(21 Jun 2021, 5:14 pm)Andreos1 wrote Surely it's just as important for passengers boarding 60mins down the road as it is for those boarding at Gateshead.
Someone getting on the bus at Easington Lane, but getting off in Newcastle needs to know where the bus will drop them off, just as much as those boarding at Gateshead and travelling for 2 stops.

Someone boarding in West Auckland needs to know where that X21 is going to drop them off, just as someone boarding for the last leg from Gateshead does.

The same applies for those people getting on the 2 on Chester Road and wondering where in Washington it will take them.
Good job it displays The Galleries for those people in Penshaw. Cos I would hazard a guess they were just as important as the ones getting on half a dozen stops prior. Not more important.

Someone in Middlesbrough may decide on using the train as its easier to determine where abouts they get off, than it is on the X9/10.

Genuinely have my mind blown at the perceived point, that the blind for passengers making a short journey is more important than for those making longer journeys and could be less familiar with that terminating point

What does ‘Eldon Square’ mean to someone in West Auckland?


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(21 Jun 2021, 5:44 pm)Andreos1 wrote You've got LA's closing roads, you've got route changes, some buses not dropping off/setting off as they were 18months ago and you've got drivers who don't want to have to chat to passengers for obvious reasons... 
Yet someone thinks it's better for punters travelling 2 stops to have a clearer picture of where they need to get off, than it does someone travelling 60mins.

Regardless of any other barriers that exist for some passengers, such as the ones you mention, difficulties reading timetables or having the nerve to speak to a driver to clarify.

Especially when GNE still don't clearly tell passengers that some services still don't drop off at Eldon Square.

Take the X30 for instance, the website and app still say it terminates at Eldon Square even though they haven't for well over a year now!

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(21 Jun 2021, 6:27 pm)Dan wrote What does ‘Eldon Square’ mean to someone in West Auckland?


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It means the destination of the bus.

Just because we're 30 miles away doesn't mean we don't want to know where in Newcastle the bus goes!

(21 Jun 2021, 6:27 pm)Dan wrote What does ‘Eldon Square’ mean to someone in West Auckland?


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Probably that shopping centre in the middle of the town.
If it had Eldon Square Bus Station, then quite a bit I'd imagine.

(21 Jun 2021, 6:27 pm)Dan wrote What does ‘Eldon Square’ mean to someone in West Auckland?

How feasible would it be to add an additional screen into the 'via' point rotation to specify the exact point in the city? 

It used to be a feature when the via points scrolled and I'm sure would satisfy the arguments being made without detracting from 'Newcastle' as being the terminus.

(21 Jun 2021, 6:28 pm)streetdeckfan wrote Especially when GNE still don't clearly tell passengers that some services still don't drop off at Eldon Square.

Take the X30 for instance, the website and app still say it terminates at Eldon Square even though they haven't for well over a year now! 

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It means the destination of the bus.

Just because we're 30 miles away doesn't mean we don't want to know where in Newcastle the bus goes!

But does the display show it for those wanting to get on at that stop in the middle of the Redheugh Bridge?
They're the important passengers

(21 Jun 2021, 6:28 pm)streetdeckfan wrote Especially when GNE still don't clearly tell passengers that some services still don't drop off at Eldon Square.

Take the X30 for instance, the website and app still say it terminates at Eldon Square even though they haven't for well over a year now!

The app, website and destination display is correct.

They all still terminate at Eldon Square for those that need to travel to Eldon Square (i.e a passenger with limited accessibility needs who would struggle to walk from The Gate to Eldon Square).

It wouldn’t be for a driver to judge nor comment on that - so if the passenger is that way inclined, they’re able to wait on the bus at The Gate for the entire duration of the layover time to travel to Eldon Square. Almost all able-bodied passengers choose not to.


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(21 Jun 2021, 6:34 pm)S813 FVK wrote How feasible would it be to add an additional screen into the 'via' point rotation to specify the exact point in the city? 

