Going back to the discussion the other day about the X84/X85, I saw the 11:05 X84 arrival to Newcastle whilst on the A69 and it had a few standing passengers, so the service must be doing fairly well.

The X84 replaced the former 687 (which was operated by an MPD) and that was well-used and frequently had standing passengers (especially when the 685 broke down or ran late).

The current 687 shuttles between Hexham and Corbridge.

(16 Jul 2014, 12:28 pm)G-CPTN wrote The X84 replaced the former 687 (which was operated by an MPD) and that was well-used and frequently had standing passengers (especially when the 685 broke down or ran late).

The current 687 shuttles between Hexham and Corbridge.

"Tynedalexpress" service X85 was mainly introduced to compete with Arriva North East/Stagecoach Cumbria & North Lancs on their 685 service. At the time, the Stagecoach side was still being operated by high floor vehicles. Arriva had only introduced low-floor vehicles about two months beforehand - this is why Go North East heavily advertised the service as being 'low floor, with no difficult steps to climb'.

"Tynedalexpress" service X84 was introduced to replace "Tynedale Links" service 684, which at the time was operated by an MPD. It was thought that the service was performing well and could justify an upgrade - which is exactly what has happened, and the service has continued to grow.

"Tynedale Links" service 687 was also introduced at this time, running hourly between Highford Park, Wydon Park, Hexham, Beaufront and Corbridge. This in part also replaced "Tynedale Links" service 684.


Of the two, I do think that "Tynedalexpress" service X84 is still the better performer, but that is mainly down to the lack of competition on the route. In addition, it was not a new service - simply re-numbered - and its market was already established. "Tynedalexpress" service X85 has obviously had a more difficult time, what with competition from service 685. Customers have left service 685 in favour of Go North East's X85; whether that's down to the reliability (or lack thereof) of service 685 or the lack of customer perks such as free Wi-Fi, I do not know.

I do think that both services have proven themselves worthy of an upgrade, when the time is right. I don't think it'll happen this year, but should any Mercedes Citaro vehicles become available next year, I think we can put money on five being earmarked for this purpose.

Sorry about the confusion - Dan is correct, the previous service was 684.

In my mind as I used it between Hexham and Corbridge, it was the same as the replacement 687.

Yes, the Arriva 685 'coaches' were difficult for the elderly to access and, towards the end, were becoming unreliable (frequent overheating - possibly due to belt failures) and, even tyre tread failures (due, no doubt, to running underinflated on a twin). Even though I was an occasional user rather than a regular commuter I, nevertheless, had my share of breakdowns - not to mention numerous significant late runnings (typically 20 minutes).

On one occasion the MPD 684 picked up the 685 passengers from Corbridge (I had been on the 685 which 'terminated' at Corbridge Angel with a tyre blowout) and went on to pick up passengers until it became full (really full - there wasn't any room for any more standees) at Heddon and ran through to Eldon Square without being able to pick up any more passengers. I couldn't count the standees, but, believe me, there wasn't any room for more (there were people standing alongside the driver and in the door-opening space!).

The arrival of the GNE Tynedale Express services has certainly improved the availability for the traveller - up to three options per hour (four as far as Corbidge) means that there are alternatives if the 685 doesn't show up.

The GNE services run 'behind' the (scheduled) 685s but offer a back-up (and an alternative).

Just to pick up on the passengers/revenue/bums on seats discussion again.

I was on a 21 earlier and I was easily the youngest person on the bus (apart from the toddler sat with a grandparent).
The rest of the passengers who boarded at Eldon Sq and points onwards to Gateshead were all pass holders (down stairs was full).
An older guy used his key to board the bus later on and a guy in his fifties had some sort of pass too.

A lot disembarked at Gateshead having used the bus to get over the river and only a couple of cash fares were taken beyond this point.

On a different note, it looks like the old rear destination screens from vehicles departed are being used - at least one Cadet from Washington has a retro look to it.

(16 Jul 2014, 3:55 pm)Andreos Constantopolous wrote Just to pick up on the passengers/revenue/bums on seats discussion again.

I was on a 21 earlier and I was easily the youngest person on the bus (apart from the toddler sat with a grandparent).
The rest of the passengers who boarded at Eldon Sq and points onwards to Gateshead were all pass holders (down stairs was full).
An older guy used his key to board the bus later on and a guy in his fifties had some sort of pass too.

