Surprised that there was never a general disclaimer on timetables for Xlines services anyway to state non spec buses may be used on occasion.

(05 Sep 2021, 5:04 pm)DeltaMan wrote Surprised that there was never a general disclaimer on timetables for Xlines services anyway to state non spec buses may be used on occasion.

Any disclaimer may as well state something along the lines of "The information printed in this timetable may, on occasion, not be true. Sorry for any inconvenience caused". I think that covers just about everything.

(05 Sep 2021, 4:10 pm)Dan wrote Riverside operated the X30 long before it was upgraded to X-lines.

It was always said when Go North East diverted some of its StreetDecks to Oxford Bus Company that a new interworking pattern was planned to make use of the vehicles that remained at Go North East. These new interworking patterns were always going to see the evening X30 become operated by Consett (I think this has been said before too), but we have been in a global pandemic for the past year and a half which has prevented these schedule changes from taking place (due to the conditions of the government support package).

Whilst the plan has actually since evolved over the past 18 months, following local authority feedback, seeing the creation of services like the 47/47A and the curtailment of the X30 at Stanley, the schedule changes have been brought in at the earliest opportunity (and with that, the evening operation of the X30 transferring to Consett) and this issue addressed.


Whilst the point you make is the same, operationally the X15 is slightly different and a more difficult one to resolve. It is one that Go North East are aware of, but at this stage couldn't be resolved. The Venture minibuses are used on a night because minibus drivers (who are paid less than a 'big bus' established driver with more years experience) operate this service. It'd be massively inefficient and add a lot of extra cost to have the X15 operated by X-lines buses on a night, when passenger numbers are considerably lower than they are during the day.

I haven't checked and no doubt someone will quite quickly come back and tell me I'm wrong and this has been missed, but a note should have been put in the timetable to highlight that those journeys aren't operated by an X-lines bus (the least Go North East could do!)

Well I didn't realise you got paid less for driving a minibus, so I get that. But there was a E400 MMC on it yesterday with a Minibus. So can a "big bus" bus driver drive the mini buses? Anyway I do agree it should be put on the timetable. They could atleast get a high spec mini to be put on it. and on a Sunday it is a high spec but not as high spec. What if a minibus drivers bus breaks down and gets replaced. Peterlee drivers are all mini bus but now it is operating the 65, does that mean there has been new drivers stationed at peterlee

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So what are the fleet movements which are happening for these massive changess.

(05 Sep 2021, 5:36 pm)Keeiajs wrote Well I didn't realise you got paid less for driving a minibus, so I get that. But there was a E400 MMC on it yesterday with a Minibus. So can a "big bus" bus driver drive the mini buses? Anyway I do agree it should be put on the timetable. They could atleast get a high spec mini to be put on it. and on a Sunday it is a high spec but not as high spec. What if a minibus drivers bus breaks down and gets replaced. Peterlee drivers are all mini bus but now it is operating the 65, does that mean there has been new drivers stationed at peterlee

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So what are the fleet movements which are happening for these massive changess.

It's not black and white. Peterlee is a low cost depot, the 39 at Deptford is soon to be Solos and that's run by "big bus" drivers, but the X20 is on the low cost rota, so run by "minibus" drivers.

(05 Sep 2021, 5:47 pm)deanmachine wrote It's not black and white. Peterlee is a low cost depot, the 39 at Deptford is soon to be Solos and that's run by "big bus" drivers, but the X20 is on the low cost rota, so run by "minibus" drivers.

But they use big buses...

(05 Sep 2021, 6:09 pm)Keeiajs wrote But they use big buses...

All cats have four legs. My dog has four legs. Therefore my dog is a cat.

(05 Sep 2021, 6:19 pm)MurdnunoC wrote All cats have four legs. My dog has four legs. Therefore my dog is a cat.

Can u just stop being a pain.

(05 Sep 2021, 6:41 pm)Keeiajs wrote Can u just stop being a pain.

How appropriate, you post like a cow.

