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(14 Dec 2012, 3:39 pm)Liam wrote Northern Prestige 4988 (R983 FNW) on the X21
Tyne Tees Xpress Gemini 3963 (NK06 JXG) on the X66
Northern Gemini 3964 (NK06 JXC) on the 24
Northern Renown's 4915 (X915 WGR) and 4923 (X923 WGR) on the 49's
Northern Volvo B7TL/East Lancs 3972 (PJ02PYY) on the 27
And a Crusader Renown on the 53 (Unsure of fleet number)
All of that just passing through Gateshead
Hope the driver of 3826 is ok, never easy being in a traffic accident. Volvo 6020 was on the 35 today too, was running in front of the 99 I was on from Royal Hospital to Park Lane arriving at about 1pm. There was a Laser Citaro parked at Park Lane not in service, so that could have been to relieve 6020.
(15 Dec 2012, 8:22 pm)Brandon wrote Great photos!Cheers. Driver was nowhere to be seen when I arrived [to my memory] - just the guys in the trucks.
(15 Dec 2012, 9:57 pm)Brandon wrote That is strange for so early in the morning! There is a diversionary route still on at Castletown which does cause some disruption but I wouldn't have expected a 30 minute delay that early in the morning! The Renown must have been taken off because the allocation later in the day was two Vykings, "The Key" branded SPD, and a Northern Cadet. Sorry I just realised got my timings wrong, I got the 99 which was a Vyking at 1pm from Hylton Castle, arriving at Park Lane at about 1:30pm which was following 6020 on the 35. Going from your timings, that would have been the duty that the Renown would have worked had it stayed on.
(15 Dec 2012, 8:29 pm)Daniel wrote(15 Dec 2012, 8:22 pm)Brandon wrote Great photos!Cheers. Driver was nowhere to be seen when I arrived [to my memory] - just the guys in the trucks.
Can't remember when I saw a Vyking work the 35 today - it was either at 13:30ish or 17:15ish... Only times I was at Park Lane! :L
Ooh, regarding the 99... This morning, I was at Chester Road at about 08:40am [I like my early mornings - I had set out at around 08:00am]... The 08:10am 99 and the 08:35am 99 were both running together - the former being a Renown and the latter being a Vyking - how the hell could the driver of the former been 30 minutes late?!
(16 Dec 2012, 2:47 pm)W179SCU wrote I am thinking of coming up to Sunderland on Sunday. Is there anything different?
(18 Dec 2012, 9:25 pm)Daniel wrote Latest News:
- The additional Mercedes Citaro artic, 5357: BX54 UCO, has been withdrawn from service because the internal layout is unsuitable for Go North East use without modification.
- SPD 8221: V221 ERG has been transferred from Deptford to Stanley.
Apologies for not uploading pictures to my Flickr yesterday - in the process of captioning 'em now. Josh and I spotted a President on the 56 today but I think that was about as 'unusual' as it got, unfortunately! Plenty of pictures to go around when we upload 'em - Josh has quite a fair amount more than me to upload!
(18 Dec 2012, 9:27 pm)W179SCU wrote(18 Dec 2012, 9:25 pm)Daniel wrote Latest News:
- The additional Mercedes Citaro artic, 5357: BX54 UCO, has been withdrawn from service because the internal layout is unsuitable for Go North East use without modification.
- SPD 8221: V221 ERG has been transferred from Deptford to Stanley.
Apologies for not uploading pictures to my Flickr yesterday - in the process of captioning 'em now. Josh and I spotted a President on the 56 today but I think that was about as 'unusual' as it got, unfortunately! Plenty of pictures to go around when we upload 'em - Josh has quite a fair amount more than me to upload!
I am so annoyed I could not have joined you! - Sadly, I was stuck in a stupid classroom
(19 Dec 2012, 8:18 am)Wellsey18 wrote So are the ex-London B10BLE's on the 17 at the minute getting branded soon or are they staying yellow?
Daniel Graham:
Hi there – my name is Daniel Graham and I am a bus enthusiast whose local depot is Deptford. I regularly go out to take pictures of buses, and I have a few questions to ask you, which usually on a Wednesday, I wouldn’t get the chance to ask [due to educational commitments].
