(08 May 2023, 12:06 pm)Adrian wrote I notice how you avoided my questions, instead opting to play the martyr.

As a reminder - 

• From what I could see from the drone footage on Youtube, there were 20 preserved buses there. Half of them running on the shuttle service would have been almost a half-hourly service between the three points, if it was organised. Why don't you question that, when asking yourself why JH ended up running most of the shuttle services?
  
• I'm all for accessible buses on shuttle services; don't we now have preserved low floor buses? Did they do any runs to Beamish and back, or is it solely down to commercial operators? 
  

I do think that NEBPT do a good job of putting these events on, but are perhaps badly let down by those attending then not wanting to participate. If I was running the events, personally I'd remove the advertisement of a free shuttle/bus service at all events. That way you're delivering what in practice actually happens, which is a load of static exhibits.

I do understand. Sorry I miss read what you were saying. I'd do the same. Tbh a small shuttle round the area would have been alright. I did speak with them at Whitehaven. The only reason the Beamish/Tanfield shuttle was on was due to the Tanfield running train event & Beamish 50th Tramway. It was to connect the events so you could have time at each event. If Beamish wasn't on then she shuttle would have just been local

(08 May 2023, 12:14 pm)Busu284 wrote I do understand. Sorry I miss read what you were saying. I'd do the same. Tbh a small shuttle round the area would have been alright. I did speak with them at Whitehaven. The only reason the Beamish/Tanfield shuttle was on was due to the Tanfield running train event & Beamish 50th Tramway. It was to connect the events so you could have time at each event. If Beamish wasn't on then she shuttle would have just been local

I too was at Whitehaven, and like I said above, the shuttles were ran like a military operation. I'm assuming that this is because they had buy in from those bringing buses well in advance and were able to timetable accordingly. 

It should be a learning point that a shuttle is only provided if there's enough buy in to put a timetable together. Otherwise, like I say, it shouldn't be advertised and instead it becomes a show of static exhibits.

(08 May 2023, 12:06 pm)Adrian wrote I do think that NEBPT do a good job of putting these events on, but are perhaps badly let down by those attending then not wanting to participate. If I was running the events, personally I'd remove the advertisement of a free shuttle/bus service at all events. That way you're delivering what in practice actually happens, which is a load of static exhibits.

Absolutely, whilst one can criticise NEBPT for how these events are organised, if they are led up the garden path by attendees not wishing to participate on the day, removing the advertised free shuttle service is one contingency they can implement for future events with immediate effect. Personally, I'd be very much in favour of this approach. At least, that way, you won't have people stranded in remote locations for seemingly hours on end.

(08 May 2023, 11:57 am)streetdeckfan wrote It's great when new accounts come on here and do nothing but complain

Maybe we need a banner at the top of every page that says "This is a bus enthusiasts' forum, not the complaints department."

(08 May 2023, 3:29 pm)wibblejunior wrote Maybe we need a banner at the top of every page that says "This is a bus enthusiasts' forum, not the complaints department."

Therapy is a lot more expensive than ranting on here though.

(08 May 2023, 3:41 pm)Andreos1 wrote Therapy is a lot more expensive than ranting on here though.

But when mixed with copious alcohol consumption, therapy may actually be cheaper.


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(08 May 2023, 3:54 pm)Dan wrote But when mixed with copious alcohol consumption, therapy may actually be cheaper.


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I haven't moaned for ages!!!

(08 May 2023, 3:41 pm)Andreos1 wrote Therapy is a lot more expensive than ranting on here though.

Why'd you think that the 'annoying' threads were one of the most popular on here for a long while?!

Some used it to vent more than others... hehe... errhhh

(08 May 2023, 9:56 am)Busu284 wrote So my thoughts on the rally

I helped out on two of the shuttle. It seemed that the South Shields Daimler, JH59 COM & ENX from the JH fleet only did runs. Gne pi##ed about sending there buses back and forwards which weren't even washed. The stagecoach decker didn't even do the proper shuttle and decided to do scottswood road. 

I was on the West Yorkshire bus helping him get to Beamish & back. Not because the nebpt are unorganised. I was helping out with them. The driver did not know his way and I helped. We went to Tanfield & Beamish but got stopped at Beamish as the driver didn't want to head back to Tanfield due to him not wanting to kill it on the hills again. The stagecoach bus was meant to be heading to Beamish but never did cause he "didn't want to" the dceker was full because of that driver. Gne sat and screwed about during the rally. Not 1 single shuttle they did at all. They faffed about running them back and forwards on stupid journeys when they could have helped doing shuttle. The buses weren't even clean which was just pathetic. Then just to make it worse the X50 woman completely went and ruined it by shouting at everyone cause she wanted her own way. 