(05 Sep 2021, 4:49 pm)mb134 wrote I think it's exactly the argument to make. Daytime vs evening experience on the X30 for over 18 months has, literally, been night and day. That the journeys were at least some of the time also operated by Scanias and Versas (have they had X-Lines refurbs?), and that the Citaros don't have tables which are advertised clearly on the daytime allocation (and are virtually life expired), is a pretty clear downgrade to me.

 But what if we looked at Arriva land and before you think I'm going to have a dig at them, I'd actually support them of they did such practice.

Lets say Arriva wanted to introduce and evening & Sunday X20 service to Ashington only and lets say Jesmond ran it using a Streetlite interworking with another service whereas the daytime service was run using a brand new Sapphire or Arriva Express spec double decker.

If Arriva ran the service using a StreetLite as opposed to a full spec decker, that would make sense given the commercial risk and uncertainty.

GNE have experimented with the late evening X30 journeys and as they've now been established and in conjunction with changes to other interworking patterns, it will be run using XLines spec deckers 7 days per week.

Likewise with the X5, if evening & Sunday passenger numbers grew to an extent that a bigger bus was required, then they'd no doubt try forming a StreetLite or decker operation in conjunction with other changes.

Some very childish behaviour in this thread.

As these September Changes have now been implemented, is there any reason to continue this discourse?

What more is there to discuss?

I once owned a dog that was smarter than some of the posters on here!

(05 Sep 2021, 6:52 pm)MurdnunoC wrote How appropriate, you post like a cow.

Ah name calling, maturity is on point.

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(05 Sep 2021, 6:55 pm)L469 YVK wrote  But what if we looked at Arriva land and before you think I'm going to have a dig at them, I'd actually support them of they did such practice.

Lets say Arriva wanted to introduce and evening & Sunday X20 service to Ashington only and lets say Jesmond ran it using a Streetlite interworking with another service whereas the daytime service was run using a brand new Sapphire or Arriva Express spec double decker.

If Arriva ran the service using a StreetLite as opposed to a full spec decker, that would make sense given the commercial risk and uncertainty.

GNE have experimented with the late evening X30 journeys and as they've now been established and in conjunction with changes to other interworking patterns, it will be run using XLines spec deckers 7 days per week.

Likewise with the X5, if evening & Sunday passenger numbers grew to an extent that a bigger bus was required, then they'd no doubt try forming a StreetLite or decker operation in conjunction with other changes.

Tbh when I saw it it did have around 20 passengers on. I don't necessarily think it need to be a double decker, maybe a streetlites, or maybe just a high spec Solo but it should be advertised like it was with the 78.

I don't know why people complain about things when GNE do them but when arriva do the same thing noone says a thing. Example Sunday allocations just because the 61 & 2/A are interworking people were complain even though its no big deal yet the arriva 6 interworks with the 22/24 on a Sunday yet noone makes a fuss about that. Or people complaining about a lack of timetables yet arriva have no timetables or stagecoach have a lack of timetables.

(05 Sep 2021, 9:08 pm)GNE6312 wrote I don't know why people complain about things when GNE do them but when arriva do the same thing noone says a thing. Example Sunday allocations just because the 61 & 2/A are interworking people were complain even though its no big deal yet the arriva 6 interworks with the 22/24 on a Sunday yet noone makes a fuss about that. Or people complaining about a lack of timetables yet arriva have no timetables or stagecoach have a lack of timetables.

The 6 and 22/24 are less noticeable in fairness, they’re all Sapphire branded.

A better comparison would be with most of the work out of Arriva’s Stockton Depot, which, if it is still the same as it used to be a few years ago, saw drivers keep the same bus for the duration of their duty (if my memory serves) resulting in Frequenta, Max and Sapphire buses all being muddled up.

The point remains though, it makes things confusing having wrongly branded buses out in service on evenings and Sundays and in the main it doesn’t happen all too often at Go North East nowadays. There’s specific examples where it needs to for operational reasons, in order to maintain the same level of service as is being offered with the wrongly coloured bus.


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(05 Sep 2021, 9:30 am)Keeiajs wrote I don't think the Public are aware of the 65's Sunday Service.

