(22 Jan 2022, 10:12 am)busmanT wrote I still can't see any mention on the Go North East website of this going back to normal, I would have expected GNE to tell its passengers rather than Nexus

Go North East hasn't told its passengers because they aren't reverting back to normal timetables from this date.

(22 Jan 2022, 9:13 am)busmanT wrote I can't see any mention of this on the Go North East website - all alterations are shown as until further notice.

Just for clarification - this is the Arriva thread and the service in question is the 56 from Durham to Bishop Auckland. The 56, alongside the 6, 7 and 64 were temporarily reduced from 31st October 2021 due to driver shortages. The 56 is now returning to it's normal timetable where one journey per hour was running between Bishop Auckland and Coundon only which is now re-extended through to Durham. No word yet on when the 6, 7 and 64 will revert, but on VOSA the 'End Date' for these changes is 31st March 2022, so perhaps that's the ideal.

(22 Jan 2022, 10:16 am)Dan wrote Go North East hasn't told its passengers because they aren't reverting back to normal timetables from this date.

Well, I wonder if it will be before March. 

Also, I hope from the past few weeks that GNE can get some extra capacity on some routes, e.g 39/20/X1/60 (granted not much more can be done)/X45/46.

Route 308 will be diverted southbound between Blyth and South Beach from the 14th, presumably via the 309 route.

Northbound journeys are unaffected with passengers for Newcastle able to travel to Blyth and back out on a diverted service.

PB0002032/266
Variation ARRIVA NORTHUMBRIA LTD 57 (57, 57A) Ashington North Shields

PB0002032/340
Variation ARRIVA NORTHUMBRIA LTD 53 (53) Cramlington North Shields



PB0002032/341
Variation ARRIVA NORTHUMBRIA LTD X9 (X9) Blyth Newcastle

PB0002032/337
Variation ARRIVA NORTHUMBRIA LTD X10 (X10, X11) Blyth Newcastle

PB0002032/458
Variation ARRIVA NORTHUMBRIA LTD 51 (51A, 51) Newcastle Whitley Bay

PB0002032/459
Variation ARRIVA NORTHUMBRIA LTD 52 (52) Ashington Newcastle

PB0002032/450
Variation ARRIVA NORTHUMBRIA LTD 308 (308, 306) Blyth Newcastle

PB0002032/340
Variation ARRIVA NORTHUMBRIA LTD 53 (53) Cramlington North Shields

PB0002032/457
Variation ARRIVA NORTHUMBRIA LTD 54 (54) Whitley Bay Newcastle

PB0002032/11
Variation ARRIVA NORTHUMBRIA LTD X7 (X7) Blyth Newcastle

PB0002032/252
Variation ARRIVA NORTHUMBRIA LTD X8 (X8) Blyth Newcastle

PB0002032/266
Variation ARRIVA NORTHUMBRIA LTD 57 (57, 57A) Ashington North Shields

PB0002032/153
Variation ARRIVA NORTHUMBRIA LTD 55 (55) Newcastle Forest Hall

PB0002032/152
Variation ARRIVA NORTHUMBRIA LTD 46 (46, 46A) Newcastle Featherstone Grove


Effective date is 27 Mar 2022

(11 Feb 2022, 4:09 pm)Michael wrote PB0002032/152
Variation ARRIVA NORTHUMBRIA LTD 46 (46, 46A) Newcastle Featherstone Grove


Effective date is 27 Mar 2022

Wonder if the 46A might be the replacement for the 33 down Hollywood Avenue since there's heavy rumours that the Q3 is going via Osbourne Road now. Whatever it is, it doesn't exist now. Be a good improvement for them if so with a faster service.

I wonder what the above changes will present? Would the 43/44/45 not be better going to Single Decks and going to a 6/6/7 frequency running every 20 mins each (like the 309/310/311 do)? Would give a more even service between the 43/45 from Lockey Park .

