bite at Arriva, they’d be running a half hourly frequency service from Scarborough to Middlesbrough using East Yorkshire’s buses, connecting to the established X9 and X10 services at Middlesbrough. Clearly that’s not the case.


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In Martijn's live update tonight, he has confirmed the X11 will be ran by 6377 - taking around 3 hours from Newcastle to Scarborough with a run between Whitby and Scarborough during the day.

https://www.facebook.com/100009920923911...3024762714 - 11:10

(13 Mar 2021, 5:08 pm)RobinHood wrote On Weekends though, when it is more likely to be used, it will be full of zero fare paying passengers, whom on average will earn GNE significantly less in revenue than if they paid normal fares.
I recall when the X60 was withdrawn, Arriva were crystal clear that ENCTS killed the service. I really cant see what has changed in the meantime.

Fair play, trying something new, but even super fast links to Whitley Bay from Durham (example) or really fast link to Seahouses/Bamburgh from Newcastle etc somewhere like that would have provided more lucrative options. Its not painfully long, a few trips per day could operate to make worthwhile (i.e. spend a few hours at the coast rather than half a day).

The more I view it, the more it appears to be a bite at Arriva, similar to the 21 extension to Brandon. Stick a bus on (funded by the tax payer) and see what happens.

Arriva tried this a few years ago on the X16, running fast from Newcastle and Morpeth to Alnwick before switching to the X18 route to Belford.

(13 Mar 2021, 5:08 pm)RobinHood wrote On Weekends though, when it is more likely to be used, it will be full of zero fare paying passengers, whom on average will earn GNE significantly less in revenue than if they paid normal fares.
I recall when the X60 was withdrawn, Arriva were crystal clear that ENCTS killed the service. I really cant see what has changed in the meantime.

Fair play, trying something new, but even super fast links to Whitley Bay from Durham (example) or really fast link to Seahouses/Bamburgh from Newcastle etc somewhere like that would have provided more lucrative options. Its not painfully long, a few trips per day could operate to make worthwhile (i.e. spend a few hours at the coast rather than half a day).

The more I view it, the more it appears to be a bite at Arriva, similar to the 21 extension to Brandon. Stick a bus on (funded by the tax payer) and see what happens.

I agree that a fast link to the Northumberland Coastal towns may be more lucrative, but I think on the other hand, running to Scarborough provides some operational security (in the case of a bus developing a fault), with the East Yorkshire depot there. 

I think it has to be taken as an operator trying to do things to encourage people back onto buses. The more this is done the better, but they seem to be the only one doing it in the North East at the moment. I'm an Arriva customer, so I have a vested interest, but I have not heard a peep out of them lately.

Without going off topic too much, I don't think the 21 extension to Brandon was a dig at Arriva. Everything else along that route terminates at Durham Bus Station, like most Arriva services do, so I don't think its comparable to the X11/X93. Hopefully this provides customers along that section with a bit more choice, if travelling to other parts of Durham or even all the way to Newcastle.

Questions it when will it leave Newcastle and when will it leave Scarborough

(13 Mar 2021, 11:24 pm)Adrian wrote I agree that a fast link to the Northumberland Coastal towns may be more lucrative, but I think on the other hand, running to Scarborough provides some operational security (in the case of a bus developing a fault), with the East Yorkshire depot there. 

I think it has to be taken as an operator trying to do things to encourage people back onto buses. The more this is done the better, but they seem to be the only one doing it in the North East at the moment. I'm an Arriva customer, so I have a vested interest, but I have not heard a peep out of them lately.

Without going off topic too much, I don't think the 21 extension to Brandon was a dig at Arriva. Everything else along that route terminates at Durham Bus Station, like most Arriva services do, so I don't think its comparable to the X11/X93. Hopefully this provides customers along that section with a bit more choice, if travelling to other parts of Durham or even all the way to Newcastle.

How would a breakdown or driver sickness work for the Whitby / Scarborough end of the X11?

---

Also, what would stand in for 6377 if it wasn't available? A B9TL?

I can't believe so many people are already complaining about this service.

Those familiar with me know that I like to sing a song or two whilst travelling on public transport and,personally, I can't wait to lead my fellow patrons in a hearty rendition of Cliff Richard's "Summer Holiday' whilst blasting down the A19 or A171 on the way to sunny Scarborough.

I am also looking forward, after a year of misery for us all, to meeting up with my friend, Leyland, and hopefully making the most of our concessionary passes (we're both pensioners now) on this great journey.