I wasn't until bigun sent me a link to a photo.

(05 Sep 2021, 9:31 pm)BusLoverMum wrote I wasn't until bigun sent me a link to a photo.

There’s a bigger marketing campaign planned, but only two of the four buses are actually ready, so a bit of a soft launch for the first week or two just until everything settles down.

There’s also a later service provided than there was previously on the 265, so it represents a pretty good investment from Go North East’s point of view which will be backed up with appropriate marketing (including printed publicity).

It’s one of the big positives in this round of changes, which hasn’t really been discussed here (possibly because the majority seem so focused on the negatives at the moment?!) and likewise the 21 to Brandon, opening up through connections to the Arnison and New College.


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(05 Sep 2021, 9:08 pm)GNE6312 wrote I don't know why people complain about things when GNE do them but when arriva do the same thing noone says a thing. Example Sunday allocations just because the 61 & 2/A are interworking people were complain even though its no big deal yet the arriva 6 interworks with the 22/24 on a Sunday yet noone makes a fuss about that. Or people complaining about a lack of timetables yet arriva have no timetables or stagecoach have a lack of timetables.

Arriva gave up on allocations a couple of years ago, though, so we're used to it!

(05 Sep 2021, 9:53 pm)BusLoverMum wrote Arriva gave up on allocations a couple of years ago, though, so we're used to it!

That's a good point arriva just put anything on anything, won't be surprised if we have 1429/32 running round in Blyth in the 63 livery and let's not forget 2843/49 advertising quick links to Darlington Town centre operating the 57/A & X14 and let's not forget 7558 spending 9 months in Blyth brand for the 268 from Bradford to Huddersfield .

(05 Sep 2021, 9:40 pm)Dan wrote There’s a bigger marketing campaign planned, but only two of the four buses are actually ready, so a bit of a soft launch for the first week or two just until everything settles down.

There’s also a later service provided than there was previously on the 265, so it represents a pretty good investment from Go North East’s point of view which will be backed up with appropriate marketing (including printed publicity).

It’s one of the big positives in this round of changes, which hasn’t really been discussed here (possibly because the majority seem so focused on the negatives at the moment?!) and likewise the 21 to Brandon, opening up through connections to the Arnison and New College.


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Have I read this right:
The route has been launched, alongside a Sunday service - but because 2 buses haven't been painted yet, there's very little promotion or marketing 'until things settle down'?
What happened to striking when the iron was hot and letting passengers know about these changes well in advance?

On a slightly different note.
There was a little bit of a conversation a few days back about the booklets and how they're being distributed.
I've seen one!
No idea who the distribution company was, but rather than post through letterboxes, they had been thrown on to the ground in gardens or dropped in front of doors.
I've not actually read it yet as the booklet was still drying out last time I had the chance to look.

(05 Sep 2021, 10:08 pm)GNE6312 wrote That's a good point arriva just put anything on anything, won't be surprised if we have 1429/32 running round in Blyth in the 63 livery and let's not forget 2843/49 advertising quick links to Darlington Town centre operating the 57/A & X14 and let's not forget 7558 spending 9 months in Blyth brand for the 268 from Bradford to Huddersfield .

And they've had JH runni g half of the 64 for the past 6 weeks. If that isn't confusing for passengers...

(05 Sep 2021, 9:53 pm)BusLoverMum wrote Arriva gave up on allocations a couple of years ago, though, so we're used to it!

Personally I'd rather have a bus that takes me all the way to my destination in the wrong brand than one in the right brand but I have to change buses or it's not running at all because it was cut short.

The branding would never work at Jesmond, Blyth or Durham because of how they regulate routes at each of the bus stations but imo that's a good thing. Ashington are usually a bit better though especially with the X21/X22. Personally never understood why they even tried it it's been the same since day one bar back then they made an effort to put the right bus at the start of the day now it's just anything on anything especially at Blyth.

And the 65 needs to be promoted well. People will be Christmas shopping soon and a twice hourly and sunday service to dalton park will be a draw (we've got no shops left in Durham!)