(12 Feb 2022, 5:08 pm)L469 YVK wrote I wonder what the above changes will present? Would the 43/44/45 not be better going to Single Decks and going to a 6/6/7 frequency running every 20 mins each (like the 309/310/311 do)? Would give a more even service between the 43/45 from Lockey Park .

I'm not sure they need more services along there. 20 mins seems a bit overkill for both Dinnington bits and I don't believe it would reduce the PVR, potentially increase it though because of the interworking patterns.

44/45 PVR 5 with 30 min run time each all with a 7 minute layover.

(12 Feb 2022, 7:12 pm)Storx wrote I'm not sure they need more services along there. 20 mins seems a bit overkill for both Dinnington bits and I don't believe it would reduce the PVR, potentially increase it though because of the interworking patterns.

44/45 PVR 5 with 30 min run time each all with a 7 minute layover.

It would increase PVR but would give more even headway between the 43 & 45 in Wideopen, 13/7 as opposed to an oddball 30 minute service running amongst a 15 minute frequency provided by the 43. 

So frequency would be
Dinnington 44/45 - Every 7-13 mins
Wideopen Travellers Rest 43/45 - Every 7-13 mins
North Gosforth & Gosforth Park 43/44/45 - Every 6-7 mins

Although I suppose my argument is invalid to some extent given that GNE went the opposite way on the Rowlands Gill corridor by making the 47/47A an oddball amongst the X45/X46.

(12 Feb 2022, 9:40 pm)L469 YVK wrote It would increase PVR but would give more even headway between the 43 & 45 in Wideopen, 13/7 as opposed to an oddball 30 minute service running amongst a 15 minute frequency provided by the 43. 

So frequency would be
Dinnington 44/45 - Every 7-13 mins
Wideopen Travellers Rest 43/45 - Every 7-13 mins
North Gosforth & Gosforth Park 43/44/45 - Every 6-7 mins

Although I suppose my argument is invalid to some extent given that GNE went the opposite way on the Rowlands Gill corridor by making the 47/47A an oddball amongst the X45/X46.

Aye I see what you mean but if I'm right the timings should be every 7.5, 7.5, 15, 7.5, 7.5, 15... anyway through Wideopen so it's not really much different to a 7 / 13 it's easier to understand as it is imo.

If you look at the way things are going generally with Covid funding coming to an end and service cuts on the horizon - do you honestly think they’ll be increasing the PVR?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Having a look at the 306 & 308 including a potential depot consolidation, Arriva & GNE could perhaps be looking a BSIP friendly approach to their retrospective changes given they're both happening at the same time?

If Arriva reduced both the 306 & 308 to every 20 mins each, dropping the 306 out of Battle Hill (saving 3 mins in either direction) but still keeping the Tynemouth to Whitley Bay section, they could comfortably interwork with a PVR of 14x (down from 18x) and, a relatively combined frequency could be provided from both Arriva's 308 & GNE's 309.

ANE 308
308 Blyth/NCL: 00:23 - 01:29
308 NCL/Blyth (interworked from 306): 01:27 - 02:30

GoNE 309
309 Blyth/NCL: 00:10 - 01:17
309 (interworked from 311) NCL/Blyth: 01:17 - 02:23

308 & 306 interworking pattern
308 - Blyth: 00:23
308- NCL: 01:29
306 - NCL: 01:37
306 - WBay: 02:35
306 - WBay: 02:40
306 - NCL: 03:39
308 - NCL: 03:47
308 - Blyth: 04:50

Are the 306/308 both double decker routes now?

I'll be using the 306 this week (finally using Arriva, having not done so in around 16 years) and I'm hoping for a Pulsar (Streetlites rattle too much). What is usually on the 52/54?

(13 Feb 2022, 12:47 pm)OrangeArrow49 wrote Are the 306/308 both double decker routes now?