Since the 11/11/12, when a lot of Go North East’s routes were evaluated and changed accordingly, I have noticed that allocations have – to be blunt – “gone to pot”. While I understand that some of these allocations could be due to services now interlinking on mornings and/or evenings which they previously didn’t, I do not understand the way it is being done. A prime example I can think of off-hand is the 61 and 38/38A/38B services. Lately, the 38/38/38B services have been using “Drifter” branded DAF SB120/Wright Cadets which should be used on the 61 service [see picture below]:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/danielgraha...otostream/
Because of this, the 61 has been short of its usual “Drifter” branded Cadets and has been receiving “Northern” branded Cadets. Now, if I’m honest, wouldn’t it be a more feasible idea to put the “Northern” branded Cadets on the 38/38A/38B services for the bulk of the day for them to later move onto the 61 service, and the “Drifter” branded Cadets on the 61 et cetera?
Another service which has seemingly been having the same problem is the 20. “Simplicity” branded Optare Versas – used on services 36 and 42 – have been making their way onto the 20/20A services. Admittedly, this example is not as prevalent and has only had pictures uploaded to Flickr of its occurrence twice or so in the past few weeks [unlike the 38/38A/38B whose entirety is seemingly of “Drifter” branded Cadets instead of “Northern” ones.
On the subject of allocations, I would like to confirm one of my many hypothesises regarding the X66 and its odd allocations as of late. As you can see on the image linked below, the X66 has been receiving “Tyne Tees eXpress” branded Eclipse Geminis on its service recently. My hypothesis was that – because this bus was seemingly not running to any form of timetable – it is merely being provided by Go North East to allow more frequent travel to the Metrocentre. Is this correct?
Another question asked by the community of North East bus enthusiasts was, ‘Are the ex-London B10BLE's on the 17 at the minute getting branded soon or are they staying yellow?’; while we are on that subject, will the 9 be receiving any sort of branding soon? The buses which are used on the service are nice vehicles, and if these vehicles are going to stay on the service permanently, it would be sensible to brand them up, right? The buses which used to be used on the service have been partially de-branded and frequently make their way onto the “Coaster” 1 service. Putting the incorrect allocation aside, the vehicle’s branding itself looks rather odd indeed, and it is increasingly becoming more and more irritating by the day, for de-branding a vehicle on one side and not the rest seems a little illogical, don’t you think?
Another problem which has recently arisen is the announcements system on the “Angel” 21 service. Many people have complained about these announcements on the Go North East Facebook page, and while some were more funny than including informative feedback, I would like to hear what your opinions are on the announcements, and any updates on [possibly] improving them. Although I have not witnessed the announcements system yet, as I have had no reason to board an “Angel” 21 bus in the past week or so, it has been described as 'loud, intrusive and irritating', for every few minutes, passengers hear the 'incessant droning of two Metro Radio DJ's shouting "Wakey Wakey" and telling us the next stop'. Below is a rather funny [in my opinion] wall post recently wrote on Go North East’s Facebook page, I think it sums up the announcement system “update” for everyone who uses the “Angel” 21 service:
"What's the chances of losing the droning DJs from the 21? It WAS eventually quite a nice bus trip when the hybrids came into force, but now you get them two chattering on in your ear "We're now approaching Low Fell" (as we head into Birtley!) "If you want to get off, ring the bell" Really?!??! I thought the bell was to summon the stewardess for more hot towels..... Get rid please!"
While this must irritate passengers a great deal [especially if travelling from Durham to Newcastle or vice versa], I can't imagine how irritating it must be for the driver who has to sit through it for multiple runs up and down..!
I’d also like to ask if this is why recently, “Northern” branded double deckers have made their way onto the service? Is it because some of the other vehicles are undergoing the “update” so depots are short of “Angel” branded vehicles?
Finally, I’d like to pass on a few service suggestions members of the bus enthusiast community have brought up. It is written by the original poster – I have not edited the wording at all:
“I'd like to see the "Tyne Tees eXpress" services re-routed to include Sunderland. Though this would increase the journey time by approximately 40 minutes or so, I think this would be better.