Good on you, Go North East.

An express service to Northumberland coastal towns won't work, there isn't a much demand for a service to them places as the likes of Bamburgh and Seahouses don't have the same draw for people compared to Whitby and Scarborough.

As for drivers sicknesses / breakdowns, I'm sure it be covered from the Scarborough end by EYMS with no doubt a replacement vehicle from GNE meeting it halfway.

So I take it when 6377 arrives at Scarborough it will do a short return trip to Whitby and back before heading back to Newcastle


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(14 Mar 2021, 11:01 am)cbma06 wrote So I take it when 6377 arrives at Scarborough it will do a short return trip to Whitby and back before heading back to Newcastle


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Dont think there are any short journeys as more than likely when the bus arrives into Scarborough the driver will be due his rest period

MG said that there would be a Scarborough-Whitby return journey between the full runs in the facebook video Michael posted the link to yesterday a few posts upthread. Not long after the 9:30 mark if you want a timestamp.

(14 Mar 2021, 11:25 am)ifm001 wrote Dont think there are any short journeys as more than likely when the bus arrives into Scarborough the driver will be due his rest period

Maybe I picked it up wrong, but I'm fairly sure that MG said during his Facebook Live that it would do a short to Whitby between the southbound and northbound journey

Could they not find a 2nd hand astromega or something to use on the X11 seeing as its longer than the 2 gne coach services so in theory Is more than entitled to a coach or would a coach like an astromega be too large?

(14 Mar 2021, 11:48 am)GNE6312 wrote Could they not find a 2nd hand astromega or something to use on the X11 seeing as its longer than the 2 gne coach services so in theory Is more than entitled to a coach or would a coach like an astromega be too large?

Navigating whitby bus station would be fun

(14 Mar 2021, 7:28 am)Clifton Hignett III wrote I can't believe so many people are already complaining about this service.

Those familiar with me know that I like to sing a song or two whilst travelling on public transport and,personally, I can't wait to lead my fellow patrons in a hearty rendition of Cliff Richard's "Summer Holiday' whilst blasting down the A19 or A171 on the way to sunny Scarborough.

I am also looking forward, after a year of misery for us all, to meeting up with my friend, Leyland, and hopefully making the most of our concessionary passes (we're both pensioners now) on this great journey.

Good on you, Go North East.

Any word on Srriva or Fyacbuk Polis? Good to see you make an appearance on the forum Clifton.

(13 Mar 2021, 11:24 pm)Adrian wrote I agree that a fast link to the Northumberland Coastal towns may be more lucrative, but I think on the other hand, running to Scarborough provides some operational security (in the case of a bus developing a fault), with the East Yorkshire depot there. 

I think it has to be taken as an operator trying to do things to encourage people back onto buses. The more this is done the better, but they seem to be the only one doing it in the North East at the moment. I'm an Arriva customer, so I have a vested interest, but I have not heard a peep out of them lately.

Without going off topic too much, I don't think the 21 extension to Brandon was a dig at Arriva. Everything else along that route terminates at Durham Bus Station, like most Arriva services do, so I don't think its comparable to the X11/X93. Hopefully this provides customers along that section with a bit more choice, if travelling to other parts of Durham or even all the way to Newcastle.

I know this thread isn't about the 21 extension to Brandon but seeing as you mention it, what's actually happening with that? Is it going to be done at some point or not? I seen it appear as a vosa registration in January and heard nothing since.

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(14 Mar 2021, 12:16 pm)big mac wrote I know this thread isn't about the 21 extension to Brandon but seeing as you mention it, what's actually happening with that?  Is it going to be done at some point or not? I seen it appear as a vosa registration in January and heard nothing since.

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MG said it as on hold for the minute, I'd imagine we'll see more of it once things open back up

(14 Mar 2021, 11:37 am)S813 FVK wrote MG said that there would be a Scarborough-Whitby return journey between the full runs in the facebook video Michael posted the link to yesterday a few posts upthread. Not long after the 9:30 mark if you want a timestamp.

Ah. I seen the post about his Facebook video but I didn't view it.   Hands up my error this one.

(14 Mar 2021, 11:25 am)ifm001 wrote Dont think there are any short journeys as more than likely when the bus arrives into Scarborough the driver will be due his rest period

I’d imagine it will have a break in Scarborough after arrival then do a return to Whitby then break before returning to Newcastle. Max driving time is 4h30 which if we expect the journey to Scarborough to be ~3 hours will be pushing it if any delays occur to fit Scarboro-Whitby in without a break in Scarbs.