If gne had have helped out on a shuttle service then it would have been fine. But no they sat and faffed about doing absolutely nothing. Constant trips back and forwards. Fgs at one point 5808 was at the rally. Disappeared then they came back with 5801 instead. Whatever the hell gne were thinking yesterday was pathetic. No wonder the nebpt dropped them as support. Jh Coaches were sat doing most of the shuttle work since gne didn't. Like for a company like gne who claim there the best out there. Yesterday was pathetic. 3 buses (a merc with a few stickers about King Charles & a Voltra (which changed twice) a mucky looking Scania and a random OmniDekka) non of which were clean. The rally yesterday would have been better. If gne had have helped out on shuttle. The nebpt aren't organised. They ask who wants to do a shuttle and help park up the buses. Gne didn't even do one shuttle. The shuttle was fine but with Damiler & West Yorkshire & 2 jh buses doing it. Yes the West Yorkshire didn't come back to Tanfield cause he didn't want to which I can understand. But to berate the nebpt for bad organised. It was a good event and the nebpt do a fantastic job at the rallys and think good we actually have a rally season here. But no people sit and berate them for nothing it's pathetic

I understand that as a result of “feedback” some GNE staff received at the event, GNE are considering ceasing to send vehicles to rallies. It doesn’t sound as if they are welcome.

The top end of the car park was taped off to allow car parking and the X50 to operate, but several of the rally buses just drove through the tape.

As it’s the NEBPT rally, hopefully all those commenting/complaining on here have also sent a written complaint to the NEBPT.

(08 May 2023, 6:06 pm)busmanT wrote I understand that as a result of “feedback” some GNE staff received at the event, GNE are considering ceasing to send vehicles to rallies. It doesn’t sound as if they are welcome.

The top end of the car park was taped off to allow car parking and the X50 to operate, but several of the rally buses just drove through the tape.

As it’s the NEBPT rally, hopefully all those commenting/complaining on here have also sent a written complaint to the NEBPT.

One thing I've noticed in the 'bus scene' is that there's a lot of arrogance and sense of entitlement. It's one of the reasons I hate going to the events.

When I was younger my father and his friend had a bus on display at the MetroCentre and I hated every minute of being there.

Our bus was a converted camper and one of the bedrooms had a sign on it saying no entry, and people completely ignored it and went in anyway.

I don't think I was older than 10 and I was getting shoved out of the way by people so they could get their crappy photo.

Honestly, the only positive memory I have of it was my haul of Arriva merch!

I had wondered if things had changed, but reading this it doesn't sound like it!

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Its quite sad to hear GNE getting hate, when they've always been the nicest bus company for enthusiasts, so what if a bus rally is turning into GNE rally atleast they care to turn up and offer their vehicles its more than SNE, ANE tend to do.

But avoiding signs is nothing new for enthusiasts, pretty sure there was an issue with the open day when people were going places which they weren't supposed to.

(09 May 2023, 7:35 am)streetdeckfan wrote One thing I've noticed in the 'bus scene' is that there's a lot of arrogance and sense of entitlement. It's one of the reasons I hate going to the events.

When I was younger my father and his friend had a bus on display at the MetroCentre and I hated every minute of being there.

Our bus was a converted camper and one of the bedrooms had a sign on it saying no entry, and people completely ignored it and went in anyway.

I don't think I was older than 10 and I was getting shoved out of the way by people so they could get their crappy photo.

Honestly, the only positive memory I have of it was my haul of Arriva merch!

I had wondered if things had changed, but reading this it doesn't sound like it!

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I don't think I've ever seen a sense of entitlement at any events, but I do think there's a level of mistrust between preservationists and those who attend the events, mainly based on a few isolated incidents. 

There's 'no entry' signs galore these days, mainly because of people thinking they've got free reign to use the emergency open button on the doors and have a look around. Whilst I get what the signs are trying to achieve, I've always thought the better option is to actually speak to people who are showing an interest in your exhibit and give them an opportunity to have a look round.

(09 May 2023, 7:58 am)Unber43 wrote Its quite sad to hear GNE getting hate, when they've always been the nicest bus company for enthusiasts, so what if a bus rally is turning into GNE rally atleast they care to turn up and offer their vehicles its more than SNE, ANE tend to do.

But avoiding signs is nothing new for enthusiasts, pretty sure there was an issue with the open day when people were going places which they weren't supposed to.

It shouldn't need to be about comparing them to anyone else. The more that participate in the event, the more people tend to get out of it. It's good that all three of the largest operators in the region have done so this year.

There has been, for a number of years now, a certain amount of snobbery towards Go North East bringing 'modern' buses to rallies. At times they've been accused of bringing too many buses, despite these being more attractive to the younger generation.