It used to be a feature when the via points scrolled and I'm sure would satisfy the arguments being made without detracting from 'Newcastle' as being the terminus.

Yes, in theory that is possible although on a cycle with several pages of via points, it would rarely be seen.

I think it’s bewildering that Andreos1 would prefer to detract from Newcastle as being the main terminus at the start of the route, but each to their own.

I’m personally glad Go North East is making use of the technology to change the destination automatically to better serve those in Gateshead Interchange making short hop journeys into the city centre, and want to know which bus is the best one for them to use given they have a choice of many different routes. Passengers in Easington Lane, Bishop Auckland, Sunderland or Middlesbrough only have one Go North East service, so it doesn’t matter where in Newcastle the bus goes at that point, they’re going to use that bus regardless.


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(21 Jun 2021, 6:43 pm)Dan wrote The app, website and destination display is correct.

They all still terminate at Eldon Square for those that need to travel to Eldon Square (i.e a passenger with limited accessibility needs who would struggle to walk from The Gate to Eldon Square).

It wouldn’t be for a driver to judge nor comment on that - so if the passenger is that way inclined, they’re able to wait on the bus at The Gate for the entire duration of the layover time to travel to Eldon Square. Almost all able-bodied passengers choose not to.


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I was told by two drivers that they weren't allowed to drop passengers off in Eldon Square

(21 Jun 2021, 5:14 pm)Andreos1 wrote Surely it's just as important for passengers boarding 60mins down the road as it is for those boarding at Gateshead.
Someone getting on the bus at Easington Lane, but getting off in Newcastle needs to know where the bus will drop them off, just as much as those boarding at Gateshead and travelling for 2 stops.

Someone boarding in West Auckland needs to know where that X21 is going to drop them off, just as someone boarding for the last leg from Gateshead does.

The same applies for those people getting on the 2 on Chester Road and wondering where in Washington it will take them.
Good job it displays The Galleries for those people in Penshaw. Cos I would hazard a guess they were just as important as the ones getting on half a dozen stops prior. Not more important.

Someone in Middlesbrough may decide on using the train as its easier to determine where abouts they get off, than it is on the X9/10.

Genuinely have my mind blown at the perceived point, that the blind for passengers making a short journey is more important than for those making longer journeys and could be less familiar with that terminating point

I think the answer here is that you can only put so much information on the front of the bus.

As Dan says, those using buses from further afield don't have the same choice as those boarding from Gateshead Interchange, and I largely agree with that. You'll never please everyone in Hetton for example, for where the X1 stops in town. Those who have a real problem with it can alight at Gateshead, and then choose one of the buses every couple of minutes, to a variety of different locations in town. 

As for the actual destination point, this is already clearly available in a range of places: bus stop liners, timetable booklets, GNE/Nexus websites, GNE Smartphone app and Bustimes.  You can see in this example, the liner from Wrekenton shows numerous Newcastle-terminating services, but clearly showing which part of the town they terminate: https://liners.nexus.org.uk/22028.pdf

(21 Jun 2021, 6:49 pm)streetdeckfan wrote I was told by two drivers that they weren't allowed to drop passengers off in Eldon Square

Team briefings at the time were clear, that any passengers that needed to travel to Eldon Square Bus Station could do so, but they’d need to be dropped off at Prudhoe Place or on the drop off stand - not the pick up stand - to avoid passengers crossing in the bus station.

My personal view is that it really ought to be reviewed with normal arrangements returning anyway - if it’s OK for passengers in Durham, Sunderland, The Galleries, Concord etc to cross as passengers alight next to those waiting to board, there’s not a great deal of difference for Haymarket and Eldon Square.


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(21 Jun 2021, 6:43 pm)Dan wrote The app, website and destination display is correct.

They all still terminate at Eldon Square for those that need to travel to Eldon Square (i.e a passenger with limited accessibility needs who would struggle to walk from The Gate to Eldon Square). 