These (improved) services could then replace Sunderland's X3 service, allowing the current Citaros and/or Renowns to be used on another service (such as the one you suggested) or to replace smaller vehicles (such as MPDs) on the 39 service.
In addition to it replacing the X3 and ultimately being a lot better (further buses after 6pm or so when the X3s finish), it could provide an additional direct service to Peterlee - the 202 would still operate to cover those stops the X9/X10 don't due to it being a limited stop service.
Those who want to stop before Boldon should use the 26 or 9 services.
Oh yeah, and this would hopefully provide a more reliable timetable. The X9/X10 services rarely have waiting time at Newcastle as they should. With the additional 10 minutes or so waiting time required at Newcastle for the timings to work as they should, the driver would actually get the waiting time!”
When asked about which route this service would take, the poster replied:
“In an idealistic situation, they would cover the same route as the X3 from Newcastle to Park Lane - it would still serve Gateshead, Heworth and Boldon, but would not serve places like Fulwell etc that the current X3 service does. Should members of the public wish to alight the bus there, they should use an alternative service (ie the 26 or 9, as mentioned above). So, we can conclude as the service is missing out a series of stops, it will take less than 53 minutes to get from Newcastle to Sunderland as the current X3 does, and perhaps, more like 45 minutes.
From Sunderland, the service would not stop until it got to Peterlee. To get to Peterlee, it would follow the same route as the 60/61 etc to Ryhope. From Ryhope, it isn't so difficult to navigate its way back onto the A19. Perhaps this would take approximately 25 minutes from Sunderland to Peterlee? From there, the services could resume their normal regimes... The X9 serves Peterlee, while the X10 doesn't, and the X10 serves Stockton while the X9 does not.
If, for whatever reason, this was ever suggested to GNE and they decided to elaborate on this suggestion... They could work it so the X9 serves Sunderland and misses Peterlee and Stockton while the X10 doesn't serve Sunderland but serves both Peterlee and Stockton?
Meh, I don't know. Always thought it stupid that the X9/X10 don't serve Sunderland though.”
Another suggestion is shown below:
“Service 73: Go North East/Nexus
The Service currently does Coach Road Estate/Concord – Teal Farm – Sunderland, i think more people would use it if NEXUS, extended this from concord to Washington Galleries also change its route from Park Lane to Castletown by letting go down towards Fawcett Street and then past the Town Bridge and on to its current route to Castletown all its missing out is Green Terrance towards Castletown, it could still go that way on its route back in to Park Lane, would add a extra time on but it might make the usage more.
So my route would be...
Park lane - Fawcett Street - St Mary's way - Queen Alexandra Bridge,Sunderland Enterprise Park east end, Hylton Riverside Retail Park,Sunderland Ent Pk, Defender Ct, Castletown,Sunrise Enterprise Park, Waterview Park,Teal Farm estate,Washington District 15 Exit,Peel Retail Park, Sulgrave,Washington Concord Bus Station,Coach Road Estate - Washington Galleries
The way back would be the same untill it gets to st Marys way and it does its current route to park lane.. Via Green Terrance”
Another suggestion is as follows:
“What I'd love to see for the 135/136 is for it changed into the 99A from Sunderland right round to Seaburn, but instead of turning into Morrisons, have it terminate at South Bents Estate. The PVR would remain the same at 2, but it would provide an evening/Sunday link on the Stagecoach 18/19 route between South Bents, Seaburn, Fulwell, Thompson Road, Southwick, Pallion and Royal Hospital. Nexus have said that they cannot afford an evening/Sunday service on the 18/19, but this would cover a part of the route at no extra cost. Go North East and Stagecoach already run frequent 20 minute services to North Sunderland from the City Centre on Sundays on 3/4/13/16/56, no need for the hourly 135/136 too.”
Thanks for your time. I understand that this is quite a lengthy question – with about five other questions packed into it – so it may take you quite some time to answer them all. I also understand you may not be capable of answering some of the questions yourself yet as they haven’t been thought about by Go North East as a company yet! Cheers.