I'll be using the 306 this week (finally using Arriva, having not done so in around 16 years) and I'm hoping for a Pulsar (Streetlites rattle too much). What is usually on the 52/54?

52/54 are normally Streetlites. 306 is a mix of everything although single deck on paper

---

To be honest, the current Saturday PVR of both the 306 & 308 is already 14x with the 308 having a tight layover in Blyth.

Interworking and reducing the main frequency to every 20 mins each would reduce the PVR by 22-23%. And keeping the 306 out of Battle Hill would be a win/win for both operators. GNE having Battle Hill - Newcastle in full with Arriva providing a 'solid' 10 minute service between Billy Mill and Station Road rather than having the 308 sitting in front taking the brunt. Not forgetting the 308 & 309 working more in sync rather than against each other.

(13 Feb 2022, 1:12 pm)L469 YVK wrote 52/54 are normally Streetlites. 306 is a mix of everything although single deck on paper

Believe the 306 is actually a split allocation on paper. 4 boards should be decker operated, with the others single. In reality that's pretty rare as you say.

(13 Feb 2022, 1:12 pm)L469 YVK wrote 52/54 are normally Streetlites. 306 is a mix of everything although single deck on paper

---

To be honest, the current Saturday PVR of both the 306 & 308 is already 14x with the 308 having a tight layover in Blyth.

Interworking and reducing the main frequency to every 20 mins each would reduce the PVR by 22-23%. And keeping the 306 out of Battle Hill would be a win/win for both operators. GNE having Battle Hill - Newcastle in full with Arriva providing a 'solid' 10 minute service between Billy Mill and Station Road rather than having the 308 sitting in front taking the brunt. Not forgetting the 308 & 309 working more in sync rather than against each other.

I'm avoiding StreetLites where possible, so hoping 52, 54, 306 and 685 don't have them on when I go out this week. Pulsars are the best. The StreetLites look good from the outside.

(13 Feb 2022, 6:51 pm)OrangeArrow49 wrote I'm avoiding StreetLites where possible, so hoping 52, 54, 306 and 685 don't have them on when I go out this week. Pulsars are the best. The StreetLites look good from the outside.

Good luck with that

(11 Feb 2022, 4:09 pm)Michael wrote PB0002032/341
Variation ARRIVA NORTHUMBRIA LTD X9 (X9) Blyth Newcastle

PB0002032/337
Variation ARRIVA NORTHUMBRIA LTD X10 (X10, X11) Blyth Newcastle

PB0002032/458
Variation ARRIVA NORTHUMBRIA LTD 51 (51A, 51) Newcastle Whitley Bay

PB0002032/459
Variation ARRIVA NORTHUMBRIA LTD 52 (52) Ashington Newcastle

PB0002032/450
Variation ARRIVA NORTHUMBRIA LTD 308 (308, 306) Blyth Newcastle

PB0002032/340
Variation ARRIVA NORTHUMBRIA LTD 53 (53) Cramlington North Shields

PB0002032/457
Variation ARRIVA NORTHUMBRIA LTD 54 (54) Whitley Bay Newcastle

PB0002032/11
Variation ARRIVA NORTHUMBRIA LTD X7 (X7) Blyth Newcastle

PB0002032/252
Variation ARRIVA NORTHUMBRIA LTD X8 (X8) Blyth Newcastle

PB0002032/266
Variation ARRIVA NORTHUMBRIA LTD 57 (57, 57A) Ashington North Shields

PB0002032/153
Variation ARRIVA NORTHUMBRIA LTD 55 (55) Newcastle Forest Hall

PB0002032/152
Variation ARRIVA NORTHUMBRIA LTD 46 (46, 46A) Newcastle Featherstone Grove


Effective date is 27 Mar 2022

Courtesy of Bustimes:
Revised route and timetable: 46, 51/51A, 53, X7, X8, X9
Revised timetable: 52, 54, 55, 57/57A, 306/308, X10/11