A lot disembarked at Gateshead having used the bus to get over the river and only a couple of cash fares were taken beyond this point.

On a different note, it looks like the old rear destination screens from vehicles departed are being used - at least one Cadet from Washington has a retro look to it.

Are you talking about the Cadets having flipdot screens on the rear? One or two of the 8242-46 batch has 'em too.

If so, they have done for ages now - it's just a case of finding one of the very few which actually works.

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(16 Jul 2014, 4:05 pm)Dan wrote Are you talking about the Cadets having flipdot screens on the rear? One or two of the 8242-46 batch has 'em too.

If so, they have done for ages now - it's just a case of finding one of the very few which actually works.

Aye, flip dots at the back.
Never noticed them before - ever, so naturally presumed they had been fitted recently.

(16 Jul 2014, 3:55 pm)Andreos Constantopolous wrote Just to pick up on the passengers/revenue/bums on seats discussion again.

I was on a 21 earlier and I was easily the youngest person on the bus (apart from the toddler sat with a grandparent).
The rest of the passengers who boarded at Eldon Sq and points onwards to Gateshead were all pass holders (down stairs was full).
An older guy used his key to board the bus later on and a guy in his fifties had some sort of pass too.

A lot disembarked at Gateshead having used the bus to get over the river and only a couple of cash fares were taken beyond this point.

On a different note, it looks like the old rear destination screens from vehicles departed are being used - at least one Cadet from Washington has a retro look to it.

It always amazes me just how many people actually make the short hop from Newcastle to Gateshead - even on the express routes, there's often folk getting off at the Heed.

(15 Jul 2014, 6:28 pm)Andreos Constantopolous wrote Imagine if the tickets were reasonably priced for people living in the region?
Numbers could have been even higher!

And walk several miles to town?

You've got to remember that, out here, with an extremely limited bus service, people don't really care about money - it's shut up or put up.

5214 is on 39 caught a shot at it at park lane 5213 was on X36 but vehicle broke down and returned to Deptford 646 was on 8 then 78

(16 Jul 2014, 12:38 pm)Dan wrote Of the two, I do think that "Tynedalexpress" service X84 is still the better performer, but that is mainly down to the lack of competition on the route. In addition, it was not a new service - simply re-numbered - and its market was already established. "Tynedalexpress" service X85 has obviously had a more difficult time, what with competition from service 685. Customers have left service 685 in favour of Go North East's X85; whether that's down to the reliability (or lack thereof) of service 685 or the lack of customer perks such as free Wi-Fi, I do not know.

I do think that both services have proven themselves worthy of an upgrade, when the time is right. I don't think it'll happen this year, but should any Mercedes Citaro vehicles become available next year, I think we can put money on five being earmarked for this purpose.

I personally think GNE should swap round the X84 and X85 to opposite ends of the clock. Whenever I'm on a day trip to Newcastle/North East, my 685 arrives into Hexham at xx:22. An X85 then leaves at xx:05, perfect - it doesn't serve Throckley or Walbottle etc. (Something that absolutely infuriates me on 685, especially when they have a frequent service as it is!!). However, you've got to wait 45 minutes for this privilage; the 685 would be in Newcastle for then.

The alternative is to wait for the xx:48 X84 over, which goes around the houses. For direct Hexham to Newcastle passengers (granted there are people who live out Ovingham/Ovington/Wylam way, but as I see it, the Tynedalexpress is mostly focussed on 685 competition), this is slower than 685 and more sodding annoying!!

If they could time it so an X85 leaves Hexham around 10-15 minutes after the 685 is due in, I could see it having and winning a lot more competition.

Pretty much, the same happens the other way - 685s leave Eldon Square at xx:45 with an X84 at xx:40. If the xx:40 was an X85, a small break could be had in Hexham with you missing out Throckley etc. Additionally, you wouldn't have to battle your way onto the bus amongst crowds who travel only to Throckley (grrrr). You have to get the xx:10 which missed the 685 at Hexham by approximately 15-20 minutes.


More folk use Tynedalexpress due to the cheaper day and weekly tickets than Arriva - this is what all Jesmond 685 drivers that I've spoken to say.
An upgrade would be smashing, I'm not too sure how long the Scanias will last for, doing full speed on the X85 on the A69...