Martin Harris:
Hello, welcome to the Go North East Open Line facility - your question/query will be selected by one of our senior managers or directors, then you will enter into a window allowing private one to one communication.
Daniel Graham:
Hah, if I were them, I'd be putting it off! Seems like it'll take them more of a cuppa coffee to answer it.
Martin Harris:
No I'm still here, just dealing with three other callers too. Please give me a moment.
Daniel Graham:
I was joking
Martin Harris:
No worries. You aRE RIGHT OUR BRAND ALLOCATION HAS BEEN STRETCHED A BIT IN THE LAST FEW WEEKS DUE TO SOME TEMPORARY ISSUES BUT A LOT OF STEPS ARE IN PLACE TO GET IT BACK ON TRACK AND YOU SEE A MARKED IMPROVEMENT IN THE COMING WEEKS (CAPS NOT INTENTIONAL)
Martin Harris:
Daniel you have raised a number of issues in you email and this requires some more careful reading than is possible in this quick fire "open Line" facility. if you are able to leave your line open I will keep returning to your questions and answer them as quickly as possible whilst answering other customers messages.
Martin Harris:
YES WE HAVE BEEN USING ADDITIONAL BUSES FOR THE X66 TO HELP CHRISTMAS SHOPPERS. WHICH VEHICLE WILL VARY FROM DAY TO DAY.
Martin Harris:
Daniel a lot of your questions are very much "enthusiast questions" and this facility is really for customers queries. On the Angel next stop announcement system it is clear that it hasn't worked as well as planned or as it works on Quaylink and Red Arrows, so we are fixing it. My colleague is out there as we speak reviewing the content, the volume, the way it comes across with customers and we will be changing it as soon as possible.
Daniel Graham:
Do enthusiasts have a place to ask questions such as the ones I have regarding specific vehicles?
Martin Harris:
if we had the resources we would run a dedicated enthusiasts online session but there are just too many other priorities at the moment. it is something I would like to do in the near future though.
Daniel Graham:
Can their questions be answered by e-mail, as opposed to asking on this Open Line session?
Daniel Graham:
Also, I don't think the questions regarding service suggestions are too heavily based on the "enthusiast" side rather than the "customer". One Mick Foo Parker has just been advised to speak to come to the Open Line session if he wanted to speak to management regarding a service suggestion. Perhaps the questions regarding specific vehicles are, though with a brand name applied to a service, it usually improves a little, so it could be considered a customer question too..! Nonetheless, I thank you for your replies up to now.
Martin Harris:
Suggestions are always welcome - its just the practicalities of responding to a large number of suggestions relating to a wide variety of services and issues in a single burst during what is often a hectic open line session. Your suggestions will be passed to our service designers and given full consideration along with those from any other customer. in terms of emailing suggestions about services, that is what our customer services team is for to provide the interface between users and planners and mangers. it works well most of the time as we have many examples of where services or plans to change them have been significantly influenced by suggestions from users.
Daniel Graham:
Thanks again. Have you anything in response to the queries regarding the branding and/or de-branding of services I mentioned in my OP?
Martin Harris:
we have recently debranded 9 amongst other service to ease some branding pressures and 17 is going to be branded - as a rule we won't be branding any more routes with low pvrs - they will need at least 5 or 6 to justify branding. we now have about 50 brand as you know and we are mindful of reaching saturation point for customers as well as the logistical issues. You appear to have some talent as a bus planner - are you studying transport or working in transport?
Daniel Graham:
It appears that, in some pictures enthusiasts have recently taken, some of the 9's vehicles have only been partially debranded. Thanks for confirming the 17 being branded. Ah, I had always wondered how you decided which services were to be branded and which weren't.
Daniel Graham:
I don't study transport or work with it, but I consider myself to be one of the North East's biggest bus enthusiasts.
Martin Harris:
I see. well thanks for getting in touch. Your suggestions are being passed to our service designers to consider. Regards Martin Harris
Daniel Graham:
Thanks a lot, Martin.
(19 Dec 2012, 4:12 pm)W179SCU wrote Nice to know the 17 is getting a brand.
Do you know if the 38's are getting branded as the Drifter?