Revised Routes for the 51 and 53?,what could this be?

https://www.nexus.org.uk/consultation/it...h-tyneside

(22 Feb 2022, 3:50 pm)citybus1979 wrote https://www.nexus.org.uk/consultation/it...h-tyneside

Already been posted on the Nexus Tenders thread


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Looks like the Traveline site has been updated with the new timetables for Arriva so far I can see:

X7 - Serving Amersham Drive all day now, last bus 23:10, no other changes

X8 - Last bus 20:40 out of Newcastle, now does the X9 route from Cramlington to Blyth

X9 - Last bus 22:35 out of Newcastle, now does the X8 route from Cramlington to Blyth

I can't see changes in anything else seem all minor changes other than the already mentioned 55 changes so they've either not been uploaded yet or there's not much changing including the 306/308 still both being every 15 minutes. The 46/46A/52 aren't online yet though so assuming routes relating to tenders are delayed.

That X8 is setup to fail so that will be getting withdrawn before long. The X8/X9 swap generally is a good move though imo, gives Beacon Hill and the new estate an evening service and North Blyth get a slightly quicker service. No-one really loses out with the X8 as it's covered by the 43/X7 mostly anyway.

Arriva must be commercially tactical here and I believe the Blyth and Newcastle link may operate at a loss for the next few years for a very specific reason

CAMBOIS

Think about it Cambis is getting a huge Giga Factory being built its like a Nissan Factory or Amazon factory on a large scale employing thousands- do you think Arriva will want to maintain services and cash in on increased workers and passengers?


Best example I can give is look at Amazon at Follingsby Park

Dan and the Team at GNE have worked endlessly to create additional services including short routes to Washington and Heworth to connect with other services creating a discreet shuttle service bus incorporating a normal bus service

This Giga Plant in Cambois near Blyth is absolutely huge massive and you think Arriva don't want to cash in on this?

Remove a service its open for competition to step in keep it twig it and possibly run it at a loss for a few years (with long term revenue potential) is in the longer term financially viable

Another issue regarding Battlehill is residents prefer to use 306 and GNE 309 as its "quicker"

On paper you are saving 3mins by going direct along the coast Road towards Newcastle. For 3 minutes you are missing conncections to a bingo approx 8 bus stops including outside a shopping centre (Lidl shops etc )

To save 3 minutes as someone said I think it's about 5 personally in return for picking say 10 passengers heading towards Newcastle so say £2 a head and creating competition with GNE services


Think about it keep the service running through Battlehill because if you don't you give monopoly away of an area and we have seen what happens when services have a monopoly they bite little by little making a 10 min service to a 12 min service to a 15min service to a 20 min service then a 30min service

Think about it keeping competition on service routes keeps bus routes

Think about it

(24 Feb 2022, 12:20 am)DaveFromUpNorth wrote Arriva must be commercially tactical here and I believe the Blyth and Newcastle link may operate at a loss for the next few years for a very specific  reason

CAMBOIS

Think about it Cambis is getting a huge Giga Factory being built its like a Nissan Factory or Amazon factory on a large scale employing thousands- do you think Arriva will want to maintain services and cash in on increased workers and passengers?


Best example I can give is look at Amazon at Follingsby Park

Dan and the Team at GNE have worked endlessly to create additional services including short routes to Washington and Heworth to connect with other services creating a discreet shuttle service bus incorporating a normal bus service

This Giga Plant in Cambois near Blyth is absolutely  huge massive and you think Arriva don't want to cash in on this?