(08 May 2023, 6:06 pm)busmanT wrote I understand that as a result of “feedback” some GNE staff received at the event, GNE are considering ceasing to send vehicles to rallies. It doesn’t sound as if they are welcome.

Sounds like our lot aren't welcome either.

I don't believe that we have risk assessed MetroCentre to Beamish via Tanfield, nor was the driver obliged to take the open topper out on shuttles or out for a spin.

Heading out to the Scotswood Road via the Scotswood Bridge is covered by the 6/7 and 22 risk assessments.


There'll be more buses on show in MetroCentre Interchange next year... 

(09 May 2023, 8:15 am)Adrian wrote There has been, for a number of years now, a certain amount of snobbery towards Go North East bringing 'modern' buses to rallies. At times they've been accused of bringing too many buses, despite these being more attractive to the younger generation.

I for one have zero interest in older buses, the L94s are about as old as I can tolerate!

Then again, I don't see the point in going to an event to see the same buses I can play on with a day ticket!

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(09 May 2023, 10:04 am)streetdeckfan wrote I for one have zero interest in older buses, the L94s are about as old as I can tolerate!

Then again, I don't see the point in going to an event to see the same buses I can play on with a day ticket!

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I don't think you'd get very far telling the driver to get out of their seat, so you can get a photo in the cab, when out on a day ticket though! We shouldn't forget that some families take their kids along to these events, and that's literally what they want to do... sit in the drivers cab or have a good look around inside an empty bus, which they can't really do in service.

NEBPT generally do a good job of trying to cater for everyone.

(09 May 2023, 7:35 am)streetdeckfan wrote One thing I've noticed in the 'bus scene' is that there's a lot of arrogance and sense of entitlement. It's one of the reasons I hate going to the events.

When I was younger my father and his friend had a bus on display at the MetroCentre and I hated every minute of being there.

Our bus was a converted camper and one of the bedrooms had a sign on it saying no entry, and people completely ignored it and went in anyway.

I don't think I was older than 10 and I was getting shoved out of the way by people so they could get their crappy photo.

Honestly, the only positive memory I have of it was my haul of Arriva merch!

I had wondered if things had changed, but reading this it doesn't sound like it!

Sent from my SM-F721B using Tapatalk

Train events are worse. I was with a group at the Crewe Diesel Depot open day a few years ago, and we were just chatting when we were rudely told to move by someone so they could get a photo of a rusty old Class 47 which probably hadn't ran for about 20 years and wasn't even part of the event (https://www.flickr.com/photos/160759456@...datetaken/). Later I was told I'd "had enough time" looking at a steamer and had to move on - again, by someone just attending, not someone volunteering at the event or staff or whatever - I was just slowly walking around it.

(09 May 2023, 11:52 am)F114TML wrote Train events are worse. I was with a group at the Crewe Diesel Depot open day a few years ago, and we were just chatting when we were rudely told to move by someone so they could get a photo of a rusty old Class 47 which probably hadn't ran for about 20 years and wasn't even part of the event (https://www.flickr.com/photos/160759456@...datetaken/). Later I was told I'd "had enough time" looking at a steamer and had to move on - again, by someone just attending, not someone volunteering at the event or staff or whatever - I was just slowly walking around it.

No idea if it's connected and is merely just a hunch, but I wonder what the correlation is between 'spotters' and those on the autistic spectrum, who don't always have the social skills that others may expect.

I'm not saying the two are mutually exclusive, but it may go some way in explaining why there may be a reputation or perception around these events and indeed incidents talked about on this very forum over the years.

(09 May 2023, 1:18 pm)Andreos1 wrote No idea if it's connected and is merely just a hunch, but I wonder what the correlation is between 'spotters' and those on the autistic spectrum, who don't always have the social skills that others may expect.

I'm not saying the two are mutually exclusive, but it may go some way in explaining why there may be a reputation or perception around these events and indeed incidents talked about on this very forum over the years.

There's some correlation between some but not all spotters, certainly some of those incidents in the last few years have been a result of those on the spectrum but at the same time, not all of the incidents have been committed by those on the spectrum.

Some of the incidents have been spotters on the spectrum getting over excited making things being difficult to be around, at the Metrocentre rally one year, I narrowly missed being knocked to the ground over someone wanting to chase down a GNE bus, there's been instances of buses being entered without permission or even knowledge of the owner/driver.