It wouldn’t be for a driver to judge nor comment on that - so if the passenger is that way inclined, they’re able to wait on the bus at The Gate for the entire duration of the layover time to travel to Eldon Square. Almost all able-bodied passengers choose not to.


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Where is that information publicly available?

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(21 Jun 2021, 6:50 pm)Adrian wrote I think the answer here is that you can only put so much information on the front of the bus.

As Dan says, those using buses from further afield don't have the same choice as those boarding from Gateshead Interchange, and I largely agree with that. You'll never please everyone in Hetton for example, for where the X1 stops in town. Those who have a real problem with it can alight at Gateshead, and then choose one of the buses every couple of minutes, to a variety of different locations in town. 

As for the actual destination point, this is already clearly available in a range of places: bus stop liners, timetable booklets, GNE/Nexus websites, GNE Smartphone app and Bustimes.  You can see in this example, the liner from Wrekenton shows numerous Newcastle-terminating services, but clearly showing which part of the town they terminate: https://liners.nexus.org.uk/22028.pdf 

Assuming (and I'm not being flippant here), that the passenger can read/see/access that information - why go to the bother of displaying the terminating destination for those passengers boarding at Gateshead?
The exact same information available at Wrekenton, is available for those passengers wishing to board at Gateshead.

There's the whole point made above of detracting Newcastle as the destination. May as well go the whole hog and have vehicles display Newcastle for the entirity so it doesn't detract for those last couple of stops.

As for the 2 showing Washington for the majority of the route and assuming passengers can access all the information you mention, why does it need to change its display as it gets beyond the confines of Sunderland and detract from Washington? That same information available for passengers boarding at Chester Road is available to the passengers boarding at the Prospect or Barnwell Shops.

(21 Jun 2021, 6:48 pm)Dan wrote Yes, in theory that is possible although on a cycle with several pages of via points, it would rarely be seen.

I think it’s bewildering that Andreos1 would prefer to detract from Newcastle as being the main terminus at the start of the route, but each to their own.

Given that these displays can be programmed to display allsorts now, would it be possible to simply display "Newcastle - Eldon Square" with the "Eldon Square" part in a smaller font to the side/below. Something along the lines of the two pics posted below - folk would know in both instances that it's going to Newbiggin, but can see for the length of the route that it's terminating at either Moor Estate or Cresswell Arms (thinking more on dual depth displays, such as those in the StreetDecks, so the via points can still be shown below).


Arriva North East: 7413 / P413 CCU by Matt D Williamson, on Flickr
7413 (P413CCU) Ashington X21 by Carlisle Bus Group, on Flickr

(21 Jun 2021, 8:25 pm)mb134 wrote Given that these displays can be programmed to display allsorts now, would it be possible to simply display "Newcastle - Eldon Square" with the "Eldon Square" part in a smaller font to the side/below. Something along the lines of the two pics posted below - folk would know in both instances that it's going to Newbiggin, but can see for the length of the route that it's terminating at either Moor Estate or Cresswell Arms (thinking more on dual depth displays, such as those in the StreetDecks, so the via points can still be shown below).


Arriva North East: 7413 / P413 CCU by Matt D Williamson, on Flickr
7413 (P413CCU) Ashington X21 by Carlisle Bus Group, on Flickr

Probably be a bit too much information overload and the LED Screens don't display smaller text too well imo.

Wish the better LED screens would become more popular as they'd be perfect for stuff like that but they're supposedly rather expensive - https://www.flickr.com/photos/snakeydave/29960464898. That's an example of a London bus using one and it's as clear as the old roller blinds (which I prefer personally). Could easily do Newcastle then with the Eldon Square to the right on those ones tbh in smaller maybe in caps with space underneath for via points etc aswell if needed.