(05 Sep 2021, 10:15 pm)BusLoverMum wrote And the 65 needs to be promoted well. People will be Christmas shopping soon and a twice hourly and sunday service to dalton park will be a draw (we've got no shops left in Durham!)

It would be nice to get some USB's & Wifi.

My thoughts and observations on the service changes: Becoming Future Fit

Would welcome any comments/feedback as always.

(05 Sep 2021, 10:47 pm)Adrian wrote My thoughts and observations on the service changes: Becoming Future Fit

Would welcome any comments/feedback as always.

Another great blog post! Only thing I will say is that DCC did find the funds for a bus to Burnhope via the new service 730 - not sure if you perhaps missed that as it was added after the updates for the continuation of the 28 Chester stretch and the 71.

(05 Sep 2021, 11:00 pm)peter wrote Another great blog post! Only thing I will say is that DCC did find the funds for a bus to Burnhope via the new service 730 - not sure if you perhaps missed that as it was added after the updates for the continuation of the 28 Chester stretch and the 71.

Cheers! I'll update that tomorrow.
I had thought I had seen something about it, but couldn't find anything when I looked. The journey data doesn't appear to be in Google Maps yet either.

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(05 Sep 2021, 10:08 pm)GNE6312 wrote That's a good point arriva just put anything on anything, won't be surprised if we have 1429/32 running round in Blyth in the 63 livery and let's not forget 2843/49 advertising quick links to Darlington Town centre operating the 57/A & X14 and let's not forget 7558 spending 9 months in Blyth brand for the 268 from Bradford to Huddersfield .

It’s not just the exterior but also the interior. At least one of the 15 plates from Yorkshire still has 202/203 branding. 7553 or 7556 or both.

(05 Sep 2021, 11:30 pm)NewcastleOne wrote It’s not just the exterior but also the interior. At least one of the 15 plates from Yorkshire still has 202/203 branding. 7553 or 7556 or both.

Think they all do, forgot to mention thst, sure 7557/8/60/62 have internal 268 branding

(05 Sep 2021, 4:52 pm)Dan wrote I think we're just going round in circles now...

They weren't ever intended to be allocated Scania OmniCitys or Optare Versas, always Citaros (to maintain advertised customer specification - Wi-Fi, USB charging points and next stop announcements). As I say, this has been addressed at the very earliest opportunity (and was always intended to be, as there's no denying that the Citaros 'feel' a lot worse than a brand new ADL Enviro400).

Fair enough, hopefully a consistent X-Lines allocation through to end of service helps to build leisure passenger numbers in the evening.

(05 Sep 2021, 9:08 pm)GNE6312 wrote I don't know why people complain about things when GNE do them but when arriva do the same thing noone says a thing. Example Sunday allocations just because the 61 & 2/A are interworking people were complain even though its no big deal yet the arriva 6 interworks with the 22/24 on a Sunday yet noone makes a fuss about that. Or people complaining about a lack of timetables yet arriva have no timetables or stagecoach have a lack of timetables.

Differences in expectations. I'm not saying it's right, but given that GNE are far more shouty about the things they're doing well (of which there are a lot) it's far more evident when those things aren't happening/not to the standard expected. I haven't seen anything in the way of a push from either Arriva (bar the X93) or Stagecoach to get folk back on the buses, they both seem to just be assuming folk will come back - which to be honest is likely the case for both of them in various parts of their operations. 

To put it into a bit of perspective, I had a day out on Transdev Blazefield last week. Given all the hype surrounding the operation from themselves, their MD, and enthusiasts, my expectations were high. Had I stopped after the first two buses of the day they would have been met, but the more I went around their network, the more questions I asked. Now I don't think it's quite at that level with GNE, for example investment seems to trickle down far better and Sunday services (AFAIK) aren't as laughable on secondary routes, but when the sky high expectations aren't met then there will always be more room for criticism. When comparing that with Arriva, as folk like to do on here, I don't think I'm being harsh when I say expectations are substantially lower - so there's a lower drop if the bus doesn't have what is promised, for example.

So if I want to get the 62 from Sunderland what service will it be on previously, 38A or X6?