(19 Dec 2012, 4:25 pm)Daniel wrote(19 Dec 2012, 4:12 pm)W179SCU wrote Nice to know the 17 is getting a brand.
Do you know if the 38's are getting branded as the Drifter?
The 38/38A/38B has a PVR of three if my maths is correct, so given what I was told during that Open Line, no.
The 38 [on mornings and evenings] requires less vehicles than it does during the day, when it is the 38A/38B. With that in mind, I believe the 61 shares some vehicles with the 38. Said vehicles are put onto the 38A/38B and then on the evening, go back to the 61.
Common sense would tell you to make the morning/evening vehicles "Northern" branded, and the ones during the day [on the 61] "Drifter" branded ones, so the 61 retains its brand and doesn't have to go "Northern". According to Martin, it's already a known problem and they hope to get it fixed within the coming weeks though!
(19 Dec 2012, 4:27 pm)W179SCU wrote(19 Dec 2012, 4:25 pm)Daniel wrote(19 Dec 2012, 4:12 pm)W179SCU wrote Nice to know the 17 is getting a brand.
Do you know if the 38's are getting branded as the Drifter?
The 38/38A/38B has a PVR of three if my maths is correct, so given what I was told during that Open Line, no.
The 38 [on mornings and evenings] requires less vehicles than it does during the day, when it is the 38A/38B. With that in mind, I believe the 61 shares some vehicles with the 38. Said vehicles are put onto the 38A/38B and then on the evening, go back to the 61.
Common sense would tell you to make the morning/evening vehicles "Northern" branded, and the ones during the day [on the 61] "Drifter" branded ones, so the 61 retains its brand and doesn't have to go "Northern". According to Martin, it's already a known problem and they hope to get it fixed within the coming weeks though!
Aright - Cheers
(19 Dec 2012, 5:25 pm)dans_bus_photos wrote(19 Dec 2012, 4:27 pm)W179SCU wrote(19 Dec 2012, 4:25 pm)Daniel wrote(19 Dec 2012, 4:12 pm)W179SCU wrote Nice to know the 17 is getting a brand.
Do you know if the 38's are getting branded as the Drifter?
The 38/38A/38B has a PVR of three if my maths is correct, so given what I was told during that Open Line, no.
The 38 [on mornings and evenings] requires less vehicles than it does during the day, when it is the 38A/38B. With that in mind, I believe the 61 shares some vehicles with the 38. Said vehicles are put onto the 38A/38B and then on the evening, go back to the 61.
Common sense would tell you to make the morning/evening vehicles "Northern" branded, and the ones during the day [on the 61] "Drifter" branded ones, so the 61 retains its brand and doesn't have to go "Northern". According to Martin, it's already a known problem and they hope to get it fixed within the coming weeks though!
Aright - Cheers
The 38s interwork with the 61s during the day with a PVR of 8! Thats why the drifter cadets are on there every day.
(19 Dec 2012, 6:00 pm)Daniel wrote(19 Dec 2012, 5:25 pm)dans_bus_photos wrote(19 Dec 2012, 4:27 pm)W179SCU wrote(19 Dec 2012, 4:25 pm)Daniel wrote(19 Dec 2012, 4:12 pm)W179SCU wrote Nice to know the 17 is getting a brand.
Do you know if the 38's are getting branded as the Drifter?
The 38/38A/38B has a PVR of three if my maths is correct, so given what I was told during that Open Line, no.
The 38 [on mornings and evenings] requires less vehicles than it does during the day, when it is the 38A/38B. With that in mind, I believe the 61 shares some vehicles with the 38. Said vehicles are put onto the 38A/38B and then on the evening, go back to the 61.
Common sense would tell you to make the morning/evening vehicles "Northern" branded, and the ones during the day [on the 61] "Drifter" branded ones, so the 61 retains its brand and doesn't have to go "Northern". According to Martin, it's already a known problem and they hope to get it fixed within the coming weeks though!
Aright - Cheers
The 38s interwork with the 61s during the day with a PVR of 8! Thats why the drifter cadets are on there every day.
Where have you gotten eight from?