(21 Jun 2021, 8:44 pm)Storx wrote Probably be a bit too much information overload and the LED Screens don't display smaller text too well imo.

Wish the better LED screens would become more popular as they'd be perfect for stuff like that but they're supposedly rather expensive - https://www.flickr.com/photos/snakeydave/29960464898. That's an example of a London bus using one and it's as clear as the old roller blinds (which I prefer personally). Could easily do Newcastle then with the Eldon Square to the right on those ones tbh in smaller maybe in caps with space underneath for via points etc aswell if needed.

I've never understood why we're still stuck with such low resolution blinds.

It's probably down to the likes of Hanover and Mobitec wanting to maximise profits! Less LEDs means more profit

(21 Jun 2021, 8:50 pm)streetdeckfan wrote I've never understood why we're still stuck with such low resolution blinds.

It's probably down to the likes of Hanover and Mobitec wanting to maximise profits! Less LEDs means more profit

Haven't all new buses had the white HD displays since first being ordered with the peterlee solos

With the exception of the yutongs

(21 Jun 2021, 8:57 pm)JP6004 wrote Haven't all new buses had the white HD displays since first being ordered with the peterlee solos

With the exception of the yutongs

I mean, calling them 'HD' is a bit disingenuous! They're still low res!

My watch has over 15x more pixels in those displays, and it's a 1.5" screen!

(21 Jun 2021, 8:50 pm)streetdeckfan wrote I've never understood why we're still stuck with such low resolution blinds.

It's probably down to the likes of Hanover and Mobitec wanting to maximise profits! Less LEDs means more profit

They cost an absolute bomb, that London bus I linked there is using an LED blind but supposedly it's cheaper in London to buy paper blinds and replace them through their lifetime than the HD screen.

https://i.ibb.co/F4X3kfZ/kim-rennie-25.jpg - That's another photo of the LED screens, think they look good personally and hope they go more mainstream soon.

(21 Jun 2021, 8:57 pm)JP6004 wrote Haven't all new buses had the white HD displays since first being ordered with the peterlee solos

With the exception of the yutongs

Nah, no-one has them bar a very few in London.

http://www.transportengineer.org.uk/arti..._popup.jpg
https://www.flickr.com/photos/148377450@...059828191/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/166165416@N06/50073404957

That's what the HD Displays look like, crystal clear pretty much and look like old blinds rather than all pixelated like the current ones.

(21 Jun 2021, 9:08 pm)Storx wrote They cost an absolute bomb, that London bus I linked there is using an LED blind but supposedly it's cheaper in London to buy paper blinds and replace them through their lifetime than the HD screen.

https://i.ibb.co/F4X3kfZ/kim-rennie-25.jpg - That's another photo of the LED screens, think they look good personally and hope they go more mainstream soon.


Nah, no-one has them bar a very few in London.

http://www.transportengineer.org.uk/arti..._popup.jpg
https://www.flickr.com/photos/148377450@...059828191/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/166165416@N06/50073404957

That's what the HD Displays look like, crystal clear pretty much and look like old blinds rather than all pixelated like the current ones.

I get ya, I know there was something about them solos have more LEDs for clearer display. Yea they deffo not HD

(21 Jun 2021, 7:13 pm)Andreos1 wrote Assuming (and I'm not being flippant here), that the passenger can read/see/access that information - why go to the bother of displaying the terminating destination for those passengers boarding at Gateshead?
The exact same information available at Wrekenton, is available for those passengers wishing to board at Gateshead.

There's the whole point made above of detracting Newcastle as the destination. May as well go the whole hog and have vehicles display Newcastle for the entirity so it doesn't detract for those last couple of stops.

As for the 2 showing Washington for the majority of the route and assuming passengers can access all the information you mention, why does it need to change its display as it gets beyond the confines of Sunderland and detract from Washington? That same information available for passengers boarding at Chester Road is available to the passengers boarding at the Prospect or Barnwell Shops.