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(14 Mar 2021, 12:15 pm)Andreos1 wrote Any word on Srriva or Fyacbuk Polis? Good to see you make an appearance on the forum Clifton.

Alas, Fyacbuk has fallen on hard-times and is no longer an agent of law enforcement. There was a scandal involving him a few years back which you may have read about in the papers. Coincidentally, it involved a Srriva vehicle as well as a turnip and an undisclosed farm animal whilst on duty investigating the theft of farm machinery. He claimed innocence of the affair but, alas, CIB board concluded otherwise.

I tried to help him by making him my head-of-security when embarking upon my retirement tour in Las Vegas but he went missing after becoming friendly with some shady, mafia-esque gentlemen at the casino where I was performing. I hope he's alright and, more importantly, alive.

(14 Mar 2021, 11:48 am)GNE6312 wrote Could they not find a 2nd hand astromega or something to use on the X11 seeing as its longer than the 2 gne coach services so in theory Is more than entitled to a coach or would a coach like an astromega be too large?

Even if it could do the route, Whitby bus station (as JP6004 pointed out) and Eldon Square say hello, you've got to look at it financially. 

You'd need to find one in decent condition mechanically and internally, I can't imagine GNE would want the headache of it breaking down before it reached Whitby on its first day, or it having a shoddy interior. Then you need to look at operational costs. You'd need to do type training on it, you'd need to ensure engineering were up to speed with it, you'd need to find work for it from September(?) to March. Then you face the issue of what happens when something does go wrong, it would be non standard in the fleet so you likely won't have any parts lying around that are suitable to fix it - so that's a tow job from Scarborough. 

Whereas with 6377, it's a vehicle already in the fleet. It has an interior that is up to spec, it won't need a refurb or repaint. Mechanically, for this summer at least, it should be absolutely fine. You have normal routes you can use it on September to March, you have drivers already type trained, you have parts available in engineering so if something goes wrong there's a higher probability of being able to fix it on location. 

This route needs, realistically, to be operated as low-cost as GNE feel comfortable with. It's a once a day seasonal route, if you start increasing initial outlay on Astromegas (which don't actually seat too many more than 6377, particularly the smaller variants) then you'll take the route from something which can potentially make a decent little profit to something which loses thousands. Remember that the only real data GNE will have to go on with this is how the ANE X60 did, and that was cut because it was essentially a pensioner shuttle to Scarborough. There are ways around that (primarily timing the southbound journey before passes kick in) which GNE will likely explore, but the entire route is a rare bit of ambition in the NE network, so for this year at least it would be beyond silly to invest more than is needed.

(14 Mar 2021, 1:17 pm)Clifton Hignett III wrote Alas, Fyacbuk has fallen on hard-times and is no longer an agent of law enforcement. There was a scandal involving him a few years back which you may have read about in the papers. Coincidentally, it involved a Srriva vehicle as well as a turnip and an undisclosed farm animal whilst on duty investigating the theft of farm machinery. He claimed innocence of the affair but, alas, CIB board concluded otherwise.

I tried to help him by making him my head-of-security when embarking upon my retirement tour in Las Vegas but he went missing after becoming friendly with some shady, mafia-esque gentlemen at the casino where I was performing. I hope he's alright and, more importantly, alive.

How the mighty have fallen. Long gone are the days that you, fyacbuk, Leyland, Percy Main and our very own NEBDan trolled the GNE fb page.

I'd not heard anything about the turnip incident. Sounds quite the adventure!

Getting back to the main point of the post, you make some interesting points about the X11 in your original comment.
Assuming you're putting on a show at The Grand and you have an overnighter, you will be OK to get back using your CAT pass the next evening. 
However, your roadies will presumably have to buy a single in each direction. Quite an expensive trip and not one I personally would want to make, after a few hairs of the dog whilst watching the clock all day for the trip back.

I'm not too sure if there's been any comments about the pricing of the tickets, but I'd hope they were set up for more than day-trippers once the daily service kicks in over the summer.