The sooner GNE pick up the 685/85 from Arriva and Stagecoach and create a fully integrated system, with no unfair (to the customer) competition and cutbacks, the better IMO. There is great scope for it to be a success under the right ownership!

After travelling down the A19 on a coach today, I strongly suggest that GNE consider either single deck coaches with a frequency increase or double deck coaches for the TTX. The A19 can be very demanding at times and I can see why buses can be unreliable on the TTX. The only bus that can cope with the A19 going against DDA is the Palatine. Coaches would be far better suited despite the higher cost but, they also look newer and last longer than service buses.

(16 Jul 2014, 5:52 pm)DaveyBowyer wrote After travelling down the A19 on a coach today, I strongly suggest that GNE consider either single deck coaches with a frequency increase or double deck coaches for the TTX. The A19 can be very demanding at times and I can see why buses can be unreliable on the TTX. The only bus that can cope with the A19 going against DDA is the Palatine. Coaches would be far better suited despite the higher cost but, they also look newer and last longer than service buses.

Are DDA-compliant, step-free coaches properly available?

Not step free but probably with lifts or something I reckon!

(16 Jul 2014, 5:52 pm)DaveyBowyer wrote After travelling down the A19 on a coach today, I strongly suggest that GNE consider either single deck coaches with a frequency increase or double deck coaches for the TTX. The A19 can be very demanding at times and I can see why buses can be unreliable on the TTX. The only bus that can cope with the A19 going against DDA is the Palatine. Coaches would be far better suited despite the higher cost but, they also look newer and last longer than service buses.

Van Hool Astromegas would be Perfect of the TTX, Coped no bother up the A19 to Middlesbrough from Sunderland(Seaham), And onto Leeds, Furthermore the Astromega I got on Last Wednesday at 06:25am from Newcastle to London, was the same Vehicle I got on coming back from Leeds, Obviously that proves they can cope with the Route of the TTX with no problem at, only problem would be the Cost of 6 Vehicles.

(16 Jul 2014, 5:52 pm)DaveyBowyer wrote After travelling down the A19 on a coach today, I strongly suggest that GNE consider either single deck coaches with a frequency increase or double deck coaches for the TTX. The A19 can be very demanding at times and I can see why buses can be unreliable on the TTX. The only bus that can cope with the A19 going against DDA is the Palatine. Coaches would be far better suited despite the higher cost but, they also look newer and last longer than service buses.

It would turn out to be inconvenient because, if for whatever reason a bus breaks down and they need to allocate a branded bus (not like it should ever happen but as we all know, it does), would they want to allocate a coach to a route that doesnt need them because its standing spare and is closest to the actual incident while out of service? It reduces the depots flexibility with buses.

(14 Jul 2014, 1:17 pm)Dan wrote Looks like they're starting paint prep for 4910 too, but they did this last time it was due in for repaint as well...

Just to confirm, as I forgot to earlier this week, Volvo B10BLE 4910 has now been repainted into corporate livery.

Likewise, Volvo B10BLE 4905 has been given a freshen up repaint into corporate livery - another Northern bites the dust.

(16 Jul 2014, 6:39 pm)NEBCD Malarkey wrote Van Hool Astromegas would be Perfect of the TTX, Coped no bother up the A19 to Middlesbrough from Sunderland(Seaham), And onto Leeds, Furthermore the Astromega I got on Last Wednesday at 06:25am from Newcastle to London, was the same Vehicle I got on coming back from Leeds, Obviously that proves they can cope with the Route of the TTX with no problem at, only problem would be the Cost of 6 Vehicles.

What they could do is set a life span of 12 years with a mid life refurb at 6 - 7 years.

(16 Jul 2014, 6:54 pm)DaveyBowyer wrote What they could do is set a life span of 12 years with a mid life refurb at 6 - 7 years.

For the record, full sized single deckers (49xx/52xx/53xx fleet numbers) have a shell life of 15 years.
Midi/mini-sized single deckers have a shell life of 12 years (5xx,6xx,82xx/83xx fleet numbers).

A coach like that would have to have a shell life of at least 18 years.