Remove a service its open for competition to step in  keep it twig it and possibly run it at a loss for a few years (with long term revenue potential)  is in the longer term financially viable

Another issue regarding  Battlehill is residents prefer to use 306 and GNE 309 as its "quicker"

On paper you are saving 3mins by going direct along the coast Road towards Newcastle. For 3 minutes you are missing conncections to a bingo approx 8 bus stops including outside a shopping centre (Lidl shops etc )

To save 3 minutes as someone said I think it's about 5 personally in return for picking say 10 passengers heading towards Newcastle so say £2 a head  and creating competition with GNE services


Think about it keep the service running through  Battlehill because if you don't you give monopoly away of an area and we have seen what happens when services have a monopoly  they bite little by little making a 10 min service to a 12 min service to a 15min service to a 20 min service then a 30min service

Think about it keeping competition  on service routes keeps bus routes

Think about it

As DB are desperate to get rid of Arriva I’m not sure they would be interested in any long term gains especially if if means short to medium term losses.

(24 Feb 2022, 12:57 am)Bazza wrote As DB are desperate to get rid of Arriva I’m not sure they would be interested in any long term gains especially if if means short to medium term losses.

What you are implying there makes little sense - it is local Depot/Network Management which changes routes & timetables and not senior management relating to DB.

(24 Feb 2022, 1:28 am)Cobalt271 wrote What you are implying there makes little sense - it is local Depot/Network Management which changes routes & timetables and not senior management relating to DB.

And are you saying that senior management wouldn’t step in if routes were loss making? That makes little sense too.
(I’m not talking about senior managers in Germany either, Depot/Network managers will answer to those higher up the chain in Arriva Northumbria and ultimately Arriva UK Bus).

308, it looks like the short journeys will terminate at the Silverlink as opposed to Billy Mill. Makes sense as the drivers can then just boot it up the A19 light back to Blyth.

Arriva must have some confidence keeping the Monday-Friday 306 & 308 frequency at every 15 minutes. Unless that will change when operations eventually move to Blyth?

(24 Feb 2022, 11:15 am)L469 YVK wrote 308, it looks like the short journeys will terminate at the Silverlink as opposed to Billy Mill. Makes sense as the drivers can then just boot it up the A19 light back to Blyth.

Arriva must have some confidence keeping the Monday-Friday 306 & 308 frequency at every 15 minutes. Unless that will change when operations eventually move to Blyth?

What a surprise, another round of changes where the 306 and 308 inevitably don't change frequency 

(23 Feb 2022, 11:43 pm)Storx wrote Looks like the Traveline site has been updated with the new timetables for Arriva so far I can see:

X7 - Serving Amersham Drive all day now, last bus 23:10, no other changes

X8 - Last bus 20:40 out of Newcastle, now does the X9 route from Cramlington to Blyth

X9 - Last bus 22:35 out of Newcastle, now does the X8 route from Cramlington to Blyth

So if I'm right, the "new" X9 does the current X8 route to Shankhouse roundabout then via High Pit following the "current" X9 route to Newcastle?

Then the "new X8" does the current X9 route to Shankhouse then via Durham Road following the "current" X8 route to Newcastle?

These are actually a really positive set of changes to be honest and got to give Arriva credit where it's due. Only criticism is that they should drop the "X" from the X8 and renumber to something like the 367.

Or.....renumber the X7 and X8 to 367/368 (still marketing as limited stop where appropriate) and that would give a clean network of actual 'X' routes from Blyth, them being the X9 & X10/X11

(24 Feb 2022, 12:12 pm)L469 YVK wrote So if I'm right, the "new" X9 does the current X8 route to Shankhouse roundabout then via High Pit following the "current" X9 route to Newcastle?

Then the "new X8" does the current X9 route to Shankhouse then via Durham Road following the "current" X8 route to Newcastle?

These are actually a really positive set of changes to be honest and got to give Arriva credit where it's due. Only criticism is that they should drop the "X" from the X8 and renumber to something like the 367.

Or.....renumber the X7 and X8 to 367/368 (still marketing as limited stop where appropriate) and that would give a clean network of actual 'X' routes from Blyth, them being the X9 & X10/X11

X8/X9 swap gives a much quicker service from Bebside to Newcastle, presumably getting passengers onboard before the Northumberland Line opens.