So what would the purpose of the Scarborough to Whitby shorts during the day be?
Would it be a 'shuttle service' that's included in the ticket price for those that want to go up to Whitby, or will it be a separate ticket to pick up some extra passengers

(14 Mar 2021, 1:42 pm)streetdeckfan wrote So what would the purpose of the Scarborough to Whitby shorts during the day be?
Would it be a 'shuttle service' that's included in the ticket price for those that want to go up to Whitby, or will it be a separate ticket to pick up some extra passengers

Something for the bus/driver to do in the hope of picking up some extra pennies to put towards the cost of running it I expect. Scarborough to Whitby is after all the busier half of the X93 - not that you’d think it seeing the loads out of Mbro on a morning!

In regards to getting other vehicles in to operate it... simply not going to happen. Services like this is only going to be viable by utilising existing capacity in the fleet in quiet times, ie school holidays. It might be a flop, and only last one summer. Fair enough you might make a loss, but it’s not going to be huge.

Imagine if you’d bought a specific vehicle for it that you then need to find above for or sell on... that’s a huge cost put towards your service that you don’t need!


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(14 Mar 2021, 1:40 pm)Andreos1 wrote How the mighty have fallen. Long gone are the days that you, fyacbuk, Leyland, Percy Main and our very own NEBDan trolled the GNE fb page.

I'd not heard anything about the turnip incident. Sounds quite the adventure!

Getting back to the main point of the post, you make some interesting points about the X11 in your original comment.
Assuming you're putting on a show at The Grand and you have an overnighter, you will be OK to get back using your CAT pass the next evening. 
However, your roadies will presumably have to buy a single in each direction. Quite an expensive trip and not one I personally would want to make, after a few hairs on the dog whilst watching the clock all day for the trip back.

I'm not too sure if there's been any comments about the pricing of the tickets, but I'd hope they were set up for more than day-trippers once the daily service kicks in over the summer.

You raise some very valid points here and I think I've came up with an interesting business opportunity for myself, my roadies, and Go North East.

As we've learned, there will be a short X11 service operating from Scarborough to Whitby and back again. As a world-renowned artist, I'm willing to perform on this service for a cut-price fee in order to drum up punters and, in return, my roadies can travel on the full service for free.

Can't say any fairer than that!

(14 Mar 2021, 1:42 pm)streetdeckfan wrote So what would the purpose of the Scarborough to Whitby shorts during the day be?
Would it be a 'shuttle service' that's included in the ticket price for those that want to go up to Whitby, or will it be a separate ticket to pick up some extra passengers

(14 Mar 2021, 1:47 pm)tyresmoke wrote Something for the bus/driver to do in the hope of picking up some extra pennies to put towards the cost of running it I expect. Scarborough to Whitby is after all the busier half of the X93 - not that you’d think it seeing the loads out of Mbro on a morning!

The purpose of the short journey is to allow passengers to visit both Whitby and Scarborough in the same day as part of their day trip - they can stop off at Whitby in the morning on the southbound journey, then go to Scarborough on the return trip on the short journey, spending a few hours in both places (or vice versa). Just gives day-trippers the option, rather than them needing to choose between the two. I wouldn't expect it to pick up many extra passengers as the X93 is such an established service, running to a much more frequent timetable.

(14 Mar 2021, 4:48 pm)Dan wrote The purpose of the short journey is to allow passengers to visit both Whitby and Scarborough in the same day as part of their day trip - they can stop off at Whitby in the morning on the southbound journey, then go to Scarborough on the return trip on the short journey, spending a few hours in both places (or vice versa). Just gives day-trippers the option, rather than them needing to choose between the two. I wouldn't expect it to pick up many extra passengers as the X93 is such an established service, running to a much more frequent timetable.

That's what I thought, will it just be the one short journey to Whitby?
I'm also guessing you can't mention whether that would be included in the ticket price just yet?

(14 Mar 2021, 4:52 pm)streetdeckfan wrote That's what I thought, will it just be the one short journey to Whitby?
I'm also guessing you can't mention whether that would be included in the ticket price just yet?

Unless they're taking down two drivers or planning the return for midnight, I can't see how you fit in any more than 1 trip given driver hours.

(14 Mar 2021, 11:59 pm)mb134 wrote Unless they're taking down two drivers or planning the return for midnight, I can't see how you fit in any more than 1 trip given driver hours.

It would technically be possible for the Go North Driver to have their break and a Scarborough and District/ EYMS driver to do a few hours on the shorts before the Go North east driver takes over again for the journey back to Newcastle.  Maybe if it’s successful EYMS might make the Scarborough - Whitby shorts a permanent service.