I can't think of another place that compares to Gateshead Interchange for buses into one place though? There's literally a bus to Newcastle every couple of minutes, so whilst the timetable on stand N also gives the information, it acts as a quick reference to passengers trying to spot the correct bus out of the sheer amount that pass through. 

Not sure in regards to the 2/2A, but I would assume that passenger data shows that the service essentially acts as two? Similar to how the old 43/44 provided local journeys for 3 or 4 sections of the route, with no one in their right mind wanting to travel on it the whole way between Durham and the Metrocentre/Newcastle. Although the 43/44 displayed Newcastle as the terminus, I'd question what value that offered to passengers, and it probably had something to do with it being split in recent years!

(21 Jun 2021, 9:08 pm)Storx wrote They cost an absolute bomb, that London bus I linked there is using an LED blind but supposedly it's cheaper in London to buy paper blinds and replace them through their lifetime than the HD screen.

https://i.ibb.co/F4X3kfZ/kim-rennie-25.jpg - That's another photo of the LED screens, think they look good personally and hope they go more mainstream soon.


Nah, no-one has them bar a very few in London.

http://www.transportengineer.org.uk/arti..._popup.jpg
https://www.flickr.com/photos/148377450@...059828191/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/166165416@N06/50073404957

That's what the HD Displays look like, crystal clear pretty much and look like old blinds rather than all pixelated like the current ones.

The only reason tehy cost an 'absolute bomb' is because there's basically a duopoly on destination blinds so they can essentially charge what they want.

The technology behind them is actually quite basic and been around for years

(21 Jun 2021, 7:13 pm)Andreos1 wrote Where is that information publicly available?

No idea - I've never looked, as I've got no need to.

Presumably there will be something online, if not on the Go North East and Stagecoach websites, certainly the Nexus one (who imposed the change in rules to dropping off orrangements)?

(22 Jun 2021, 6:14 am)Dan wrote No idea - I've never looked, as I've got no need to.

Presumably there will be something online, if not on the Go North East and Stagecoach websites, certainly the Nexus one (who imposed the change in rules to dropping off orrangements)?

After a bit of digging, the Nexus website states this from an article in June 2020:

"People with restricted mobility will be able to stay on buses into Haymarket if they would have difficulty at alternative stops, but all other passengers will be asked to alight at Barras Bridge (buses from Great North Road) or St Mary’s Place (buses from Coast Road)

Neighbouring Eldon Square Bus Station has also been modified to make it more covid-secure.  Newcastle City Council has created extra drop-off bays immediately outside the concourse building, so that buses can always pull onto their stands empty to pick up boarding passengers."

Pretty poor from all bus operators and Nexus when it comes to providing such information - especially for those with disabilities.

(22 Jun 2021, 6:14 am)Dan wrote No idea - I've never looked, as I've got no need to.

Presumably there will be something online, if not on the Go North East and Stagecoach websites, certainly the Nexus one (who imposed the change in rules to dropping off orrangements)?

Regardless of whoever imposed changes, I'd have thought operators would have used their own initiative (or blinds) and kept their own passengers informed.
Ownership and responsibility goes a long way in keeping passengers happy.
I'm not sure finger pointing and shoulder shrugging does.

(22 Jun 2021, 7:39 am)Andreos1 wrote Regardless of whoever imposed changes, I'd have thought operators would have used their own initiative (or blinds) and kept their own passengers informed.
Ownership and responsibility goes a long way in keeping passengers happy.
I'm not sure finger pointing and shoulder shrugging does.

Where’s the finger pointing and shoulder shrugging?


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First time I’d noticed the two different ‘Come on England’ displays this morning flicking in and out on Not In Service screens.

One for orange screens with a coloured square of LEDs for the number to the right: Come on England in orange, then the white and red flag on the coloured square.

One for all white screens: Come on England across the full width of the screen with a full width/full height white ‘+’ to form the flag behind the text.