(16 Jul 2014, 6:45 pm)Robert wrote It would turn out to be inconvenient because, if for whatever reason a bus breaks down and they need to allocate a branded bus (not like it should ever happen but as we all know, it does), would they want to allocate a coach to a route that doesnt need them because its standing spare and is closest to the actual incident while out of service? It reduces the depots flexibility with buses.

If coaches were bought and if a buggy bay was added:
- 6043, 6044 and 6045 would make up the PVR on the 21.
- 6046 would make up the PVR on the TEN now at 14.
- 6047 would become spare for the Red Arrows.
- 6048 would become 1 spare for the TEN.
- 1 B7 would swap with 6099 acting as another spare for the TEN.
- 1 B7 would swap with 6100 acting as another spare for the Red Arrows.
- 6116 and 6117 would swap with 3962 and 3965 and act as spares for the 21.
- 3 B7's would be released.

(16 Jul 2014, 7:01 pm)DaveyBowyer wrote If coaches were bought and if a buggy bay was added:
- 6043, 6044 and 6045 would make up the PVR on the 21.
- 6046 would make up the PVR on the TEN now at 14.
- 6047 would become spare for the Red Arrows.
- 6048 would become 1 spare for the TEN.
- 1 B7 would swap with 6099 acting as another spare for the TEN.
- 1 B7 would swap with 6100 acting as another spare for the Red Arrows.
- 6116 and 6117 would swap with 3962 and 3965 and act as spares for the 21.
- 3 B7's would be released.

Some of these B7s been freed up would probably withdraw a few non-DDA compliant deckers, therefore despite me perfectly understanding what you're saying, i still think that the element of inconvenience will still be existant. Sorry for disagreeing with you and please, dont think im trying to start an argument, its just my point of view and could be wrong.

(16 Jul 2014, 4:49 pm)Andreos Constantopolous wrote Aye, flip dots at the back.
Never noticed them before - ever, so naturally presumed they had been fitted recently.

Cadets 8242-52 were delivered new with flip dots all round.

Once they lost GNE livery in favour of branding, they gained LED displays on fronts only, keeping flip dot on side and rear.

Most of the rear screens now show nothing, so if you see one that works, it is probably just shock to actually see it working.

(16 Jul 2014, 7:20 pm)park5354 wrote Cadets 8242-52 were delivered new with flip dots all round.

Once they lost GNE livery in favour of branding, they gained LED displays on fronts only, keeping flip dot on side and rear.

Most of the rear screens now show nothing, so if you see one that works, it is probably just shock to actually see it working.

8242's rear flipdot works

(16 Jul 2014, 6:49 pm)Dan wrote Just to confirm, as I forgot to earlier this week, Volvo B10BLE 4910 has now been repainted into corporate livery.

Likewise, Volvo B10BLE 4905 has been given a freshen up repaint into corporate livery - another Northern bites the dust.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rY0WxgSXdEE

(16 Jul 2014, 7:01 pm)DaveyBowyer wrote If coaches were bought and if a buggy bay was added...

I'm not trying to be awkward, but what's the point? If you've got a buggy, you'd probably just fold it up and carry it up the stairs rather than sit on the wheelchair ramp (which takes significantly longer to operate than a manual ramp on something like a Versa) with it. I'm not sure you're allowed buggies to be up on the Tyne-Tees Express anyway, except for the Heworth to Newcastle part.

(16 Jul 2014, 9:34 pm)BJ10VUS wrote I'm not trying to be awkward, but what's the point? If you've got a buggy, you'd probably just fold it up and carry it up the stairs rather than sit on the wheelchair ramp (which takes significantly longer to operate than a manual ramp on something like a Versa) with it. I'm not sure you're allowed buggies to be up on the Tyne-Tees Express anyway, except for the Heworth to Newcastle part.

No, I meant buggy bay added to 6043 to 6048vifbthey were removed of the TTX.

Hasn't it been said many a time that the costs of the coaches just wouldn't justify the service. As well as this what needs to be kept in mind is where they get cascaded

(16 Jul 2014, 11:31 pm)Wellsey18 wrote Hasn't it been said many a time that the costs of the coaches just wouldn't justify the service. As well as this what needs to be kept in mind is where they get cascaded

I suppose they could go elsewhere in the Go Ahead Group or everyone's favourite Ensign

But they would last 12 year though with a mid life refurb.