See below for how I worked out the PVR:
1: #38A - Departs S/land: 10:14am, Arrives & Departs Esdale Est: 10:35am, Arrives S/land: 10:55am... Changes into 38B, due to depart 10:59.
2: #38B - Departs S/land: 10:29am, Arrives & Departs Tunstall Bank Est: 10:50am, Arrives S/land: 11:10am... Changes into 38A, due to depart at 11:14.
3: #38A - Departs S/land: 10:44am, Arrives & Departs Esdale Est: 11:05am, Arrives S/land: 11:25am... Changes into 38B, due to depart at 11:29.
That's all of the duties covered, is it not?
__
As a side note - but still related - Deptford have nine Cadets now in total... Five of those are "Drifter" branded, and four, "Northern". One "Northern" branded Cadet has been on the 60 every day for the past week or so, as opposed to the usual "Drifter" branded Versa, leaving eight Cadets in total left for the services in question. Given that [very recently] no "Northern" branded SPDs have made their way onto the 38/38A/38B/61 [a lot have been on the 39/20/20A/99 instead] and Renowns have all been kept occupied on the X3 service apart from the spare one which has either been on the 35 [or its variations] or 56, we know that all vehicles must have been used because the 61 has a PVR of 5, and the 38/38A/38B, a PVR of 3. 8 Cadets, and a PVR total of 8 between ALL routes - 38A/38B/61... Not just the 38A/38B.
(20 Dec 2012, 7:14 am)dans_bus_photos wrote(19 Dec 2012, 6:00 pm)Daniel wrote(19 Dec 2012, 5:25 pm)dans_bus_photos wrote(19 Dec 2012, 4:27 pm)W179SCU wrote(19 Dec 2012, 4:25 pm)Daniel wrote The 38/38A/38B has a PVR of three if my maths is correct, so given what I was told during that Open Line, no.
The 38 [on mornings and evenings] requires less vehicles than it does during the day, when it is the 38A/38B. With that in mind, I believe the 61 shares some vehicles with the 38. Said vehicles are put onto the 38A/38B and then on the evening, go back to the 61.
Common sense would tell you to make the morning/evening vehicles "Northern" branded, and the ones during the day [on the 61] "Drifter" branded ones, so the 61 retains its brand and doesn't have to go "Northern". According to Martin, it's already a known problem and they hope to get it fixed within the coming weeks though!
Aright - Cheers
The 38s interwork with the 61s during the day with a PVR of 8! Thats why the drifter cadets are on there every day.
Where have you gotten eight from?
See below for how I worked out the PVR:
1: #38A - Departs S/land: 10:14am, Arrives & Departs Esdale Est: 10:35am, Arrives S/land: 10:55am... Changes into 38B, due to depart 10:59.
2: #38B - Departs S/land: 10:29am, Arrives & Departs Tunstall Bank Est: 10:50am, Arrives S/land: 11:10am... Changes into 38A, due to depart at 11:14.
3: #38A - Departs S/land: 10:44am, Arrives & Departs Esdale Est: 11:05am, Arrives S/land: 11:25am... Changes into 38B, due to depart at 11:29.
That's all of the duties covered, is it not?
__
As a side note - but still related - Deptford have nine Cadets now in total... Five of those are "Drifter" branded, and four, "Northern". One "Northern" branded Cadet has been on the 60 every day for the past week or so, as opposed to the usual "Drifter" branded Versa, leaving eight Cadets in total left for the services in question. Given that [very recently] no "Northern" branded SPDs have made their way onto the 38/38A/38B/61 [a lot have been on the 39/20/20A/99 instead] and Renowns have all been kept occupied on the X3 service apart from the spare one which has either been on the 35 [or its variations] or 56, we know that all vehicles must have been used because the 61 has a PVR of 5, and the 38/38A/38B, a PVR of 3. 8 Cadets, and a PVR total of 8 between ALL routes - 38A/38B/61... Not just the 38A/38B.
I was under the impression it left Sunderland on a 38A/B went to Tunstall Bank then returned to Park Lane and then went to Murton on a 61. Then returns and goes back onto a 38. Which collectively has a PVR of 8!