Everyone on the spectrum acts and reacts differently, I for example and the rather quiet type that doesn't want to escalate or request for things even usually just as simple as politely asking if anyone would mind stepping aside so I can get a photo, whilst that's me, someone else will be the very opposite, last year at Howlands there was an incident where a certain iPad spotter very rudely told an old woman to shift who was stood next to a bus he wanted to photograph (believe this upset the woman in the process), some spotters (autistic or not) are murder for anything that disrupts a photo op, at a rally in the South East last year, I had someone stop to photograph a bus directly in front of me which blocked my shot, in a bid to attempt to get a photo I moved right without thinking, next thing I know, I've got about 8 spotters of mostly middle aged men and a few teenagers kicking off with me over this which whilst annoying was totally unwarranted IMO, worse still when I was already distraught by another incident shortly prior where veg attempted to rush to board an electric Volvo demo bus whilst a full bus load where having to alight and unfortunately I was the first and had to confront them to shift which ended up with a gaggle of teenagers giving me abuse (sure enough this was for nothing as bus went to park up again).

(09 May 2023, 7:58 am)Unber43 wrote Its quite sad to hear GNE getting hate, when they've always been the nicest bus company for enthusiasts, so what if a bus rally is turning into GNE rally atleast they care to turn up and offer their vehicles its more than SNE, ANE tend to do.

But avoiding signs is nothing new for enthusiasts, pretty sure there was an issue with the open day when people were going places which they weren't supposed to.

I'm pretty sure at least one of those was there.

(09 May 2023, 10:04 am)streetdeckfan wrote I for one have zero interest in older buses, the L94s are about as old as I can tolerate!

Then again, I don't see the point in going to an event to see the same buses I can play on with a day ticket!

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Same, im not one of older buses, but I like Cadets/ SPD/MPDs, and go as far back as 3945 but thats it for me.

(09 May 2023, 8:22 am)omnicity4659 wrote Sounds like our lot aren't welcome either.

I don't believe that we have risk assessed MetroCentre to Beamish via Tanfield, nor was the driver obliged to take the open topper out on shuttles or out for a spin.

Heading out to the Scotswood Road via the Scotswood Bridge is covered by the 6/7 and 22 risk assessments.


There'll be more buses on show in MetroCentre Interchange next year... 

This sort of ties into what Adrian was saying about the NEBPT removing the advertised shuttles, and to what I was saying about the NEBPT asserting some semblance of control over their own event.

While I appreciate things can always change at short notice, resulting in an attendee or two perhaps not showing up to the rally, there should be some general idea about which preservationists/operators are attending; which are likely to be static displays; and which are open to using their vehicles on shuttles and runs. The site can be organised accordingly with static displays in one place; and the vehicles doing runs in another. Details of where the runs/shuttles are going (including maps/explanation of services covering sections of the route) should be passed to the relevant parties who can then perform their own risk assessments, if necessary, before deciding whether to participate or not. Collate all the feedback received and, if there are not enough participants to do the runs/shuttles, don't advertise anything. If there are enough participants, make it clear that the advertised runs take priority, and if they deviate from the script (thus preventing a scheduled run from happening), they won't be allowed back on site. Unscheduled runs are only allowed if the scheduled runs are fulfilled. 

Some organisation along those lines should bring some order to the event. Enthusiasts can plan their day without potentially being stranded in the middle of nowhere; and NEBPT can manage the event more effectively.

(09 May 2023, 1:18 pm)Andreos1 wrote No idea if it's connected and is merely just a hunch, but I wonder what the correlation is between 'spotters' and those on the autistic spectrum, who don't always have the social skills that others may expect.

I'm not saying the two are mutually exclusive, but it may go some way in explaining why there may be a reputation or perception around these events and indeed incidents talked about on this very forum over the years.

The main difference being enthusiasts on the autistic spectrum are a lot more pleasant than some of the old dinosaurs who are nothing but rude who frequent open days on the railway in my experience more than bus events

(07 May 2023, 3:59 pm)pbjd wrote Very poorly organised I found, majority of the shuttles to Tanfield seemed to not operate and then other buses driving about for the sake of it with no forward planning.


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Agreed, I attended Easter Cumbria Rally (Brough and Kirkby Stephen) and Leyland National 51 (Whitehaven) in April and both were very well organised when it came to running buses around the local area.

NEBPT should take a page out of their book as their organisation skills aren’t the best sometimes.


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(09 May 2023, 3:19 pm)Unber43 wrote Same, im not one of older buses, but I like Cadets/ SPD/MPDs, and go as far back as 3945 but thats it for me.

You lot are making me feel REALLY old; the types you've listed are the modern ones just coming into service when my interest first time round started to wane!

REs and VRs are my memories, Olympians and Nationals a bit too modern, MWs and Lodekkas are the "old" stuff, and trips to London were to ride on the ubiquitous Routemasters whilst avoiding those Daimler things that they were touting as replacements .....